Bee: Big moves by Kings? Petrie plays it patiently

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Marty Mac's World: Big moves by Kings? Petrie plays it patiently
By Martin McNeal - Bee Columnist
Published 12:00 am PDT Thursday, July 5, 2007
Story appeared in SPORTS section, Page C2


Kings basketball president Geoff Petrie doesn't have to worry about one thing -- surpassing extraordinary expectations.

The consensus following the draft selection of 19-year-old center Spencer Hawes and the early days of free agency seems to be the Kings will struggle even to be a playoff contender next season.

Petrie said Wednesday the Kings had nothing going from a trade standpoint. The team still is deliberating on whether to use its entire mid-level exception (approximately $6 million), some of it or none of it.

The guess here is the exception will not be used. Petrie's long-term stance on building a team has been to become a player in free agency by getting under the salary cap, use that room to sign impact players and add them to draftees.

Said Petrie: "If we want to get into the situation here where you have real (salary) room, you have to curtail some of the team's spending and gather enough contracts expiring to create that room. The second part of that is what you still can do through trades to help in the interval you're working with.

"At some point, you have to take a philosophical stance, and if you keep adding four- and five-year or five- and six-year contracts, it makes it a lot more difficult to get there. Potentially, on a two-year horizon, we can naturally arrive there. The exception is if something comes up you think is really good, I think you still do that."

Petrie said attempting to get that real room following the 2008-09 season is what he is looking to do at this point. The contracts of Mike Bibby and Ron Artest (who is expected to opt out of his deal in the summer of 2008) would be off the cap.

The Kings likely will try to sign Kevin Martin to a long-term deal during the July 11-Oct. 31 window, so his projected salary of $8 million to $10 million would be added to those of Brad Miller ($12.25 million), Kenny Thomas ($8.55 million), Shareef Abdur-Rahim ($6.6 million), John Salmons ($5.45 million), Francisco García ($2.89 million), Quincy Douby ($2.2 million) and subsequent draft choices, putting the team's payroll at about $45 million.

Certainly, myriad moves could alter this projection, but it seems Petrie, new coach Reggie Theus and the Maloof ownership group are committed to working with what is on board.

Many observers have painted the Kings as desperate to rid themselves of Artest before next season and anticipate a trade of Bibby. However, Petrie's first name might as well be "Patient." Giving away talent has not been part of his résumé, and Petrie believes Bibby and Artest not only have value around the league but talents to help the Kings.

"I don't think you can live in the world thinking about what can't work," Petrie said. "I don't know any successful people in the world of business that look at things like that. You go back to the first year and when we drafted Jason (Williams), some people said he was a (Continental Basketball Association) player. Chris (Webber) wasn't coming here. We paid Vlade (Divac) too much money, and it was questioned why we drafted Peja (Stojakovic).

"The only thing we can do with our coaching staff is try to get the best out of what we have here, and eventually we'll (have success). I'm totally confident in that."

Petrie said the Kings have the talent to be competitive "if they play together."

That is where Theus and his soon-to-be created coaching staff enter the picture. Petrie said Theus has had four or five candidates in town during the past two days.

"Hopefully, we'll be hiring one or two (assistant coaches) pretty quickly," Petrie said.

Those assistants likely will coach the team's summer-league squad in Las Vegas, although Petrie said Theus will have major involvement.

"If he doesn't hire any coaches," Petrie half-joked of his new head coach, "he will be coaching the team. I know I'm not going down there (on the sideline)."

About the writer: The Bee's Martin McNeal can be reached at mmcneal@sacbee.com.
 
The consensus following the draft selection of 19-year-old center Spencer Hawes and the early days of free agency seems to be the Kings will struggle even to be a playoff contender next season.

Erm, Marty? I don't think they're really planning on being playoff contenders at this point. Isn't that the whole point of rebuilding?
 
We may not be making any moves until the trade deadline when playoff teams need someone to possibly push them over the top. And that's fine with me at this point. Enough with the Hedo and Mo Pete crap already!

BTW, Randy Brown and Larry Drew are solid assistant coaching choices by Theus if that's who he has in the fold so far IMHO.
 
If we're truly going to commit to a 3- to 5-year rebuild a la Portland, we're gonna have to realize it's gonna be a long, hard arduous road ahead.

You can't do it any other way. We either suck for a couple of seasons or we continue to do what we did for the past couple of years. I honestly prefer genuine suckitude than continuing to "struggle even to be a playoff contender," especially with some of the leaps and bounds other teams in the Western Conference have made.

If we don't do any additional trades right now, it's not like it's gonna make matters any worse. If we actually have to live through the remainder of KT's contract and whatever other albatrosses (albastrossi?) we're stuck with, then so be it. And if we do get a chance right at the trade deadline to move some of the pieces, then that will just make life easier down the road.
 
Firstly hi, I'm new, and from a tiny island in south east asia called singapore. pft.

But even with rebuilding, do you think we'll be able to compete with the other powerhouses in the West be it 3-5 years down? As in, will the core of young players we have now become championship callibre?
 
Firstly hi, I'm new, and from a tiny island in south east asia called singapore. pft.

But even with rebuilding, do you think we'll be able to compete with the other powerhouses in the West be it 3-5 years down? As in, will the core of young players we have now become championship callibre?


First off welcome! I think it will be some time before the Kings are "championship caliber." But that does not mean they cannot be competitive, fighting for a playoff spot even in the West sooner rather than later. If Petrie pulls off some dynamite trades as he's done in the past and our new coach can make progress like he did in two short years at NMSU almost anything is possible - except an NBA championship in as you said - 5 years at best - maybe. In about 5 years Duncan would probably be retired along with Nash, Iverson, etc. But opps, Durant and Oden will be in their prime plus Melo, Boozer, Yao, Dirk, and Kobe will still be around. The Kings need some breaks and some other teams in the west to have a run of bad luck for a change.
 
Honestly- if everything is done right- there is NO REASON that we would not be a good/consistent playoff team in three years or a championship contender in four.

You already have Martin/Cisco/Hawes. We are likely going to have a fairly high draft pick next year where we can add either our point guard of the future- OJ Mayo or Derrick Rose from Memphis (he would be my pick- awesome pure PG), or get your athletic PF of the future (Arthur or Beasley are similar to Branden Wright). Plus, we will likely have a high draft pick in the 2009 draft where we add either the PF or PG (whichever one we didn't get in 2008).

Plus, by that time Bibby and Artest are off the books- either in terms of cap space or we added a few extra pieces via trade.

Going into 2009- you have a first/second year point guard, Martin (5th season), Cisco (4th), PF (1st/2nd), Hawes (3rd). That year you also have Brad/KT/SAR ALL as expiring contracts. You either let them all walk and head into free agency with money to add a big impact player, or you use them to trade to a rebuilding team for major talent. Plus, you add in a likely high draft pick in Summer 2010. Splash in a couple of vets (either from the Artest/Bibby/KT/Miller/SAR trades or free agent money) and you have really got something...

So- IF DONE RIGHT, the 2010 team could be very good and young. Plus, most of them will have had the benefit of playing together a few years. It could be like 2000 all over again. A good team heading towards being great for years to come.

Of course it assumes a lot, but it shows that a rebuild could be done in a couple of years. Keys are patience, and avoiding taking on longer contracts or using the MLE the next few years. Let the young guys develop and lets have some fun.
 
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Wow, Rain man that all sounds great! I like your optimism since it's been sorely lacking around here lately. Now, if we can just get an Arena deal struck right on cue at least we'll know for sure "that team" will be firmly entrenched in Sacramento to watch grow back to 'ol glory days:)
 
I read somewhere yesterday that Theus interview Bob Weiss for the head assistant job. Anybody got anymore on this?
 
I understand that rebuilding doesn't happen overnight. Still, I would much prefer his name to be "proactive" Petrie instead of "patient" Petrie.
 
I think we'll see some trading because the Kings have nothing to sell tickets and generate excitement. Fans are basically apathetic about the product to date. The Maloofs are in the entertainment business and this ain't entertaining.:p
 
Celebrity siting: Tuesday night about 10:00 PM, I saw Reggie Theus at the outdoor cafe at downtown Sacramento's Embassy Suites. (I was down there to eat dinner and watch the July 3 fireworks across the river from Raley field.) He was talking to an mid-50's, balding man, who I took to be a lawyer or agent. This article mentioned that several possible assistants were in town, which jogged my memory. The guy he was talking to was Bob Weiss.

I didn't interrupt them, as I figure celebrities and semi-celebrities get bothered enough. But it was definitely Theus and Bob Weiss.
 
I think GP is trying to put on his best poker face. I've seen some out of town articles saying that Kings are "desparate" to move Artest and Bibby. That artest might be able to be picked up as a Bargain before the season starts.

If another team is in a big need for an established PG (Maimi) of has a big hole at SF (NY) I think Geoff wants to get real potential youth players or draft picks not justcrap contracts or expirings. Yes expirings are nice but one or possibly both Artest and Bibby might opt out next summer anyway, so Geoff maybe wants GM's to know that he is just not handing over our two best veterans for a hand of magic Beans.

So memo to NY - Better add Lee to any offers, Maimi better throw in some Draft picks and/or take on KT bad contracts
 
If we're truly going to commit to a 3- to 5-year rebuild a la Portland, we're gonna have to realize it's gonna be a long, hard arduous road ahead.

You can't do it any other way. We either suck for a couple of seasons or we continue to do what we did for the past couple of years. I honestly prefer genuine suckitude than continuing to "struggle even to be a playoff contender," especially with some of the leaps and bounds other teams in the Western Conference have made.

If we don't do any additional trades right now, it's not like it's gonna make matters any worse. If we actually have to live through the remainder of KT's contract and whatever other albatrosses (albastrossi?) we're stuck with, then so be it. And if we do get a chance right at the trade deadline to move some of the pieces, then that will just make life easier down the road.

I agree that when going through a 3 to 5 year rebuild we will be a losing team during that period and that can be tough for fans, but let's not compare this to Portland's, not yet. Even without Greg Oden Portland was much more proactive during their rebuild by trading away their fading and troubled stars for expiring contracts and a ton of draft picks. On draft nights they acquired so many extra draft picks, they traded up, traded down, and even purchased other teams' picks. Now they are going to buy out their one bad contract in Steve Francis to save more money. We should take a couple pages from their book.

If true this Petrie strategy is troubling, if he simply waiting for the Bibby and Artest contracts to come off the books. First of all they aren't even our worst contracts. Second, there is no guarantee that Artest will exercise his ETO, in fact I doubt he will. And third we have to give extensions to our draft picks, Martin is due, Garcia will be due, even Douby and Hawes may require one depending on how they play. That being the case we won't be any better on the salary cap.

It's nice that Petrie's long term strategy is to wait for cap room and then sign good players to go with what you have. Hmm, I doubt any of us would have thought of that, what a genius and shrewd move by the great Petrie. I have no problem not using the MLE, but Bibby could have been traded for expiring contracts last season and Artest could be this offseason so if this in fact is Petrie's plan then why not speed up the process?
 
I like the tone of this article along with Petrie' comments. On top of being a long time Kings fan, I have been a San Francisco 49ers fan all of my life, and their rebuilding process from the day Nolan walked into Santa Clara in 2005 followed this exact same model. Now the Niners used their cap space to sign some impact free agents, and '07 and especially '08 is looking very nice.

I am willing to wait the 2 to 3 years to get back to being competitive. And as much as I love Hedo, bringing his midlevel contract on makes no since. We already have two contracts like that in Salmons and Shareef. If Petrie can get David Lee for Artest, i am down with that. If not, let Artest and Bibby stay and lets try to compete with what we have.
 
Geoff is beginning to talk the language of true rebuilding. That said, this article...there are some major logical flaws, and I do not know if they are Geoff's or Marty's:

1) first of all, the estimates for salary on the books after 08-09 seem to be incomplete at best -- it does not take into account having or resigning any of the current kids other than Kevin (Cisco, Douby, Price, Williams) (actuially...Douby may be on a team option there, but don't think its accounted for either). Hell, I'm not even sure it takes into account Hawes' salary. Let alone the pick or picks next year. And it may also be underestimating Kevin's salary. In a world in which Rashard Lewis gets paid $15mil how confident are we that Kevin's agent isn't going to ask for $12? Bottom line, even if we did absolutely NOTHING but resign our current guys and draft, we might not have significant cap room in 08-09 unless WE DO SOMETHING.

2) the real problem with trying to free up for a big summer in 08-09 is not Bibby/Artest obviously, it is the awful forever deals lavished on Kenny (through 09-10) Reef (09-10) Brad (09-10) and Salmons (10-11) which combined will add up to $33 million dollars in that offesason (08-09) and completely choke our free agent hopes. If 08-09 really is your target , then more than ever you HAVE to do something. No more *** sitting Geoff!

3) even if the summer of 08-09 is the target, that is no excuse at all to keep ANY of the vets on the team (Mike, Ron, Brad, Kenny, Reef, Salmons) with long term deals. ALL it is is an excuse not to take on any worse deals in return. But if this is a rebuild, then its even MORE important to try to swap out your vets for chaep kids and picks, just so long as any major contracts you take back don't last beyond 08-09. If you keep the vets around, they win more games, and then you are stuck picking 10th again next year when you should be picking 4th and with a gaggle of kids and picks in reserve as well. You do NOT want to "compete", at least not successfully, while you are trying to stockpile talent. Its the difference between landing a potential superstar, or another Spenser Hawes (at best). Just for example, dealing Ron for Lee and Malik Rose would NOT in any way particularly hinder your 08-09 plan, as Rose's deal ends at the same time as Ron's. An 08-09 plan is no reason at all to be "patient", it is just a reason to be picky and have parameters.
 
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I don't care about Bibby's or Rons as much as our bigs. We need to be trying to send one of those contracts more than anything esle.
 
Geoff is beginnign to talk the language of true rebuilding. That said, this article...there are some major logical flaws, and I do not know if they are Geoff's or Marty's

If I were to hazard a guess, it would be the fault for the flaws lies with Marty and not Petrie. There seem to be a lot of assumptions made by Marty, who - like the majority of Bee writers - seems unable to draw the line between fact and supposition, even in news stories. Now that he's a "COLUMNIST" he seems to have decided it just doesn't matter.
 
Geoff is beginnign to talk the language of true rebuilding. That said, this article...there are some major logical flaws, and I do not know if they are Geoff's or Marty's:

................................................

3) even if the summer of 08-09 is the target, that is no excuse at all to keep ANY of the vets ont eh t4eam (Mike, Ron, brad, Kenny, Reef, Salmons) with long term deals. ALL it is is an excuse not to take on any worse deals in return. But if this is a rebuild, then its even MORE important to try to swap oout your vets for chape kids and picks, jsut so long as any major contracts you take back don't last beyond 08-09. If you keep the vets around, they winmore games, and then you are stuck picking 10th again next year when you should be picking 4th and with a gaggle of kids and picks in reserve as well. You do NOT want to "compete", at least not successfully, while you are trying to stockpile talent. Its the difference betwen landing a potential superstar, or another Spenswer Hawes (at best). Just for instance, dealing Ron for Lee and Malik Rose does NOT in any way particularly hinder your 08-09 plan, as Rose's deal ends at the same time as Ron's.

Going one step further (and I'm sure it's already been mentioned before) if you take the chance on waiting (patience?) till the trade restrictions come off, you add Thomas as outgoing and add Dickau and Jones (both expiring) as incoming you get rid of Thomas's contract. NY with its draft picks has too many players and taking two players for four allieviates this problem. It basically becomes Artest for Lee with the other players thrown in to make things work. What is one more year of Thomas in exchange for Rose when part of that salary cost can be rationalized away with the player cuts that were going to have to be made this year anyways?
 
Going one step further (and I'm sure it's already been mentioned before) if you take the chance on waiting (patience?) till the trade restrictions come off, you add Thomas as outgoing and add Dickau and Jones (both expiring) as incoming you get rid of Thomas's contract. NY with its draft picks has too many players and taking two players for four allieviates this problem. It basically becomes Artest for Lee with the other players thrown in to make things work. What is one more year of Thomas in exchange for Rose when part of that salary cost can be rationalized away with the player cuts that were going to have to be made this year anyways?

Teh year Bibby's contract expires we're due to be 19 million under the cap, however that's before the Martin extension(probably in the 8-10 million dollar range? SO for us to have REAL salary cap money to spend the summer of 09 we need to reduce Kenny's deal to at least shed 1 year off of it(Malik Rose does just that.) Martin's deal would likely replace Kenny's deal at around 8ish million dollars and then the Kings would have 17-20 million dollars to fool around with once Mike is gone. That's at least 2 very good FA signings as a possibility that summer. Two MAJOR FA signings.
 
Teh year Bibby's contract expires we're due to be 19 million under the cap, however that's before the Martin extension(probably in the 8-10 million dollar range? SO for us to have REAL salary cap money to spend the summer of 09 we need to reduce Kenny's deal to at least shed 1 year off of it(Malik Rose does just that.) Martin's deal would likely replace Kenny's deal at around 8ish million dollars and then the Kings would have 17-20 million dollars to fool around with once Mike is gone. That's at least 2 very good FA signings as a possibility that summer. Two MAJOR FA signings.

I suspect Martin's going to be more than $8. We'll be lucky if its even $10.

That said, Just wanted to add that I think Reef and Salmons are both still tradeable. You add one or both of those as cap room that summer and you begin to have something. A max type deal, AND a secondary free agent (assuming it does not all get eaten up resigning guys like Cisco or whatnot).
 
I think the plan would be to be about $10 million under the cap in 2009 when Bibby's deal expires, which would be enough to make a somewhat big free agency splash. Even keeping in mind Kevin's extension and the draft picks, this is pretty realistic. Even if Kevin gets $10 million and we have a few draft picks and minor signings the roster will be around $45-46 million, and the cap should be around $56 million. And yeah, as Brick points out, any expirings for SAR or Salmons would just be icing.

And then we could make a huge splash in 2010 when $27 million worth of Brad/Kenny/SAR come off the books.

I think this is a pretty solid plan. It's going to take some supreme patience on the part of the fan base and it's hard to imagine suffering for three seasons (four including this past one), but again, it's the same timeline that Portland has just gone through.
 
I like the tone of this article along with Petrie' comments. On top of being a long time Kings fan, I have been a San Francisco 49ers fan all of my life, and their rebuilding process from the day Nolan walked into Santa Clara in 2005 followed this exact same model. Now the Niners used their cap space to sign some impact free agents, and '07 and especially '08 is looking very nice.

I am willing to wait the 2 to 3 years to get back to being competitive. And as much as I love Hedo, bringing his midlevel contract on makes no since. We already have two contracts like that in Salmons and Shareef. If Petrie can get David Lee for Artest, i am down with that. If not, let Artest and Bibby stay and lets try to compete with what we have.

I agree that the 49ers rebuilding has been done very well, but the NFL and NBA are completely different animals in this regard. If you want to open cap space in the NFL for this kind of rebuild you simply cut or restructure all of your bad contracts, it's what gives the NFL such parity. In the NBA just waiting around for your worst contracts to end could put you in mediocrity or worse for a decade. Which is what will happen if Petrie sits on his hands as Brick and I have pointed out.

I understand that acquiring expiring contracts can be difficult, but acquiring contracts that expire in 2 years is much easier. So if the target date is after the next two seasons then Petrie must do whatever he can to unload all of those veterans for players whose contracts expire at that time. I believe that Bibby's, Artest's, and Shareef's contracts can be moved by themselves. However Miller's, Thomas', and Salmons' contracts will either have to be packaged with the others or included with a young player or future draft pick to be moved, which might be worth it at this point to give us a complete clean slate.
 
Celebrity siting: Tuesday night about 10:00 PM, I saw Reggie Theus at the outdoor cafe at downtown Sacramento's Embassy Suites. (I was down there to eat dinner and watch the July 3 fireworks across the river from Raley field.) He was talking to an mid-50's, balding man, who I took to be a lawyer or agent. This article mentioned that several possible assistants were in town, which jogged my memory. The guy he was talking to was Bob Weiss.

I didn't interrupt them, as I figure celebrities and semi-celebrities get bothered enough. But it was definitely Theus and Bob Weiss.


Bob Weiss must have been looking pretty good bald head and all - he's more like mid-60's. He would be an excellent choice for Theus as lead assistant coach. Highly experienced in the league as former NBA player on a 76ers championship team, head coach of Hawks, Clippers and Sonics, known as a relaxed players coach who likes up-tempo style, and has developed young talent before. Reggie said soon after he was named Kings head coach that he wanted an old pro next to him like Avery Johnson had in Del Harris - Weiss fits the bill as a wise gray beard to the freshly minted new head coach.
 
Okay, let's play a little game called "find some crap".

Let's assume that 08-09 is the target date. Let's further assume that knowing that 08-09 is the target date, our GM actually plans to try to free up some extra money that summer. In order to do that we need to find ways to liquidate Brad, Reef, KT and Salmons. I think the best chance of doing that would be to find worthless players with big contracts ending after 08-09. Not for guys with real value that we could not get. Not for contracts with options, unless it be a team option which we could decline. Not immediate enders because it would be tough to convince a team to take our long term turds for them. But contracts that run through 08-09, for which we might be able to trade one of ours running through 09-10 or 10-11:

Jason Collins NJ $6.1, $6.2
Malik Rose NY $7.1, $7.6
Rasho Nesterovic TOR $7.8, $8.4 (2nd yr = player option)
Eric Snow CLE $6.7, $7.3
Drew Gooden CLE $6.4, $7.1
Donyell Marshall CLE $5.6, $6.0
Damon Jones CLE $4.2, $4.5
Marquis Daniels IND $6.4, $6.9 (then a team option)
Jeff Foster IND $5.7, $6.2
Antoine Walker MIA $8.6, $9.3 (then a team option)
ORLANDO (note team is full of crap with enders and 2 yr deals)
Stromile Swift MEM $5.8, $6.2 (2nd yr = player option)
Damon Stoudamire MEM $4.4, $4.7
Bobby Jackson NOH $5.7, $6.1
Juwan Howard MIN $6.9, $7.4 (2nd yr = player option)
Raef LaFrentz POR $11.8, $12.7
Steve Francis POR $16.4, $17.2 (but not for long -- if this was the plan, too bad we didn't get him after all)
Adonal Foyle GSW $8.9, $9.8 (then a team option)


Kind of a who's who of everybody we have argued AGAINST picking up in years past. Now it would be time to celebrate if one or more of them showed up in town.

I mean if we went to the frontcourtless New Jeresy Nets and told them we were willing to trade them Brad Miller ($10.5mil) for Jason Collins ($6.1mil) and Bostan Nachbar ($2.5mil ender) are you telling me they would turn us down?
 
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Okay, let's play a little game called "find some crap".

Let's assume that 08-09 is the target date. Let's further assume that knowing that 08-09 is the target date, our GM actually plans to try to free up some extra money that summer. In order to do that we need to find ways to liquidate Brad, Reef, KT and Salmons. I think the best chance of doing that would be to find worthless players with big contracts ending after 08-09. Not for guys with real value that we could not get. Not for contracts with options, unless it be a team option which we could decline. Not immediate enders because it would be tough to convince a team to take our long term turds for them. But contracts that run through 08-09, for which we might be able to trade one of ours running through 09-10 or 10-11:

Jason Collins NJ $6.1, $6.2
Malik Rose NY $7.1, $7.6
Rasho Nesterovic TOR $7.8, $8.4 (2nd yr = player option)
Eric Snow CLE $6.7, $7.3
Drew Gooden CLE $6.4, $7.1
Donyell Marshall CLE $5.6, $6.0
Damon Jones CLE $4.2, $4.5
Marquis Daniels IND $6.4, $6.9 (then a team option)
Jeff Foster IND $5.7, $6.2
Antoine Walker MIA $8.6, $9.3 (then a team option)
ORLANDO (note team is full of crap with enders and 2 yr deals)
Stromile Swift MEM $5.8, $6.2 (2nd yr = player option)
Damon Stoudamire MEM $4.4, $4.7
Bobby Jackson NOH $5.7, $6.1
Juwan Howard MIN $6.9, $7.4 (2nd yr = player option)
Raef LaFrentz POR $11.8, $12.7
Steve Francis POR $16.4, $17.2 (but not for long -- if this was the plan, too bad we didn't get him after all)
Adonal Foyle GSW $8.9, $9.8 (then a team option)


Kind of a who's who of everybody we have argued AGAINST picking up in years past. Now it would be time to celebrate if one or more of them showed up in town.

I mean if we went to the frontcourtless New Jeresy Nets and told them we were willing to trade them Brad Miller ($10.5mil) for Jason Collins ($6.1mil) and Bostan Nachbar ($2.5mil ender) are you telling me they would turn us down?

The good news in this is that the teams with quite a few of them such as Orlando, Cleveland, and Miami are ones we have supposedly been talking with. Perhaps it would be possible to package Bibby and a bad contract to Cleveland and Artest and another bad one to Miami or even New York that would be a nice start. The Kings need to use the few guys who still have value to package with the rest.

Such as Artest/Thomas to Miami for JWill/Walker, I believe they would do this.

Then perhaps Bibby/Reef to Cleveland for Snow/Gooden/Marshall would also be realistic.

It still seems tough to move Miller as he has the worst contract and including him with Artest or Bibby would be a lot of salary for another team to match.
 
The good news in this is that the teams with quite a few of them such as Orlando, Cleveland, and Miami are ones we have supposedly been talking with. Perhaps it would be possible to package Bibby and a bad contract to Cleveland and Artest and another bad one to Miami or even New York that would be a nice start. The Kings need to use the few guys who still have value to package with the rest.

Such as Artest/Thomas to Miami for JWill/Walker, I believe they would do this.

Then perhaps Bibby/Reef to Cleveland for Snow/Gooden/Marshall would also be realistic.

It still seems tough to move Miller as he has the worst contract and including him with Artest or Bibby would be a lot of salary for another team to match.

Okay, I have to draw the line at Antoine Walker. I would sooner poke my eyes out with flaming pine needles than have to see him in a Kings uniform even if he was buried so deep on the bench you couldn't even see him.

Honestly...
 
Okay, I have to draw the line at Antoine Walker. I would sooner poke my eyes out with flaming pine needles than have to see him in a Kings uniform even if he was buried so deep on the bench you couldn't even see him.

Honestly...

And therein lies the problem. I think in a vacuum Petrie would absolutely be trading for the Antoine Walkers of the world in a bid to make a big splash in 2009, but not at the expense of a fanbase revolt and not for owners who desperately want the Kings to be relevant to raise the profile of their casinos. People want the Kings to be good again, but they also don't want to cheer for guys like Antonie Walker.

Hopefully there's a middle ground (like Hedo -- popular! Expiring before Kenny!) that will enable Petrie to do the dirtywork he needs to do to make the Kings good again. Otherwise, if the sole goal is to keep winning as many games as possible no matter the future consequences, the Kings are going to suck forever.
 
And therein lies the problem. I think in a vacuum Petrie would absolutely be trading for the Antoine Walkers of the world in a bid to make a big splash in 2009, but not at the expense of a fanbase revolt and not for owners who desperately want the Kings to be relevant to raise the profile of their casinos. People want the Kings to be good again, but they also don't want to cheer for guys like Antonie Walker.

Hopefully there's a middle ground (like Hedo -- popular! Expiring before Kenny!) that will enable Petrie to do the dirtywork he needs to do to make the Kings good again. Otherwise, if the sole goal is to keep winning as many games as possible no matter the future consequences, the Kings are going to suck forever.

It's true that fans don't want to cheer for players like Walker, I know I don't, but the advantage to having all of these irrelevant guys is that it gives minutes to all of our young guys and you know how our fans love the young guys.
 
Never forget in all this trade-acquisition talk the Petrie "personality" quotient. GP puts big faith in the type of player we get if they are expected to play. "Pot" notwithstanding, that rule has held true with Artest being the lone exception since JWill in 1998. And Artest, when motivated, can be awesome. I think he got turned off early by Muss as did many others.
 
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