49ers thread for 2008-2009
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Telemachus
Starter
So far, none of the QBs have shown me anything this pre-season. O'Sullivan has the best grasp of the offense, but only because he has been playing it for 3 years. He also has a slight side-armed release that I have always disliked. His decision making under pressure has also been suspect, which makes me wonder what to expect when teams start playing their real defenses.
Alex Smith has done what he has done the last couple years. He has done nothing to impress or to look really bad. He has pretty much been invisible.
I have been disappointed that Shawn Hill really hasn't been given a chance so far. Of the 3 QBs, he is the ONLY one who has shown anything during a real NFL game. Neither Smith or O'Sullivan have done anything in the past in a real game that was impressive. And when it comes down to it, I care much more about what a QB does when the heat is on than in practice or pre-season.
Good or bad, one of those three is going to be our starting QB. While I don't envision JT as the next Joe Montana, I certainly think he could be an adequate fill-in until someone comes along who can truly be a "FORTY-NINER QUARTERBACK" in the tradition of Joe or Steve Young.
uolj
Starter
I've seen this kind of comment before, and it really confuses me.
What did Hill do in his three games that Smith didn't show in 2006 and the beginning of 2007? Wins? Smith had lots of those... 200 yard games? Hill didn't have one, Smith had six in that time period... Poise? Smith has led fourth quarter comebacks on several occasions... 100+ QB ratings? Again, Smith has had more. Going through progressions and hitting the third option? Well, maybe, but that is much lower on my list of "anything" than winning, touchdowns, fourth quarter comebacks, etc.
I've been pleasantly surprised at O'Sullivan's play so far this preseason, but Hill hasn't looked good at all, and his throws look absolutely horrible. Smith doesn't look bad but also doesn't look good, so :shrug:. We'll have to see how it plays out.
Telemachus
Starter
When I look at a QB, there are 3 areas I tend to look at:
1. Taking care of the football.
-In his 3 games last season (2 starts) Hill had 1 Interception and 3 TDs.
2. Wins/Losses.
- Hill started 2 games and won both of them.
3. Decision making skills.
-This is the area that Smith has struggled with his entire career. Hill makes quick decisions, and last season they were generally the right ones.
As for QB ratings, Smith has had 4 games in 3 seasons in which his QB rating was over 100.
Hill has started 2 games, and had a QB rating over 100 in both of them.
Now I am NOT saying that Hill should start for the Niners or is the next great QB. I'm just saying he should have been given a shot at starting, and from what I can tell; he hasn't. Martz has been looking primarily at Smith and O'Sullivan from day one, and I wish I knew why.
uolj
Starter
Ok, I was just confused by your wording. Smith has shown all those things (although you might argue with the decision making - while I would point out the fourth quarter comebacks), just not consistently. Hill showed those things in his three games, but that's not much of a sample size.
I think Hill got as much of a chance as possible. There's no way to get all three guys a fair shot, especially when they are so close to each other. But based on the reports of practices and the little he's played in preseason it's entirely fair to focus the limited practice and playing time on the two guys who aren't playing as poorly as he had.
I think Hill got as much of a chance as possible. There's no way to get all three guys a fair shot, especially when they are so close to each other. But based on the reports of practices and the little he's played in preseason it's entirely fair to focus the limited practice and playing time on the two guys who aren't playing as poorly as he had.
SLAB
Hall of Famer
I think Ziegler and Clayton deserve to make this team.
Clayton over Robinson because Robinson has never shown anything in any game situation...Sure he could have fun with trickery, but Clayton has had two good preseasons in a row. Maybe stash Robinson on the PUP list until week 6 and wait and see what happens during that stretch?
RBs: Gore/Foster/Clayton .... Robinson (PUP)
Ziegler over Lelie...I really wanted Lelie to show something this preseason because a bona-fide downfield threat in the Martz system couldn't hurt, but he's been out all preseason...Same with last year...Time to move on.
WRs: Bruce/Johnson/Morgan/Battle/Hill/Ziegler?
Oh..and Keasey over Norris! Keasey's hair is totally awesome! Plus I like his offensive capabilities.
Clayton over Robinson because Robinson has never shown anything in any game situation...Sure he could have fun with trickery, but Clayton has had two good preseasons in a row. Maybe stash Robinson on the PUP list until week 6 and wait and see what happens during that stretch?
RBs: Gore/Foster/Clayton .... Robinson (PUP)
Ziegler over Lelie...I really wanted Lelie to show something this preseason because a bona-fide downfield threat in the Martz system couldn't hurt, but he's been out all preseason...Same with last year...Time to move on.
WRs: Bruce/Johnson/Morgan/Battle/Hill/Ziegler?
Oh..and Keasey over Norris! Keasey's hair is totally awesome! Plus I like his offensive capabilities.
uolj
Starter
Yeah, that's what I was thinking. I'm much happier when a guy plays well to (presumably) get the starting job than if it's just a big mediocre-fest.
LoungeLizard
Starter
And Keasey made that beast of a tackle on special teams v. Hester. It should have been a safety. Hester totally brought that out of the end zone and went back in. Keasey made the tackle. Oh well, its preseason for the refs too.
SLAB
Hall of Famer
Those were his linebacker days doing all the talking!
allrightythen
Starter
Wow. You guys are pretty rough on Alex Smith (IMO). I don't think he's done much to show that he should have been the 1st overall or anything. But he doesn't seem like a bad guy and there appears to be real dislike for him here. He was bad his first year, decent his second, solid since when he wasn't hurt. He's had a rough first couple of years in the league, hope he's better for it in the end.
If he's in I hope he succeeds. I think O'Sullivan has been better thus far so he should probably start. What happened to Shaun Hill? Did he really underperfrom or has he not gotten the chance? I didn't expect him to really get the job or anything but it seems like they just stopped talking about one day.
If he's in I hope he succeeds. I think O'Sullivan has been better thus far so he should probably start. What happened to Shaun Hill? Did he really underperfrom or has he not gotten the chance? I didn't expect him to really get the job or anything but it seems like they just stopped talking about one day.
NME
Starter
It's official: 49ers riding JTO into regular season
Mike Nolan just made the announcement during a conference call. Nolan said he met with all three quarterbacks about an hour ago and explained them the situation. O'Sullivan is the starter and he is backing him "100 percent." Alex Smith is the No. 2 quarterback and Shaun Hill is third. Said Nolan of O'Sullivan: "He had better command among the three. He played with consistency, and we've played well as a unit."
http://www.sacbee.com/static/weblogs/49ers/archives/014825.html
Mike Nolan just made the announcement during a conference call. Nolan said he met with all three quarterbacks about an hour ago and explained them the situation. O'Sullivan is the starter and he is backing him "100 percent." Alex Smith is the No. 2 quarterback and Shaun Hill is third. Said Nolan of O'Sullivan: "He had better command among the three. He played with consistency, and we've played well as a unit."
http://www.sacbee.com/static/weblogs/49ers/archives/014825.html
uolj
Starter
No it's not. His decent performance in 2006 and the fact he's better than most other options is why he's still on the team.
That said, I agree with you that they need to fix the rookie salary system.
Jechtsphere
Starter
Defense was good in the first half but never gave us a chance in the second...the offense got one possession in the second half...there was so many problems to name right now.
You know, even with the problems, I think there's hope. It didn't suck to watch today's game, and that's a step up from most of last year.
GO NINERS!!!
SLAB - Were we watching the same game? I certainly don't blame O'Sullivan, who wasn't to blame for the Cardinals having the ball for almost an entire quarter. You used to tell me I needed to look past my dislike of Smith and give him a fair chance. I think the same holds true for JT.
GO NINERS!!!
SLAB - Were we watching the same game? I certainly don't blame O'Sullivan, who wasn't to blame for the Cardinals having the ball for almost an entire quarter. You used to tell me I needed to look past my dislike of Smith and give him a fair chance. I think the same holds true for JT.
SLAB
Hall of Famer
Bitter over the loss so I took unwarranted shots at the easy target.
3 TO's from the guy made him that target.
Color me unimpressed but not ready to behead him just yet.
est.1999
Starter
how did it not suck to watch todays game?
Our defense and offense both played pretty good but the turnovers were just flat out ridiculous. We kept giving the ball away in our territory and although the defense held up at first they eventually broke.
Bad penalties and turnovers are a sign that Nolan has this team unprepared. 4 years later and although the talent has upgraded enormously since he came in we still either underachieve or play unprepared and sometimes it's both at the same time. I'm sick and tired of holding my breath on every offensive posession hoping we don't turn it over and I'm tired of holding my breath on every defensive third down when the game is on the line only to be dissapointed again and again!
Our defense and offense both played pretty good but the turnovers were just flat out ridiculous. We kept giving the ball away in our territory and although the defense held up at first they eventually broke.
Bad penalties and turnovers are a sign that Nolan has this team unprepared. 4 years later and although the talent has upgraded enormously since he came in we still either underachieve or play unprepared and sometimes it's both at the same time. I'm sick and tired of holding my breath on every offensive posession hoping we don't turn it over and I'm tired of holding my breath on every defensive third down when the game is on the line only to be dissapointed again and again!
uolj
Starter
I hate turnovers. I prefer a conservative style to a risk taking style. So that was not a great start to the season.
But I was definitely encouraged by Gore's play and the defense. Unfortunately it looks like at best this will be a team like two years ago that wins about half its games and rarely blows anybody away.
But I was definitely encouraged by Gore's play and the defense. Unfortunately it looks like at best this will be a team like two years ago that wins about half its games and rarely blows anybody away.
I guess I'm truly seeing the glass half full. I'm seeing a defensive unit that looks to be improving; I'm seeing a front line that didn't clear the way like matadors for the Cardinals defense. I'm not delusional enough to be talking the "P" word, but I'm just going to enjoy the good parts and be thankful for whatever joy I can find in this season. But it's my general philosophy. I always look for something good. If I couldn't find anything good, I don't know how I could manage to watch the games.
I am an eternal and possibly infuriating at times optimist.
I am an eternal and possibly infuriating at times optimist.
Jechtsphere
Starter
I liked JTO's accuracy, he had 140 yards passing at halftime, never got much of an opportunity in the second.
The INT he shouldn't of tried to squeeze into Battle, the first time he got stripped was Staley's fault...he got beat badly...he needs to do much better if he's gonna protect his blindside!
Gore was brilliant. [after that 40 yard run you see martz say "wow"
VD got some nice catches...again offense only was on the feild for the first half.
turnovers were terrible.
on top of everything nothing went in our favor...the D was great in the first half...AZ was always like 30 yards away from the endzone and the D did a nice job...with everything we're lucky to lose by 10!
I'm sure things will be much better next week!
The INT he shouldn't of tried to squeeze into Battle, the first time he got stripped was Staley's fault...he got beat badly...he needs to do much better if he's gonna protect his blindside!
Gore was brilliant. [after that 40 yard run you see martz say "wow"
VD got some nice catches...again offense only was on the feild for the first half.
turnovers were terrible.
on top of everything nothing went in our favor...the D was great in the first half...AZ was always like 30 yards away from the endzone and the D did a nice job...with everything we're lucky to lose by 10!
I'm sure things will be much better next week!
allrightythen
Starter
I was encouraged overall but that 3rd quarter sucked to watch from my seat. I was so frustrated I had to walk away a few times.
Like I said I was encouraged overall though. The defense besides the 3rd was pretty solid and the offense when they were on the field weren't all that bad. If we could limit a few of those glaring mistakes that game is a lot closer if not a complete reversal.
GO 9ers!
From the "Just when you think you've heard it all" department:
According to the Bee, Alex Smith fractured something in his shoulder Friday throwing a deep pass.
Um, what?!?!?!?
That's the little pink plastic flower on the icing of the cake for me. We need to just bite the bullet, cut our losses and get him on down the road...
According to the Bee, Alex Smith fractured something in his shoulder Friday throwing a deep pass.
Um, what?!?!?!?
That's the little pink plastic flower on the icing of the cake for me. We need to just bite the bullet, cut our losses and get him on down the road...
uolj
Starter
You sound like you think it was his fault, or that he's a wuss, or injury prone. He's none of that as far as I can tell.
But I do agree that it's time to let him go if this injury is anything more than a couple weeks (and even then it's probably time).
And that sucks because it means the 49ers still don't have a quarterback to make them elite and it will be a few more years before they have a chance at the Super Bowl.
uolj
Starter
To my knowledge he's only had the one injury, and then complications from it. But you're free to have your own impressions.
One theory about the cause of this fracture is that it is related to the sutures used in the surgery for the separated shoulder: http://www.sacbee.com/static/weblogs/49ers/archives/015253.html
One theory about the cause of this fracture is that it is related to the sutures used in the surgery for the separated shoulder: http://www.sacbee.com/static/weblogs/49ers/archives/015253.html
