I'm sure this comment wasn't meant to be inflammatory, or anything...
Cousins suspended by the team
- Thread starter ReinadelosReys
- Start date
ArcoKings
Starter
I was so pissed off when I read the Cuz news at the bottom of the tv screen during the rebroadcast of the Kings/OKC game. Dude needs to just chill and handle things professionally. He was 'behaving' of late, too. He's a young kid and has lots of growing up to do... more than I thought. I hope the win vs. the Suns really stings Cuz.
gunks
Hall of Famer
After blowing up he generally seems remorseful...So I'm awaiting Cuz's word on the entire debacle with bated breath.
Hopefully he makes up with Greene/Kings. Wouldnt want this incident to fester. He acted extremely immature, I'm sure he knows it...Lets just see if he mans up and admits it. Dude just wants to win. All those close losses had to be taking their toll.
Just to add salt in the wound: Cousins has been averaging 17/11 this month...And thats against elite competition.
Hopefully he makes up with Greene/Kings. Wouldnt want this incident to fester. He acted extremely immature, I'm sure he knows it...Lets just see if he mans up and admits it. Dude just wants to win. All those close losses had to be taking their toll.
Just to add salt in the wound: Cousins has been averaging 17/11 this month...And thats against elite competition.
no it wsnt but ive lost all hope in the matter of the kings staying here. i mean we had 10 years. if something was going to happen it shuld already have.
Glenn
Hall of Famer
I understand totally. However, if we put a winner on the court and every sign is pointing that way, people will turn out. Voters may change their mind with an exciting team on the court. The Maloofs have hung in their. Heck we were sure they wre going to move the team a decade ago and they haven't. This would be a lousy time to give up.
I think you are far too negative about Cuz though. It's not like his behavior is a surprise. He shows tremendous abilities to learn. I feel fairly confident in saying that he doesn't want to lose control. He is very intense and will mellow as he gets older. It's a process of years and not months. I have little doubts that we are watching a superstar in the making and he will attain that status as a King.
Gary
All-Star
Nope.. I have watched a ton of games both in GS and in college. He moves without the ball MUCH MUCH better than Evans does. I am not saying he's great or anything but he actually does some moving when he doesn't have the ball. He's not as ball dominant as Evans is.
Gary
All-Star
Vlade4GM
All-Star
Eh... Curry is actually having a better year than Reke.
Thing is, Curry is about maxed out as who he is as a player. Without Ellis, he might average 5 more PPG, but he's never going to be that guy who can carry a team on his back. With luck, dedication, and some good coaching, Reke can be that player down the line.
It would be nice to have Curry's brain in Reke's body though
I would take Curry over Evans rather than hope that Evans one day completely alters the style of player he has always had. Curry may never be a franchise player, but I do think he has the potential to improve as a playmaker. I think Evans is too ball dominant to ever be a guy to build a championship around. His game is all about pounding the ball until he gets into the lane. No championship offense can thrive with a player that stops ball movement like he does. It's a great show, but it's not how championship basketball is played. It doesn't happen unless that player is absolutely dominant like LeBron or something, and Evans will never come near that. Also, where is the shot he was supposed to improve on? How many players that come in as horrendous shooters become good shooters when they don't even improve one bit in their second year?
So yes, I take Curry over Evans, instead of banking on a hope that Evans overhauls his game. I take the sure thing of Curry's IQ, versatility, and efficiancy. Curry is a player that is great on and off the ball, that is so underrated in this league. Curry will always be a very valuable player on the offensive end, Tyreke may be one of those guys that's all individual talent. I hope I'm wrong, but I don't think he's ever going to be good enough to justify how much needs to pound the ball to be effective. I don't think he's the kind of player you can build a championship level team around. Curry isn't either, but Curry doesn't have to be in order to justify his style of play. He can fit in with great offensive players. I think Evans as a franchise player on a contending team is a pie in the sky hope at this point.
Vlade4GM
All-Star
Nothing is for certain about Cousins, but I'd only like to point out that his behavior is not common for players his age. More often than not it's a personality defect and they stay who they are for the duration. Maybe it's something the team can learn to work around, maybe he spends his career being a perpetual salvage job for many different teams. Poor attitudes have taken down players more talented than him.
I disagree with your point that not dealing well with losing is a good thing. Coping with failure is a big part of what makes a good competitor, because failure is always happening in competition, in one way or another. If you can't learn to deal with failure in a constructive way, then you will continue to struggle. The pouting, complaining, and blaming of others is not a sign of a good competitor IMO.
Bricklayer
Don't Make Me Use The Bat
You wouldn't expect any less from Donte.
Despite all the crud, and all the money we have to spend, things like this are what give you pause a bit when considering how to finish off the rebuild this summer. Donte is a good teammate, Jason is a good teammate, Cisco is a good teammate who serves as a mentor for the kids. Those sorts of things don't show up in a stat sheet but can be very useful in promoting longterm stability, in particular with a volatile personality like Cousins as part fo the mix. If you ship those guys out and replace them with me players, or tempermental players, or just guys who won't accept a role, and you could potentially lose ground even with more talent. We are definitely going to add talent this summer, and need to, but you have to be careful that you don't break anything along the way.
P.S. As an aside, the Curry stuff remains just silly. He'll never be the man on a great team. He's great for fantasy ball. But once you get serious about trying to win it all you take a physically dominant player who looks like Evans every day and twice on Sunday and hope he smooths out his game rather than hitch your horse to a pretty tweener knowing for a fact you'll never go anywhere until you go out and get a physically dominant superstar type player to play ahead of him. Aim low and low you will be.
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To add on, it goes without saying that there are aspects of Evans' game that he needs to change/work on. It's certainly true that we have to "hope" for Tyreke's playing style to evolve (as did Kobe's and like the big 3 in boston), but to say that you'd take Curry over him NOW is just silly. The guy is in his frikin 2nd year on a bad team. What did Steve Nash do in his second year? Certainly not see the floor perfectly and set guys up as much.
I understand how some posters can empathise with DMC, but to protect him from criticism over this is going overboard. There is a difference between calling out guys for their play and running after them yelling. Till we know the full facts I shan't really delve too deep into this, but let's just say that rookies should not have a sense of entitlement as if they are 5 time MVPs carrying the team on their back.
I still don't get the whole discontent with the last play. With 5 seconds to go, going for the last shot, you simply cannot inbound the ball to Omri. You get a clear passing lane to Tyreke, and he goes for the win but misses by a bit. Sucks to be us. May not have been the best play, but certainly not one that was THAT bad.
Big Cuz 15
All-Star
i think he has to. he doesn't have the physique or ball handling abilities to get into the lane consistently.
for me, i take evans time and time over. if cousins is not clicking or in foul trouble on the bench.. we have reke who will force double teams. curry on the other hand, may or may not; probably the latter. curry can be shut down w/ a great defender. if we are concerned w/ shooting and play making abilities.. we can always get a player that can do those things alongside reke.
UK_King
Starter
bajaden
Hall of Famer
Your read on what I mean't about not dealing well with losing is dead wrong. And I'm not advocating throwing a tantrum or getting into fights. Lets use a little common sense here. My point is that he doesn't like to lose, and thats a good thing. I don't want a bunch of guys that go off the floor smiling, holding hands and singing kumbaya when they lose. Yes, you can learn from losing. And you can also learn to accept losing. I've seen it happen too many times. As Vince Lombardi said. "Show me a good loser, and I'll show you a loser".
I will agree that if placed against the backdrop of all the other players his age in the NBA, his behavior isn't common. But in the real world, it is. If you don't believe that, I can take you on a tour of places where his behavior would be a welcome sight. And thats not an endorsement of his behavior. Its just that the NBA isn't a microcosm of the real world. Could Cousins still be the same player with the same behavior 10 years from now? Sure, I guess so. But thats not written in stone. I guess I have more faith in the human spirit than others. He says he wants to change. He says the right things. So for now I'm going to believe him. That doesn't mean I'm going to excuse him.
Let me make one thing perfectly clear, and this isn't intended toward you Vlade. There's a distinct difference between being outraged at bad behavior, and taking pleasure at that same players failure. I believe there are people on this fourm that can't wait to say "I told you so". I believe these people want to be right about Cousins so badly that they want him to fail. Sorry folks. I can't buy into that concept. All I want is for the Kings to win. So if Cousins succeeds, and Tyreke succeeds and the rest of the team succeeds, then I'm a happy man.
Do I believe that Evans is a true PG? No! Do I believe he dribbles the ball too much at times? Yes! Do I dislike him because of it? Do I wish we had drafted another player in his stead? No, No, and No!!!!! Because he's an extremely talented player, and were lucky to have him. So for god's sake, can we have a little patience. The same applies to Cousins. Both players have flaws. And both players have winning attitudes. Both players have been winners on every team they've played on. So this is hard for them. Perhaps harder for Cousins right now, because this is his first year of losing, and there's no doubt he's very immature emotionally. Now if your 5'11", weigh 185 pounds, and have an emotional outburst, somehow that just doesn't seem as bad as when your 6'11" and weigh 275 pounds.
I don't think he quite gets that. I really doubt that he thought very much about the outcome of his actions when he lost his temper and started calling out Evans or Greene or whomever it was he called out. If he had, I sincerely doubt he would have done what he did. I don't think his goal at the time was to ultimately be sitting in Petrie's office today at 2 pm instead of on a plane with his teammates. Actions have consequences. And hopefully he'll start to realize that sometimes it best to look before you leap. Maybe the best thing Petrie could do is take away the one thing he loves the most for a while. Let him sit at home for a while and think about it. Not knowing all the circumstances, I'll trust Petrie to do the right thing. Ultimately, all I want is for Cousins to succeed. Because thats the best possible outcome for both him, and the team.
bajaden
Hall of Famer
Vlade4GM said:
There have been quite a few players that have become good shooters, or at minimun, decent enough shooters to the point where you have to respect their shot. But before I get into that, lets first deal with your premise. That Tyreke hasn't improved. There's a difference between his not improving as much as you or I would have liked, and not impoving at all.
last year he took 1.9 three pt shots per game. So far this year he's averaging 2.7 three pt shots per game. Which in part, is contributing to his overall lower FGA. However, last year he shot 25.5% overall from beyond the arc, and this year so far, he's shooting 29.1%. And improvement of almost 4%. While not earth shattering, Lebron, who shot in the 20% range his first year in the league impoved only 5% from his 1st to 2nd year.
So while taking more shots, he's making a higher percentage of those shots. I grant you that he's far from being where he needs to be. But he has improved. At least percentage wise. His actual shooting form is still a work in progress. Sometimes it looks better, and sometimes it doesn't.
But as to how many players have improved their shot after just a little or no improvement in their second year. Well I'm not going to bore you with a huge list of players. I'll just give you a few. And because they may have eventually become creditable outside shooters, doesn't guarantee Tyreke will. Lets face it, Wade has never been a good 3 pt shooter, and probably never will as long as he has his athleticism.
Michael Jordan's 3 pt. percentages:
1st year: 17.3%
2nd year: 16.7%
3rd year: 18.2%
4th year: 13.2%
5th year: 27.6%
6th year: 37.6%
It took him 6 years to finally reach the numbers were all familiar with.
Magic Johnson's 3 pt percentages:
1st year: 22.6%
2nd year: 17.6%
3rd year: 20.7%
11th year: 38.4%
Magie didn't start shooting the ball well from beyond the arc until his 11th year. So its never too late I guess. He still made the HOF.
Gerald Wallace's 3 pt percentages:
4th year: 27.4%
5th year: 28.0%
6th year: 32.5%
Last year: 37.1%
I started with his 4th year because he just didn't shoot three pointers until then. Unless you count shooting 6 and missing them all. Gerald will probably never be a great 3pt shooter, but he has made himself into someone you have to guard. And thats really all Tyreke has to do.
If he's willing to do the work, and it appears he has a good work ethic, then there's no reason to believe he won't eventually become a good outside shooter. I'm giving no guarantee's though..
sidney
Starter
Interesting. Solid post. Thank you
Section 101
All-Star
% is great, but what about the number of 3 pt shots? This is the problem.
Evans 37-141, 45.8% overall shooting
MJ 9-52, 51.5% overall shooting
Magic 7-31, 53% overall shooting
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Sluggah
All-Star
I like how it all starts with them bashing cousins, then turns into them hoping he gets traded to their team.
Vlade4GM
All-Star
There are plenty of players that don't like losing, that's not really a standout attribute. It's an attribute that most competitors have. While it's certainly better than players like Kwame Brown and Eddy Curry, it's not something that really separates him all that much.
The real world is irrelevant, the NBA isn't even close to being like the real world. Especially for someone like Cousins who is making millions, and even if he doesn't do very well, he'll probably still make good money and get chance after chance from teams trying to salvage him.
I don't have anything against Cousins, I just want to point out that the prognosis may not be all kitty cats and puppy dogs with him. Maybe I'm just a cynic.
The real world is irrelevant, the NBA isn't even close to being like the real world. Especially for someone like Cousins who is making millions, and even if he doesn't do very well, he'll probably still make good money and get chance after chance from teams trying to salvage him.
I don't have anything against Cousins, I just want to point out that the prognosis may not be all kitty cats and puppy dogs with him. Maybe I'm just a cynic.
sacgirl88
Bench
via sam amick at twitter
@samickAOL
Kings forward DeMarcus Cousins is headed for Oklahoma City to join the team, according to a source close to the situation.
http://twitter.com/#!/samickAOL
@samickAOL
Kings forward DeMarcus Cousins is headed for Oklahoma City to join the team, according to a source close to the situation.
http://twitter.com/#!/samickAOL
Bricklayer
Don't Make Me Use The Bat
different eras when it came to 3pt shooting as part of the offense.
But if you can find Reke a few knockdown shooters of the Byron Scott/Jim Paxson variety to pass to, he'd probably be happy to back off that shot and up his shooting percentages. Not being able to hit a three is so common its almost a prerequisite for high level star perimeter types when they come into the league, whether it be Magic, Michael, LeBron, CP3, Wade, Payton, Kidd or whoever else. Generally you quickly surround them with shooting roleplayers until they slowly pull the percetanges up themselves.
Kings Faithful
Starter
Exactly... Evans does need to improve his shooting, but he doesn't need to become a 3 point sharpshooter. What he needs is some 3 point sharp shooters around him. There is alot of them around the league and getting our hands on one or two of them would dramatically imrpove this team.
I think maybe the problem is that you're comparing him to two of the best players of all time.
Peter_Gibbons
Starter
In case someone wants to watch it.
Cousins was open for a split second. I don't know how many seconds it was into the 5 sec clock to inbound. Greene was probably a bit nervous in that situation and didn't want to risk it with Durant hovering. Cousins is still a kid and doesn't understand that other people may look at the same situation as him and interprets it differently. He'll learn.
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Vlade4GM
All-Star
So you equate overall shooting ability with 3 pt%? That just doesn't make a whole lot of sense. Besides, I'm not going to put a ton of stock into 4 percentage points with only a .8 attempt per game increase.
Jordan improved his mid range shot early on when he was in the league. He didn't start paying attention to his 3 pt shot until he was older and needed it more.
Magic? Okay, I'll give you that it took a while for him to improve his shot, but he turned into an okay shooter. It was mostly when he was in the set position and had space, since his release was so low.
Gerald Wallace is still a crappy shooter. One fluke year of 3 pt shooting does not change that.
rainmaker
Hall of Famer
But even during that sec Cousins was open, from Donte's view, he can clearly see Omri already cutting towards Cousins, and passing between Donte and Cousins. For Cousins to get the ball there, safely, Omri would have had to of been out of the picture, not cutting directly between Donte and Cousins.
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Peter_Gibbons
Starter
If you are referring to before the Casspi cut then yes, Greene couldn't have got it in. Thats why I mentioned that it depends on how far it was into the 5 sec clock at that point. After Casspi ran by, Greene could've got the ball to Cousins if he didn't already hurried it to Tyreke. So maybe its because he felt 5 secs was almost up. Again, Cousins needs to realize that not everyone is going to think exactly the same way as he does. Sometimes you just won't get what you want everytime. Tyreke had an OK look and it didn't go it. Move on.
Its really more of repeatedly losing by a few points through out the season thats leading up to this explosion rather than just this one play. DMC needs to learn to control himself better.
He added that there is no suspension of any sort for Cousins (so he wasn't technically "suspended" yesterday, which means he doesn't lose the day's pay). No word yet on Donte but I wouldn't expect anything different.
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