Carlisle Fired!

[Packt]

Hmmm... when I look at that list, I see a raw rookie, 2 guys not known for their defense, KT, and a draft pick that might end up being a guard.

Could be worse, we could be without Justin.

But is that the sort of game we want? Arco famously loud for having 18,000 people all snoring in unison?

Isn't Justin Williams a FA?

 

[fnordius]

Isn't Justin Williams a FA?

Good point. That leaves KT, SAR and Brad. Not my choice for stifling defense.

 

[Bricklayer]

Brad Miller/SAR/Justin Williams/Kenny Thomas/draft pick...that's potentially 5 bigs for the rotation. Could be worse.

Really?

That better be a helluva draft pick because the rest of that rotation stinks to the tune of bottom 5 in the league.


In any case, Carlisle's slow it down game isn't really that dependent on his bigs. He's slowed it down wiht all sorts of combos there. But, and here's the key BUT that the Maloofs were incapable of comprehending last offseason, Carlisle isn't going to magically make that crew great defensively sans a bigtime defensive anchor inside ala Big Ben or Jermaine.

 

[BMiller52]

Just the thought of Rick Carlisle for coach makes me want to vomit.

 

[SacTownKid]

Well if you want a winner this guys proven it. But if the rumors are true, no way would Ron want to stay, or maybe Rick would even want to come here with Ron on the team.

 

[Löwenherz]

I have an idea!

Let's hire Carlisle

Then trade Bibby, SAR, Salmons and the #10 to Indy for O'Neal and Tinsley.

That would give us this lineup:

Brad Miller
Jermaine O'Neal
Ron Artest
Kevin Martin (Reggie Miller)
Jamaal Tinsley

Coach Rick Carlisle.

We could call it Hoosiers West

Sarcasm aside, there's a lot worse we could do than Carlisle. The comparison with Muss is unfair. Carlisle has had success as head coach of two different teams.

Muss had/has never been a successful head coach.

 

[ParniValjak]

I have an idea!

Let's hire Carlisle

Then trade Bibby, SAR, Salmons and the #10 to Indy for O'Neal and Tinsley.

That would give us this lineup:

Brad Miller
Jermaine O'Neal
Ron Artest
Kevin Martin (Reggie Miller)
Jamaal Tinsley

Coach Rick Carlisle.

We could call it Hoosiers West

Sarcasm aside, there's a lot worse we could do than Carlisle. The comparison with Muss is unfair. Carlisle has had success as head coach of two different teams.

Muss had/has never been a successful head coach.

The comparisons to Muss come in terms of his micro management and him wanting to call every play from the sidelines.

In terms of coaching ability alone, Carlisle is an excellent coach but his way of doing things rubs players the wrong way after a while. Before he got sacked at Detroit we were hearing the same things we are hearing out of Indiana now.

If Carlisle can address the issues in his make up then I would jump on his bandwagon so quickly but its still an issue. As Bricklayer said, just appointing him makes us instantly better but in 2 years time we will be hearing the same things from players and the organization that we have heard about Muss this year.

There is more to coaching that knowing your Xs and Os as we have just found out.

 

[ParniValjak]

http://www.indystar.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20070425/SPORTS04/70425045

Here are some interesting pros and cons about Carlisle as a coach

Indiana Pacers coach Rick Carlisle met with CEO Donnie Walsh and president Larry Bird on Tuesday. Team officials haven't commented since the season ended, but it's possible Carlisle's fate could be determined soon. Three of the most pressing questions: Will he return? Will he move upstairs? Will he be coaching elsewhere? As the Carlisle watch enters a second week, beat reporter Mike Wells assesses the merits of keeping and firing the coach.

The case for Carlisle

• Rick Carlisle is considered a brainiac because of his vast "Xs" and "Os" knowledge. Larry Bird leaned on him to run the offense when Bird was the coach. Jermaine O'Neal said the Pacers' myriad offensive plays make them difficult to prepare for.
• Can't hold him responsible for the brawl, suspensions, trades, off-court problems, mood issues and countless injuries, which led to 82 starting combinations the past three seasons. No other NBA coach dealt with that much, and he still made the playoffs two of those seasons.
• Who's better? Bird has said he will trade any player if it improves the team. Does that hold true for the coach? Carlisle is the only coach to finish in the top five of the NBA Coach of the Year voting in each of his first four seasons. He won the award in 2002. If the Pacers fire him, he'll have opportunities to resurface as a head coach.
• Players might complain about his restrictive style, but Carlisle must be doing something right. He coached two franchises to the Eastern Conference finals in two of the past six seasons.

The case against Carlisle

• Players have criticized Carlisle's people skills. They acknowledge he knows the game and is a master tactician but has trouble communicating and relating with players.
• His micromanaging style doesn't fit in a league full of independent contractors. Jermaine O'Neal has called the Pacers' offense "complicated" and said he doesn't always execute it properly. The Pacers brought in players to run, but Carlisle quickly applied the brakes, which led to the Golden State trade that brought in players who suit his structured style.
• Players grew tired of his over-analyzing during shootarounds. What typically is a 45-minute workout for other teams often lasted 75 minutes because Carlisle frequently added elements to the offense. One security official said Carlisle holds the longest shootarounds in the league.
• He hasn't won enough. His victory totals have decreased every year since winning 61 games in 2003-04.

 

[Circa_1985_Fan]

Good point. That leaves KT, SAR and Brad. Not my choice for stifling defense.

Yeah, and we only have to look back about 10 games to see how stifling that defense was.

 

[Smills91]

The comparisons to Muss come in terms of his micro management and him wanting to call every play from the sidelines.

In terms of coaching ability alone, Carlisle is an excellent coach but his way of doing things rubs players the wrong way after a while. Before he got sacked at Detroit we were hearing the same things we are hearing out of Indiana now.

If Carlisle can address the issues in his make up then I would jump on his bandwagon so quickly but its still an issue. As Bricklayer said, just appointing him makes us instantly better but in 2 years time we will be hearing the same things from players and the organization that we have heard about Muss this year.

There is more to coaching that knowing your Xs and Os as we have just found out.

One thing that Carlisle has done well is taken poor to average role players on teams and turned them into VERY productive players. If Carlisle came in as an "interim coach" for 2-3 years, improved the values of Mike/Brad/Kenny/SAR/Ron etc then we could potential trade them off for a higher yield and expedite the rebuilding process. This is screaming Kenny Thomas to me.

 

[LPKingsFan]

also becomes a guy who has already been canned twice despite a lot of intial success, and who has had a lot of players angry with him for strangling the game.

I wouldn't say he was "canned twice." Maybe with this Indy situation, sure, but Detroit was different. What if the Maloof's flirtations with Phil Jackson had gotten somewhere, and we let Rick go? Would that have meant Rick wasn't a good coach anymore? No, it would have meant that they found a bigger and better face--which I feel was what went down with Larry Brown.

As for Indy, I imagine his micromanaging wore his players out, but with all that has gone on with that team (the franchise still has not recovered from The Brawl, IMHO) there were a lot more pressing issues than Carlisle's coaching style.

 

[Kingster]

When I think of Carlisle I think of a slow down, grind it out, kind of coach. From what I've heard, he like to call a lot of plays from the bench. If we go young and athletic, is this kind of coach that is going to get the most out of them? I'm skeptical.

 

[Kingster]

One thing that Carlisle has done well is taken poor to average role players on teams and turned them into VERY productive players. If Carlisle came in as an "interim coach" for 2-3 years, improved the values of Mike/Brad/Kenny/SAR/Ron etc then we could potential trade them off for a higher yield and expedite the rebuilding process. This is screaming Kenny Thomas to me.

If that is the plan, then just shoot me. That means we would have to see Mike, Brad, Kenny, SAR and Ron for the next 2-3 years.........AHHHHHHHH!!!!