Brady Heslip to Kings?

pshn80 said:
I need to stir the locker room up, to stir Stauskas up,to do something shake the mental attitude of the bunch, not stability. To me right now stability is locking in the poor play and all its causes. Is this an important move? Not at all. But I don't think it is stupid or worth rebuke.
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You are better served by 'stirring up the lockerroom' by bringing in some sort of veteran player.
Bringing in an undrafted rookie isn't going to help the locker room and is being unfair to Heslip.

In the last game Stauskas played 16 minutes.
In those 16 minutes his teammates kicked it out to him for an open 3pt shot One time...that is it. In 16 minutes. (He made the shot by the way)

What makes you think that Heslip will even get the ball if he manages to get into the game?
I ask, because the players are not even getting the ball to Ben or Nik right now, so why would they pass up their own opportunity for an undrafted player who can't defend, rebound, or pass coming in on a 10-day contract.

The FO brought the house down around the heads of the players and the FO needs to do something to fix it.
Bringing in a guy like Heslip makes zero sense at this time.
Again, it's not a terrible move that the FO should be ridiculed over...but it isn't a good move and it certainly shouldn't be praised.
 
Siranthony said:
I don't know why but I kind of like that the new management is pissing people off around here. They think outside the box and in the long run I think it will be a good thing. I like that they are running an unconventional offence in Reno in order to find talent they might otherwise not. It is smart to have a plan to use your assets to your advantage. As opposed to running a garbage team that none of the players will ever see the light of the NBA, for the 10 people who show up to see the games.
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Conversely, you could create a system that has won NBA titles since the history of forever, and then have a better shot of finding NBA ready players running an NBA system. It's not like the game of basketball is in its nascency.
 
Siranthony said:
I don't know why but I kind of like that the new management is pissing people off around here. They think outside the box and in the long run I think it will be a good thing. I like that they are running an unconventional offence in Reno in order to find talent they might otherwise not. It is smart to have a plan to use your assets to your advantage. As opposed to running a garbage team that none of the players will ever see the light of the NBA, for the 10 people who show up to see the games.
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You know, I could sit down across from a chess master and start using my pawn to hop over multiple guys like I was playing checkers too, but it wouldn't be a sign of me "thinking outside the box", it would be a sign of me not understanding the game.

I made this point in a tweet to Vivek -- the NBA is not a tech startup. The boundaries are not unlimited. It is a bounded set. There are rules. there are 5 men on a side, 10 foot baskets, standardized courts, and 70 years of history, of systems, coaches, players, champions, and losers. Your task in running an NBA team is not to invent some entirely new way to play the game. Its to as completely as possible understand all the ways it has been played, and discern from those the best way for your own team to play it.

"Thinking outside the box" is an empty buzzword that can just as easily connote ignorance as brilliance.
 
Bricklayer said:
You know, I could sit down across from a chess master and start using my pawn to hop over multiple guys like I was playing checkers too, but it wouldn't be a sign of me "thinking outside the box", it would be a sign of me not understanding the game.

I made this point in a tweet to Vivek -- the NBA is not a tech startup. The boundaries are not unlimited. It is a bounded set. There are rules. there are 5 men on a side, 10 foot baskets, standardized courts, and 70 years of history, of systems, coaches, players, champions, and losers. Your task in running an NBA team is not to invent some entirely new way to play the game. Its to as completely as possible understand all the ways it has been played, and discern from those the best way for your own team to play it.

"Thinking outside the box" is an empty buzzword that can just as easily connote ignorance as brilliance.
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G.K. Chesterton, is that you?

For the sake of argument, consider the economist who walks by a $20 bill on the sidewalk. When his friend asks why the economist didn't pick it up, he replies, "If that had been a real $20 bill, the market would have already seized it up. Therefore, it was a figment of my imagination."

There is some benefit to putting pressure on the edges of convention. There is also a lot to be said for "Dominant big men have won most of the titles in league history by pounding the ball inside." I tend to lean toward the latter.
 
Hadlowe said:
G.K. Chesterton, is that you?
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There are probably worse insults to be laid, but no. He in fact would have made the inverse mistake a guy like Vivek has. Vivek is mistakenly bringing in the idea of boundless innovation from the open world into the closed set of the NBA. Chesterton would have done the opposite and extrapolated from a smaller closed set to imagine a strictly bounded outer world. (And yes, I was fully arrogant enough to directly challenge some of history's most brilliant men in my philosophy/history courses. And people think I should quail at the likes of Vivek or even PDA.) Pfft. :p

P.S. I am much closer to a Hume/John Stuart Millls man.
 
The problem with Bighorn players is that I can't make any good judgement on how they'll work in a professional setting. I've seen Heslip drain shots, but I've seen him doing it by just jacking the shot as soon as he touches it.

The problem with the Bighorns is that you cannot eye-test them. There is no translation of what they do in regards to pro-level play.
 
Uncia03 said:
Now I understand that you're not as down on the FO as most others (which actually doesn't make much sense to me considering what I thought I gathered from you in a different thread...but that is sort of irrelevant to this topic) and so you're coming in and trying to balance out the narrative and bring some calm to the discussions so that people won't go over-board.
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You said quite a bit in that message, and the majority of it I either agree with or stand neutral on, so I'll leave it be, but I did have a couple of comments.

Yes, I'm not as down on the FO as most of the crowd. I'm not 100% up of course, and I've been frustrated from time to time myself, but I'm not calling for heads by any means. I'm not sure which comments you're taking about. Perhaps some that I've made about Ranadive, who keeps finding ways to really rub me wrong.

The thing with Ranadive is that until he decides otherwise, we're stuck with him. He's not trying to move the team and he hasn't kicked my dog, so while I wish he'd take a different approach a lot of the time, I just kind of have to roll with whatever he does. If I wanted PDA fired, there would be at least a glimmer of hope that getting vocally angry about it might help. I think there's no point in getting angry with Ranadive, so I'll spare myself the anger.

I don't know why people feel the need to defend the FO on a small move that has pretty much zero upside and has multiple down-sides.
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I look at this from the complete opposite perspective, I suppose. I don't know why people feel the need to jeer the FO on a small move that would have pretty much zero downside (we disagree on that) and, more to the point, hasn't actually happened.

Well, I guess I do know why they feel the need to jeer, I'm just not on board with it.
 
Uncia03 said:
You are better served by 'stirring up the lockerroom' by bringing in some sort of veteran player. Bringing in an undrafted rookie isn't going to help the locker room and is being unfair to Heslip. In the last game Stauskas played 16 minutes. In those 16 minutes his teammates kicked it out to him for an open 3pt shot One time...that is it. In 16 minutes. (He made the shot by the way) What makes you think that Heslip will even get the ball if he manages to get into the game? I ask, because the players are not even getting the ball to Ben or Nik right now, so why would they pass up their own opportunity for an undrafted player who can't defend, rebound, or pass coming in on a 10-day contract. The FO brought the house down around the heads of the players and the FO needs to do something to fix it. Bringing in a guy like Heslip makes zero sense at this time. Again, it's not a terrible move that the FO should be ridiculed over...but it isn't a good move and it certainly shouldn't be praised.
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Uncia03 said:
You are better served by 'stirring up the lockerroom' by bringing in some sort of veteran player. Bringing in an undrafted rookie isn't going to help the locker room and is being unfair to Heslip. In the last game Stauskas played 16 minutes. In those 16 minutes his teammates kicked it out to him for an open 3pt shot One time...that is it. In 16 minutes. (He made the shot by the way) What makes you think that Heslip will even get the ball if he manages to get into the game? I ask, because the players are not even getting the ball to Ben or Nik right now, so why would they pass up their own opportunity for an undrafted player who can't defend, rebound, or pass coming in on a 10-day contract. The FO brought the house down around the heads of the players and the FO needs to do something to fix it. Bringing in a guy like Heslip makes zero sense at this time. Again, it's not a terrible move that the FO should be ridiculed over...but it isn't a good move and it certainly shouldn't be praised.
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I'm not praising the move, I am expressing my reaction to the total rebuke on here. I don't like it.

In your comments you bring up one of my basic complaints - since the beginning of the season neither
Cuz nor Gay who have the ball inside the most pass it to an open guy at the 3 point line. Once in a long while they do but should be doing lots until until excess even. That has nothing to do with who is coaching. Ride Cuz has been the theme of the team and the theme on here. Change it is my advice.
 
Capt. Factorial said:
I don't know why people feel the need to jeer the FO on a small move that would have pretty much zero downside (we disagree on that) and, more to the point, hasn't actually happened.
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The response on this board to this absolute non-move is more of a testimony on how fans feels toward the FO right now than it is on the kid's basketball skills.
The whole discussion is (unfortunately) not basketball related.
 
R2D2 said:
The response on this board to this absolute non-move is more of a testimony on how fans feels toward the FO right now than it is on the kid's basketball skills.
The whole discussion is (unfortunately) not basketball related.
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Here's basketball:

we are calling up a 6'2" 180lb shooting guard used to running at pace pace pace and chucking at will will will. Allowed to do that and not worry about anything else, he is capable of averaged 27.7ppg...along with 1.8reb and 1.0ast. Such a creature would appear as virtually worthless as calling up some dude in Iowa who wins state fair FT shooting contests. He CAN in fact hit a three, even a contested three if the contesting is being done by a non-NBA level player. But to say that there appears to be absolutely nothing else there would be just a tad of an understatement.

Here's Brady Heslip -- take the outlet pass, race upcourt to the 3pt line, immediately chuck up a three. That's what he does. How could that help even if he weren't so small and unatheltic he'd get bullied by most PGs, let alone SGs?

But yes, you would normally just ignore said "experiment" were it absolutely not 100% inline with all the stupidity that you fear, and that has been sagely predicted by some of our members, ever since this summer.
 
Bricklayer said:
we are calling up a 6'2" 180lb shooting guard used to running at pace pace pace and chucking at will will will..
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Are we? It's a serious question. As far as I can tell, this entire discussion is based off a vague tweet from a random person in Canada.
 
At the very least, I encourage those who have not done so to watch a few minutes of a Reno Bighorns game to get a sense of the type of play being showcased. Then, think about what it's doing to the statistical value of each shooter.

You only really have to watch for about 5 minutes, but if you really want to be a macho man (or fiery female), go for 10 minutes. It really is a spectacle, in both the traditional and modern sense of the word.

You might get a good sense of why we've reacted so violently, even to something that is apparently just a rumor. As it stands, if it's just a rumor, I'll let it go until the ink dries on that 10 day contract.
 
This franchise makes me more sick with every passing day! We need to get ourselves free from the parasites that have infested this franchise!

PDA and Mullin need to go and fast!
 
who exactly is he supposed to play over? this is just another one of those making a move for the sake of making a move. I understand they want shooting but sheesh
 
pshn80 said:
And what do you mean by that? So Stauskas, Hollins, Moeland have NBA games? Come on.
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At this point the Kings and Corbin might as well just go forced run-and-gun and get it over with. Long term that would actually be the best thing because if they fail miserably maybe just maybe Vivek and PDA will actually learn from it.

I know a lot of fans don't want to see that but that's what they are aiming for and I don't think they are going to get off this "push the pace" obsession until they are proven wrong. That of course is assuming they would even admit they are wrong.

As long as they keep dabbling in bits of run-and-gun and never really going full-bore they are going to cling to excuses with "what if's" as people always do. I say that this point the fans should almost hope they go full experiment mode with guys like Haslip and really get it out of their system. Do you really want to see them still talking about pushing the pace and NBA 3.0 and all this nonsense in 2016-2017? That would be horrible if they are still trying to re-invent basketball 2 years from now.
 
ESP47 said:
tumblr_m676nzLcvY1ruj0bpo1_1280.jpg


This should quiet the legion of fans who are still mad about the Malone firing.

This is it right here. A guy who averages 2 reb and 1 ast a game. But hey, he can shoot. We have our very own Steph Curry/Jimmer Fredette hybrid right here. Take a seat and get used to the pine Nik and Ben. Cousins and Rudy, you two take a backseat and feed the beast the ball. You guys saw what happened when Jordan took a backseat to Steve Kerr. They rolled off half a dozen championships.

We have a proven track record of success here. Vivek's daughters team, Summer League and our D-League team that's averaging 141 points a game. Which is the most exciting thing that's ever happened in basketball. I don't know if you folks have been living under a rock but it is sweeping the country, the world, the universe and at least 7 different dimensions by storm. NBA 3.0 has officially begun. Mindlessly empty your wallets and give Vivek your checking account and routing numbers for the new Arena is close. Step into the UFO and join Vivek and PDA on their journey into NBA 3.0.
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ok, i see what your saying. we're one step closer to being chinese knock off of GSW.
 
I know
R2D2 said:
The response on this board to this absolute non-move is more of a testimony on how fans feels toward the FO right now than it is on the kid's basketball skills.
The whole discussion is (unfortunately) not basketball related.
Click to expand...

Here here.
 
Bricklayer said:
There are probably worse insults to be laid, but no. He in fact would have made the inverse mistake a guy like Vivek has. Vivek is mistakenly bringing in the idea of boundless innovation from the open world into the closed set of the NBA. Chesterton would have done the opposite and extrapolated from a smaller closed set to imagine a strictly bounded outer world. (And yes, I was fully arrogant enough to directly challenge some of history's most brilliant men in my philosophy/history courses. And people think I should quail at the likes of Vivek or even PDA.) Pfft. :p

P.S. I am much closer to a Hume/John Stuart Millls man.
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Speaking of Hume and Mills- some quotes for you:

John Stuart Mills:
"In this age, the mere example of non-conformity, the mere refusal to bend the knee to custom, is itself a service. Precisely because the tyranny of opinion is such as to make eccentricity a reproach, it is desirable, in order to break through that tyranny, that people should be eccentric. Eccentricity has always abounded when and where strength of character has abounded; and the amount of eccentricity in a society has generally been proportional to the amount of genius, mental vigor, and moral courage which it contained. That so few now dare to be eccentric, marks the chief danger of the time" and also: "Originality is the one thing which unoriginal minds cannot feel the use of"- it's clear where Mills stand... right beside Vivek.

David Hume:
"Nothing is more usual and more natural for those, who pretend to discover anything new to the world in philosophy and the sciences, than to insinuate the praises of their own systems, by decrying all those, which have been advanced before them" and also: "Where men are the most sure and arrogant, they are commonly the most mistaken, and have there given reins to passion, without that proper deliberation and suspense, which can alone secure them from the grossest absurdities"

I'm taking Hume's side on this one...
 
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