and with the #1 pick in the 2009 NBA draft the Kings select...

Do you guys think if Derozan will drop to Houston pick if he doesnt have a strong tournament. And will you be willing to take a flyer on him at that spot.
 
Henkel said:
Don't really understand the all the hate for Holiday. A lot of great NBA pg have had rather pedestrian freshman season. Every year kids get written off way to early. After his freshman year Thabeet was crucified because he was over hype. While Rose is a rare exception most point guards are not ready to go pro after their freshman season.

I wouldn't be the least bit surprised if Holiday works himself into a lottery pick by next year. He has pretty good handles from what i have seen. Must be watching a different game then you guys. Being out of control with the ball isn't all ways a result of not being able to handle it. His ball handling is much better then Westbrook was at the same age. His shot looks good he just needs to get more confident and consistent. Physically he is set with good size, speed, and athleticism. If Holiday never improves or only improves slightly next season then ill start being more critical but i think dismissing him this early could make you look foolish.
Click to expand...

On the flipside -- if Holiday had not entered college with so much hype around him, would anybody even be talking about him at all at this point?
 
nbrans said:
I agree with most of this especially that he can definitely get better and may turn into a really good player. He has incredible vision and good defensive effort, so that's a start.

I think the biggest limitation right now though is that he's not as quick as he was advertised. It's not a matter of him coming in like Westbrook and being a sensational athlete who's still putting together his skills, he just doesn't have that kind of explosiveness. He's not a special athlete, especially when it comes to quickness.

He's athletic enough to be a good player and certainly has the vision to be a true point, but the Westbrook comparisons really need to end. He's a far different player. Westbrook is mostly athleticism. Jrue Holiday is going to need to be all smarts and skills because he's not that quick.
Click to expand...

I agree comparing him to Westbrook was a mistake. Jrue is never going to have the first step to get by defenders like Westbrook so he is going to have to become better at handling the ball. I suppose the point i was trying to make was his ball handling is good enough that with some more time i could see him developing into a good ball handler.

You are right Jrue isn't going to be much of a player if he intends to make it on the next level as a combo guard. He has to develop into a true point guard. Thats could take some time but like you said he has the vision and the passing ability, which are the most important thing. He needs to become consistent with his jumper and learns to more aggressive going to the basket. Got to agree with you again he doesn't have great speed. Good enough sums up his overall athletic ability quite nicely, and is probably the reason i see him as good point guard at the next level rather then a potential star. His height is going to really help him on both side of the court but overall hes not going to overwhelm anyone athletically on the next level.

I suppose by "not very good" you were referring to him as a prospect for this years draft? If thats the case i agree but as a freshman point guard i think he is having a decent season.
 
Bricklayer said:
On the flipside -- if Holiday had not entered college with so much hype around him, would anybody even be talking about him at all at this point?
Click to expand...

Without a doubt. Going to UCLA helps with that for sure. Collison and Westbrook saw far less playing time and hype as freshman but both were talked about going into their sophomore years because like Jrue they had pro potential and they were playing for one of the biggest programs in the nation. Would he be talked about as much? No, but it cuts both ways. He would be seen as a nice young player to watch rather then a kid trying to living up to high expectations.
 
Last edited:
Bricklayer said:
On the flipside -- if Holiday had not entered college with so much hype around him, would anybody even be talking about him at all at this point?
Click to expand...

Your absolutely right. When you go to a UCLA, North Carolina, Kansas, Duke, etc. It can be a huge stepping stone to the NBA and the riches that follow. It can also be a curse if you don't live up to expectations. There's no place to hide in those programs, and the pressure is greater. In Holiday's case, I think he has talent, and it would serve him well to return to school, especially since Collison will be gone and the point position will be solely his.
 
Its actually been worst for Jrue this year because last year Westbrook came out of nowhere and went top 5 in the draft. So everyone expected Jrue to fill in his shoes even though they are totally different players.
 
bajaden said:
Your absolutely right. When you go to a UCLA, North Carolina, Kansas, Duke, etc. It can be a huge stepping stone to the NBA and the riches that follow. It can also be a curse if you don't live up to expectations. There's no place to hide in those programs, and the pressure is greater. In Holiday's case, I think he has talent, and it would serve him well to return to school, especially since Collison will be gone and the point position will be solely his.
Click to expand...

Was that Bricks point? What i read was a simple question. Would Jrue be talked about as pro prospect without the hype coming into this season? The answer in my opinion is yes.

All that other stuff seems to be piggybacking on my point that prospect with pro potential from large programs get attention regardless of the hype surrounding them when they enter college.

Anyways its fair to say Jrue doesn't deserve attention in a discussion for a top pick in this years draft, which is probably what this thread should be about.
 
Henkel said:
I suppose by "not very good" you were referring to him as a prospect for this years draft? If thats the case i agree but as a freshman point guard i think he is having a decent season.
Click to expand...

Yeah, I meant this year. We'll see how/if he steps up next year.
 
Did anyone catch Mississippi St. vs. LSU? Jarvis Varnado put up 19 pts 7 rbs and 7 blks. The numbers were fine but something about the guy intrigues me. I think it's that he passes the eyeball test-- possessing good length and broad shoulders while showing nice quick jumping ability as well as running the floor quite well. In addition, his hands also seemed solid. I am not sure how to best articulate it, but he has been one of the few players I have seen the last few days who pops off the screen as being an NBA caliber athlete.

To be honest, I had only half-watched the guy play a few times before so I can't claim an informed opinion about him. Neither does he have much of a presence on the draft websites. So I was wondering what the draft experts and college basketball gurus here thought of him. Just another Justin Williams type, or does anyone think more could be there?
 
Last edited:
Justin Williams pt deux.

That may not be quite fair, but at his size he absolutely needs to develop a skillset. He's an NBA PF, and not a bulky one. If he can't play offense he'll end up like Cedric Simmons over on our bench.
 
Henkel said:
Was that Bricks point? What i read was a simple question. Would Jrue be talked about as pro prospect without the hype coming into this season? The answer in my opinion is yes.

All that other stuff seems to be piggybacking on my point that prospect with pro potential from large programs get attention regardless of the hype surrounding them when they enter college.

Anyways its fair to say Jrue doesn't deserve attention in a discussion for a top pick in this years draft, which is probably what this thread should be about.
Click to expand...

Ummm, I don't think that I was necessarily disagreeing with you. I was simply expanding on what Bricky said. I think your more likely to get hyped when you go to a big program. I doubt he would have been ranked as high if he had gone to Rider and played the same way.. But your right, he shouldn't even be in the conversation.
 
Jrue was hyped before he even signed with UCLA, he was ranked as top 5 recruit from high school for a long time. This ranking over hyped him leading to his downfall. Also guys like Collison and Westbrook werent that highly recruited so no one noticed them until they started playing well in their sophomore years. The only UCLA recent PG I can remember doing well as freshman was Jordan Farmar, and even he was decent not that great.


Derozan is putting up good numbers in the pac 10 tournament.
 
Last edited:
Alabi

I mentioned Alabi (Florida St.) earlier in the season. This is the second time I've watched him. 7'1", good wingspan, mobile. BETTER offensively than Thabeet. He's more fluid. He gets off a jump hook quickly, even hit a mid-range jumper. Obviously still raw, just a freshman, and has only been playing basketball for a few years, but here's a guy who has a defensive presence in the paint AND who also looks like he could be legitimate offensive threat in the NBA in a few years. Very interesting. I like him better than Thabeet, who looks like he plays offense through a series of mechanical steps, like building an erector set.

Douglas is a stud. He's the only major offensive threat on his team, and he still gets shots off. Defensive player of the year. Very nice player.

Florida St has got to be the most athletic college basketball team in the country.
 
Kingster said:
I mentioned Alabi (Florida St.) earlier in the season. This is the second time I've watched him. 7'1", good wingspan, mobile. BETTER offensively than Thabeet. He's more fluid. He gets off a jump hook quickly, even hit a mid-range jumper. Obviously still raw, just a freshman, and has only been playing basketball for a few years, but here's a guy who has a defensive presence in the paint AND who also looks like he could be legitimate offensive threat in the NBA in a few years. Very interesting. I like him better than Thabeet, who looks like he plays offense through a series of mechanical steps, like building an erector set.

Douglas is a stud. He's the only major offensive threat on his team, and he still gets shots off. Defensive player of the year. Very nice player.

Florida St has got to be the most athletic college basketball team in the country.
Click to expand...

When I watched Florida St. early on this year, I thought to myself that if they ever start to jell they could be scary by the end of the year. Their still pretty eratic and inconsistant, but I wouldn't want to play them in the tourney.
 
bajaden said:
When I watched Florida St. early on this year, I thought to myself that if they ever start to jell they could be scary by the end of the year. Their still pretty eratic and inconsistant, but I wouldn't want to play them in the tourney.
Click to expand...

If they had that one other guy that could consistently score 15+ points a game, they would go all the way in the NCAAs. With only Douglas as a good scorer, and pg play that is very mediocre, they probably won't make a big splash. But if they play some teams that don't feel comfortable with outside shots in the tourney, then Fl State will smother them.

I swear that the Fl State coach is trying to "hide" Alabi by playing him fewer minutes. He did the same thing in the earlier game I saw this season. He's probably telling the guy he is not even close to being good enough to be drafted by the NBA so he doesn't come out. The guy has a 7'5" wingspan and mobility, a jump hook, and can hit a free throw. Yeah, I'll take a wild guess and say that he's going to make it in the NBA...
 
Jespher said:
How far will Stephen Curry fall this year? Davidson isn't in the tournament, and his turnovers increased as he was pushed around with bigger players. Since he is a tweener, could he slip lower in the draft than a Lawson, Collison, or Mills even?

http://www.realgm.com/src_wiretap_archives/57919/20090315/scout_stephen_curry_still_a_first_rounder/
Click to expand...

Hard to say for sure since there is a lot that will still happen between now and the draft, and he already was one of those prospects that people have wildly different opinions on. I think a team will still take a chance on him late in the lottery or very soon after.
 
kingsnation said:
Idk, NBA teams love pure shooters.
Click to expand...

WE love pure shooters -- NBA teams pass on them all the time if the questions are sufficient. Especially in the case of tweener guards, which are second only to too small PFs in their bust potential in the NBA. But in this draft, with so few highly respected prospects and so many question marks, he's still got to be a lottery pick of some kind, especially with the NBA pedigree.
 
Curry is more than a pure shooter though. I don't know if people got to see him play this year, but his passing was really stellar. Not just competent, but creative. I still don't know if he has the athleticism, but he has the ballhandling and passing ability to be a true point even aside from his scoring.
 
nbrans said:
Curry is more than a pure shooter though. I don't know if people got to see him play this year, but his passing was really stellar. Not just competent, but creative. I still don't know if he has the athleticism, but he has the ballhandling and passing ability to be a true point even aside from his scoring.
Click to expand...
That's how I feel about him...reminds a lot of Bibby. I would love for us to find a way to land Curry in this draft.
 
For anyone who watched the Pac-10 tournament this year, it looks like DeRozan is back in the lottery discussion. He was the best player on the floor in all three of their games, nailing almost all of his jumpers and showing off all of the athleticism we've been expecting to see. Taj Gibson did well for himself too.

I also got a chance to see the Syracuse v UCONN game on ESPN Classics yesterday. Johnny Flynn made quite an impression in that game, especially in the overtime periods. He looks like more of a scorer than a pure PG, but he showed some kind of heart staying out there for all two hours worth of OT, making things happen for his team, and not missing a single free throw.
 
nbrans said:
Curry is more than a pure shooter though. I don't know if people got to see him play this year, but his passing was really stellar. Not just competent, but creative. I still don't know if he has the athleticism, but he has the ballhandling and passing ability to be a true point even aside from his scoring.
Click to expand...

I will admit that I've been more impressed with his passing ability than I thought I would be. He has more pt guard skills than I thought. I'm still not totally sold on him, but would certainly take a flyer on him with our second pick. I doubt he will be there then.
 
nbrans said:
Curry is more than a pure shooter though. I don't know if people got to see him play this year, but his passing was really stellar. Not just competent, but creative. I still don't know if he has the athleticism, but he has the ballhandling and passing ability to be a true point even aside from his scoring.
Click to expand...

I think he'll be pretty good, Bibby with slightly less handle.
 
Kings need Patrick Mills. flat out.

I dont care if we trade down, move up on our 2nd first rounder. but if no Ricky Rubio, Mills needs to be our pg.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Similar threads

Y
76ers could acquire $36 million lottery pick via major trade with Kings
Replies
16
Views
1K
See_Hanks
See_Hanks
A
LaVine and DeRozan combine for 80 points in Kings 127-117 win over the Pistons
Replies
0
Views
116
Associated Press
A
twslam07
[Drastic Edition] “THE” Trade Deadline Move to Make…
2
Replies
39
Views
2K
twslam07
twslam07
A
Kings beat Hornets 125-102 to maintain hold on 10th spot in the West
Replies
0
Views
96
Associated Press
A
S
Bold Lineup Change the Sacramento Kings Need to Make
Replies
7
Views
415
ShastaKingsFan
ShastaKingsFan
Back
Top