Fire Walton

Tetsujin

The Game Thread Dude
I think Walton thinks owners only look at a coach's W-L record. No other reason why he would have Barnes, Buddy and Fox almost hitting 40 minutes a piece in a pointless game against the Timberwolves when the Kings greatly need to increase their lottery odds.

If I was an owner I'd be thinking this guy is dumb as rocks. Puts his franchise player and his best veteran in danger of getting injured to win meaningless games that only hurt the team's lottery odds.
Meh, he's played Moe Harkless more than Tyrese over the past week and didn't even play De'Aaron 30 minutes last night. Maybe he's just an incompetent nincompoop.
 
I am curious about what you wrote here. The first game allowed only 1500 fans. I am interpreting what you wrote as they haven't been able to sell that many. I have wondered aloud how the time away from the games and the product offered would affect the fans attendance. But if they couldn't sell out with that few seats available I would be utterly shocked.
THEY WERE NOT ABLE TO SELL OUT THAT FEW SEATS

not even close. hundreds of unsold tickets. check tickemaster for the two games next week and see for yourself.
 
I don't know what the Kings are doing but the Timbers have 25% capacity at matches right now and have implemented some type of dynamic seat pricing in making seats available to STHs. They sell out in minutes and are commanding big prices on Seat Geek. I'm guessing at 1500 fans the Kings market is even hotter even as bad as they are.
You would be guessing wrong. They did not sell out - it is a disaster. Go on ticketmaster and look at the two games next week and see for yourself.
 
THEY WERE NOT ABLE TO SELL OUT THAT FEW SEATS

not even close. hundreds of unsold tickets. check tickemaster for the two games next week and see for yourself.
I thank you for the clarification. Meant to add I couldn't like this even though I wanted because this isn't good unless Vivek sells.

I figured after the thrill of being able to go again AND it was completely opened back up there would be seats available. I didn't imagine that it had gotten SO BAD that they couldn't sell 1,600 tickets.

Hopefully Vivek and his bookkeeper will have a long talk and he will get cold feet and sell controlling interest. He has been a disaster.
 
Those tickets were given away to front line workers.
it's called "papering the house" - gary gerold referred to there being several hundred fans in attendance on tuesday. he might have been told to shut up because he did not mention any numbers on wednesday. in fairness, "several hundred" COULD refer to 1600 (i mean, that is "several hundred" also).

but after playing metu and harkless a bunch (no choice really) and burning out his starters, they collapsed on cue in the fourth quarter tuesday, but failed to tank again on wednesday.

which is really dumb.

had they lost wednesday, i think they could have slipped below minnesota in the final standings.

the t-wolves should not really WANT a high lottery pick. they already pay KAT top dollar and bennet has shown himself to be a future max guy. a pick at 10-12 would be lower salaried for a few years.

not sure what they intend to do with russell. he doesn't seem like the type of guy to be alfred to KAT and AB's batman and robin, but if they keep him, that is one hell of a big three going forward (two #1's and a #2 overall). they got a bad break this season when multiple members of KAT's family died of covid and he missed a lot of time while they dug a hole they can't crawl out of (this year). but i don't see this version of the kings ever finishing ahead of minnesota again.

and the t-wolves must know they have something going because they dumped a (too young) coach, so they expect to win, not rebuild.

the kings could still finish below them in the standings, but it looks like it will be over luke's dead body.

it's just old luke and luke's waitin' for the judgement day.
 
it's called "papering the house" - gary gerold referred to there being several hundred fans in attendance on tuesday. he might have been told to shut up because he did not mention any numbers on wednesday. in fairness, "several hundred" COULD refer to 1600 (i mean, that is "several hundred" also).

but after playing metu and harkless a bunch (no choice really) and burning out his starters, they collapsed on cue in the fourth quarter tuesday, but failed to tank again on wednesday.

which is really dumb.

had they lost wednesday, i think they could have slipped below minnesota in the final standings.

the t-wolves should not really WANT a high lottery pick. they already pay KAT top dollar and bennet has shown himself to be a future max guy. a pick at 10-12 would be lower salaried for a few years.

not sure what they intend to do with russell. he doesn't seem like the type of guy to be alfred to KAT and AB's batman and robin, but if they keep him, that is one hell of a big three going forward (two #1's and a #2 overall). they got a bad break this season when multiple members of KAT's family died of covid and he missed a lot of time while they dug a hole they can't crawl out of (this year). but i don't see this version of the kings ever finishing ahead of minnesota again.

and the t-wolves must know they have something going because they dumped a (too young) coach, so they expect to win, not rebuild.

the kings could still finish below them in the standings, but it looks like it will be over luke's dead body.

it's just old luke and luke's waitin' for the judgement day.
Did they add Anthony Bennet to their roster?
 

Tetsujin

The Game Thread Dude
speaking as someone in the business of box office and show put-on-ing, you can pretty much throw out all those figures and numbers because they’re pretty much meaningless.

anti-maskers and anti-vaxxers aren’t gonna go to games right now and it’s still too early in the vaccination process for a lot of people to feel comfortable coming to any sort of live entertainment. Even if they were, the team would still barely be breaking even at 1500 max capacity while having to pay game day staff and security, etc, and even with mask rules in effect, the current varients are contagious enough and vaccine resistant enough (see India and its dreaded double variant) that any further increase in seating capacity would probably result in all sorts of oogy outbreak headlines in California. In other words, the Kings really have no incentive to really sell these tickets beyond making sure they remember how to when next season starts.

speaking off the record here (though I doubt people here would really care about how things are going in the Japanese love entertainment industry), the company I work for has seen infection clusters in pretty much every single one of our theaters over the past month and we’ve got a strict mask policy ( that people actually follow) and are operating at fifty percent capacity with a no laughing/talking policy and all our cast members wearing masks. I can only imagine how crazy numbers would get if an NBA team tried the same rules in America.

Also not sure why we’re talking about this in the “Luke Walton is dumb” thread.
 

Warhawk

The cake is a lie.
Staff member
speaking as someone in the business of box office and show put-on-ing, you can pretty much throw out all those figures and numbers because they’re pretty much meaningless.

anti-maskers and anti-vaxxers aren’t gonna go to games right now and it’s still too early in the vaccination process for a lot of people to feel comfortable coming to any sort of live entertainment. Even if they were, the team would still barely be breaking even at 1500 max capacity while having to pay game day staff and security, etc, and even with mask rules in effect, the current varients are contagious enough and vaccine resistant enough (see India and its dreaded double variant) that any further increase in seating capacity would probably result in all sorts of oogy outbreak headlines in California. In other words, the Kings really have no incentive to really sell these tickets beyond making sure they remember how to when next season starts.

speaking off the record here (though I doubt people here would really care about how things are going in the Japanese love entertainment industry), the company I work for has seen infection clusters in pretty much every single one of our theaters over the past month and we’ve got a strict mask policy ( that people actually follow) and are operating at fifty percent capacity with a no laughing/talking policy and all our cast members wearing masks. I can only imagine how crazy numbers would get if an NBA team tried the same rules in America.

Also not sure why we’re talking about this in the “Luke Walton is dumb” thread.
Also, you have to be fully vaccinated for at least a week (I think that's the time frame ?) or have a specific type of negative COVID test result right before the event. We considered going to a game, but we won't get our second shots until after the season is over. I'm also not going to be hunting down specific COVID tests to take (if you can even find out before you take it) and go through all that hassle with only a few games left as well as all the junk we have going on (work, personal, etc.) right now. I think a lot of other folks are in the same situation.
 

Tetsujin

The Game Thread Dude
Also, you have to be fully vaccinated for at least a week (I think that's the time frame ?) or have a specific type of negative COVID test result right before the event. We considered going to a game, but we won't get our second shots until after the season is over. I'm also not going to be hunting down specific COVID tests to take (if you can even find out before you take it) and go through all that hassle with only a few games left as well as all the junk we have going on (work, personal, etc.) right now. I think a lot of other folks are in the same situation.
Right. Pending the results of a PCR test in a couple of hours, I’m heading back to Sacramento for the first time in eight years and, while I’d sure as hell be going to G1C for a game or two in a normal season, it’s pretty much the last thing I want to do right now.

I’m really not sure how Vivek or the Kings organization is to blame for people not wanting to risk infection/go out of their way to prove they aren’t infected right now. Or how there being tickets unsold is some sort of indication of some sort of failure on the team’s part.
 
Right. Pending the results of a PCR test in a couple of hours, I’m heading back to Sacramento for the first time in eight years and, while I’d sure as hell be going to G1C for a game or two in a normal season, it’s pretty much the last thing I want to do right now.

I’m really not sure how Vivek or the Kings organization is to blame for people not wanting to risk infection/go out of their way to prove they aren’t infected right now. Or how there being tickets unsold is some sort of indication of some sort of failure on the team’s part.
Giants are selling out their limited capacity. Warriors are selling out their limited capacity. And Kings would be selling out a hot ticket if they weren’t trash on the floor with eroded fan enthusiasm. Vivek apologists absolutely never cease to amaze me
 
Also, you have to be fully vaccinated for at least a week (I think that's the time frame ?) or have a specific type of negative COVID test result right before the event. We considered going to a game, but we won't get our second shots until after the season is over. I'm also not going to be hunting down specific COVID tests to take (if you can even find out before you take it) and go through all that hassle with only a few games left as well as all the junk we have going on (work, personal, etc.) right now. I think a lot of other folks are in the same situation.
Counter argument, wasn't first responders in the first group allowed to take the vaccine? And the first game was for first responders and apparently their families.

I'm basing that on the sequence of eligibility to take the vaccine in Kentucky which was based on CDC guidelines.

This isn't a good look. But looks can be deceptive.
 
I will give Vivek this : the Kings have a partnership to provide a $25 game day rapid results test. Kudos for that. And why is this in the Luke Walton thread? BecAuse I correlate the fan apathy with the lazy dumb complacent stoned Laker in the head coach chair.
 
I will give Vivek this : the Kings have a partnership to provide a $25 game day rapid results test. Kudos for that. And why is this in the Luke Walton thread? BecAuse I correlate the fan apathy with the lazy dumb complacent stoned Laker in the head coach chair.
At least they are being pro-active by having the partnership for the test. Is that done at the stadium? I don't think I would want to pay for tickets, pay for the test only to end up quarantined besides not seeing the game. :(
 

Tetsujin

The Game Thread Dude
Giants are selling out their limited capacity. Warriors are selling out their limited capacity. And Kings would be selling out a hot ticket if they weren’t trash on the floor with eroded fan enthusiasm. Vivek apologists absolutely never cease to amaze me
Completely different markets and situations.

Warriors aren’t letting their fans in until tomorrow, have a player in the midst of one of the greatest hot streaks in league history, are still riding the crest of their championship run and new arena, and get to play the Nuggets on their first game back instead of the TWolves. Also the economics of their seating licenses are completely different from the Kings season ticket system.

I’m far from a Vivek apologist but the situation for each team in the league is different depending on their local COVID restrictions right now so I’m not really going to get on a franchise for not selling tickets to games most of the fan base seems to want them to lose since that was largely the whole appeal of tanking this season in the first place.
I’m really not sure what point it is you’re trying to make, considering this is the Luke Walton thread and you’ve been vacillating between “People aren’t going to games” and “Of course people aren’t going to games because we suck” over the last couple of pages in this thread while getting increasingly further and further away from the main point of the thread.
 

Tetsujin

The Game Thread Dude
Counter argument, wasn't first responders in the first group allowed to take the vaccine? And the first game was for first responders and apparently their families.

I'm basing that on the sequence of eligibility to take the vaccine in Kentucky which was based on CDC guidelines.

This isn't a good look. But looks can be deceptive.
It depends on how the tickets were being distributed to first responders though and, considering the hellish year they’ve had, it’s hard to fault any of them for not wanting to spend an evening watching two of the worst teams in the NBA take turns kicking each other in the balls.
 
Completely different markets and situations.

Warriors aren’t letting their fans in until tomorrow, have a player in the midst of one of the greatest hot streaks in league history, are still riding the crest of their championship run and new arena, and get to play the Nuggets on their first game back instead of the TWolves. Also the economics of their seating licenses are completely different from the Kings season ticket system.

I’m far from a Vivek apologist but the situation for each team in the league is different depending on their local COVID restrictions right now so I’m not really going to get on a franchise for not selling tickets to games most of the fan base seems to want them to lose since that was largely the whole appeal of tanking this season in the first place.
I’m really not sure what point it is you’re trying to make, considering this is the Luke Walton thread and you’ve been vacillating between “People aren’t going to games” and “Of course people aren’t going to games because we suck” over the last couple of pages in this thread while getting increasingly further and further away from the main point of the thread.
It depends on how the tickets were being distributed to first responders though and, considering the hellish year they’ve had, it’s hard to fault any of them for not wanting to spend an evening watching two of the worst teams in the NBA take turns kicking each other in the balls.
I don't know. The act of actually doing something closer to normal I would think would be enticing. Even if the teams aren't that good.

Even during Philly’s "The Process" they gave the fans something to look forward to and no they didn't have great attendance but the youngsters were trying to make the league... and there was always the hope one or more would stick. Walton's stubbornness isn't even giving the fans that.

One of the hopes going into this year was to develop the unknowns. Seeing if any of them were worth keeping after the transition year. That hope and interest has been dashed. Optics matter and it simply looks like the Kings continue to do Kangz stuff. I don’t put this on McNair because I really don't think he was ever given the option to remove a removable part of the problem. To me this resides on the sidelines and the man upstairs. Saving a penny but costing a pound.
 

Warhawk

The cake is a lie.
Staff member
Counter argument, wasn't first responders in the first group allowed to take the vaccine? And the first game was for first responders and apparently their families.

I'm basing that on the sequence of eligibility to take the vaccine in Kentucky which was based on CDC guidelines.

This isn't a good look. But looks can be deceptive.
I believe it was, but I don't know all the details. Since we wouldn't be vaccinated in time, we didn't look into it further.

Also, just because one member of the family is vaccinated doesn't mean the rest were. I doubt they would go on their own if their spouse or younger children still hadn't been vaccinated.
 
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Warhawk

The cake is a lie.
Staff member
I don't know. The act of actually doing something closer to normal I would think would be enticing. Even if the teams aren't that good.
I'll just say that we (my family) are still not going to movies, games, etc., until we are fully vaccinated. We are doing some things (outdoor restaurant dining, meeting with small groups of friends while staying socially distanced, etc.), but are avoiding such higher-risk environments until we have had our second shots. With over 1/2 million dead and millions sick and possibly suffering from long COVID, it's the decision we made for our family and work reasons. Another few weeks and we will be doing more of the "normal" stuff.
 
Completely different markets and situations.

Warriors aren’t letting their fans in until tomorrow, have a player in the midst of one of the greatest hot streaks in league history, are still riding the crest of their championship run and new arena, and get to play the Nuggets on their first game back instead of the TWolves. Also the economics of their seating licenses are completely different from the Kings season ticket system.

I’m far from a Vivek apologist but the situation for each team in the league is different depending on their local COVID restrictions right now so I’m not really going to get on a franchise for not selling tickets to games most of the fan base seems to want them to lose since that was largely the whole appeal of tanking this season in the first place.
I’m really not sure what point it is you’re trying to make, considering this is the Luke Walton thread and you’ve been vacillating between “People aren’t going to games” and “Of course people aren’t going to games because we suck” over the last couple of pages in this thread while getting increasingly further and further away from the main point of the thread.
Not sure what YOUR point is. Warriors have been competently run and have an attractive product on the floor. And they are a hot ticket despite MUCH more complicated covid protocols. They are playing the Nuggets? Fine, we are playing Luka and the Mavs Monday - check the ticketmaster. Same.

I posit that the reason the Kings are not a hot ticket is because they suck. Where is vaccilating? That is my whole premise -that 1600 tickets cannot be sold BECAUSE THEY SUCK. that is not at odds with "of course people aren't going because they suck". The two statements are coherent together.

Players in the midst of hot streaks, great players, and championship runs - these are not random variables. these are consequences of competent ownership and coaching.

So, agree or disagree:

"The Kings are unable to sell out what SHOULD be a hot ticket because there is widespread fan apathy that is not present where teams are good"
"there is widespread fan apathy because the product on the floor is not a good show - because the games are open gym shootarounds."
"the product on the floor is not a good show in part because the coaching talent is wanting - there is no discernable defence nor offensive approach"

You don't have to agree, nobody does. But... the Kings have made decisions - including the decision about who the coach is right now - that have contributed to a lethargic product on the floor and serious fan apathy like I have never seen. That's just my take. and I lay a lot of it at Walton's feet - he has no pulse at all and I am a biased Joerger man anyway.
 
Completely different markets and situations.

Warriors aren’t letting their fans in until tomorrow, have a player in the midst of one of the greatest hot streaks in league history, are still riding the crest of their championship run and new arena, and get to play the Nuggets on their first game back instead of the TWolves. Also the economics of their seating licenses are completely different from the Kings season ticket system.

I’m far from a Vivek apologist but the situation for each team in the league is different depending on their local COVID restrictions right now so I’m not really going to get on a franchise for not selling tickets to games most of the fan base seems to want them to lose since that was largely the whole appeal of tanking this season in the first place.
I’m really not sure what point it is you’re trying to make, considering this is the Luke Walton thread and you’ve been vacillating between “People aren’t going to games” and “Of course people aren’t going to games because we suck” over the last couple of pages in this thread while getting increasingly further and further away from the main point of the thread.
Fair criticism - it has run far afield. I wrecked the thread and I'm sorry. When I popped in, I was mad at Luke for being terrible he is like Toby in The Office to me, and I just felt that the pathetic fan turnout was symptomatic of how "Toby" Luke Walton is. but I'm sorry - it didn't really work out and I wrecked an otherwise lovely thread. my bad
 
I'll just say that we (my family) are still not going to movies, games, etc., until we are fully vaccinated. We are doing some things (outdoor restaurant dining, meeting with small groups of friends while staying socially distanced, etc.), but are avoiding such higher-risk environments until we have had our second shots. With over 1/2 million dead and millions sick and possibly suffering from long COVID, it's the decision we made for our family and work reasons. Another few weeks and we will be doing more of the "normal" stuff.
I fully understand. I thought my second dose was this week but not until next AND then 14 days until considered "fully vaccinated." I have begun to eat in IF and only if it's nearly empty. I am being recalled to the office the week after next and have mixed feelings about that. The one thing the arena has going for it minus the natural sunlight is the volume of air. Provided that they follow social distancing and the air circulation system is up to snuff risk is minimal with the steps they have implemented. I say that but I can't say that I haven't become more of a introvert.
 
speaking as someone in the business of box office and show put-on-ing, you can pretty much throw out all those figures and numbers because they’re pretty much meaningless.

anti-maskers and anti-vaxxers aren’t gonna go to games right now and it’s still too early in the vaccination process for a lot of people to feel comfortable coming to any sort of live entertainment. Even if they were, the team would still barely be breaking even at 1500 max capacity while having to pay game day staff and security, etc, and even with mask rules in effect, the current varients are contagious enough and vaccine resistant enough (see India and its dreaded double variant) that any further increase in seating capacity would probably result in all sorts of oogy outbreak headlines in California. In other words, the Kings really have no incentive to really sell these tickets beyond making sure they remember how to when next season starts.

speaking off the record here (though I doubt people here would really care about how things are going in the Japanese love entertainment industry), the company I work for has seen infection clusters in pretty much every single one of our theaters over the past month and we’ve got a strict mask policy ( that people actually follow) and are operating at fifty percent capacity with a no laughing/talking policy and all our cast members wearing masks. I can only imagine how crazy numbers would get if an NBA team tried the same rules in America.

Also not sure why we’re talking about this in the “Luke Walton is dumb” thread.
For the record I'm fully vaxxed and not anti-mask (though I don't like wearing them, which influences my decision to stay inside) and I am not going anywhere near those Timbers games which are also outdoors. We're playing Club America in an actual meaningful match, something I've waited years to see, and I'm NOT GOING.

I am slightly surprised that they aren't selling ~1500 tickets, and I have had friends go to the games, but I wouldn't go near them and its not because the team is bad. I just assume there are a lot of people just looking for any social outlet right now.
 

Warhawk

The cake is a lie.
Staff member
I fully understand. I thought my second dose was this week but not until next AND then 14 days until considered "fully vaccinated." I have begun to eat in IF and only if it's nearly empty. I am being recalled to the office the week after next and have mixed feelings about that. The one thing the arena has going for it minus the natural sunlight is the volume of air. Provided that they follow social distancing and the air circulation system is up to snuff risk is minimal with the steps they have implemented. I say that but I can't say that I haven't become more of a introvert.
It is, if they use it to full capacity. I remember we took an "engineering" tour of the arena while it was under construction (March 2016) and they said that the huge air blowers they had on the roof could suck the air out of the arena every 4 minutes (or something like that). They had to do that in order to hold monster truck events, etc., with running vehicles inside and the pyrotechnics that are used for some concerts or other events. You can see a few of the blowers in this photo I took during the tour.
2016-03-18 G1C ASCE engineering tour (28) small.jpg
 
I don't know. The act of actually doing something closer to normal I would think would be enticing. Even if the teams aren't that good.

Even during Philly’s "The Process" they gave the fans something to look forward to and no they didn't have great attendance but the youngsters were trying to make the league... and there was always the hope one or more would stick. Walton's stubbornness isn't even giving the fans that.

One of the hopes going into this year was to develop the unknowns. Seeing if any of them were worth keeping after the transition year. That hope and interest has been dashed. Optics matter and it simply looks like the Kings continue to do Kangz stuff. I don’t put this on McNair because I really don't think he was ever given the option to remove a removable part of the problem. To me this resides on the sidelines and the man upstairs. Saving a penny but costing a pound.
I’m fully vaccinated along with my wife and we had the option of going but my daughter is not vaccinated. While the option of doing something normal sounds very enticing we rather just have a dinner meal outside since the weather is so nice rather than watch two bottom dweller team play to be honest. I definitely want to go to a kings game at some point but too much of a hassle and at this point with the way the season is going
 
It is, if they use it to full capacity. I remember we took an "engineering" tour of the arena while it was under construction (March 2016) and they said that the huge air blowers they had on the roof could suck the air out of the arena every 4 minutes (or something like that). They had to do that in order to hold monster truck events, etc., with running vehicles inside and the pyrotechnics that are used for some concerts or other events. You can see a few of the blowers in this photo I took during the tour.
I've been to a Monster Jam (it was fun), never really thought about the logistics of airflow like that. Makes sense. Still not going to any indoor events this year.