Are the Maloofs really the good guys/victims in all of this?

[BayAreaKingsFan]

I'm about as hard-core of a Kings fan as you will ever meet. I used to listen to every game on the radio as a kid when there was only about 25 games a year on tv. I remember the days of Lasalle Thompson, Derek Smith, Travis Mays, L-Train, Pressley, Ricky Berry, etc...

So it's a REALLY emotional time for me to see that the team that I have loved for the past 26 years is practically GONE.... I have a 7 year old son who has gotten addicted to the Kings the past couple of years and is infatuated with Tyreke Evans. I'm soooo sad that he won't be able to grow up with the Kings...

I had to tell him the other day that they were probably going to move and he kept asking why? I told him that they needed a newer, bigger arena. And his response was that they could make this one bigger? He has been pretty heartbroken....

So back to my original reason for writing this note. I see that alot of Kings fans are saying that they don't blame the Maloofs one bit for moving. On the outside, that seems like a logical feeling. I felt the same, I mean they've wanted an Arena for 10 years, and the city hasn't been able to provide one.

But digging a little deeper, I think that the Maloofs are doing exactly what they intended to do for several years:

1. What have they done in the last 5 years to even show that they are committed to helping build a new arena? The closest we came to this was the Q and R vote in 2006, when the day before (or a couple of days before) the vote, Joe Maloof came out and basically said that they weren't fully behind the measure. I mean it was going to be a brand new arena in downtown for them, but since they weren't going to be able to control the parking revenues from ALL of the events there, they sabotaged what little chance it did have of passing.

2. They have made it seem like they were willing to contribute towards building a new Arena. They even threw out the $300 million figure as their contribution. When in reality all it amounted to was a lease payment of $10 million a year for 30 years as a lease payment of sorts. In return they wanted to control EVERYTHNG at the arena, even though the City was going to foot the entire bill for everything.

3. Since 2006, they have done absolutely nothing on the Arena front. Instead, they sat back and let the NBA come in and do there work for them. What major facility around the country has been built without active lobbying and support from the team itself?

4. They have continously cut salary for several years now. Every year it was like wait till the Summer of 2010, and then the Summer came and went with nothing happening. The salary cuts have resulted in a horrible product. And the following formula is true:

Horrible Product + Bad Economy = LOW Attendance

And the low attendance gives them a perfect reason to move without looking like the bad guys. Now they're the poor little millionaire victims that are "forced" to move. Every one keeps saying how they're losing money in Sacramento, when in fact they have made a profit on the Kings the past few years. This has been documented in the media and they have even stated it.

Also, no Pro Sports owner buys a team to necessarily turn a profit every year. They make their money in the equity that the team builds over time. If they sold the team today, they would have made a huge profit compared to how much they bought the team for.

The City is definitely not without blame here, they have not done their share. Heather Fargo was totally inept and out of her league on this issue......

But KJ has put together a team that needs a little bit of time to come up with a plan, and they asked for the Maloofs to hand over some documents to assist. KJ announced yesterday that the Maloofs weren't comfortable presenting the "financial documents" requested. Why is that???? Is there something to hide? Are they making more money then they let on??? Do they NOT want an arena here?

 

[RookieOfTheDay]

I agree with your insights. I think they've been planning a move for a long time. They aren't good guys at all in my book. They're public enemy number one for Sacramento as far as I'm concerned. They're bad businessmen who ran the team into the ground and now they want some other city to magically solve all their woes for them. **** The Magoofs, for real. We're losing our team because they won't work with the mayor and the ICON group and they won't even consider selling part of the team. As far as I'm concerned, they're just a couple of chumps that struck it rich in the gene pool lottery and who happened to buy The Kings when they were on the way up.

 

[fansinceday1]

I blame the maloofs for being bad business men. They ran through their inheritance and are now in a huge financial bind. They need the kings as an income source. They HAVE TO LEAVE sacramento for that reason alone. If Larry Ellison or Mark Cuban were the kings owners they wouldnt need them to survive. They woyld have a better chance of surviving here in sac. So yeah, i blame the maloofs.

 

[est.1999]

The older I got, the less sensitive I got towards things I cannot control. I just don't understand the animosity towards the Maloofs.

 

[Kingster]

I blame the maloofs for being bad business men. They ran through their inheritance and are now in a huge financial bind. They need the kings as an income source. They HAVE TO LEAVE sacramento for that reason alone. If Larry Ellison or Mark Cuban were the kings owners they wouldnt need them to survive. They woyld have a better chance of surviving here in sac. So yeah, i blame the maloofs.

I think there's a lot of truth to this. The Palms was a fiasco. Buying in near the top of an incredibly overheated market into a town known for boom and bust, while California is expanding its gaming industry and sucking demand out of Las Vegas, into a casino business where the latest bestest casino is forever drawing away customers from yesterday's old news - what a lousy, lousy business decision. You wonder if it was made more for the glamour and the hormones than anything else. That said, there are a lot of causes to this failure. Horry's shot. A pitiful city council and Mayor Fargo pre-crash. The crash itself. One of the worst economies in the country. It's the perfect whirlpool for inaction.

 

[RookieOfTheDay]

I think there's a lot of truth to this. The Palms was a fiasco. Buying in near the top of an incredibly overheated market into a town known for boom and bust, while California is expanding its gaming industry and sucking demand out of Las Vegas, into a casino business where the latest bestest casino is forever drawing away customers from yesterday's old news - what a lousy, lousy business decision. You wonder if it was made more for the glamour and the hormones than anything else. That said, there are a lot of causes to this failure. Horry's shot. A pitiful city council and Mayor Fargo pre-crash. The crash itself. One of the worst economies in the country. It's the perfect whirlpool for inaction.

I've never been to Las Vegas but from what I've read The Palms off strip location alone made it a terrible investment.

 

[Arkitect]

I'm about as hard-core of a Kings fan as you will ever meet. I used to listen to every game on the radio as a kid when there was only about 25 games a year on tv. I remember the days of Lasalle Thompson, Derek Smith, Travis Mays, L-Train, Pressley, Ricky Berry, etc...

So it's a REALLY emotional time for me to see that the team that I have loved for the past 26 years is practically GONE.... I have a 7 year old son who has gotten addicted to the Kings the past couple of years and is infatuated with Tyreke Evans. I'm soooo sad that he won't be able to grow up with the Kings...

I had to tell him the other day that they were probably going to move and he kept asking why? I told him that they needed a newer, bigger arena. And his response was that they could make this one bigger? He has been pretty heartbroken....

So back to my original reason for writing this note. I see that alot of Kings fans are saying that they don't blame the Maloofs one bit for moving. On the outside, that seems like a logical feeling. I felt the same, I mean they've wanted an Arena for 10 years, and the city hasn't been able to provide one.

But digging a little deeper, I think that the Maloofs are doing exactly what they intended to do for several years:

1. What have they done in the last 5 years to even show that they are committed to helping build a new arena? The closest we came to this was the Q and R vote in 2006, when the day before (or a couple of days before) the vote, Joe Maloof came out and basically said that they weren't fully behind the measure. I mean it was going to be a brand new arena in downtown for them, but since they weren't going to be able to control the parking revenues from ALL of the events there, they sabotaged what little chance it did have of passing.

2. They have made it seem like they were willing to contribute towards building a new Arena. They even threw out the $300 million figure as their contribution. When in reality all it amounted to was a lease payment of $10 million a year for 30 years as a lease payment of sorts. In return they wanted to control EVERYTHNG at the arena, even though the City was going to foot the entire bill for everything.

3. Since 2006, they have done absolutely nothing on the Arena front. Instead, they sat back and let the NBA come in and do there work for them. What major facility around the country has been built without active lobbying and support from the team itself?

4. They have continously cut salary for several years now. Every year it was like wait till the Summer of 2010, and then the Summer came and went with nothing happening. The salary cuts have resulted in a horrible product. And the following formula is true:

Horrible Product + Bad Economy = LOW Attendance

And the low attendance gives them a perfect reason to move without looking like the bad guys. Now they're the poor little millionaire victims that are "forced" to move. Every one keeps saying how they're losing money in Sacramento, when in fact they have made a profit on the Kings the past few years. This has been documented in the media and they have even stated it.

Also, no Pro Sports owner buys a team to necessarily turn a profit every year. They make their money in the equity that the team builds over time. If they sold the team today, they would have made a huge profit compared to how much they bought the team for.

The City is definitely not without blame here, they have not done their share. Heather Fargo was totally inept and out of her league on this issue......

But KJ has put together a team that needs a little bit of time to come up with a plan, and they asked for the Maloofs to hand over some documents to assist. KJ announced yesterday that the Maloofs weren't comfortable presenting the "financial documents" requested. Why is that???? Is there something to hide? Are they making more money then they let on??? Do they NOT want an arena here?

While the Maloofs have made several public relations missteps, to imply that they have not been trying to get a new arena is ridiculous.

1. The Q and R vote was thrown together at the last minute and was going to lose horribly. It was not well thought out or planned and was going to make a serious dent in the revenues for the team. It lost by 60 points.

2. It was not like the city was going to write a huge check for the arena out of its own coffers. It was going to be financed with bonds backed by the city, much like the current arena is. Which would be paid off over time. Most of it with the money that the Maloofs would be paying for a lease.

3. The Maloofs spent millions of dollars on consultants, engineers, planners, etc. to try and get a deal done before the NBA was even brought in.

4. They had to cut salary because the fans stopped going to games. It was well documented the Maloofs were losing money hand over fist. We had one of the highest payrolls until as recently as 2008 so it wasn't like they were not paying for good players. Obviously the team was horribly assembled at that point. Throwing money at a problem doesn't fix it.

While you can try and rewrite history, the fact of the matter is the Maloofs have been emotionally and financially attached to Sacramento since they got here. They have done everything in their power to get a new arena done. But they can't afford to build it themselves. They have not even given a hint of leaving until the last 2 months. If they really wanted to leave, there was nothing preventing it from happening before now. ICON/Taylor already said an arena is less than likely. Would you be willing to lose millions of dollars because you waited to move a year? The Maloofs will make more in Anaheim than they ever could in Sacramento.

The only reason they are leaving is because Sacramento is not willing to financially support a sports team.

 

[Spike]

While the Maloofs have made several public relations missteps, to imply that they have not been trying to get a new arena is ridiculous.

1. The Q and R vote was thrown together at the last minute and was going to lose horribly. It was not well thought out or planned and was going to make a serious dent in the revenues for the team. It lost by 60 points.

2. It was not like the city was going to write a huge check for the arena out of its own coffers. It was going to be financed with bonds backed by the city, much like the current arena is. Which would be paid off over time. Most of it with the money that the Maloofs would be paying for a lease.

3. The Maloofs spent millions of dollars on consultants, engineers, planners, etc. to try and get a deal done before the NBA was even brought in.

4. They had to cut salary because the fans stopped going to games. It was well documented the Maloofs were losing money hand over fist. We had one of the highest payrolls until as recently as 2008 so it wasn't like they were not paying for good players. Obviously the team was horribly assembled at that point. Throwing money at a problem doesn't fix it.

While you can try and rewrite history, the fact of the matter is the Maloofs have been emotionally and financially attached to Sacramento since they got here. They have done everything in their power to get a new arena done. But they can't afford to build it themselves. They have not even given a hint of leaving until the last 2 months. If they really wanted to leave, there was nothing preventing it from happening before now. ICON/Taylor already said an arena is less than likely. Would you be willing to lose millions of dollars because you waited to move a year? The Maloofs will make more in Anaheim than they ever could in Sacramento.

The only reason they are leaving is because Sacramento is not willing to financially support a sports team.

Voices of reason!

 

[JB_kings]

It's ultimately their decision. So it stands to reason they should bear the large part of the responsibility here. The city leadership also failed to do their job to keep the team here. And lets not forget that the NBA played a big role in setting up the small market teams to stuggle by allowing player salaries to skyrocket so high that only large market teams can truly compete. Even with new facilities, many small markets are not able to survive. They should have addressed this during the last lockout and didn't. They look to be doing that soon, but too late for this town it seems. Which gets back to the Maloofs who are making the decision to leave now and not after a new CBA.

There is plenty of warning signs like have 3/4 of the home games scheduled before the all star break that make you wonder if this was planned? Knowing the Kings have control over their own available arena dates, it's easy for them to limit the open dates to schedule after March 1. It doesn't help much to have this exercise to guess motivations, but I think there wasn't enough done by all the parties involved.

 

[Section 101]

But digging a little deeper, I think that the Maloofs are doing exactly what they intended to do for several years:

1. What have they done in the last 5 years to even show that they are committed to helping build a new arena? The closest we came to this was the Q and R vote in 2006, when the day before (or a couple of days before) the vote, Joe Maloof came out and basically said that they weren't fully behind the measure. I mean it was going to be a brand new arena in downtown for them, but since they weren't going to be able to control the parking revenues from ALL of the events there, they sabotaged what little chance it did have of passing.

2. They have made it seem like they were willing to contribute towards building a new Arena. They even threw out the $300 million figure as their contribution. When in reality all it amounted to was a lease payment of $10 million a year for 30 years as a lease payment of sorts. In return they wanted to control EVERYTHNG at the arena, even though the City was going to foot the entire bill for everything.

3. Since 2006, they have done absolutely nothing on the Arena front. Instead, they sat back and let the NBA come in and do there work for them. What major facility around the country has been built without active lobbying and support from the team itself?

4. They have continously cut salary for several years now. Every year it was like wait till the Summer of 2010, and then the Summer came and went with nothing happening. The salary cuts have resulted in a horrible product. And the following formula is true:

Horrible Product + Bad Economy = LOW Attendance

And the low attendance gives them a perfect reason to move without looking like the bad guys. Now they're the poor little millionaire victims that are "forced" to move. Every one keeps saying how they're losing money in Sacramento, when in fact they have made a profit on the Kings the past few years. This has been documented in the media and they have even stated it.

I was just talking to a friend the other day who said the same thing. He and his family are well known in Sacramento. He believes the past 5 years has been an exit strategy to leave Sacramento.

 

[Section 101]

The Maloofs will make more in Anaheim than they ever could in Sacramento.

This is still speculation. I could make a ton of money in the stock market too.

A few good point was brougt up on Grant's show yesterday. If the Anaheim deal is so great why hasnt another team moved there the past 15 years? The Griz, Hornets, Thunder (more understandable to bring a team to the owners hometown)have all moved. There was a rumor Portland was on the move until Allen sold the arena and got a better deal. As stingy as Sterling is if he were able to make millions more I dont see the travel as being a barrier. He is a businessman before an NBA guy. The Pacers have been having problems too.

 

[Purple Reign]

Of course there is plenty of blame to go around, but I ultimately blame the short-sighted, small town, "bass-ackward" vision of local government. There was a window from 2002-06 to build an arena before the collapse of the economy while this team was thriving. I understand that MSE was playing hard ball, and right then the City should have taken the bull by the horns and built the arena and then dictated to the Maloofs the terms of the agreement. THEY DID NOT DO THAT! There was never an effort to develop public-private partnership and look to invest into this community's future.

With that said, i do believe the Maloofs have always had an exit plan in the back of their minds, and the minute they turned this process over to the NBA, was the minute they withdrew from the community and allowed Stern to dictate this effort. The first sign was the dismantling of the Sacramento Monarchs. Though many looked at that move as very minor, it was the first indication of community withdrawal.


But I would like to add this thing is not over yet. I do not believe that the family will be able to strike a 2011-12 TV deal with Fox Sports West by April 18. And then by the Board of Governors meeting in late June, the only thing the 30 owners will be concentrating on is the CBA. What sense does it make to relocate when there will be a lock out.

What does make sense is that they will file for relocation March 1, 2012 and hopefully by that time, this community will get it's act together and give the Maloofs an offer they can not refuse.

If by 3/1/2012 and there is no arena deal in Sac, I will drive the Maloofs to the airport and begin to root for the Anaheim Royals.

 

[Merdiesel]

Something that has been stewing in my mind since all this started last month was the horrible timing the Maloofs seem to have for us Kings fans. We have stuck by this team since the "rebuilding" started in 2005. Now the summer right before it all comes together with tons of cap space, valuable trade pieces, and serious young talent, there just going to up and leave like the god damn building is falling down. I don't give a **** if Arco is old. The place isnt falling to the ground. We will be in the playoff hunt next season and that place will sellout like it always has. The buzz will be back in Sacramento and with guys like Kevin Johnson and David Taylor, we WILL get an arena deal done! The Maloofs are being not only selfish pieces of ****, but horrible business men in the progress. Everyone in the right mind see it that way, why are the Maloofs so damn stubborn all of the sudden?!

 

[Section 101]

But I would like to add this thing is not over yet. I do not believe that the family will be able to strike a 2011-12 TV deal with Fox Sports West by April 18. And then by the Board of Governors meeting in late June, the only thing the 30 owners will be concentrating on is the CBA. What sense does it make to relocate when there will be a lock out.

Kinda hard to negotiate a deal with Fox when they still have 2 years left on their Comcast deal.

 

[RookieOfTheDay]

Something that has been stewing in my mind since all this started last month was the horrible timing the Maloofs seem to have for us Kings fans. We have stuck by this team since the "rebuilding" started in 2005. Now the summer right before it all comes together with tons of cap space, valuable trade pieces, and serious young talent, there just going to up and leave like the god damn building is falling down. I don't give a **** if Arco is old. The place isnt falling to the ground. We will be in the playoff hunt next season and that place will sellout like it always has. The buzz will be back in Sacramento and with guys like Kevin Johnson and David Taylor, we WILL get an arena deal done! The Maloofs are being not only selfish pieces of ****, but horrible business men in the progress. Everyone in the right mind see it that way, why are the Maloofs so damn stubborn all of the sudden?!

Bravo!

 

[Peter_Gibbons]

I've never been to Las Vegas but from what I've read The Palms off strip location alone made it a terrible investment.

The Maloofs actually did very well with the Palms initially. They did so well that they were building the Playboy tower right away almost after the opening of their first building. The problem is everyone in Vegas over extended themselves thinking the boom will never end. All these casino groups were expanding at an extremely rapid rate and borrowing $10 for every $1 they made.

Sure enough, it ended and everyone fell hard. Huge corporations like MGM, Sands, etc are all still in the **** hole because they expanded too much and too fast. The difference between them and the Maloofs is those companies have a deeper pocket to cover the losses. The 3rd building of the Palms (Palms Place) is really a condo complex that the Maloofs were trying to cash in like every other company in Vegas at that time. The City Center still has lots of empty condos just like at the Palms. They have to pay their loans when no one is buying. Gambling revenue also went down. All that together put the Maloofs in bad shape.

 

[Section 101]

The Maloofs actually did very well with the Palms initially. They did so well that they were building the Playboy tower right away almost after the opening of their first building. The problem is everyone in Vegas over extended themselves thinking the boom will never end. All these casino groups were expanding at an extremely rapid rate and borrowing $10 for every $1 they made.

Sure enough, it ended and everyone fell hard. Huge corporations like MGM, Sands, etc are all still in the **** hole because they expanded too much and too fast. The difference between them and the Maloofs is those companies have a deeper pocket to cover the losses. The 3rd building of the Palms (Palms Place) is really a condo complex that the Maloofs were trying to cash in like every other company in Vegas at that time. The City Center still has lots of empty condos just like at the Palms. They have to pay their loans when no one is buying. Gambling revenue also went down. All that together put the Maloofs in bad shape.

Plus factor in all the indian casinos popping up everywhere less people are going to Vegas to gamble for quick getaways.

 

[Arkitect]

This is still speculation. I could make a ton of money in the stock market too.

A few good point was brougt up on Grant's show yesterday. If the Anaheim deal is so great why hasnt another team moved there the past 15 years? The Griz, Hornets, Thunder (more understandable to bring a team to the owners hometown)have all moved. There was a rumor Portland was on the move until Allen sold the arena and got a better deal. As stingy as Sterling is if he were able to make millions more I dont see the travel as being a barrier. He is a businessman before an NBA guy. The Pacers have been having problems too.

You are right. It is speculation. But it hard to believe that they would lose more money by moving to an area where they can get a lucrative TV deal, have a larger arena to fill, have more companies to provide sponsorship, is a larger market, and has more luxury boxes. Plus they won't have to pay for a new arena in the near future. Obviously we don't know all of the details of the Anaheim deal. But if things go well, the opportunity is there to make way more money than they ever could in Sacramento. The worst case is they do about as well as they are doing now.

 

[bajaden]

I've never been to Las Vegas but from what I've read The Palms off strip location alone made it a terrible investment.

The Palms has long been a favorite hangout for the locals of Las Vegas. Which is a good thing to have when things are slow. And the Palms by the way, isn't the only big casino off the main drag. The problem is the economy. Las Vegas is a destination vacation spot. As is the Palms. When people don't travel, and instead stay closer to home, places like Las Vegas suffer. The economy in mexico is suffering for the same reason. Good businessmen or not, they had no control over the economy. And as they say, timing is everything. Unfortunately for them, the economy went south at almost the same time they had commited millions of dollars to expansion. Sometimes, its just bad luck. Kind of ironic don't you think, considering that they're in the gambling business.

 

[Superman]

But digging a little deeper, I think that the Maloofs are doing exactly what they intended to do for several years:

The reason I disagree with that is the fact that they haven't moved, even though they've had the opportunity to do so. This Anaheim idea isn't new. The fact that the Kings are still in Sacramento makes me believe that that's where the Maloofs want them to be.

1. What have they done in the last 5 years to even show that they are committed to helping build a new arena? The closest we came to this was the Q and R vote in 2006, when the day before (or a couple of days before) the vote, Joe Maloof came out and basically said that they weren't fully behind the measure. I mean it was going to be a brand new arena in downtown for them, but since they weren't going to be able to control the parking revenues from ALL of the events there, they sabotaged what little chance it did have of passing.

From what I understand, MSE wasn't going to have control over any of the parking revenues, even for Kings events. I could be misremembering, but I thought that was their objection, not that they couldn't control parking revenues for non-Kings events.

And I don't think it's fair to say that Joe Maloof sabotaged the vote; it was doomed from the start. Both measures went down practically 80/20. The pre-polling from days before the vote showed that they didn't have enough support to pass. You're making it seem like a measure that was on the road to passage was shot down by MSE.

2. They have made it seem like they were willing to contribute towards building a new Arena. They even threw out the $300 million figure as their contribution. When in reality all it amounted to was a lease payment of $10 million a year for 30 years as a lease payment of sorts. In return they wanted to control EVERYTHNG at the arena, even though the City was going to foot the entire bill for everything.

A $10 million/year lease agreement is unheard of in professional sports. If the city floated a $300 million loan (or bonds), expecting payment within 30 years, and still got to retain ownership of the facility after the 30 year lease, that's not that crazy of a deal. I don't blame them for wanting a more feasible agreement, but $10 million a year for a sports lease is more than generous. And the city would have put up the money to build the arena, but MSE would have paid all operating costs associated with Kings events, on top of the $10 million/year.

3. Since 2006, they have done absolutely nothing on the Arena front. Instead, they sat back and let the NBA come in and do there work for them. What major facility around the country has been built without active lobbying and support from the team itself?

Didn't Stern take the reins? The Maloofs asked for some support from the NBA, since the NBA had been reticent regarding their feelings on the Sacramento arena issue, and Stern came in trying to get a deal done. The Maloofs have been actively lobbying for support for an arena for over a decade, and just because the NBA got more involved doesn't mean they've stopped.

4. They have continously cut salary for several years now. Every year it was like wait till the Summer of 2010, and then the Summer came and went with nothing happening. The salary cuts have resulted in a horrible product. And the following formula is true:

Horrible Product + Bad Economy = LOW Attendance

That formula is not always true. There are several teams even now that haven't won for years, with poor local economies, that have better attendance than the Kings.

On top of that, the Maloofs have cut salary the past three or four years because we've been rebuilding. If anything, we waited too long to start cutting salary, because they were trying to keep a semi-competitive team on the floor, rather than blowing it up when they should have in 2005. Instead, they kept handing out $30 million MLE contracts to players like SAR and Mikki Moore, when they should have been paring back. The idea that they've been skimping on salary to save money is not true.

And the low attendance gives them a perfect reason to move without looking like the bad guys. Now they're the poor little millionaire victims that are "forced" to move. Every one keeps saying how they're losing money in Sacramento, when in fact they have made a profit on the Kings the past few years. This has been documented in the media and they have even stated it.

The meager profits they've made in recent seasons don't even offset the losses they took during the Webber/Bibby/Vlade/Miller years, when we were one of the highest payroll teams in the NBA, paying luxury taxes.

Also, no Pro Sports owner buys a team to necessarily turn a profit every year. They make their money in the equity that the team builds over time. If they sold the team today, they would have made a huge profit compared to how much they bought the team for.

There's no equity in the Kings. The Maloofs are upside down.

I also reject the idea that a sports franchise should be okay with losing money every year, not that the Maloofs are. According to Forbes, much of the league turns a profit every year, including good small market teams (Portland, OKC, etc.) Forbes also says the Kings were $9 million in the hole last year.

The City is definitely not without blame here, they have not done their share. Heather Fargo was totally inept and out of her league on this issue......

But KJ has put together a team that needs a little bit of time to come up with a plan, and they asked for the Maloofs to hand over some documents to assist. KJ announced yesterday that the Maloofs weren't comfortable presenting the "financial documents" requested. Why is that???? Is there something to hide? Are they making more money then they let on??? Do they NOT want an arena here?

They did hand their documents over. The only reason this has been an issue is because KJ said 'we want them to do this on Friday, and they didn't do it until Monday.' It's a non-issue, really. Taylor/ICON have everything they need from the Maloofs. And they have an extension to work out a plan.

As I said, if they just wanted to move, damn what happens in Sacramento, why haven't they moved yet? They could have done so at any point since they've owned the team. They could have filed papers weeks ago.

I do NOT think the Maloofs are the victims, or without blame. They obviously haven't been perfect, and have made a mess of things. Their franchise and fanbase is depressed, mostly because they haven't put a winning product on the floor for the last five years. I have maintained for several seasons that they've made Petrie's job harder than it had to be, whereas many felt like Petrie wasn't a good GM anymore. There's tons of blame to assign to MSE.

However, I believe that they do want to stay in Sacramento, and I believe that they have wanted to stay the entire time. It's been over a decade.

But the only "victims" are the Sacramento area fans and the local employees.

 

[bajaden]

I think there's a lot of truth to this. The Palms was a fiasco. Buying in near the top of an incredibly overheated market into a town known for boom and bust, while California is expanding its gaming industry and sucking demand out of Las Vegas, into a casino business where the latest bestest casino is forever drawing away customers from yesterday's old news - what a lousy, lousy business decision. You wonder if it was made more for the glamour and the hormones than anything else. That said, there are a lot of causes to this failure. Horry's shot. A pitiful city council and Mayor Fargo pre-crash. The crash itself. One of the worst economies in the country. It's the perfect whirlpool for inaction.

If you've ever been to Las Vegas, you'd realize that gambling isn't the whole picture by a long shot. Its about the experience. Anyone that just wants to sit and pull the lever on a slot machine all day isn't going to go to Las Vegas to begin with. Las Vegas has been transformed from a pure gambling town into a family experience town. The reason the Palms expanded, is because they couldn't accommadate all their potential customers. They didn't just get up one morning and decide to spend millions. They had research done. It simply came down to the economy going bad.

 

[Spike]

Something that has been stewing in my mind since all this started last month was the horrible timing the Maloofs seem to have for us Kings fans. We have stuck by this team since the "rebuilding" started in 2005. Now the summer right before it all comes together with tons of cap space, valuable trade pieces, and serious young talent, there just going to up and leave like the god damn building is falling down. I don't give a **** if Arco is old. The place isnt falling to the ground. We will be in the playoff hunt next season and that place will sellout like it always has. The buzz will be back in Sacramento and with guys like Kevin Johnson and David Taylor, we WILL get an arena deal done! The Maloofs are being not only selfish pieces of ****, but horrible business men in the progress. Everyone in the right mind see it that way, why are the Maloofs so damn stubborn all of the sudden?!

Because the team has already been there, and the city's attitude was "why rebuild? Look at how packed it is now!"

 

[Section 101]

If you've ever been to Las Vegas, you'd realize that gambling isn't the whole picture by a long shot. Its about the experience. Anyone that just wants to sit and pull the lever on a slot machine all day isn't going to go to Las Vegas to begin with. Las Vegas has been transformed from a pure gambling town into a family experience town. The reason the Palms expanded, is because they couldn't accommadate all their potential customers. They didn't just get up one morning and decide to spend millions. They had research done. It simply came down to the economy going bad.

did their research include what happens if the economy tanks? Smart businessmen look at all senarios and plan for them before making decisions . Maybe they should have raised prices instead of expanding so much.

 

[R1LOVER]

Vegas is paid for by gambling... always has been and always will be.... the attractions you see are just because! The money comes from the tables!

(disclaimer) this is my opinion and nothing more, I will not provide a source or sources of this information. lmao

 

[Superman]

did their research include what happens if the economy tanks? Smart businessmen look at all senarios and plan for them before making decisions . Maybe they should have raised prices instead of expanding so much.

Any business venture can die if the economy tanks.

 

[cstorm]

Something that has been stewing in my mind since all this started last month was the horrible timing the Maloofs seem to have for us Kings fans. We have stuck by this team since the "rebuilding" started in 2005. Now the summer right before it all comes together with tons of cap space, valuable trade pieces, and serious young talent, there just going to up and leave like the god damn building is falling down. I don't give a **** if Arco is old. The place isnt falling to the ground. We will be in the playoff hunt next season and that place will sellout like it always has. The buzz will be back in Sacramento and with guys like Kevin Johnson and David Taylor, we WILL get an arena deal done! The Maloofs are being not only selfish pieces of ****, but horrible business men in the progress. Everyone in the right mind see it that way, why are the Maloofs so damn stubborn all of the sudden?!

Unless they planned to be in a playoff run in Aneheim.

 

[BMiller52]

No they deserve about 50-60% of the blame atleast. I mean they are bailing on Sac when Sac finally has a mayor and city council who wants to get this done, and a group like Taylor/ICON with some experience. And they wont even talk to ICON/Taylor? Give me a break.

 

[pdxKingsFan]

Vegas is paid for by gambling... always has been and always will be.... the attractions you see are just because! The money comes from the tables!

(disclaimer) this is my opinion and nothing more, I will not provide a source or sources of this information. lmao

This is true but not as true as it used to be. The gambling revenue is supposed to be a million or more per day so food and attractions profits are just a drop in the bucket but sometime in the past 10-15 years the casinos stopped using them as loss leaders to get people into their casinos and actually expected them to profit. It really has changed the complexion of Vegas and not for the better imho.

 

[fnordius]

Do they NOT want an arena here?

Now that they've whizzed away the family fortune, they need a huge bailout. Saramento can't offer that, so if we offer them an arena now, all we'll be accomplishing is to make them look worse, and give them headaches when the NBA's asked to approve the relocation.

Speaking only for myself, it doesn't matter whether the answer is that the Maloofs have lied to us, or merely been incompetent. My unbreakable tie to the Sacramento Kings dated from a committment I made to my son in 1993, while we were waiting in line to get an autograph from Olden Polynice, who'd just been traded to Sac. My kid was a wide eyed little 3rd grader then, and I consider any promises made to a sweet little kid to be absolutely sacred. I would support the Sacramento Kings, no matter what.

A decade later, after the WCF, my son concluded that the NBA would never let the Kings win over an enormous cash cow like the Lakers, and lost most of his interest in the NBA. A couple of years later, he didn't even know the roster anymore.

By then I hadn't lived within an hour of Sac for several years. As continuous cost cutting and "refurbishing" slowly turned the team into rubbish, I kept my promise. As all of the players I loved were shown the door, and replaced by players who I didn't have any feelings for, or even disliked, I kept my promise. Through the recent years of basketball that was often so bad that I could not bear to watch it, I kept my promise.

Reading VF's beautiful post made me realize what had kept me going this long. It wasn't the crappy team, the somnambulent GM, the dim owners, or the cash hungry NBA, it was the way the Kings, as some sort of intangible entity, had interwoven itself with so many aspects of my friendships and family, and decades of my life.

I just concluded a long and tearful phone call with my son, reminiscing about better days. He hadn't been able to understand why I'd stayed interested in such a mess of a franchise for so long. I told him that I was just keeping my vow to that sweet little kid. But if there will be no more Sacramento Kings, then I am finally free. I am letting go as quickly as the pain will let me.

Every fan will have their own stories, and none of them will be quite like mine. Every fan will reach their own conclusions, and I guess that some of you will care whether the Maloofs have been deceptive or not. All I care about is that they ended the Sacramento Kings, permanently severing whatever connection I had to them. They are dead to me.

 

[pdxKingsFan]

On the original subject I think there is blame to be spread all around. Regardless, the Maloofs are setting themselves up to look like villains by the timing of this move while the Taylor/ICON project is still in motion and also with the destination that they have apparently chosen for their team. At this point they seem to have made it clear that the only reason they will stay is because Anaheim didn't give them what they wanted which also means that if Sacramento does keep them there may be an extended period of hurt feelings and distrust.