BEE:Ostertag, Rare Failure for successful system

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Mark Kreidler: Ostertag: Rare failure for successful system



By Mark Kreidler -- Bee Sports Columnist
Published 2:15 am PST Tuesday, March 15, 2005


And so now Rick Adelman proceeds to the next phase of Operation Accessibility, which, as it turns out, is the one right before moving on to jabbing No. 2 pencils directly into one's eye sockets.



For as long as he has been around Sacramento, Adelman has been the man running on the freedom ticket. He's the coach whose system is said to work because so many different types of NBA players can come in and find a way to fit, and are given the broad latitude to do so.

And now all of that needs to prove true, and immediately. And it has to work for just about everybody else on the Kings' roster, since it already has found its staggering exception to the rule in Greg Ostertag.

Wait: Was it just last week we pondered the possibility of a deep playoff push for the lads Maloof?

Missed it by that much.

Monday was the day for somberly reckoning with the big stuff around the place once known as Camp Happy Happy Joy Joy.

Chris Webber is Philadelphia's hard case now. Brad Miller just layup-drilled his way into injury infamy. Brian Skinner, Corliss Williamson and Kenny Thomas have become not only Sacramento's surrogate big men, but also the last best hope for this team pulling itself together in time to crash the playoffs and make any sort of noise.

And over to one side sits Ostertag, all 7 feet and 2 inches of him, mostly useless, mostly idling and almost completely off the coach's radar.

There are reasons, and we can get into them, but the bottom line is that at the precise moment when a system's success would have brought the big man to the fore to offset the crippling loss of Miller in the offense, Ostertag has moved to the back of the line.

"I don't have time. I can't have the patience to wait to see if he comes through," Adelman said of Ostertag at the team's practice facility. As Adelman spoke, Ostertag stood a few feet away, telling reporters that he blamed himself for thinking that he would use game minutes to play himself back into shape after breaking his right hand during the preseason.

As it turns out, there are virtually no game minutes to be had, and Ostertag, by his own reckoning, remains well behind his normal conditioning level, which wasn't exactly Karl Malone-sharp to begin with. Adelman is blunt: The other guys are better, albeit undeniably shorter.

"If you play Greg, then you're taking time away from Kenny and Corliss and Darius (Songaila) and Brian, who may be more effective for you all the way around, and that's where I'm at right now," Adelman said. "I'm going to play the people who give us the best chance to win."

The funny, likeable Ostertag represents a failure on every front - player, coach, design, acquisition, everything. One colossal bust. And it's only stunning considering the history, which suggests that the Kings have outperformed most of the NBA over the years in terms of what they get out of the talent they bring in.

Webber's immediate struggles in Philly may not last (or, shoot, they could last forever), but there's no question that he absolutely thrived - for as long as he was healthy - in Adelman's free-form system in Sacramento. It was the same system, in which Adelman allows his players to improvise and find a running rhythm together, that made Jason Williams an NBA phenomenon and flogged life into a dying franchise at Arco Arena.

Vlade Divac had the best years of his career playing for Adelman. Bobby Jackson became a Sixth Man of the Year playing for Adelman. Jim Jackson revived his professional life there. Peja Stojakovic, Vernon Maxwell, Anthony Peeler -- it's no secret. Players generally like the system and generally like the man who runs it, which may explain why so many of them (Jon Barry, Scot Pollard, Doug Christie, on and on) do great things in Sacramento and then struggle to recapture that magic when they go elsewhere.

"He's really patient - really patient - and really laid-back," said Skinner, who has gone from deep on the bench in Philadelphia to a front-line starter under Adelman. "Players just respect him."

Skinner compared Adelman's standing in the locker room to a coach he played for briefly in Toronto, Lenny Wilkens. Kind words, but Adelman right now is a man in the closest thing to a crisis that a winning coach can be.

Ostertag's season-long absence of impact meant Miller had to stay healthy. It wasn't that Ostertag could do what Miller does, but that a big body is a big body. Even in the revamped Western Conference, with its emphasis on sleek, athletic forwards, a big man who can alter a game is gold bullion.

Miller's injury might have been the time for Ostertag to step forward, but he's just not capable. Adelman says Ostertag never did adjust to the system, in which centers and power forwards are so crucial to the offensive flow. If so, it's a fairly shocking swing and miss by executive Geoff Petrie, who doesn't miss often on talent fits.

Result: No 'Tag, and no true center through which to run even part of the offense. So now it is Adelman adjusting on the fly, trying belatedly to shift that responsibility to Mike Bibby and Cuttino Mobley.

"And even Peja's going to have to step up, because the other (new) guys aren't comfortable doing it," Adelman said. They need to get comfortable soon. All of which is to say that the celebrated Adelman system, once again, is on trial for its life.

http://www.sacbee.com/content/sports/basketball/kings/story/12565929p-13420907c.html
 
And so now Rick Adelman proceeds to the next phase of Operation Accessibility, which, as it turns out, is the one right before moving on to jabbing No. 2 pencils directly into one's eye sockets.

How pedestrian.
 
Better Late Than Never ???

G-Tag either has a conscience or musta had a WAKE-UP CALL (someone probably told him they were gonna kick his a$$ if he didn't become apart of the team) !!!

All I can say is it'd be nice if he did do something to help his team ... he's got as much a chance at this as "Lynyrd Skinner" does.

I'ts never too late .... get in there Tag .... show us what you can do !!!
 
Greg still should of got some time to play especially sunday against yao and when the kings played the Heat.Both shaq and yao ar notorious for being out of shape and they both get tired fast.Greg with his size and shot blocking ability would of done a better job against those dudes than Brian skinner and kenny thomas.Rick wants all offense and he will even take skinners dunk put backs and junk lay ups over really being able to match up properly with certain match ups.Adleman hates defense and loves offense and will not adjust his philosophy for nothing and nobody and it isn't that Greg is superior on the Defensive but more of giving the man a chance to compete and make a few mistakes like skinner and thomas.I am quite sure Greg wouldn't be the one to let the ball out of bounce while chasing it down the way skinner did or hurl a Terrible pass the way kenny thomas did.I think Greg would set better screens and be more of a Big body presence with rebounding and just plain interior presence.
 
shaka zulu said:
Adleman hates defense and loves offense and will not adjust his philosophy for nothing and nobody and it isn't that Greg is superior on the Defensive but more of giving the man a chance to compete and make a few mistakes like skinner and thomas.

I agree with most of your post, except for the quoted portion. I would agree that Adelman is more of an offensive coach, but when you look at the talent on his roster over the years, it always had exceptional offensive talent and average to subpar defensive talent (except for 2003 when CWebb got injured -- more on that later).

My thought is that Adelman is coaching to his players' strengths --- he's had great passing forwards and centers on his teams over the past five or six years, so the Princeton offense was a no brainer, not to mention it allows a guy like Bibby to get his open looks without having to constantly worry about breaking down his defender on his own. It lets a guy like Peja move without the ball and just have the responsibility to shoot/score when he catches it. It even allowed a guy like DC to be relatively successful despite his meager offensive abilities in terms of scoring.

But outside of DC (and Peja, I guess), none of his "premier" players have been defensive stalwarts. I'm not saying that excuses any lack of focus on defense, but with the teams Adelman has been given, he hasn't had what you would term "defensive-minded" rosters. CWebb has rarely, if ever, in his career cared enough about defense, nor has Bibby. Vlade was a competent post defender of big guys that didn't move too quickly, but he was almost always ground bound in his Kings' years. Pollard was no athlete, either...just a banger and hustler.

The one year that was the exception was 2003 (I think) where the Kings lead the league in defensive field goal percentage, due largely, imho, to guys like BJax, JJax, Keon and even Hedo coming off the bench. Keon was a major shotblocking presence that helped cover up a lot of perimeter weaknesses, and he was a solid rebounder. CWebb was healthy so he gobbled up his fair share of rebounds and still had his athleticism around the rim, and Vlade usually did a good job neutralizing the other team's C in the post. With DC near the height of his game and Peja emerging as a guy that didn't get killed off the dribble, the only true weak link as far as penetration was concerned was Bibby, but 1 out of 5 defenders being below average wasn't half bad, and it showed. That year I don't recall anyone complaining about the Kings' defense. Did Adelman just adjust for that one year, or did he coach to the strengths of his players (like he has always done)? My guess would be the latter.

So to get back to OTag, he hasn't done a reasonable job of attempting to get back into shape (ever heard of a stationary bike or treadmill, Greg?), and he wasn't exactly a good fit for the offense to begin with, so I don't really fault Adelman for not giving the guy time. If he's not going to provide you with what you want him for (defense), why suffer at both ends of the floor when you have other guys who can at least provide offense and will be able to at least compete from a conditioning standpoint on the defensive end?
 
4cwebb said:
If he's not going to provide you with what you want him for (defense), why suffer at both ends of the floor when you have other guys who can at least provide offense and will be able to at least compete from a conditioning standpoint on the defensive end?

For whatever its worth, according to 82games.com Tag has by far the best defensive rating of all the guys currently on the team (Doug was better):

Opp. Pts per 100 possessions (balances out pace):
Christie -- 103.0
Ostertag -- 104.9
Daniels -- 105.2
Jackson -- 106.2
Miller -- 106.8
Songaila -- 107.0
Bibby -- 107.4
Skinner -- 107.7
Barnes -- 107.9
Martin -- 108.2
Stojakovic -- 108.4
Thomas -- 108.6
Webber -- 109.1
Evans -- 109.6
Mobley -- 111.2
Williamson -- 111.6
House -- 114.3
Bradley -- 117.3
 
I find it funny that coach says he will not let tag work back into shape playing, yet isn't that what he did last year with webber?

There is by no means any comparison between webber and tag. webber is a much better all around player, but last year adleman put webber back in there and let him work towards whatever he thought he was working towards and the team suffered.

I guess he learned his leasson last year.
 
Diehard Jim said:
I find it funny that coach says he will not let tag work back into shape playing, yet isn't that what he did last year with webber?

There is by no means any comparison between webber and tag. webber is a much better all around player, but last year adleman put webber back in there and let him work towards whatever he thought he was working towards and the team suffered.

I guess he learned his leasson last year.

Don't think there really is any comparison -- Webb was susposed to be the final key to a hoped for championship push last year. He was going to be the guy who finally gave us the rebounding and shotblocking push to go with the prolific offense we already had going. Such a huge player and such huge hopes. Didn't work out that way of course. But Tag...borderline guy. And not Rick's type of player anyway. You can bench Tag and convince yourself it wouldn't make a difference. Couldn't do that with Webb.
 
I'm having a hard time drawing any sort of parrallel between a franchise player being worked back into the rotation after an injury, one that had kept himself in shape, and a guy who should have kept himself in shape despite not getting playing time.
 
brick I hear ya, but the kings D SUCKS!

I mean they need a guy like Tag, if you have him use him. there are no excuses now.

like I said I was not comparing the players just the situation. I am sure every kings fan in this room remembers last year being #1 in the league, then all of a sudden to not even win the pacific division.

with all of the new cogs and missing cogs, either give the guy a shot or release him like they did with massenburg, who actually played some really good D for the kings.
 
Kingsgurl said:
I'm having a hard time drawing any sort of parrallel between a franchise player being worked back into the rotation after an injury, one that had kept himself in shape, and a guy who should have kept himself in shape despite not getting playing time.

There is a big time difference between game shape and being in shape.

Look at chris when he came back last year, he was out of shape, (he was still in good shape, but he was out of game shape)

I am not comparing the 2 players just the situation.

And if you have watched Tag at all over the years, he is not that far out of shape for him, But he is big time out of game shape.
 
Forgot to mention something else.

Does anyone here remeber when Oliver Miller played for the Kings? Rick did not have a problem playing him and he was BIG, BIG time out of shape.

I think there is another underlying problem between the two of them.
 
with all of the new cogs and missing cogs, either give the guy a shot or release him like they did with massenburg, who actually played some really good D for the kings.

Technically, we did not release him, just left him off the play off roster.....a fate that may yet await the Tagster. Did anyone else notice before the game that Tag wasn't even sitting WITH the team, but rather behind them?
 
Diehard Jim said:
Forgot to mention something else.

Does anyone here remeber when Oliver Miller played for the Kings? Rick did not have a problem playing him and he was BIG, BIG time out of shape.

I think there is another underlying problem between the two of them.

I think so too -- Tag doesn't have a jump shot and therefore is evil...EVIL I tell ya. :p
 
Diehard Jim said:
There is a big time difference between game shape and being in shape.

Look at chris when he came back last year, he was out of shape, (he was still in good shape, but he was out of game shape)

I am not comparing the 2 players just the situation.

And if you have watched Tag at all over the years, he is not that far out of shape for him, But he is big time out of game shape.

Of course Chris was out of game shape, that's why you had to play him and play him a lot.
Tag, while maybe having an excuse to be out of GAME shape, really has no excuse for being as out of shape as he is, playing or not.
 
Moving on to a senseable analysis, the big problem here has to do withAdelman realy having no idea what Tag is capible of. Tags broken hand killed him on tow fronts. Before the accedent Tag was getting some decnt min and doing good things with them, but certinaly was not "locked into" the line up. With Webber avaliable to spell atcenter while Darius palyed PF Tags absense was not only not noticed much, but probably resulted in much better offense. Since he did not play mcuh there is no real way to notice how it effected the team defenseively. Secondly after bing injured Tag lost what little condition he had, so now when he hits the floor for 4 min he looks bad, has no offense at all and his defense is not missed. I actually agree with Shaka in part here. While I am not sure Adelman "Hates defense" I don't think he looks for it much so once Ostertag makes an offensive mistake RA yanks him with no concern for how that effects the defense.

It's good to see Tag responsablity for being out of shape but that and a buck fifity will get you a cup oc coffee. Malone rode him for reporting to camp out of shape for years, I WOULD like ot see Tag hititng the weights and doing some road work not sure if he has enough time now to turn things arround for the season but there IS this very long shot that IF the Kings can strugle through the first round of the paly off and IF both BObby and Brad are back and able to contribute THEN the team could maybe make some waves, but to get there the Kings would really need Tag to bring the D and to do that he needs to stay on court with means NOT making mistakes in the offense that rile Adelman.
 
At least we now have an answer to the question of why Adelman hasn't used Tag more.

Have I mentioned how good it is to have Kreidler back? ;) Objectivity aside, it's nice to have someone Adelman will talk to ask the questions the fans want answered.

"If you play Greg, then you're taking time away from Kenny and Corliss and Darius (Songaila) and Brian, who may be more effective for you all the way around, and that's where I'm at right now," Adelman said. "I'm going to play the people who give us the best chance to win."

We can agree or disagree with Adelman's reasoning, but at least we know now where he's coming from.
 
I've pretty much suspected from the start. Nice to know that it's confirmed right out from the horse's mouth, so to speak. You know you're desperate if people are crying out for Ostertag to get minutes and be our "savior". The man depends entirely on his height and bulk for his meal ticket.
 
Thank god, for this article...I so happy that I at least know his reasoning behind not playing GO instead letting games and games go by just wondering...

shaka zulu said:
I am quite sure Greg wouldn't be the one to let the ball out of bounce while chasing it down the way skinner did or hurl a Terrible pass the way kenny thomas did.

Is this a joke?

Ive never quoted anything you've ever said cuz it wasn't worth it...but this time i can't let that go un-noticed...
 
Kingsgurl said:
Technically, we did not release him, just left him off the play off roster.....a fate that may yet await the Tagster. Did anyone else notice before the game that Tag wasn't even sitting WITH the team, but rather behind them?

He always sits behind them. He's to big to fit comfortably on the seats and this allows him to stretch out.

By the way, Tag has always been a bit out of shape but he looks alot "softer" around the midsection this year than he has in years past. I think he is way out of shape and since he's not playing he is not getting into game shape.
 
I just don't understand how a player let's themselves get "out of shape!"

Barring an injury, isn't it your JOB to stay in shape and be ready in case you are needed? Skinner rarely played in Philly yet he seemed to stay in game shape. Ostertag sounded like Vlade when he mentioned playing his way into shape as the season progressed.
 
exactly! 4.2mil and they can't make him run every day? There should be a conditioning clause in nba contracts.
 
Has Ostertag EVER been in shape? It just seems dumb to get a guy for 9 mill, have him be the same as he was his whole career, and then not play him. HELLO????
 
One of the grossest misuses of talents I have ever seen from the Kings. I do remember fairly well Tag getting "some what" consistent minutes and dominating the boards and blocking multiple shots. Adelman is a great coach but still a great coach that doesn't know how to spell the word DEFENSE!!! Tag would have done well with consistent minutes under a different coach, but its probably too late now for him here. He will be packaged in the offseason. It is a shame though. :(
 
Diehard Jim said:
Forgot to mention something else.

Does anyone here remeber when Oliver Miller played for the Kings? Rick did not have a problem playing him and he was BIG, BIG time out of shape.

I think there is another underlying problem between the two of them.

Actually, i remembered Rick only played him marginally. He was sent to the Fat camp to get in shape and was suppose to return to the team but never did.
 
SacTownKid said:
One of the grossest misuses of talents I have ever seen from the Kings. I do remember fairly well Tag getting "some what" consistent minutes and dominating the boards and blocking multiple shots. Adelman is a great coach but still a great coach that doesn't know how to spell the word DEFENSE!!! Tag would have done well with consistent minutes under a different coach, but its probably too late now for him here. He will be packaged in the offseason. It is a shame though. :(
Hey now...it's not nice to pick on a guys spelling ;) :) hee hee
 
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