fansinceday1
Starter
kyrie to the mavs. Damnit!
Dallas gets Kyrie!
- Thread starter fansinceday1
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fansinceday1
Starter
Tetsujin, was it you who told me the mavs didn’t have enough to get that deal done?
Kingz19
Hall of Famer
Ugh, for a weak ass package as well
iowamcnabb
Hall of Famer
Whoa don’t like his fit in Dallas
iowamcnabb
Hall of Famer
I don’t love it for Dallas but I guess it worked with Brunson. No defense now.
captain bill
All-Star
Between this and Book getting healthy the competition at the top of the West just got much harder. Mavs and Suns will be gunning for top 5. Hopefully we get some more Fox second half magic to keep pace and stay above the play-in bracket
I think this is a negative for Dallas. DFS was the only guy playing defense and literally the only dependable forward. He played like 36 minutes per game. They are going to miss him a lot. Dude is a nails defender. Seriously, the healthy forwards on their roster are Hardaway, Bullock, and Josh Green. Then they have Bertans, Kief Morris and and Kleber all hurt, but those are all stretch 4's or small 5s. Are they going to move Wood to the 4? That seems less than ideal for spacing (and defense). The depth, especially at the wing, is terrible. We lament how we only have Keegan and Barnes as big wings who can guard guys like Durant, Lebron, Kawhi, Butler, Ingram, Tatum, etc... Who is guarding big wings (or anyone) in Dallas? Bullock? LOL.
And Kyrie and Luka are going to share one ball? Even if they want to share, I don't think either is as effective without the ball. You have two guys who are at their best with the ball. Kyrie can play a bit off ball, but the quality suffers. Luka has never shown he can play off ball. I don't think it works.
If they start Kyrie/Luka/Hardaway/Bullock/Wood they will get run off the floor. That is like past years Kings level bad on defense. And what is coming in off the bench? McGee, Powell, Bertans, Kief Morris, Kleber, Josh Green, Frank Ntiklina, and Jaden Hardy. That is next level bad depth, and they don't have many assets to improve. They literally have no 3/4 wings. Hardaway and Bullock are 2/3 wings, and the other guys are all stretch 4s, or 4/5s.
And Kyrie and Luka are going to share one ball? Even if they want to share, I don't think either is as effective without the ball. You have two guys who are at their best with the ball. Kyrie can play a bit off ball, but the quality suffers. Luka has never shown he can play off ball. I don't think it works.
If they start Kyrie/Luka/Hardaway/Bullock/Wood they will get run off the floor. That is like past years Kings level bad on defense. And what is coming in off the bench? McGee, Powell, Bertans, Kief Morris, Kleber, Josh Green, Frank Ntiklina, and Jaden Hardy. That is next level bad depth, and they don't have many assets to improve. They literally have no 3/4 wings. Hardaway and Bullock are 2/3 wings, and the other guys are all stretch 4s, or 4/5s.
So Brooklyn ended up taking on about $64M in future salaries (1 year of Dinwiddie and 3 years of Finney-Smith) in exchange for only one FRP.
One interesting point here is that the Dinwiddie contract was actually signed by Brooklyn in a sign-and-trade with the Wizards - a contract that has now been traded twice, once for Porzingis and now for Kyrie. Assuming Brooklyn doesn't turn around and ship Dinwiddie elsewhere next year, they're going to end up paying about $28M of the $60M deal - about 47% of the contract. Off the top of my head, I can't think of a sign-and-trade that ended up coming back to the team that shipped them off, certainly with that much of the deal left to run.
One interesting point here is that the Dinwiddie contract was actually signed by Brooklyn in a sign-and-trade with the Wizards - a contract that has now been traded twice, once for Porzingis and now for Kyrie. Assuming Brooklyn doesn't turn around and ship Dinwiddie elsewhere next year, they're going to end up paying about $28M of the $60M deal - about 47% of the contract. Off the top of my head, I can't think of a sign-and-trade that ended up coming back to the team that shipped them off, certainly with that much of the deal left to run.
KingsFanSince85
All-Star
Say what you want, but #77 and Kyrie will be able to score. Both can create. Both can carry the team at any time.
Neither of them are Russell Westbrick type stars. They‘re likely to be quite dangerous no matter what level of defense they’re playing. It’s not totally dissimilar to LBJ and Kyrie when they were together.
IDK how it’ll work out in the end, but I can see why the Mavs went for it.
Neither of them are Russell Westbrick type stars. They‘re likely to be quite dangerous no matter what level of defense they’re playing. It’s not totally dissimilar to LBJ and Kyrie when they were together.
IDK how it’ll work out in the end, but I can see why the Mavs went for it.
KainLear
Starter
Mavs been past due to get Luka some extra help before it turns into 08-09 Lebron's first stint in Cleveland.
burekijogurt
Starter
The only question is how well they will mesh personally, and I don't mean on the floor, they can take turns on the floor. with LBJ and Kyrie there was an established pecking order I guess.
KingsFanSince85
All-Star
I can see that. But Kyrie has played with both LBJ and KD. So he won't be exactly learning on the fly. I think it'll be more about #77 learning how and when to defer. He's got the bigger adjustment to make.
All Kyrie has to do is understand that it's #77's team. Just like Brooklyn was KD's team and Cleveland was LBJ's team. In all three situations he was just there to be the missing link.
iowamcnabb
Hall of Famer
Will Dallas have cap space if they don’t re-sign Kyrie or Wood? Sportrac isn’t updated but it looks to me like they would still be committed to around 118 mil next year without them.
ockingsfan
Starter
So, the Mavs now have 2 ball dominant Diva Point Guards and still just one ball. What could go wrong? 
iowamcnabb
Hall of Famer
The good news is the LA teams didn’t get him. The Lakers might be mostly out of options as Detroit looks like it will hold on to their guys. They could probably get Trent but I don’t think that’s enough
He’ll play ten games and then decides he’s unhappy and screw them over.
burekijogurt
Starter
In both cases LBJ and KD were established, no questions asked, "senior" top dogs. I'm not sure Kyrie views Luka as such. But I agree that he needs to if this is going to work.
LoungeLizard
Starter
This should be interesting for sure. We’ll see how they adapt to playing with each other. Both seem to need the ball in their hands, but Luka definitely has a second “star” now. I don’t think they’re contenders for a title or anything but certainly stronger than they were. On the other hand, this is Kyrie and this could blow up completely.
They switched up the All-Star format so it doesn't matter which conference the players are in anymore. The All-NBA teams aren't conference specific either so it doesn't really affect anything besides adding another obstacle for Western Conference teams in the playoffs.
The thing I love about this trade is that Brooklyn essentially salary dumped Kyrie to make sure he couldn't force his way into joining Lebron in LA without taking a pay cut. Good for them.
I think this was the best outcome for us assuming Kyrie was heading west. Mavs lost depth even though may have gained a marginal upgrade in talent. While I'm sure they can buy some down the road, those second round picks are a lot more useful to a team like Dallas with a lot of holes at the back of their bench than the average contender too. It will be interesting to see how it shakes out but I'm glad he didn't go to LA.
Bigger worry potentially is can KD get out before the deadline, and would he wind up on a team we're currently in front of? (the one in Arizona being highly problematic destination)
Bigger worry potentially is can KD get out before the deadline, and would he wind up on a team we're currently in front of? (the one in Arizona being highly problematic destination)
To me, the issue is not whether Kyrie knows how to play with an alpha. The two big questions are 1) whether Luka knows how to play with a ball dominant guy; and 2) whether Kyrie views Luka as the alpha.
As to #1 there is zero evidence that Luka knows how to play with another ball dominant guy like Lebron and KD do. He might get there, but there will be a huge learning curve for Luka.
As to #2, I’m not sure this version of Kyrie thinks he is anyone’s #2 option. He is coming to Dallas to be option 1A, not option 2.
And no one on the roster in the 1-4 positions have ever shown any desire to even try on D. Not just that they aren’t good, but they don’t even try. Bullock is the closest to a guy who will try, but he has limitations, especially playing as a 4. Lol. And none of those 5s are good enough defenders to make up for it. They are all average or worse. People are really underestimating how bad a Kyrie/Luka backcourt is at defensive effort (much less skill) and just how bad and small the wing depth is.
Should be $108M, not $118M.
I find this argument a little odd considering the Mavs rode a three point guard attack into the Western Conference Finals last season. Granted Kyrie Irving is a whole other type of personality compared to Dinwiddie and Brunson but he's played with Lebron, he's played with KD, and he shared the ball (some of the time
) with both Jaylen Brown and Jayson Tatum in Boston. Theoretically they'll both attract enough attention to get the other guy easier shots. Defense is a concern for that team but not any more than it already was. It will be interesting to see if this ends up being a short-term investment for the Mavs or if this partnership has legs.
SacTownKid
Hall of Famer
This could very well hurt, and hurt bad for Sac. A direct competitor probably jumped them in the talent race. Better hope Kyrie plays for himself.
SLAB
Hall of Famer
At this point with Dallas making this move and the Suns getting hot and healthy, I’m just hoping to stay above the play-in line.
I find this argument a little odd considering the Mavs rode a three point guard attack into the Western Conference Finals last season. Granted Kyrie Irving is a whole other type of personality compared to Dinwiddie and Brunson but he's played with Lebron, he's played with KD, and he shared the ball (some of the time
Kyrie is levels different in usage than Dinwiddie and Brunson. And if you think the defense is no more concern than it was before you have not paid attention to Finney Smith. DFS is a top 10 wing defender in the league, has legit 3/4 size, and is the ultimate 3/D glue guy. To think you are going to replace his 35-40 minutes with undersized Reggie bullock and hardaway is laughable. It is the same problem of many recent kings teams. Playing a bunch of no-defense 2/3 wings at the 3 and 4 and being surprised when big wings dominate us.
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