"Art" in front of the arena?

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I think it would be hilarious if STOP and Crown Downtown could somehow unite and stop this purchase. Surely we can get by with a $4M piece of art and hire a few cops and firemen with the left over money.
 
There is no way the folks in charge of this didn't start talking to Koons' people with the hopes of getting a balloon dog at a steep discount for "public art" and they ended up overpaying for a "coloring book." That would be like thinking about drafting Brandon Knight and taking Jimmer instead. Too soon?

Again, for the city and Koons, I fail to see how a purple balloon sword wasn't the obvious choice. That gets shown 100% of ever national TV broadcast and over 90% of the out of town TV broadcasts for 15 years. Four blobs of colored glass ... not so much.
 
There is a public vote on this contract on March 10. The "spend this money on other stuff" won't cut it, but if enough people show up and say "good try, not this one, try again", it might matter.
 
The money has to be spent on public art, so it can't be spent on anything else. I kind of like it, myself and it would be a huge coup for Sacramento to have a piece of art from an artist this famous.

Unless they pick something horribly mundane and boring, there will be some who like it and some who don't. I've rarely heard of any decent piece of art that didn't arouse strong feelings both for and against it. The Indo Arch outside the Holiday Inn at the downtown plaza aroused extreme loathing and calls for its removal when it was installed. Now most people don't even notice it. Its just part of the Sacramento landscape.

I'll guarantee the Cloud Gate sculpture in Chicago caused exactly the type of comments being posted here from people hating it. However, its absolutely an iconic piece of art in Chicago now and countless people go to that place just to see the sculpture and have their picture taken next to it. By the way, it cost $23 million

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cloud_Gate

Edit: I totally respect that some people don't like this piece of art. I don't like all art, either. You can't possibly please everybody with a piece of art. Even if they pick a piece of art I don't like, I would not try and stop it, unless it were obviously pornographic or bigoted. I don't have to like all public art and I don't. But I respect art and feel there should be many different types of art, especially including art that evokes strong responses, positive and negative. If art doesn't evoke strong feelings, the artist may have missed the mark.

I should point out that it won't be the city council picking the art. Its usually a commission of local art experts who make the recommendation.
 
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John Galt said:
I think it would be hilarious if STOP and Crown Downtown could somehow unite and stop this purchase. Surely we can get by with a $4M piece of art and hire a few cops and firemen with the left over money.
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I don't know whether Crown Downtown will take a position on this piece of art, nor can I predict what position they might take, but I can give you an iron-clad guarantee that they will never in a million years "unite" with STOP to do anything. Hell might freeze over, but it would have to reach absolute zero for Crown Downtown to join STOP, and I assume the converse is also true.
 
Well I like it and glad they didn't choose something horribly mundane or overly traditional.

...Koons has created some pretty explicit, gaudy stuff. Stuff you typically see in Vegas, so be glad we are getting an interesting abstract child's coloring structure :D This is one of the few pieces of his that I'm not repulsed by.

Also from the sound of a news segment I just heard, the outside will have multiple art pieces, this is just one piece from one artist.
 
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kennadog said:
The money has to be spent on public art, so it can't be spent on anything else. I kind of like it, myself and it would be a huge coup for Sacramento to have a piece of art from an artist this famous.

Unless they pick something horribly mundane and boring, there will be some who like it and some who don't. I've rarely heard of any decent piece of art that didn't arouse strong feelings both for and against it. The Indo Arch outside the Holiday Inn at the downtown plaza aroused extreme loathing and calls for its removal when it was installed. Now most people don't even notice it. Its just part of the Sacramento landscape.

I'll guarantee the Cloud Gate sculpture in Chicago caused exactly the type of comments being posted here from people hating it. However, its absolutely an iconic piece of art in Chicago now and countless people go to that place just to see the sculpture and have their picture taken next to it. By the way, it cost $23 million

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cloud_Gate

Edit: I totally respect that some people don't like this piece of art. I don't like all art, either. You can't possibly please everybody with a piece of art. Even if they pick a piece of art I don't like, I would not try and stop it, unless it were obviously pornographic or bigoted. I don't have to like all public art and I don't. But I respect art and feel there should be many different types of art, especially including art that evokes strong responses, positive and negative. If art doesn't evoke strong feelings, the artist may have missed the mark.

I should point out that it won't be the city council picking the art. Its usually a commission of local art experts who make the recommendation.
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This art isn't invoking strong feelings for and against it on its merits, its invoking disdain and mockery. :)
 
Larry David said:
I like art. I'm cool with going outside the box and don't mind the rabbit.

It appears Mr. Koons is a world renowned talent. From the stories I've seen, I like some of this other stuff.

The real issue here is we are buying a crappy piece by Mr. Koons. It's not objectively a good Koons piece.

This is so Sacramento. We have a statue by Koon guys!!! Oh, cool one of the balloon dogs? No. The big Scotty dog? No. Balloon flowers? No. The broken open egg? No. Uh, what did you guys get? One of the coloring books. Oh ... uh ... that's cool.

Ok, so his balloon dog goes for 50 million and the 5th and worst of his coloring books goes for 8. Will you do a purple balloon sword for 12 million? Cool. Vivek, get out your check book. Fans are pissed and you can be the hero for 6 million.
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This is my main concern too. Coloring Book is never going to be seen as iconic or original. Nor is it as concise as the pieces Koons is known for. When I google-image "public art installation" Coloring Book doesn't begin to rank among the most striking or visually appealing pieces. Though without a price tag next to each picture it's hard to form an opinion of what the city should buy.

But I do think there is significant value that the piece and the direction the city is going when choosing pieces that was going overlooked in this thread. Padrino said it best in his post on the previous page.
 
Larry David said:
I like art. I'm cool with going outside the box and don't mind the rabbit.

It appears Mr. Koons is a world renowned talent. From the stories I've seen, I like some of this other stuff.

The real issue here is we are buying a crappy piece by Mr. Koons. It's not objectively a good Koons piece.

This is so Sacramento. We have a statue by Koon guys!!! Oh, cool one of the balloon dogs? No. The big Scotty dog? No. Balloon flowers? No. The broken open egg? No. Uh, what did you guys get? One of the coloring books. Oh ... uh ... that's cool.

Ok, so his balloon dog goes for 50 million and the 5th and worst of his coloring books goes for 8. Will you do a purple balloon sword for 12 million? Cool. Vivek, get out your check book. Fans are pissed and you can be the hero for 6 million.
Click to expand...

I had to google balloon dog to make sure that it wasn't what I thought it was. And it is. You have to be flipping kidding me, right? Someone makes a statue of the stupid balloon animals you get at a circus and he gets $50 MILLION??? I'm ...... flabbergasted. Not just at the price but at the insinuation that that is "great" art. I haven't seen anything this guy has done that I would want as the centerpiece of our city's crown jewel.

Scrolling through his website I am ashamed of our society that values the garbage he puts out as great art. What a crock.

On second thought, let's get one of the fabulous Kama Sutra masterpieces he did for his "Made in Heaven" line and blow it up to 20 feet tall. That would go well on public TV, right? Look them up for yourself on his website. I think they are much more artistic than any of this coloring book garbage, but not very appropriate either.

What a flipping joke this whole thing is. I'm disgusted.
 
whitechocolate said:
This is my main concern too. Coloring Book is never going to be seen as iconic or original. Nor is it as concise as the pieces Koons is known for. When I google-image "public art installation" Coloring Book doesn't begin to rank among the most striking or visually appealing pieces. Though without a price tag next to each picture it's hard to form an opinion of what the city should buy.

But I do think there is significant value that the piece and the direction the city is going when choosing pieces that was going overlooked in this thread. Padrino said it best in his post on the previous page.
Click to expand...

So, just wondering, what pieces of his would you recommend for placement in front of our arena? Just curious.
 
Warhawk said:
So, just wondering, what pieces of his would you recommend for placement in front of our arena? Just curious.
Click to expand...

How about this? By the way, Warhawk. I love your avatar. I am currently addicted to Mechwarrior Online.


koons-2.jpg
 
Tetsujin said:
Overly expensive Art Statue 3.0 in front of the arena!
B-szaCKVIAEYbog.jpg:large


Only 8 million dollars, what a bargain.
Click to expand...

Economics aside...

I love the piece.

This bashing of 3.0 is going too far. It's not not being used fairly and is now tagged on to anything that you don't like, or that you want to not like. Y'all are getting kinda snobby about it.

So goes for the condescending use of quotation marks around the word art.

FYI art is more than train museums, paintings of the ocean with old ships, and bronze statues of cowboys.
 
Warhawk said:
So, just wondering, what pieces of his would you recommend for placement in front of our arena? Just curious.
Click to expand...

Balloon Flower:
koons-balloons_683509n.jpg


Most importantly it immediately looks nice. It's also in Jeff Koons' well known balloon style. At the same time, by not being an immediately recognizable figure such as a Balloon Dog, it naturally becomes part of the environment rather than distract from it.
 
I actually think coloring book works better than those in the context in which it will be placed. From the looks of the renderings, the arena and surroundings are going to be very modern, stark, metallic almost. The translucent splashes of color will offer a very different lens to view it all. The alternatives (not just of Koons, but mostly the Pony Express, etc) suggested here simply don't fit as well, IMHO.
 
whitechocolate said:
Balloon Flower:
koons-balloons_683509n.jpg


Most importantly it immediately looks nice. It's also in Jeff Koons' well known balloon style. At the same time, by not being an immediately recognizable figure such as a Balloon Dog, it naturally becomes part of the environment rather than distract from it.
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Thanks for taking my request seriously, I was wondering what you would like.

Again, while different, it isn't what I would think would be appropriate in front of the arena. But apparently I am just an ignorant rube when it comes to "art", so I am just going to accept that something like this is inevitable and not worry about it. I still think it is a shame we couldn't get anything to represent Sacramento in a more historical light, but whatever.
 
Warhawk said:
Thanks for taking my request seriously, I was wondering what you would like.

Again, while different, it isn't what I would think would be appropriate in front of the arena. But apparently I am just an ignorant rube when it comes to "art", so I am just going to accept that something like this is inevitable and not worry about it. I still think it is a shame we couldn't get anything to represent Sacramento in a more historical light, but whatever.
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I think they're going for something physically bigger... perhaps more abstract as well, and not so stylistically linked to one guy. They don't necessarily want people thinking "Jeff Koons" when they see the piece.

I personally think the choice of Coloring Book is fantastic. I love the color! It evokes fun, joy, a kind of childlike innocence. Anything historical, in my opinion, would have been a little stuffy, and not relatable to children. Kids love giant splashes color. This piece is going to be a fixture for a long time. It needed to be a little more transcendent of time and place... the surrounding area will contain the history... this is essentially a big accent of color and fun! It's cool!
 
LPKingsFan said:
I actually think coloring book works better than those in the context in which it will be placed. From the looks of the renderings, the arena and surroundings are going to be very modern, stark, metallic almost. The translucent splashes of color will offer a very different lens to view it all. The alternatives (not just of Koons, but mostly the Pony Express, etc) suggested here simply don't fit as well, IMHO.
Click to expand...

I think something honoring our city's rich heritage combined with a modern touch would be great. Not saying this is the epitome of art by any means, but consider something like these:

Grandfathers-Horse.gif


This is Grandfather's Horse, a horse statue made of car bumpers in Wichita. It honors the man's grandfather who helped establish a town in Kansas. Given the agricultural and ranching heritage in this area and the Pony Express, something horse-related isn't a stretch.

Or an abstract take on a train given our long history with locomotives here (Locomotive, in Germany):

stock-photo-aachen-germany-june-striking-sculpture-named-locomotive-created-by-artist-albert-sous-144146503.jpg


Or perhaps something honoring our place as the state capitol, such as the grizzly bear from our flag (this one is more traditional, but you could do all kinds of things with something similar):

a0cdb6c2-6fe2-457c-a144-78bbb06a9e10_d.JPG


There are a lot of ways you can honor the history of a location with art. Plopping random colors on a mirror doesn't do that. Well done statues can evoke a sense of place in history and respect for our past while still being works of art. The above are just a couple examples of a starting point for a conversation or idea on different things that could honor our history and make the art represent Sacramento in some manner.

Again, I am not saying these are great examples but at least something I would consider to be better than stuff this guy puts out. I mean, who wouldn't want this in front of the new ESC?

http://www.jeffkoons.com/artwork/pre-new/nelson-automatic-cooker-deep-fryer

SMH.
 
Warhawk said:
I think something honoring our city's rich heritage combined with a modern touch would be great. Not saying this is the epitome of art by any means, but consider something like these:

Grandfathers-Horse.gif


This is Grandfather's Horse, a horse statue made of car bumpers in Wichita. It honors the man's grandfather who helped establish a town in Kansas. Given the agricultural and ranching heritage in this area and the Pony Express, something horse-related isn't a stretch.

Or an abstract take on a train given our long history with locomotives here (Locomotive, in Germany):

stock-photo-aachen-germany-june-striking-sculpture-named-locomotive-created-by-artist-albert-sous-144146503.jpg


Or perhaps something honoring our place as the state capitol, such as the grizzly bear from our flag (this one is more traditional, but you could do all kinds of things with something similar):

a0cdb6c2-6fe2-457c-a144-78bbb06a9e10_d.JPG


There are a lot of ways you can honor the history of a location with art. Plopping random colors on a mirror doesn't do that. Well done statues can evoke a sense of place in history and respect for our past while still being works of art. The above are just a couple examples of a starting point for a conversation or idea on different things that could honor our history and make the art represent Sacramento in some manner.

Again, I am not saying these are great examples but at least something I would consider to be better than stuff this guy puts out. I mean, who wouldn't want this in front of the new ESC?

http://www.jeffkoons.com/artwork/pre-new/nelson-automatic-cooker-deep-fryer

SMH.
Click to expand...

The only issue I see in requiring a subject matter that symbolizes the city is that it narrows the selection. There's certainly no reason any of the subjects you mention could not inspire art.

I recently watched a documentary about Atsuhiko Misawa on television and thought he had some interesting animal sculptures. Imagine these bears hanging around the premises:
140906iwat8.jpg

Screen+shot+2012-07-03+at+00.48.04.png

E794BBE5838F20013-400.jpg
 
I don't like the art work by Koons that's being suggested.

I honestly do not care for art but Damon of CDT found a work of art that I actually like better and could be used in similar fashion of Slamson.

Puppy-Bilbao-Guggenheim-Jeff-Koons-01.jpg
 
Warhawk said:
I think something honoring our city's rich heritage combined with a modern touch would be great. Not saying this is the epitome of art by any means, but consider something like these:

Grandfathers-Horse.gif


This is Grandfather's Horse, a horse statue made of car bumpers in Wichita. It honors the man's grandfather who helped establish a town in Kansas. Given the agricultural and ranching heritage in this area and the Pony Express, something horse-related isn't a stretch.

Or an abstract take on a train given our long history with locomotives here (Locomotive, in Germany):

stock-photo-aachen-germany-june-striking-sculpture-named-locomotive-created-by-artist-albert-sous-144146503.jpg


Or perhaps something honoring our place as the state capitol, such as the grizzly bear from our flag (this one is more traditional, but you could do all kinds of things with something similar):

a0cdb6c2-6fe2-457c-a144-78bbb06a9e10_d.JPG


There are a lot of ways you can honor the history of a location with art. Plopping random colors on a mirror doesn't do that. Well done statues can evoke a sense of place in history and respect for our past while still being works of art. The above are just a couple examples of a starting point for a conversation or idea on different things that could honor our history and make the art represent Sacramento in some manner.

Again, I am not saying these are great examples but at least something I would consider to be better than stuff this guy puts out. I mean, who wouldn't want this in front of the new ESC?

http://www.jeffkoons.com/artwork/pre-new/nelson-automatic-cooker-deep-fryer

SMH.
Click to expand...

I pretty much like all art.

Nothing against your metal horses (unoriginal, and frankly trite, at this point) and your bronze bears, but you and I have incredibly different taste.

They clearly don't want something conceptual. I think that's the whole point of this selection. They don't want it message based. They want abstract. Some people condescend abstract art with such smugness, as you are doing. It's almost like you are threatened by things that don't "make sense". You should listen to some Talking Heads.
 
Mike0476 said:
I don't like the art work by Koons that's being suggested.

I honestly do not care for art but Damon of CDT found a work of art that I actually like better and could be used in similar fashion of Slamson.

Puppy-Bilbao-Guggenheim-Jeff-Koons-01.jpg
Click to expand...

Found that too as I was poking around about him. It's ****ing fantastic.
 
I like a lot of "abstract" or non-representational art, too. A legacy from my mother who fell in love with abstract art in the 50s and 60s. :)
 
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