Am I the only one who feels like the Kings are even weaker now?

[TheJewishKing]

Sure that all of these guys that the Kings management assigned can light up in a certain game and give you a 20 point game performance this is why they are playing in the NBA from the beginning, question is will they be consistant for us from the bench, or maybe we will be able to witness only one out of ten games that they actually contribute to the team.

I am trying to figure out where the chemistry is going to come from and how the pieces can add together to complete and make this squad a team, I don't know much about their locker room behavior, and how much they are willing to contribute to this team behind the shadows, we need a veteran that can show us leadership and I am not quite sure that either Barnes or Tolliver are the answers, we have plenty of young players this year, rookies and sophomores who need guidness no doubt about it, but I am not sure of who can provide it for them.

A team can fall on its chemistry and on what happens in the locker room where us fans can't see it, I hope this team can somehow become a cohesive unit and play together and be united and strong as a team.

 

[VF21]

I'd advise you to wait until they've at least had an opportunity to meet each other.

You can't predict everything. If you could, being a General Manager wouldn't be such a tough job. I trust Vlade...he knows the difference between good chemistry and a bunch of guys who just play together because they have to. I truly believe he and his staff have worked very hard interviewing players and getting an idea of just who they are. The rest of us mere mortals are just going to have to wait and see if they've made the right choices. I prefer to look at it in a positive light until I have reason not to. Life is just too short to always worry about what might not be instead of what might.

GO KINGS!!

 

[CelticsFan]

I don't think they are really better or worse, I think they're about the same. Maybe a couple more wins maybe a couple more losses, it's a toss up for me. The bottom line for me is they don't look like they have the talent to take the next step......PLAYOFFS. Maybe Joerger and Vlade turn this thing around in a few years but unfortunately it will be too late for Cuz.

IMO Kings needed to swing for the fences in free agency but either didn't try or missed. IMO they needed to bring in guys that games are projecting up not down to show Cuz the team is heading in the right direction. This season is going to make or break our Cuz plans, I wish Vlade would have got more firepower.

 

[King Baller]

Sure that all of these guys that the Kings management assigned can light up in a certain game and give you a 20 point game performance this is why they are playing in the NBA from the beginning, question is will they be consistant for us from the bench, or maybe we will be able to witness only one out of ten games that they actually contribute to the team.

I am trying to figure out where the chemistry is going to come from and how the pieces can add together to complete and make this squad a team, I don't know much about their locker room behavior, and how much they are willing to contribute to this team behind the shadows, we need a veteran that can show us leadership and I am not quite sure that either Barnes or Tolliver are the answers, we have plenty of young players this year, rookies and sophomores who need guidness no doubt about it, but I am not sure of who can provide it for them.

A team can fall on its chemistry and on what happens in the locker room where us fans can't see it, I hope this team can somehow become a cohesive unit and play together and be united and strong as a team.

A nice start is two players voted teammates of the year by their peers--> http://www.nba.com/kings/blog/temple-and-tolliver-named-teammates-year/

 

[TheJewishKing]

A nice start is two players voted teammates of the year by their peers--> http://www.nba.com/kings/blog/temple-and-tolliver-named-teammates-year/

Let's just hope that they both will be the teammates of the year here as well....

What I am basically trying to say is that the Kings didn't sign or traded any big name thus far, something is missing, there is no one new on this team that can the difference maker, someone who we can rely on shooting the ball with positive percentages consistently, someone who can be another leader next to DeMarcus Cousins, when I think about it even more, we lost a leader this offseason, like it or not, at least in my opinion, Rajon Rondo was a second leader next to DeMarcus Cousins and I am not sure that Collison can be a leader on this team....

I mean to me at least it feels like we gathered all the "odds and ends" all the residues that no team in the league was interested in, maybe besides Arron Afflalo, but I don't think both Barnes and Tolliver can really add something to us, as I mentioned before I reckon that that Barnes is passed his prime and Tolliver just isn't that good of a player, same goes for Temple, only Temple is still eligible to develop as a player, but as for now he is mediocre just like the rest of our bench..

I am kinda frustrated because there is no new big name on this team, I can't see us making the playoffs, I am sorry to be pessimistic but that's how I feel, I want to be mistaken and I will be more than happy to be proven wrong but I just don't see it happening.

 

[dude12]

I think Joerger and his schemes has to be the difference maker. There is enough alert there that maybe we overachieve this year due to good coaching and stiff defense and a premier player. Last couple of years, we underachieved and I think too many people are used to this from Sac....understandably. Maybe this year is different.

 

[ParniValjak]

Let's just hope that they both will be the teammates of the year here as well....

What I am basically trying to say is that the Kings didn't sign or traded any big name thus far, something is missing, there is no one new on this team that can the difference maker, someone who we can rely on shooting the ball with positive percentages consistently, someone who can be another leader next to DeMarcus Cousins, when I think about it even more, we lost a leader this offseason, like it or not, at least in my opinion, Rajon Rondo was a second leader next to DeMarcus Cousins and I am not sure that Collison can be a leader on this team....

I mean to me at least it feels like we gathered all the "odds and ends" all the residues that no team in the league was interested in, maybe besides Arron Afflalo, but I don't think both Barnes and Tolliver can really add something to us, as I mentioned before I reckon that that Barnes is passed his prime and Tolliver just isn't that good of a player, same goes for Temple, only Temple is still eligible to develop as a player, but as for now he is mediocre just like the rest of our bench..

I am kinda frustrated because there is no new big name on this team, I can't see us making the playoffs, I am sorry to be pessimistic but that's how I feel, I want to be mistaken and I will be more than happy to be proven wrong but I just don't see it happening.

I think this is a classic case of out of sight out of mind.

Matt Barnes is still playing at a high level and was a consistently good contributor to the Memphis team that made the play-offs despite Memphis suffering a long list of injuries and using a league leading 28 players.

For years we have been whinging about lacking perimeter defenders. We go out and sign two legitimate perimeter defenders in Barnes and Temple and all of a sudden we signed mediocre players who don't make us better.

People need to look at what offensive and defensive schemes was Joerger running in Memphis. Look at the personnel in Memphis and then look at the personnel that we have in Sacramento now and it is not that hugely different. Forget what we ran under Karl and Corbin because that is really irrelevant going forward. Our offensive and defensive sets will be very different to what we saw last year and if you look at the personnel that we recruited, each and every one of them (bar maybe Lawson defensively) fit that system

Cousins and Rudy will be our offensive guys with a sprinkle of Collison and Afflalo mixed in with some help from Casspi and maybe Lawson. For years we whinged about not having 3 and D guys on the team and when we sign them (Barnes, Temple and even Tolliver) all of a suden the sky is falling in.

Forget about scoring. This team has never had trouble scoring the basketball. Not with Karl, not before Karl and not post Karl. For years this team has had problem defending. With our signings we took some good steps forward in this area which means that hopefully we will limit the opposition teams from scoring heavily on us and as a result instead of us needing to score 120 to win, we could now quite comfortably win by scoring 95-100 points.

We added extra scoring punch with Afflalo and Lawson so our offense will certainly not get worse but our defense will improve significantly over the course of the season. It might take some time for things to settle and everyone to gels and gets better at executing the schemes at either end of the ground but rightly we were not focused on the offensive end that much but we focused on defense and adding stability to the team at positions that have been massive headaches for us for years now.

 

[KingMilz]

Only way I currently see us making any noise is if Ty Lawson is the Ty Lawson of 2012-2014 and that's highly doubtful, I think a number of the teams we are competing with for a spot got quiet a bit better and we didn't really (slight improvement) at least this time around building a mediocre team didn't cost us 2 pick swaps and whatever else.

Who knows maybe the coach could have a massive impact and all the parts fit and we have a good season but I think this scenario is far less likely of the two.

 

[Suicide King]

We missed a golden opportunity last season with some teams daring us to take a playoff spot and we couldn't. Maybe lightening will strike twice and some teams struggle that normally wouldn't.

 

[Semi]

The team is deeper at the bottom, and the coaching might be better. But unless Afflalo has a rebirth on defense, Ben wises up, and Lawson finds inner peace, 500 will be a struggle.

The coaching MIGHT be better? Come on.....that's a no brainer IMO.

 

[dude12]

The coaching MIGHT be better? Come on.....that's a no brainer IMO.

Yeah.....unless Joerger goes George Karl and decides an undersized backcourt of Lawson and Collison playing together with Afflalo at SF is a good idea and Joerger decides that is our best chance to outscore the other team is to go very small so we can keep increasing pace........

Did some people forget our lineups last year? Watch this team on defense this year. When we switch on defense, we will actually be able to do this effectively instead of having Rondo guarding Blake Griffin in the post on occasions.

 

[King Baller]

Only way I currently see us making any noise is if Ty Lawson is the Ty Lawson of 2012-2014 and that's highly doubtful, I think a number of the teams we are competing with for a spot got quiet a bit better and we didn't really (slight improvement) at least this time around building a mediocre team didn't cost us 2 pick swaps and whatever else.

Who knows maybe the coach could have a massive impact and all the parts fit and we have a good season but I think this scenario is far less likely of the two.

Here is my opinion if the Western Conference teams improved:

Warriors - Durant is a stud, no doubt, but there is only one ball. Losing Bogut, Barnes, Ezeli, Barbosa, Speights and Rush should cause their defense to take a major hit. They did add Zaza and West but the team chemistry is different. Still the top team in the West.
Clippers - They added Speights, Bass and Felton to an already very good team. If the Warriors can't keep all those shooters happy the Clips will supplant them. Blake Griffin's assault on the Team Trainer Mathias Testi is the 800 pound gorilla in the room.
Suns - Drafted Bender, Chriss and Ulis. Signed Dudley and Barbosa. I think Maybe next year the young talent gels for the Suns.
Lakers - Walton is unproven building a team. Drafted Ingram and Zubac. Added Mozgov, Deng, Calderon, Huertas and Wear. The Lakers are better but it should take a while for these guys to all play together. Waltons best players are very young. I think there could be some turmoil in LA.

Continued...

 

[Bricklayer]

I admit I have not followed much about the Kings lately, or about the NBA in general, and I haven't been watching the Sacramento Kings fan in a consecutive manner as I used to do before, mostly since I have joined the army, but I have this feeling that the current Kings roster is weaker than the previous roster of last year.

I mean we obviously have gone weaker and lost strength in the point guard spot, losing Rajon Rondo who averaged a double-double with us last season is a huge disadvantage for us, as much as I love Darren Collison I reckon that he is still not due to lead an NBA team as a starting player, we also lost Seth Curry which can be very explosive of the bench and he displayed it as the season was winding down....
We signed Ty Lawson which in my opinion was once a very decent player, but probably not anymore, wasn't able to prove himself in Houston and Indiana, I feel like he has passed his prime.

I have the same feeling towards players like Matt Barnes (which I personally dislike due to his aggressive manner on and off the court) and Aaron Aflalo, I reckon that they are both have passed their prime as well, maybe they both can add some experience to the squad but I am not sure how they are going to contribute really....

I am not going to write much about Malachi, Labbissiere and Papagiannis because as I have mentioned before in this thread I haven't been following the Kings moves in this offseason...

Just wanted to share my thoughts and see if there are people feeling the way I feel although I hope I am concerned for no reason...

Let me tell you an old story.

Once upon a time there was a HOF center entering his 7th year in the league.

He was coming off a season in which he had averaged 26.6pts 11,2reb 3.0 ast and was carrying a PER of 23.7.

Then his team went out and hired a notorious defensively minded coach. Or actually in this case, a coach who would become notoriously defensively minded.

The roster didn't look very promising. The team had won less than 40 games the season before, and 6 of the 9 main rotation players used by the new coach (he was famous for tight strict rotations) were holdovers. The new guys were a shortish PF who had averaged 3.3pts a game the previous season, a rookie defensive minded PG who couldn't shoot, and a semi-disgraced fallen former star who was looking for a bounceback/redemption year.

Holdovers included the HOF center and his offensively challenged defensive PF wingman, a veteran scoring SF near the end of his career, a mediocre veteran SG who had averaged 12ppg the season before, a youngish sloppy but dynamic SG/combo guard who had averaged 7.1pts the season before, and a sometimes starter at PG with a limited pass first no defense game.


Notice any similarities to the current situation?

That New York Knicks team went on to win 51 games for Pat Riley in 1991-92. Ewing anchored them with 24.0pts 11.2rebs. Nobody else averaged more than 13.9pts. But the coach drove them on defense, they built the team around the defensive frontline, and the various mediocrities and over the hill types on the wing scored just enough to let them grit out wins for a team that had the 3rd slowest pace in the league.

 

[John Galt]

We missed a golden opportunity last season with some teams daring us to take a playoff spot and we couldn't. Maybe lightening will strike twice and some teams struggle that normally wouldn't.

In hindsight though, I'm glad we didn't squeak into the 8 spot. Instead of conveying the pick to Chicago, Vlade parlayed it into Skal, Bogdanovic, and the big greek kid. That's better than being shellacked by the Warriors in the first round, having no draft assets, and bringing an over-exhuberant outlook into this season (probably with Karl in tow). I particularly love the fact that we'll probably get Bogdan coming over in the year we have no pick.

I think it worked out fine - I like where we are right now.

 

[Suicide King]

In hindsight though, I'm glad we didn't squeak into the 8 spot. Instead of conveying the pick to Chicago, Vlade parlayed it into Skal, Bogdanovic, and the big greek kid. That's better than being shellacked by the Warriors in the first round, having no draft assets, and bringing an over-exhuberant outlook into this season (probably with Karl in tow). I particularly love the fact that we'll probably get Bogdan coming over in the year we have no pick.

I think it worked out fine - I like where we are right now.

I completely agree with you. Sometimes things arent what they seem, and missing the playoffs was a blessing in disguise.

I merely wanted to point out that we arent automatically doomed to miss the playoffs this upcoming season before it has even began. To many variables outside of our own team without even taking into consideration the changes we have made to make such a prediction.

 

[Larry89]

We have became better just due to the fact that we added players who are willing to hustle and play defense

 

[gunks]

Getting rid of Karl has to be good for at least 5 to 10 wins.

He was awful.

 

[Gary]

This current team we have will struggle to hit 30 wins in my opinion. I would say the number is around 25-29 wins. We have one good player, one player that is good but doesn't want to be here, another that should be a backup and one terrible SG and a 2nd year big... We aren't going to be winning many games this year fellas.

 

[The_Jamal]

I don't see how anyone can like the position we are in now.

-We have 1 year left to show Cousins we mean business and get him to sign an extension, otherwise, we have no choice but to trade him instead of losing him for nothing.

-We drafted 3 projects who won't likely contribute much at all in the most important Kings season in 10 years.

-New coach again, while I really like him, usually always comes with growing pains and adjustment time.

- We brought in 3 over-the-hill vets who can still contribute, but won't be enough to get us over the hump to the playoffs or even .500.

- Even if we do somehow shock the NBA world and win 50 games, 6 of the guys who likely made it happen along with Cuz, ( Barnes, Rudy, Lawson, Afflalo, Collison, Omri) can be Free Agents next summer.

We're just in a really weird spot as a franchise. Not rebuilding, but we don't have a core we feel confident enough in that can win.

 

[kingsboi]

I don't see how anyone can like the position we are in now.

-We have 1 year left to show Cousins we mean business and get him to sign an extension, otherwise, we have no choice but to trade him instead of losing him for nothing.

-We drafted 3 projects who won't likely contribute much at all in the most important Kings season in 10 years.

-New coach again, while I really like him, usually always comes with growing pains and adjustment time.

- We brought in 3 over-the-hill vets who can still contribute, but won't be enough to get us over the hump to the playoffs or even .500.

- Even if we do somehow shock the NBA world and win 50 games, 6 of the guys who likely made it happen along with Cuz, ( Barnes, Rudy, Lawson, Afflalo, Collison, Omri) can be Free Agents next summer.

We're just in a really weird spot as a franchise. Not rebuilding, but we don't have a core we feel confident enough in that can win.

So in other words, another typical "treadmill" type of situation for the Kings.

 

[The_Jamal]

So in other words, another typical "treadmill" type of situation for the Kings.

Even worse, because we missed our chance to get our rebuild done in 2 years by not trading Boogie to Boston. There's next to a 0% chance Boston says no to a Crowder, Smart, 3 and a future first for 2 years of Cousins+them being confident they'd get the rest of his prime in an extension. Then you can still make Vlades draft day trades, which are excellent for a rebuilding team. That would give us

Smart
Crowder
Dunn (my pick at 3)
Papagiannis (Makes WAY more sense without Cousins on the roster)
Skal
Malachi
Bogdan
WCS
A likely top 3 pick after we lose 60 games
A Mid-first round pick in 2017

A core lacking a bonafide potential #1 (Dunn? The top pick next year?), but the defensive potential would be amazing, especially with Joerger at the helm. I also think Crowder and Smart aren't done growing as offensive players by any means. Regardless, we'd actually have something to develop here to build on and grow with a young coach.

 

[Big Cuz 15]

I don't see how anyone can like the position we are in now.

-We have 1 year left to show Cousins we mean business and get him to sign an extension, otherwise, we have no choice but to trade him instead of losing him for nothing.

-We drafted 3 projects who won't likely contribute much at all in the most important Kings season in 10 years.

-New coach again, while I really like him, usually always comes with growing pains and adjustment time.

- We brought in 3 over-the-hill vets who can still contribute, but won't be enough to get us over the hump to the playoffs or even .500.

- Even if we do somehow shock the NBA world and win 50 games, 6 of the guys who likely made it happen along with Cuz, ( Barnes, Rudy, Lawson, Afflalo, Collison, Omri) can be Free Agents next summer.

We're just in a really weird spot as a franchise. Not rebuilding, but we don't have a core we feel confident enough in that can win.

I don't see how anyone can like the position we are in now.

-We have 1 year left to show Cousins we mean business and get him to sign an extension, otherwise, we have no choice but to trade him instead of losing him for nothing.

-We drafted 3 projects who won't likely contribute much at all in the most important Kings season in 10 years.

-New coach again, while I really like him, usually always comes with growing pains and adjustment time.

- We brought in 3 over-the-hill vets who can still contribute, but won't be enough to get us over the hump to the playoffs or even .500.

- Even if we do somehow shock the NBA world and win 50 games, 6 of the guys who likely made it happen along with Cuz, ( Barnes, Rudy, Lawson, Afflalo, Collison, Omri) can be Free Agents next summer.

We're just in a really weird spot as a franchise. Not rebuilding, but we don't have a core we feel confident enough in that can win.

Thank god gerbil isnt still steering the ship. We would get capspace and future seconds for cousins

 

[King Baller]

Even worse, because we missed our chance to get our rebuild done in 2 years by not trading Boogie to Boston. There's next to a 0% chance Boston says no to a Crowder, Smart, 3 and a future first for 2 years of Cousins+them being confident they'd get the rest of his prime in an extension. Then you can still make Vlades draft day trades, which are excellent for a rebuilding team. That would give us

Smart
Crowder
Dunn (my pick at 3)
Papagiannis (Makes WAY more sense without Cousins on the roster)
Skal
Malachi
Bogdan
WCS
A likely top 3 pick after we lose 60 games
A Mid-first round pick in 2017

A core lacking a bonafide potential #1 (Dunn? The top pick next year?), but the defensive potential would be amazing, especially with Joerger at the helm. I also think Crowder and Smart aren't done growing as offensive players by any means. Regardless, we'd actually have something to develop here to build on and grow with a young coach.

I would rather have the current roster. Plus I don't think Ainge gives up all the assets you describe. That would leave the Celtics gutted.

 

[Capt. Factorial]

Thank god gerbil isnt still steering the ship. We would get capspace and future seconds for cousins

That's a really big hyperbole stick you're beating that dead horse with. Where'd you get it?

 

[Big Cuz 15]

That's a really big hyperbole stick you're beating that dead horse with. Where'd you get it?

Weekend yard sale. You want to borrow it sometime?

 

[IfAt1st]

I'm late to respond to the OP, but I think the Kings may well really regret letting Rajon go.
Every time I see a clip or interview with him, I'm reminded of how much more comfortable I was with him running the offense then anyone else the past 10+ years.

If Demarcus didn't think Rajon was a solution at PG, then I'll have to trust the only star we have, but if he wanted Rajon back but was over-ruled for other reasons, then I fear the Kings don't have much chance to go far this year. And that's even with the huge difference in coaching.

I believe that if the Kings had Joerger last year instead of Karl, they would have been the #5 seed.
I fear the Kings lost their shot at turning things around last year by hiring (and keeping) Karl too long.
They effectively wasted Rondo's shot at gelling this team.
His intelligence and gutsy play will not be easy to substitute, especially with Collison repeatedly proving he is not the man for pressure situations (fumbling balls away and airballing critical shots).

Having said this, I think the Kings may well end up with a better record this year than last, but that doesn;t mean they would have been the better team potentially.
Joerger may be THAT much better than Karl, and more importantly this team will actually want to win for their coach (unlike for Karl).

In other words, the ceiling for this team is lower than last year's, IMO.

 

[dude12]

When you can't stop another team from scoring and furthermore have a coach whose response to defense is to outscore them by increasing pace.......come on man, there was all kinds of things wrong last year from the head coach. A bad fit and an unwillingness to adjust. I and others can keep reminding how our go to crunch time lineup was Rondo, Collison, Bellinelli, whomever at the 4, and Boogie

 

[miltonap]

When you can't stop another team from scoring and furthermore have a coach whose response to defense is to outscore them by increasing pace.......come on man, there was all kinds of things wrong last year from the head coach. A bad fit and an unwillingness to adjust. I and others can keep reminding how our go to crunch time lineup was Rondo, Collison, Bellinelli, whomever at the 4, and Boogie

Damn I almost puked just reading that last sentence.

 

[Kingsfan23]

Even worse, because we missed our chance to get our rebuild done in 2 years by not trading Boogie to Boston. There's next to a 0% chance Boston says no to a Crowder, Smart, 3 and a future first for 2 years of Cousins+them being confident they'd get the rest of his prime in an extension. Then you can still make Vlades draft day trades, which are excellent for a rebuilding team. That would give us

Smart
Crowder
Dunn (my pick at 3)
Papagiannis (Makes WAY more sense without Cousins on the roster)
Skal
Malachi
Bogdan
WCS
A likely top 3 pick after we lose 60 games
A Mid-first round pick in 2017

A core lacking a bonafide potential #1 (Dunn? The top pick next year?), but the defensive potential would be amazing, especially with Joerger at the helm. I also think Crowder and Smart aren't done growing as offensive players by any means. Regardless, we'd actually have something to develop here to build on and grow with a young coach.

I disagree. I think the offer might have stopped at 3. As talented as Boogie is I think his market value didn't match his talent due to the perception about his character league wide and how things played out in the media. Ainge still has to worry about his job, and risking core pieces for a "malcontent" could put him in jeopardy. Not to mention it might have been more feasible to sign free agent targets for nothing in his mind

I think as Kings fans sometimes we overvalue our pieces on the market, hence expectations for Rudy's market return (if they indeed tried to move him)

I don't think the option to trade DMC for a extreme bevy was available to Vlade but I could be wrong. Either way I don't think it matters as Vlade and Vivek seem in total support

In response to the title I don't think it can be overstated the coaching change and shoring up outright sieves in the lineup, in conjunction with further evolvement and continuity of core pieces. I'm excited for the season and am expecting the 'offs

 

[Kingster]

Since it's all speculation, here's mine. Gay doesn't want to be on the team, and he plays like it. (He had the temerity to admit that he didn't even know who the Kings had drafted and sounded as if he were totally apathetic about the team). Cousins, I believe, is going to be peaking into the future imagining much greener grass. It seems like when players have been on a losing team for many years they start to detach mentally and emotionally when they closer to contract expiration, not buying in to whomever the new coach happens to be; it's a self-defense mechanism. If the Kings start out slowly I think that attitude could snowball. It will be a major check-out. Cousins has a difficult time sustaining his emotional balance and effort over the course of a season, and those attributes could magnify the greener pastures mindset. The rookies are rookies - 'nuff said. The vets are mediocre vets - 'nuff said. Add to the above, a real void in the character department of this team. All in all, there's more potential for major disaster on this team than there is for moderate success.