Geoff Petrie knows what he’s doing…

[Mr. S£im Citrus]

Are you sure about these?

Yes I'm sure about those. I was responding to the claim that it was somehow unique or special that the Kings have not immediately fallen out of the playoff picture since the last time they were a title contender:

Seattle was last a title contender in 1996; they didn't fall out of the playoff picture until several seasons after that.
Utah was last a title contender in 1998; they didn't fall out of the playoff picture until two years ago.
Portland was a title contender in 1992, continued to make the playoffs until they became a contender again in 2000, and then continued to make the playoffs for another three years after they were last title contenders.

Ergo, what Petrie has done to this point since the Kings were last title contenders is no great shakes.

 

[Kingzrool]

Ergo, what Petrie has done to this point since the Kings were last title contenders is no great shakes.

The point is that is still to early to tell. If GP gets us back in as a contender before we fall out of playoff contention (which is still possible), than he is special.

 

[Mr. S£im Citrus]

If it wasn't too early to tell for those other teams, then it's not too early to tell here.

 

[Kingzrool]

If it wasn't too early to tell for those other teams, then it's not too early to tell here.

I do not understand, wait - I guess you are assuming that we will not make the playoffs this year. If so, your point stands, it is those of us that hope for better that think GP might still be special.

None of those teams became a title contender before missing the playoffs. correct? If we can avoid missing the playoffs - that is very special indeed. no?

I can be an optimist at times

 

[Sptsjunkie]

Yes I'm sure about those. I was responding to the claim that it was somehow unique or special that the Kings have not immediately fallen out of the playoff picture since the last time they were a title contender:

Seattle was last a title contender in 1996; they didn't fall out of the playoff picture until several seasons after that.
Utah was last a title contender in 1998; they didn't fall out of the playoff picture until two years ago.
Portland was a title contender in 1992, continued to make the playoffs until they became a contender again in 2000, and then continued to make the playoffs for another three years after they were last title contenders.

Ergo, what Petrie has done to this point since the Kings were last title contenders is no great shakes.

I guess you didn't read all of my last post.

Seattle made it to the Finals in 1996; however, they were still considered contenders after that.

Utah made it to the Finals in 1998; however, they were still contenders after that.

You seem to be confusing that teams peak finish with the end of it's contender status. Our contender status ended after the loss to Minnesota, so we can start tracking our progress from there. However, the impressive part is that Petrie is completely restructuring the team with a different star player (Artest) and style of play without completely falling off. Utah, may have limped into the playoffs with Malone and Stockton, even though they weren't contenders, but they have not made the playoffs yet without the two.

Meanwhile, Portland shouldn't really count in this argument as their accomplishment was before the salary cap/luxury tax era. They did not rebuild their team and avoid a prolonged slump. Paul Allen kept letting Trader Bob expand the team's salary and take on more money. They never rebuilt their team, they kept adding great players the way the Yankees have for the last two decades.

And before someone mentions that the Blazers still made the playoffs after the salary cap was instituted, keep in mind there was no luxury tax yet. Therefore, the Blazers just kept trading expiring salaries and big salaries for big name players with equally big contracts, effectively circumventing the rules that the luxury tax was eventually put in place to prevent (or at least discourage).

 

[Mr. S£im Citrus]

I guess you didn't read all of my last post.

Seattle made it to the Finals in 1996; however, they were still considered contenders after that.

Utah made it to the Finals in 1998; however, they were still contenders after that.

According to whom? Neither of those teams ever made it out of the second round after their "peak" season; that is not the hallmark of a contender.

 

[funkykingston]

I was responding to the claim that it was somehow unique or special that the Kings have not immediately fallen out of the playoff picture since the last time they were a title contender:

No you weren't.

You were responding to my post, which made no such claim.

My very simple point was that I find it hard to be too upset with where the Kings currently stand, since a dip into mediocrity is more or less mandatory after having been a contending team.

Whether or not Petrie is able to rebuild the team BACK into a contender after these off years is what will either cement him as a very good GM or expose him as a one-trick pony.

Right now I have no idea which it will be.
​

 

[Oscar]

Geoff Petrie knows what he’s doing…

Everyone needs to chill the hell out and let Petrie do his thing.

Maybe we made a mistake but Petrie always finds a way to move problems.

No, we don't need to chill out. There are a lot of question marks for the Kings that fans want answered. They're getting impatient and frustrated because, despite all his moves over the years, Petrie has yet to produce a championship team, and people see the window slipping away.

 

[nbrans]

No, we don't need to chill out. There are a lot of question marks for the Kings that fans want answered. They're getting impatient and frustrated because, despite all his moves over the years, Petrie has yet to produce a championship team, and people see the window slipping away.

Not sure if you noticed but the window slammed shut three years ago when Webber blew out his knee. It took five years to build that team. It's going to take some more time to get back to that level.

 

[Kingzrool]

Not sure if you noticed but the window slammed shut three years ago when Webber blew out his knee. It took five years to build that team. It's going to take some more time to get back to that level.

And if he gets us there before we fall out of the playoffs, GP is the man!

And yes, those that are saying "Fire Geoff" need to chill out.

I have not been here to long, have there been those threads every time he makes a questionable call? If so, and they just need to vent, fine. But then they will chill out as they should.

I have not seen anybody mention a replacement. Maybe because firing GP is ridiculous.

I guess it really is just everyones passion that leads us here. Great in the season, kind of intense for TDOS.

 

[twocents]

i am trying hard but i don't understand the point geoff apologists are making. building a team is a continuous process, that is a given. there are two main ways to assess the team, hence the manager behind it:

1. sampling the current status (a point in time),
2. gauging the tendency (over a period).

no matter how you look at it, taking 1 or 2 as reference, geoff has been performing quite poorly. this is not to say he has "always" been incompetent. he was the primary actor in building the kings and putting sacramento on the map. but that is long gone, and the team you have now does not scare anyone, any more.

 

[BMiller52]

IMO Geoff needs to take notes from Miami and Dallas. They made a lot of changes the last couple of years and they both ended up in the finals. Dallas built around their superstar while losing soft players like Nash and Finley even though those guys were very talented and still good(or in Nash's case great) players. They replaced those guys with shotblockers, shooters, depth, and guys who would give Nowitzki the ball and then get out of the way.

The Heat made some very unpopular moves(at the time) because they filled needs. They thought they needed more play making next to Wade and some more guys who would shoot a lot 3 of pointers(Jones and Jones were good shooters, but they didn't force it/take game making(or breaking) shots). What do they do? They go out and get J-Will&Toine. I remember EVERYBODY said they just brought in two cancers, two guys with horrible shot selection, Posey wasn't as good as Jones, etc. etc. What happens? Well we all know that they won the freaking championship.

Geoff needs to start filling some holes, like the ones in the frontcourt. IMO it doesn't matter if it takes a big move or not, the point is getting a complete roster and getting better defensively!

 

[ParniValjak]

I can't believe how fickle some people are. I guess its a case of "you don't know what you have until its gone".

I am pretty sure you would all be singing to a different tune if GP was not our GM. Lets not forget that those dark days of the past were not that long ago.

Oh, and I VERY much doubt that this signing was all Goeff's doing. Our new coach just might have something to do with it. I find it extremely hard to believe that coach has no input of who is signed during the off-season.

 

[slugking50]

I can't believe how fickle some people are. I guess its a case of "you don't know what you have until its gone".

I am pretty sure you would all be singing to a different tune if GP was not our GM. Lets not forget that those dark days of the past were not that long ago.

Oh, and I VERY much doubt that this signing was all Goeff's doing. Our new coach just might have something to do with it. I find it extremely hard to believe that coach has no input of who is signed during the off-season.

Indeedy! But I kind of like how everybodys going off their collective rockers with GPs is an idiot/hasbeen comments. Its funny. Where's the pics of people jumping off a clip when you need them?!

Hes certainly made his share but believe it or not, Not everythings been his fault. With the Cat senario, GP never had a choice. He was offered crap in a S&T one time and then the Clippers quit cooperating and being the Cat he just left.

Be interesting to see where things lie this time next year. GP deserves to work things out. Rome wasnt built in a day afterall.

 

[Mr. S£im Citrus]

No you weren't.

Yes, I was. I wasn't responding to you, I was responding to this:

Well, you are part right.

If this slow drop continues and the Kings spend the next half decade in the lottery, then you are correct, Petrie's rebuilding is no more special than what the GM's you mentioned accomplished.

However, Petrie has acquired a potential franchise player in Artest, reshaped the team's image/style of play, and has acquired a number of young players to complement veterans still in their prime.

In other words, this team has a chance to avoid the 5-10 yer lottery mess that most teams have/are experiencing before becoming contenders again. If Petrie does that, he will have accomplished something that very very few GMs have ever accomplished. Especially considering he's not in a major market (i.e. Lakers and Shaq) and that there were no fluke draftpicks (i.e. Spurs and Duncan).

So it's too early to say Petrie's playoff run is much more special than the other GMs, but no we don't have to call him as big of a failure yet, since we haven't experienced their prolonged losing either.

I was in the middle of a dialogue with Sptsjunkie, and my comments yesterday were in response to his posts, not yours.

 

[Jerryaki]

IMO Geoff needs to take notes from Miami and Dallas. They made a lot of changes the last couple of years and they both ended up in the finals. Dallas built around their superstar while losing soft players like Nash and Finley even though those guys were very talented and still good(or in Nash's case great) players. They replaced those guys with shotblockers, shooters, depth, and guys who would give Nowitzki the ball and then get out of the way.

The Heat made some very unpopular moves(at the time) because they filled needs. They thought they needed more play making next to Wade and some more guys who would shoot a lot 3 of pointers(Jones and Jones were good shooters, but they didn't force it/take game making(or breaking) shots). What do they do? They go out and get J-Will&Toine. I remember EVERYBODY said they just brought in two cancers, two guys with horrible shot selection, Posey wasn't as good as Jones, etc. etc. What happens? Well we all know that they won the freaking championship.

Geoff needs to start filling some holes, like the ones in the frontcourt. IMO it doesn't matter if it takes a big move or not, the point is getting a complete roster and getting better defensively!

1) i'd rather the kings not rebuild around the superstar model; what drew me to them in the first place was the team model of the webb-divac era. everyone was a star on that team, and it was fun and good.

2) no way you can attribute the heat's success to just those guys. most of the season and first round of the playoffs they were underperforming and discombobulated just as everyone had anticipated. it was after the chicago series that they started to gel and get motivated by riley; then it all came together. so i'd also rather not build around that model either, don't think my heart could take it.

 

[Big Cuz 15]

IMO Geoff needs to take notes from Miami and Dallas. They made a lot of changes the last couple of years and they both ended up in the finals. Dallas built around their superstar while losing soft players like Nash and Finley even though those guys were very talented and still good(or in Nash's case great) players. They replaced those guys with shotblockers, shooters, depth, and guys who would give Nowitzki the ball and then get out of the way.

The Heat made some very unpopular moves(at the time) because they filled needs. They thought they needed more play making next to Wade and some more guys who would shoot a lot 3 of pointers(Jones and Jones were good shooters, but they didn't force it/take game making(or breaking) shots). What do they do? They go out and get J-Will&Toine. I remember EVERYBODY said they just brought in two cancers, two guys with horrible shot selection, Posey wasn't as good as Jones, etc. etc. What happens? Well we all know that they won the freaking championship.

Geoff needs to start filling some holes, like the ones in the frontcourt. IMO it doesn't matter if it takes a big move or not, the point is getting a complete roster and getting better defensively!

i agree with you for the most part. jwill and toine suck. jwill was consistently getting burned on the defensive end over and over again. at times i don't even know if he was guarding the opponent. did they do alot in the PO? not a whole lot... they weren't that exposed since wade and shaq sucking in defenses allowing them to get open looks.

 

[1kingzfan]

jwill and toine suck.

They sucked their way to a ring.

Obviously, both players have their faults, and JWill's primary one is on D. Obviously, Riley knew this when he acquired him, but guess what? It didn't matter, because Riley knew he had a super-athlete at the off-guard and several big guys across the front line that would have Jason's back.

It worked perfectly.

JWill filled the role of playmaker and distributor on a team with two guys that were always going to be the focus of the offense. He gave the Heat 12 ppg and 5+ dimes with a career high 44% FG%. JWill was 12th in the league in assist to turnover ratio. Not good enough to be an all-NBA player, for sure, but just what the Heat needed. Riles did well to acquire him.

Petrie does not have that luxury that Riley had with making moves around the point guard slot. Nobody down low to protect when the point gets beat. Tougher job to address. That's why I have espoused leaving Bibby right where he is and getting that athletic guy in the back to help out. That hasn't happened....yet.

 

[moradi420]

i agree with you for the most part. jwill and toine suck. jwill was consistently getting burned on the defensive end over and over again. at times i don't even know if he was guarding the opponent. did they do alot in the PO? not a whole lot... they weren't that exposed since wade and shaq sucking in defenses allowing them to get open looks.

yup what suckers, even though toine was the second best player on a team that went to the eastern confrence finals, some might even say he was better than p.p. Man those guys suck badly, and i heard jwill after the finals he was crying becuase he was burned so badly on d. he was contemplating retirement and even not accepting his ring because of his poor defense, the defense he was specificall brought in for, not his playmaking abilities.

 

[venom_7]

Let me just say in short - despite an ever changing NBA landscape, Petrie finds a way to help the Kings into the playoffs every year. Name the other GMs who are able to do the same.

Billy King is another GM who helps the Kings into the playoffs every year

 

[BMiller52]

1) i'd rather the kings not rebuild around the superstar model; what drew me to them in the first place was the team model of the webb-divac era. everyone was a star on that team, and it was fun and good.

2) no way you can attribute the heat's success to just those guys. most of the season and first round of the playoffs they were underperforming and discombobulated just as everyone had anticipated. it was after the chicago series that they started to gel and get motivated by riley; then it all came together. so i'd also rather not build around that model either, don't think my heart could take it.

1. Times are changing and our team/offense is different now. Artest and Bibby are our star players. It's time to build around them if we want to win. That's not really what I was talking about though, what I was saying is Geoff needs to keep making moves. Over the last year the Heat and even the Mavs have made a lot of changes. They were criticized about it but they filled needs. The Heat made a move for guys who shoot 3 pointers/make plays(Walker+JWill) and another perimeter defender(Posey). They also went out and got Payton. Now where are our holes? The frontcourt. Petrie needs to make one/some big moves IMO, but he hasn't been that busy in an offseason for years.

2. Walker and Posey showed up when it counted-the playoffs. Posey played good D on Dirk with Haslem and took a ton of charges. Antoine figured out his role and played it perfectly in the playoffs. He was one of the main reasons they beat NJ-he was huge in that series.

Basically what I am saying is that even though a player might be labeled a cancer or overpaid if they fix a frontcourt hole Petrie needs to make another move. This team simply cannot go into next season looking like this and expect to actually matter. Riley didn't care what people thought about Walker and Williams, he got them because he liked what they brought to the table. That got him an NBA championship.

 

[Sptsjunkie]

IMO Geoff needs to take notes from Miami and Dallas. They made a lot of changes the last couple of years and they both ended up in the finals. Dallas built around their superstar while losing soft players like Nash and Finley even though those guys were very talented and still good(or in Nash's case great) players. They replaced those guys with shotblockers, shooters, depth, and guys who would give Nowitzki the ball and then get out of the way.

The Heat made some very unpopular moves(at the time) because they filled needs. They thought they needed more play making next to Wade and some more guys who would shoot a lot 3 of pointers(Jones and Jones were good shooters, but they didn't force it/take game making(or breaking) shots). What do they do? They go out and get J-Will&Toine. I remember EVERYBODY said they just brought in two cancers, two guys with horrible shot selection, Posey wasn't as good as Jones, etc. etc. What happens? Well we all know that they won the freaking championship.

Geoff needs to start filling some holes, like the ones in the frontcourt. IMO it doesn't matter if it takes a big move or not, the point is getting a complete roster and getting better defensively!

BMiller, while I understand the point you are trying to make, I'm not sure that either of these examples are applicable to the Kings.

With the Mavs, Cuban has allowed Dallas to go far over the luxury tax. If the Maloffs allowed Petrie to go over the tax we wouldn't even be having this conversation. We would have resigned Bonzi, still signed Salmons and traded our expiring contracts for a big ma or some other combination like that.

Second, they have had their franchise player for the last several years and have built around him like we did with Webber. However, we did not have a franchise player the last two seasons (even when Webber was here), now that we have Artest we might have one again, but it does take some time to build around him.

Finally, this was a very weak year as far as the top teams are concerned. While, the Mavs were able to go way over the salary cap to stay good, the Nash-Dirk-Finley Mavs would have moped the floor with this group.

With the Heat, the biggest reason not to follow their lead with player moves from last off season is that there's a good chance the won in spite of those moves, not because of them. Two years ago, the Heat likely would have beaten the Pistons if Wade had stayed healthy. This is particularly relavent because that Pistons team was much, much better than this year's team. They had a better coach, a deeper bench, were't worn out from starters playing too many minutes during the regular season, and Rasheed wasn't playing on a bum ankle.

So one year later the same Heat that nearly beat a very good Pistons team except for Wade's injury; beat a worse version of the Pistons as they are fully healthy, saw improvement from Haslem, and had Wade make the leap to superstar in his third season. Posey was a good addition, people knew this when the trade happened, the only question with him was if he could stay healthy. With the exception of JDub's crazy shooting game, the other new additions didn't make Miami better. Walker, Payton, and Williams really did not play well inthe playoffs and Miami nearly got knocked out in the first round. If they had brought back the exact same squad from last season, the Pistons' regression and Haslem and Wade's improvement would have been enough to carry the Heat.

 

[Sptsjunkie]

Basically what I am saying is that even though a player might be labeled a cancer or overpaid if they fix a frontcourt hole Petrie needs to make another move. This team simply cannot go into next season looking like this and expect to actually matter.

I wholeheartedly agree with this though.

 

[BMiller52]

BMiller, while I understand the point you are trying to make, I'm not sure that either of these examples are applicable to the Kings.

With the Mavs, Cuban has allowed Dallas to go far over the luxury tax. If the Maloffs allowed Petrie to go over the tax we wouldn't even be having this conversation. We would have resigned Bonzi, still signed Salmons and traded our expiring contracts for a big ma or some other combination like that.

Second, they have had their franchise player for the last several years and have built around him like we did with Webber. However, we did not have a franchise player the last two seasons (even when Webber was here), now that we have Artest we might have one again, but it does take some time to build around him.

Finally, this was a very weak year as far as the top teams are concerned. While, the Mavs were able to go way over the salary cap to stay good, the Nash-Dirk-Finley Mavs would have moped the floor with this group.

With the Heat, the biggest reason not to follow their lead with player moves from last off season is that there's a good chance the won in spite of those moves, not because of them. Two years ago, the Heat likely would have beaten the Pistons if Wade had stayed healthy. This is particularly relavent because that Pistons team was much, much better than this year's team. They had a better coach, a deeper bench, were't worn out from starters playing too many minutes during the regular season, and Rasheed wasn't playing on a bum ankle.

So one year later the same Heat that nearly beat a very good Pistons team except for Wade's injury; beat a worse version of the Pistons as they are fully healthy, saw improvement from Haslem, and had Wade make the leap to superstar in his third season. Posey was a good addition, people knew this when the trade happened, the only question with him was if he could stay healthy. With the exception of JDub's crazy shooting game, the other new additions didn't make Miami better. Walker, Payton, and Williams really did not play well inthe playoffs and Miami nearly got knocked out in the first round. If they had brought back the exact same squad from last season, the Pistons' regression and Haslem and Wade's improvement would have been enough to carry the Heat.

Payton played very well in the playoffs. He hit a game winner and he brought stability and defense when JWill didn't play well. Actually I'd like to see us add an old player like GP that will now come off the bench. We could use the stability/experience... That's off topic though.

Also I disagree that the Mavs with Nash/Finley/Dirk would've beat the Heat/Spurs. Finley and Nash play zero defense while Dirk has started to try but he's still soft. You can't win without atleast above average defense. The Spurs played great D, Pistons played decent D, Mavs played very good D, Heat played good D in the playoffs, the Nets played good D, the Clippers played good D, I mean almost every team that got out of the first round this year played good D(the exceptions were Cavs&Suns led by Bron&Nash).

I don't think the old Heat would've beaten the 04-05 Spurs anyway. That team was better than this year's team.

Riley made additions that people hated but they paid off. Eddie Jones played badly for the Grizz during this year's playoffs(too many minutes, probably burned out), Damon Jones was an overrated 3 point shooter because Shaq got him so many open looks. If Walker doesn't come up huge in the Nets series that's going 7 games, Heat possibly lose. If Posey doesn't defend Dirk well and sacrifice his body to take charges they don't win the Dallas series. People hated on Walker, Williams, and they said Posey alone didn't make that deal a good deal for the Heat, all of those guys played a significant role to help win a ring.

I'm glad you agree with my original point though. The bottom line is we need a PF/C in the starting line up who defends/blocks shots and we need to find a way to get one on the bench.

 

[Sptsjunkie]

Payton played very well in the playoffs. He hit a game winner and he brought stability and defense when JWill didn't play well. Actually I'd like to see us add an old player like GP that will now come off the bench. We could use the stability/experience... That's off topic though.

Also I disagree that the Mavs with Nash/Finley/Dirk would've beat the Heat/Spurs. Finley and Nash play zero defense while Dirk has started to try but he's still soft. You can't win without atleast above average defense. The Spurs played great D, Pistons played decent D, Mavs played very good D, Heat played good D in the playoffs, the Nets played good D, the Clippers played good D, I mean almost every team that got out of the first round this year played good D(the exceptions were Cavs&Suns led by Bron&Nash).

I don't think the old Heat would've beaten the 04-05 Spurs anyway. That team was better than this year's team.

Riley made additions that people hated but they paid off. Eddie Jones played badly for the Grizz during this year's playoffs(too many minutes, probably burned out), Damon Jones was an overrated 3 point shooter because Shaq got him so many open looks. If Walker doesn't come up huge in the Nets series that's going 7 games, Heat possibly lose. If Posey doesn't defend Dirk well and sacrifice his body to take charges they don't win the Dallas series. People hated on Walker, Williams, and they said Posey alone didn't make that deal a good deal for the Heat, all of those guys played a significant role to help win a ring.

I'm glad you agree with my original point though. The bottom line is we need a PF/C in the starting line up who defends/blocks shots and we need to find a way to get one on the bench.

I definitley agree with the original point.

I just don't see the Heat's new additions with the exception of Posey having been a big asset to them.

Yes Payton hit the big shot and played better D than Williams, but that's more of a knock on Williams than a bonus to GP. If the Heat had kept Damon Jones and still acquired Williams, we would be saying the exact same thing. And Jones' shooting would have helped spread the floor for the Heat even more. Payton can't shoot from the outside anymore, having another player who could hit the wide open looks that Shaq and Wade created would have opened up the middle even more for them. Payton shot 42% from the field and 29% from the three point line, while grabbing 2 rebounds and 1.5 ast is 24 minutes a game.

Walker played well in the NJ series, but was a mess outside of that. He shot 39% from the field against both Detroit and Dallas, despite having many wide open shots, including 27% and 31% from three point land. He also hit only 57% of his free throws, while averaging less than 6 rebounds in 37 minutes a game. All this while not being a stellar defender. As my friend BJ would say, "What exactly are you bringing to the table right now?"

Jason Williams was equally as bad, shooting 40% from the field and 27% from the three point line, again including many wide open shots. And he was so atrocious on defence that he was replaced on defence by Gary Payton. That sentence wouldn't sound bad a decade ago, but for last season that's terrible. The main thing Jason brought to the team was another good ball handler who could bring the ball upcourt against pressure.

Last year in the playoffs, Eddie Jones shot 46% from the field, 40% from the 3 point line and grabed 5.8 rebounds a game. Damon Jones shot 48% from the field and 43% from the three point line, while having a 4-1 A/TO ratio. Last year's team also had Rasual Butler, who only contributed a little during the playoffs, but would likely have been able to contribute more this season.

This isn't saying last year's team was perfect. I'm not saying they shouldn't have made some moves. However, adding a couple free agents to shore up their bench would have been fine. Add Gary Payton, he was cheap and a good veteran presence, even if his stats were poor. Add another good ball handler or defender. However, turning Miami into a circus nearly cost them this year. Wade emerging as a leader and staying healthy, along with the regression of the Pistons and the injuries to the Spurs is what put Miami over the top. This year's Heat took seven games to beat a Pistons team that was much worse than last season. Remember, last year's Pistons barely beat the Heat in Game 7 with Wade hurt for both the game 6 and 7 losses (though he played gimpy in game 7). Miami would have won it all this year, without all those moves, I think they did more harm than good.

 

[1kingzfan]

Miami would have won it all this year, without all those moves, I think they did more harm than good.

Well spoken, but still conjecture.

The only thing we can say with certainty is that the team Riles assembled did in fact win the coveted ring.

My own conjecture is that while most players displayed their weaknesses, as most do, the cast assembled fit together quite well, and folks played their roles more than well enough to get them over the top.

 

[Kings113]

Indeed, Junkie.

That team last year still would of won the title, IMO. Even if there was one or two general/natural moves. I liked it better than this past season's some more. They still would of beat Detroit, and still would of handled Dallas.

Obviously we know what happened with the new team, indeed.

 

[Bricklayer]

Indeed, Junkie.

That team last year still would of won the title, IMO. Even if there was one or two general/natural moves. I liked it better than this past season's some more. They still would of beat Detroit, and still would of handled Dallas.

Obviously we know what happened with the new team, indeed.

So you think the Jones boys would have done it huh?

I don't. And yes, they had Detroit beat last year until Wade got hurt. But that was one of their real problems -- no depth.

 

[Circa_1985_Fan]

No I was saying I think that they WILL make more moves.

We are still 4-5 million under the tax after signing Salmons right? There is too much wiggle room to not be used. I see something going down where we take on more salary.

The Kings right now are at $60,409,545, and the luxury tax threshold is $65.42million, so we'd have about $5million, but I'm not sure if thats an accurate # because not sure if that includes the rooks contracts, Douby, Lou, Jeter, Williams...we'll have to wait and see, whatever Petrie does will be done on a tight budget...and I'm not sure who we could really get for a couple million, if thats all we're left with. Not sure if a guy, for example, like Chris Wilcox(who would be a great fit here), would take less to play more, and for a possible contender.

 

[Sptsjunkie]

So you think the Jones boys would have done it huh?

I don't. And yes, they had Detroit beat last year until Wade got hurt. But that was one of their real problems -- no depth.

Bricklayer, while I agree with the second half of your post, I have two questions:

1 - Couldn't they have added depth without completely overhauling a large portion of their team? As I had mentioned in my post, my argument wasn't that the Heat should have returned the exact same team, but that the same core with some more depth would have had the same result and wouldn't have required as many games to do it.

2 - Do you think that the Heat would have won the championship this year, even with the regression of the Pistons and injuries to the Spurs, if Wade had gotten hurt? Personally, I don't think there's anyway they win it all if Wade is hurt, he absolutley carried that team.

The Heat had everything in their advantage - weakened opponents, a much better playoff coach, a healthy superstar - and they still narrowly escaped every round. To me that says something about their role players and while statistics are not everything, the stats do back up this argument.