Dave Joerger...rumors and speculation

[Kingston Jamaica]

There is no doubt that we would like to play faster than the Grizzlies. The key for me with Joerger is his body of work on the defensive end. He does get the best from his players and he seems to be smart enough to play to the strength of his players.

If we hire him, I expect us to be a much better team defensively and play at a faster pace than Grizzlies but nowhere near as fast as we did this season.

When a coach plays with a roster like Joerger did this season, you have to take your hat off. Well done! There's no way to success without outstanding defense. If that fact finally sets in in the Kings collective spirit, the bad days are over. If Joerger is able to bring that Memphis defense to Sacramento, the team will immediately be a playoff team. I actually predict that the new playoff teams in the Western Conference are Minnesota and Sacramento. Who's leaving? Most probably Dallas and Houston with Memphis/Clippers as "reserves".

 

[Livinthedream]

No, the point is, whether true or not, that Joerger wanted to play faster, than Hollins, but team leaders told him to take a hike with that idea.
Hopefully that's just an unfounded speculation.

Kings can't really play any faster than they did this season. So, he won't make it worse. However, Joerger seems to know the importance of defense.

 

[SacKings384]

I like Joerger. I do. I think he's a great coach. But look at the message Paul George left for Vogel. https://www.instagram.com/p/BFIKxWlnMv0/?hl=en

It's 100% confirmed that Joerger clashed with the front office. Including reaching out about other positions last year and this year as well. He is alleged to not have a great relationship with Conley, and it isn't too rosy with Gasol or Randolph either. We need a player's coach, and Joerger doesn't necessarily seem like one of them. But we shall see. He's one of the better coaches out there, so if we can lock him up I'm ok with that.

 

[funkykingston]

I like Joerger. I do. I think he's a great coach. But look at the message Paul George left for Vogel. https://www.instagram.com/p/BFIKxWlnMv0/?hl=en

It's 100% confirmed that Joerger clashed with the front office. Including reaching out about other positions last year and this year as well. He is alleged to not have a great relationship with Conley, and it isn't too rosy with Gasol or Randolph either. We need a player's coach, and Joerger doesn't necessarily seem like one of them. But we shall see. He's one of the better coaches out there, so if we can lock him up I'm ok with that.

Joerger carries more risk in a few ways.

But:

(1) the conflict with the Grizzlies FO/ownership is more understandable when considering that Memphis is quietly one of the most dysfunctional organizations in the NBA. It's on Vlade (and hopefully to a lesser extent Vivek)to avoid that in Sacramento.

(2) There is zero indication that Vogel was even considering the Kings job. I've heard no news about even a conversation, let alone an actual interview. You can only hire a guy that is interested in the gig.

(3) While both guys are great at coaching defense and getting guys to buy in, Joerger is more forward thinking offensively.

(4) The hottest coach on the market this season (Thibs) clashed a LOT with management and he wore on his players to the point that several said at the end of last season in their exit interviews that they didn't want to return if Thibodeau was still the coach.

When a young, innovative, flexible and successful coach is interested in the Kings job you make sure he is on the same page as the front office and if so, you snatch him up.

 

[Gilles]

In the end Joerger certainly catered to his stars, so if this indeed happened the way it's reported, it might be very positive sign for potential Coach-Players relationship. And yes, we have no idea, how faster he allegedly wanted to play. Dreaming a bit, his team battled Warriors very well last year, so hopefully he comes to Sacramento and Vlade can give him enough ammo.

 

[pshn80]

I agree but a disastrous off season with a good coach we are still at square one. If we can get Dave and nail 1-2 free agents that actually help us than things get really interesting.

I agree with VF, one important task at a time.

Just to sober myself up after reading this thread, we have an interview tomorrow, maybe more, a sit down with a short list with management, a decision to make or confirm, a meetings and signing. So maybe Tuesday at the earliest. As all on here have agreed, we have AT LEAST three very good candidates. Soon we will know.

 

[Mike]

To be honest the clashes with his front office don't particularly concern me because they can happen, but as long as they can ultimately get on the same page for the betterment of the team, then that shouldn't be a problem for us. The last thing we want is a yes man at GM who does everything and agrees with everything that his head coach wants, and vice versa, the last thing we want is a yes man at head coach who does everything and agrees with everything that his GM/front office want. Now obviously if he's clashing with his front office because they didn't give him money for an expensive fish tank and tropical fish for his office, then that is a red flag. But if he clashed over roster moves, wanting to keep certain players, or recruit certain players, and in general just fight his corner for what he wants roster wise - then that I don't have a particular issue with because the majority of coaches and front offices butt heads at some point.

The only thing that does concern me, if they are true, is the reports that Joerger (or at least his agent) had requested permission to talk to other teams while he was still employed by the Grizzlies. That does make his commitment somewhat questionable and it is no wonder that the Grizzlies felt the need to move on to a coach more committed to their long term future. Then again, I don't blame Joerger for looking at other opportunities if he didn't get along with his front office.

Overall, I would be happy with Joerger as our next head coach. He has shown he has the ability to bring together a roster and get them playing like a well oiled machine, and anyone that can coach the team he did for most of this season and get them into the play offs with a winning record deserves a lot of respect. That team could easily have given up and tanked the rest of the season, but they didn't and that shows that him and his roster fought to win games and that is the type of gritty and determined coach we need at this team.

 

[Section 101]

I like Joerger. I do. I think he's a great coach. But look at the message Paul George left for Vogel. https://www.instagram.com/p/BFIKxWlnMv0/?hl=en

It's 100% confirmed that Joerger clashed with the front office. Including reaching out about other positions last year and this year as well. He is alleged to not have a great relationship with Conley, and it isn't too rosy with Gasol or Randolph either. We need a player's coach, and Joerger doesn't necessarily seem like one of them. But we shall see. He's one of the better coaches out there, so if we can lock him up I'm ok with that.

At the start of last year the owner wanted him to wear a headset on the sidelines. Almost got fired when he refused. Wouldn't you want out at that point?

http://basketball.realgm.com/wireta...d-Joerger-Wear-NFL-Style-Headset-On-Sidelines

 

[gunks]

Joerger carries more risk in a few ways.

But:

(1) the conflict with the Grizzlies FO/ownership is more understandable when considering that Memphis is quietly one of the most dysfunctional organizations in the NBA. It's on Vlade (and hopefully to a lesser extent Vivek)to avoid that in Sacramento.

(2) There is zero indication that Vogel was even considering the Kings job. I've heard no news about even a conversation, let alone an actual interview. You can only hire a guy that is interested in the gig.

(3) While both guys are great at coaching defense and getting guys to buy in, Joerger is more forward thinking offensively.

(4) The hottest coach on the market this season (Thibs) clashed a LOT with management and he wore on his players to the point that several said at the end of last season in their exit interviews that they didn't want to return if Thibodeau was still the coach.

When a young, innovative, flexible and successful coach is interested in the Kings job you make sure he is on the same page as the front office and if so, you snatch him up.

Excellent post, my good man!

Experience, offense, defense, people skills. ..... every candidate has warts.

As long as the good outweighs the bad, and this is definitely the case with Joerger, I say go for it.

 

[macadocious]

Hey guys, guess what? Mike Malone clashed with his front office and his star player.

Also the quotes I've read from Conley are far from a player who couldn't stand his coach.

 

[Telemachus]

With cuz's ankles we can't play fast paced. It about killed him this season.
His interview with CD let us know just how bad his ankles are.

It was tendinitis in his feet, not his ankles.

 

[upinsmoke]

We could end up rosy if we get this guy and hire the top tier of guys interviewed as assistance.

 

[Blob]

Joerger would be awesome for us with or w/o Boogie. Names like Blatt, Shaw and Vinnie D make my skin crawl. Joerger is blue collar no nonsense strong work ethic players coach who took a patch work squad to the playoffs. He won like 5 titles in the CBA and D-League before going to the Griz. How awesome is that?! That's called paying your dues and mastering your craft. I like Messina but I would rather have a young 40s coach than late 50s coach because there is less of generation gap and the younger coach is more passionate, generally speaking. Early 40s is actually the best age for head coach, IMHO, because you have seen a lot and experienced a lot but you still have a lot more you want to accomplish. We need to lock this guy up! This clip gives a quick insight into his journey from minor leagues to now.

 

[Blob]

Teams interested in Conley: Mavericks, Rockets, Pelicans, Jazz, Nets, Pacers, Bucks, Knicks, Magic, and Sixers...with potential teams in Nuggets, Spurs, and Celtics.

Lots of teams like him. It'll be hard to convince him to come here, and at this point, I don't even think I'd want to give him the max. The only real advantage he has over DC is defense.. is his defense going to be worth $15million more than Collison next year? I don't know....he's a not a great shooter. He's not a great scorer. He's not a great passer. He's not a great facilitator. The only above average thing he does is defend. DC does almost everything on offense better than him.

Also there are a few rumors about Joerger and Conley not getting along. Those could be absolutely false though.

I don't think we'd be front runners at all. Why play for a small dysfunctional Sacramento market, when he can get paid max by the Jazz? They're a small market, but they're not dysfunctional..and I bet he'd rather play next to Hayward/Favors/Gobert too vs. Cousins and Gay.

I'd rather throw 4 years and $50 million at Allen Crabbe (slight overpay but that's the nature of the beast) than chase Conley with all of our cap space who will have more appealing options. I think I would rather have Crabbe than Ryan Anderson too, who will cost more. Solving our starting SG position with a guy who can swing to '3' and defend has to be our top priority.

I have been playing close attention to Crabbe lately and though he emerged this season he will always be limited sharing shots with McCallum and Dame and likely will be seeking a more prominent role. He can become an easy 15 to 20 point scorer IMHO while also being a solid defender at two positions (SG and SF). He has a knack for knowing how to play and immense self-confidence, sort of the opposite of Ben. I'd feel comfortable with Darren, Seth, Crabbe as our guard rotation with Dunn as the draft pick.

In this scenario the Kings back court is revamped by bidding adieu to Rondo, Marco and Ben:

- Dunn
- Darren
- Crabbe
- Seth

Then with Ben, Marco, Rudy, Koufos, and even Boogie, you wheel and deal to fill out your front court anchored by Willie. The bottom line is there are better ways to spend our cap money than Conley, as good as he is. The value related to cost and related to our pending needs make him an imprudent target.

 

[pshn80]

I'd rather throw 4 years and $50 million at Allen Crabbe (slight overpay but that's the nature of the beast) than chase Conley with all of our cap space who will have more appealing options. I think I would rather have Crabbe than Ryan Anderson too, who will cost more. Solving our starting SG position with a guy who can swing to '3' and defend has to be our top priority.

I have been playing close attention to Crabbe lately and though he emerged this season he will always be limited sharing shots with McCallum and Dame and likely will be seeking a more prominent role. He can become an easy 15 to 20 point scorer IMHO while also being a solid defender at two positions (SG and SF). He has a knack for knowing how to play and immense self-confidence, sort of the opposite of Ben. I'd feel comfortable with Darren, Seth, Crabbe as our guard rotation with Dunn as the draft pick.

In this scenario the Kings back court is revamped by bidding adieu to Rondo, Marco and Ben:

- Dunn
- Darren
- Crabbe
- Seth

Then with Ben, Marco, Rudy, Koufos, and even Boogie, you wheel and deal to fill out your front court anchored by Willie. The bottom line is there are better ways to spend our cap money than Conley, as good as he is. The value related to cost and related to our pending needs make him an imprudent target.

Coach first.

 

[sauce-26]

Sam Amick ‏@sam_amick
Dave Joerger on a Sacramento tour today: city sights, new arena, local housing. Strong signs of a possible partnership. That being said...

 

[sauce-26]

Sam Amick ‏@sam_amick
Kings prez Vlade Divac, I'm told, plans on taking more time & following the process. No formal deal is expected today, but momentum possible

 

[sauce-26]

Sam Amick–Verified account ‏@sam_amick

The Joerger visit is later this afternoon. No word yet on whether he was greeted by a band of barrel racers upon landing at good, old SMF.

 

[bajaden]

I know this is offtopic, but i can't help myself:
Why do you think 90's basketball is superior?
Is it superior from an entertainment standpoint or in general?
Nobody knows how big mans of the past would do in todays NBA. It's more or less pure speculation.
What we do know is, that Cousins, who is regarded as a future HOF on this board, couldn't reach the playoffs yet.
What we do know is, that Memphis had a solid amount of success with two bigs and a couple of elite defenders.
What we do know is, that Anthony Davis and Andre Drummond reached the playoffs, but got swept.
And what we do know is, that guys like Monroe or Jefferson aren't considered as franchise players.
So right now smash mouth, low post basketball is not a big thing in this league.
Now of course we can assume, that's because there are no dominant bigs today (i tend to disagree).
But what we do know is, that teams with a space and pace approach make it into the playoffs and are capable of winning championships.
So from an objective point of view, it's really difficult to make the statement, that smashmouth, low post basketball is superior right now.
I agree - you have to play a style that suits your roster. But for the Kings, were Cousins, who is as versatile as any big that ever played, is the only untouchable building block from my point of view, that doesn't mean it has to be a slow, smashmouth, low post approach.
The task is to find a way to beat the current dominant playstyle without prematurely limiting this team out of the feeling, that one particular style of basketball is superior per se.

Hey, we agree! Those that would limit Cousins to growing roots in the post and bullying his way to the basket, would be doing Cousins, and the team a disservice. Cousins is too skilled to be a one trick pony. I could easily see Cousins being a key player in an offense, similar to the one the Spurs run with his passing skills. Actually, I don't see Cousins having a problem fitting into any offense, other than one that requires his having wheels on his feet instead of shoes.

As far as smashmouth basketball goes, it's a lot more difficult to play that style today than it was when the Pistons and the Knicks made it their trademark. The NBA decided that it wanted more scoring and a faster pace, so it changed the rules accordingly. You can't do a lot of the things that Mahorn and Oakley did in their heyday. So your right. If your a young bigman watching the NBA on TV, what do you see. You see Cousins pulling up for a three, or taking his man off the dribble from the top of the key. You see what makes a 7 footer valuable in today's NBA, and you emulate that. If you can do both, post up, or move outside and score, you have a chance to be a superstar. See Davis, Cousins, and Towns.

 

[itzcoatl]

Sam Amick ‏@sam_amick
Kings prez Vlade Divac, I'm told, plans on taking more time & following the process. No formal deal is expected today, but momentum possible

Let's go, Vlade - make the deal!

 

[Sac.Kings]

I wonder who Vlade is stalling for?

 

[bajaden]

Joerger carries more risk in a few ways.

But:

(1) the conflict with the Grizzlies FO/ownership is more understandable when considering that Memphis is quietly one of the most dysfunctional organizations in the NBA. It's on Vlade (and hopefully to a lesser extent Vivek)to avoid that in Sacramento.

(2) There is zero indication that Vogel was even considering the Kings job. I've heard no news about even a conversation, let alone an actual interview. You can only hire a guy that is interested in the gig.

(3) While both guys are great at coaching defense and getting guys to buy in, Joerger is more forward thinking offensively.

(4) The hottest coach on the market this season (Thibs) clashed a LOT with management and he wore on his players to the point that several said at the end of last season in their exit interviews that they didn't want to return if Thibodeau was still the coach.

When a young, innovative, flexible and successful coach is interested in the Kings job you make sure he is on the same page as the front office and if so, you snatch him up.

I agree on all points. If were looking for perfect, I think Jesus is probably busy with other things. That Joerger had a few players he didn't see eye to eye with, isn't a big deal. When your dealing with 15 players, I guarantee someone isn't going to be happy. Every one of those 15 players has his own idea about how the team should play, and most of them aren't objective. Anyone that's played organized sports, you tell me that you didn't question how you were being used at some point. The players make up the team, but it's the coach that makes them into a team. Otherwise you have five individuals running around on the court.

From my perspective, saying he wanted to play at a faster pace than the Grizzly's is a good thing. Adding a snail to the Grizzly's roster would probably speed up the pace. However, that doesn't automatically mean your going to jet your way up and down the court. How about somewhere in the middle with a little ball movement. Or a lot of ball movement. I can't predict that Joerger is going to be everything we want him to be. I can guarantee that some on this forum won't like what he does. I can remember some on this forum being critical of Adelman, and calling for a change when the Kings were winning over 50 games a year.

Point being, you can't make everyone happy, and that includes the players. Joerger looks like the good and right choice right now, so I hope Vlade gets it done, and sooner rather than later. The combine starts wednsday and for those interested in watching some of it, it's on ESPN2 on thursday and friday of this week, starting around noon pacific I believe. Some teams have already brought in some college players for workouts. In short, things are starting to move fast in the decision making dept, so lets get this coaching thing done, so we can move onto rebuilding the roster.

 

[steelevt]

And, from Aaron Bruski's Hoop-Ball.com report:

The Sacramento Kings’ coaching search is coming to an end soon. Barring an extremely unforeseen change of direction, sources tell Hoop Ball that former Memphis Grizzlies coach Dave Joerger will be their next head coach — though the Kings currently intend to meet with other finalists this week. Still, sources call the decision to hire Joerger a ‘formality.’

Formality smortality. Just call the other finalist and tell them jobs taken. I believe all the big names we wanted have already been interviewed (like blatt, Messina, vdn ) or aren't interested (thibs brooks Walton mchale)

 

[Livinthedream]

The big names don't want to interview if they have no shot. Don't waste time. Sign Joerger and pay that man his money. Stop playing around.

 

[King Baller]

Agreed, quit playing diplomat or hard to get. If Joerger is your guy, sign him.

 

[Livinthedream]

Before Joerger name, I would have been content with whatever decent coach we signed. Now, I'll be irritated if we lose Joerger to Houston or whoever because of a 'process'. If he's your guy, don't give another team an opportunity to tempt him.

 

[SacKings384]

I wonder who Vlade is stalling for?

Vogel and Messina probably. Mainly Vogel I'm guessing.

Either that or Vlade thinks it's being professional to give the guys that they were supposed to interview a shot. Although I think it's almost more disrespectful to waste their time when they've found their candidate already.

 

[Kingsgurl]

If vlade is convinced he's the guy (and it sounds that way) I could see a handshake deal until vlade contacts the others with interviews set up. It's not as if they aren't reading this stuff too

 

[VF21]

I wonder who Vlade is stalling for?

I don't think Vlade has stalled or is stalling for anyone. He's done his due diligence, he wasn't going to make a decision before a decision had to be made, and now we might just reap the benefits of showing patience.

 

[funkykingston]

I don't think Vlade has stalled or is stalling for anyone. He's done his due diligence, he wasn't going to make a decision before a decision had to be made, and now we might just reap the benefits of showing patience.

Im trusting Vlade to make the right choice. And honestly if the fear is that Joerger might be using the Kings as leverage then it makes even more sense not to extend a formal offer.

I want Vlade, Catanella and the next coach to be very successful for years and years to come. Make sure you get the right guy.

That said, if Joerger is their man then I also have no issue with them locking him up sooner than later.

In short, the Kings are only going to be successful in the next couple seasons if Vlade is as shrewd as I think he is so I'm rolling with whatever he's deciding.