Who is available as 6th-7th pick

[Gary]

Actually a lot of us know what a PG is but we also know that there are different types of PG something that is a very difficult concept for you to grasp but carry on!

I don't mind if Evans were to play the PG position on the team as a part time thing, like when IT (or whoever we had at PG) went to the bench for foul trouble or to get a rest.

MT has done the same thing. He has played PG for this team in spurts, but none of us here consider MT a PG do we?

I do know that there are different types of PGs BTW. I just prefer one that can get easy shots for other with their court vision and BBall IQ.

 

[Darth Divac]

*sigh* We should make a "What to do with Gary?" thread.

 

[Sac.Kings]

Well, attempting to transition back to the topic at hand, I think that the best move would be trading down and drafting Schroeder. After reading up on him and watching some videos, I think he has potential to become a good to great PG and he would allow Tyreke to head back to the 2 spot. I know a few people want Tyreke at PG, but I think that ship may have long sailed (not saying he can't do it, but it would be easier to have a more traditional set up). Seeing as Schroeder already has a solid to good jumpshot, any kickouts from the post or from Tyreke driving would be more efficient with Schroeder out there. Drafting him would only leave us with only one big hole to fill at SF.

 

[Kingsfan23]

Well, attempting to transition back to the topic at hand, I think that the best move would be trading down and drafting Schroeder. After reading up on him and watching some videos, I think he has potential to become a good to great PG and he would allow Tyreke to head back to the 2 spot. I know a few people want Tyreke at PG, but I think that ship may have long sailed (not saying he can't do it, but it would be easier to have a more traditional set up). Seeing as Schroeder already has a solid to good jumpshot, any kickouts from the post or from Tyreke driving would be more efficient with Schroeder out there. Drafting him would only leave us with only one big hole to fill at SF.

By the time the draft rolls around, I wouldn't anticipate being able to trade down and being able to draft Schroeder

 

[Gary]

*sigh* We should make a "What to do with Gary?" thread.

A few million bucks would do, but I assume in your very young age that you only see about $10 a week or something for taking out the trash?

Seriously though. It's very common for SGs that can handle the ball to spell a PG for a few minutes here and there.

 

[Gary]

Well, attempting to transition back to the topic at hand, I think that the best move would be trading down and drafting Schroeder. After reading up on him and watching some videos, I think he has potential to become a good to great PG and he would allow Tyreke to head back to the 2 spot. I know a few people want Tyreke at PG, but I think that ship may have long sailed (not saying he can't do it, but it would be easier to have a more traditional set up). Seeing as Schroeder already has a solid to good jumpshot, any kickouts from the post or from Tyreke driving would be more efficient with Schroeder out there. Drafting him would only leave us with only one big hole to fill at SF.

I haven't seen enough of him (except probably the same videos you have seen). I can't even find any game footage of him. Usually I can torrent a few games here and there of EURO prospects but I cannot for the life of me find anything on any streaming sites or sites to torrent. He would be interesting though. I really like how the EURO guards are more traditional in the sense that they are given a position and an objective and they go out and do it. I have no problems taking a shot on a guy like him if he's ready to come over.

 

[Glenn]

OK, guys, I missed some of this earlier but the personal sniping stops NOW!

Warning given. Carry on.

Are there consequences to when a mod gives a warning that is ignored?

 

[Gary]

Are there consequences to when a mod gives a warning that is ignored?

Good god man. There, I fixed my posts. There is no mention of the unknown agitator.

 

[Sac.Kings]

By the time the draft rolls around, I wouldn't anticipate being able to trade down and being able to draft Schroeder

Then I would keep the pick and pick him at 7. It's not like there is a consensus after the first 3-4 picks. All the mock drafts I have seen have not had the same players going in the same order

 

[Sac.Kings]

I haven't seen enough of him (except probably the same videos you have seen). I can't even find any game footage of him. Usually I can torrent a few games here and there of EURO prospects but I cannot for the life of me find anything on any streaming sites or sites to torrent. He would be interesting though. I really like how the EURO guards are more traditional in the sense that they are given a position and an objective and they go out and do it. I have no problems taking a shot on a guy like him if he's ready to come over.

I agree there was not much to read or watch about him, but from what I did see, he possess skills that a modern day PG in the NBA must have (quickness, size, BBIQ, and passing). There are a lot of unknowns for sure, but I suspect we will know much more about him as the draft nears and workouts begin. My opinion of him is subject to change as data piles up, but for now, he is at the top of my board, followed by Karasev at SF.

 

[Sac.Kings]

"The rumors flying around Chicago were that Dennis Schroeder had a promise from a team. The Celtics seem like just the sort of team that would try to lock him down." ESPN.com

Read more at http://hoopshype.com/rumors.htm#ywE3XYJmqbFOrlig.99

Though it is hoopshype, the source they claim is ESPN. Interesting that he has a promise already. The kid is legit!

 

[jalfa]

I haven't seen enough of him (except probably the same videos you have seen). I can't even find any game footage of him. Usually I can torrent a few games here and there of EURO prospects but I cannot for the life of me find anything on any streaming sites or sites to torrent. He would be interesting though. I really like how the EURO guards are more traditional in the sense that they are given a position and an objective and they go out and do it. I have no problems taking a shot on a guy like him if he's ready to come over.

mentioned this earlier, BBL coverage is absolutely putrid. they get at best one game a week and they always concentrate on the Bundesliga's "powerhouses", meaning Bayern München, Bamberg or Berlin. pretty sure that Braunschweig didn't have a single game broadcast all of last year and they haven't been playing any European competition either. ergo, there's close to no shot for mere mortals like us to get any footage of Schröder playing.

 

[smellfungus]

I always heavily research the draft. In terms of offensive abilities, I'd rank the top 3 as MeClemore, Schroder, Burke.

 

[bajaden]

I always heavily research the draft. In terms of offensive abilities, I'd rank the top 3 as MeClemore, Schroder, Burke.

I think maybe you should broaden your research if you think those are the three best offensive players in the draft. What exactly is research to you? Reading blogs and mock draft write ups, or actually watching games? Don't just throw names out there, but give an explanation of why you like them.

 

[smellfungus]

I think I already explained why I like Schroeder. Of course it's all based on video footage. I'm not someone who bases opinions on written pieces. The eyeball test comes first and foremost, clearly.

Anyway, I actually think I like Oladipo more than Burke. I love VO's defense, he reminds me a lot of Kawhi Leonard. I think VO can have an immediate impact if given the minutes. He's also a tremendous worker so his shooting should become more acceptable for a role player ala Kawhi Leonard. Jimmy Butler is another comparison for him (at least in terms of on-ball defense, VO's not a guy who can create, even to anextent Butler can, which isn't great). I see all-defensive team potential in Oladipo.

And finally with Mclemore, I see some Bradley Beal in him in terms of how advanced his off-the-ball game is. Plus his shooting mechanics, size, athleticism, and finishing ability. Not to mention he's a young freshman.

So yeah, Mclemore, Schroeder, Oladipo are my 3 favorites right now. I like how their games translate and their upside.

 

[bajaden]

I think I already explained why I like Schroeder. Of course it's all based on video footage. I'm not someone who bases opinions on written pieces. The eyeball test comes first and foremost, clearly.

Anyway, I actually think I like Oladipo more than Burke. I love VO's defense, he reminds me a lot of Kawhi Leonard. I think VO can have an immediate impact if given the minutes. He's also a tremendous worker so his shooting should become more acceptable for a role player ala Kawhi Leonard. Jimmy Butler is another comparison for him (at least in terms of on-ball defense, VO's not a guy who can create, even to anextent Butler can, which isn't great). I see all-defensive team potential in Oladipo.

And finally with Mclemore, I see some Bradley Beal in him in terms of how advanced his off-the-ball game is. Plus his shooting mechanics, size, athleticism, and finishing ability. Not to mention he's a young freshman.

So yeah, Mclemore, Schroeder, Oladipo are my 3 favorites right now. I like how their games translate and their upside.

Its not that I don't like the three you mentioned, I do like them. Oladipo has been my favorite player all year along with Porter. And I happen to believe that Oladipo is a better all around player than McLemore at the moment. You say that McLemore is a good finisher, but the problem I have with that is that he has trouble getting to the basket in order to finish. He struggles at creating off the dribble, and therefore seldom gets to the basket off the dribble. He is good at finishing on the break, but again, turns the ball over more than he should if he's leading the break, unlike Oladipo who is deadly on the break with the ball in his hands.

And I hate to nit pic, but McLemore is actually a sophmore, who was ineligible academicaly his freshman year. He does have tremendous upside potential, but he has serious holes in his game. I'm not holding it against him since he played PF in highschool, but none the less, he does have some work to do to reach his potential. Schroeder I won't comment on since I only saw him play one time and that was inconclusive. I will say that he is one of the quickest players I've seen in some time. But how good a PG he'll be is anyone's guess, and hopefully thats someone thats seen him play.

My favorites fall into two catagory's. One is players that are the most fun to watch play, and the other is players that I think can best help our team. Oladipo falls into both catagorys. As does Porter! Unfortunately both will probably be gone by the time we pick. Unless we find a way to trade up to get one of them, and I think either of them is worth trading up for.

As for video footage. Believe me, I've searched the web for full games of Schroeder and Karasev. I've found some of Karasev, but nothing of Schroeder. I put no stock in Youtube videos at all. They never miss a shot on Youtube. DraftExpress does a good job of doing video breakdowns which is useful, but nothing replaces watching actual games, and a lot more than one. In the few games of Karasev I've been able to watch, he's been as advertized. I like him quite a bit. good shooter. Terrific court vision and a very good passer. His handles are more than adequate for the SF position, and he does a pretty good job of creating his own shot. At times he looks good on defense, and other times not so much. But to be honest, its european ball and its a different game. Players live in the paint.

 

[smellfungus]

http://youtu.be/lVuJzTayFGc

Nice mix on Schroeder from the Nike Hoop Summit

 

[HereWeBoogie]

http://youtu.be/lVuJzTayFGc

Nice mix on Schroeder from the Nike Hoop Summit

wait, a PG that passes the ball on a pick n roll? that could be interesting for this team

 

[KingsCitizen]

wait, a PG that passes the ball on a pick n roll? that could be interesting for this team

This Schroder kid is really starting to intrigue me. But it would be better if we can get another first pick.
I wonder if New York is willing to give away their first round pick with either Novak or White for IT plus any of our bench except Tony D.
Isiah Thomas to New York sounds like a no brainer for the Knicks.

 

[bajaden]

This Schroder kid is really starting to intrigue me. But it would be better if we can get another first pick.
I wonder if New York is willing to give away their first round pick with either Novak or White for IT plus any of our bench except Tony D.
Isiah Thomas to New York sounds like a no brainer for the Knicks.

Dallas with the 13th pick in the first round wants to trade the pick in order to clear cap room. That would mean they would trade for future second round picks, or just flat out sell the pick. Obviously they don't want any salary back in return, because that would defeat the purpose of getting rid of the pick in the first place.

 

[King Baller]

Dallas with the 13th pick in the first round wants to trade the pick in order to clear cap room. That would mean they would trade for future second round picks, or just flat out sell the pick. Obviously they don't want any salary back in return, because that would defeat the purpose of getting rid of the pick in the first place.

So Mark Cuban and Donnie Nelson/staff must think there is no one in this draft that is significant for them?

Or is it all about clearing space to lure in the Free Agents to the Mavericks squad?

I'm thinking bringing in all the young ball handing, assist makers, 3 point shooting, defensive specialists with some size is the way to go. So extra picks is good.

KB

 

[Gilles]

It was a single speculation by Ford that Cuban wants to enter Paul-Howard sweepstakes. In that scenario Dallas would dump Marion with $9.3 million left using their #13. No team can absorb Marion on their own with cap space right now, it will require two(only if those are Suns and Kings) or even three teams together. The only team with big enough TPE is Orlando. But the main argument would be, why would Mavs do anything without knowing that they have even a slightest chance to succeed. If they don't do this pre-July, 1st, then they will have to put an agreement to take someone for other team, but he will have to satisfy Dallas as well, since they would be stuck with the prospect if deal doesn't go through. So you see, the idea becomes more complicated as you go deep into detail. In other words, it's not happening and probably wasn't seriously entertained by Mavs FO at all.

 

[Glenn]

It was a single speculation by Ford that Cuban wants to enter Paul-Howard sweepstakes. In that scenario Dallas would dump Marion with $9.3 million left using their #13. No team can absorb Marion on their own with cap space right now, it will require two(only if those are Suns and Kings) or even three teams together. The only team with big enough TPE is Orlando. But the main argument would be, why would Mavs do anything without knowing that they have even a slightest chance to succeed. If they don't do this pre-July, 1st, then they will have to put an agreement to take someone for other team, but he will have to satisfy Dallas as well, since they would be stuck with the prospect if deal doesn't go through. So you see, the idea becomes more complicated as you go deep into detail. In other words, it's not happening and probably wasn't seriously entertained by Mavs FO at all.

I think this is the correct interpretation.

Sadly this shows the difference in the status of our two teams. Some here want to get extra picks by trading down while Dallas wants to get rid of those very same type of picks to have a legitimate shot at a stud. By trading down but staying in the 1st round, we just jam up our bench with mediocrity, IMO. The reality for now is that a stud won't come here as a FA. It is a sobering thought as to the status of the Kings and where the Maloofs have left us.

Look at King Baller's note also except I don't understand the last sentence. Who are you referring to?.

 

[rainmaker]

Cuban gambled and failed by blowing up their roster after they won it all. Some turnover would have made sense, but he really lost it by letting Chandler walk.

Now his comments just look ridiculous.

As for us, no way I'd deal for Marion and the 13th pick.

 

[funkykingston]

Sadly this shows the difference in the status of our two teams. Some here want to get extra picks by trading down while Dallas wants to get rid of those very same type of picks to have a legitimate shot at a stud. By trading down but staying in the 1st round, we just jam up our bench with mediocrity, IMO. The reality for now is that a stud won't come here as a FA. It is a sobering thought as to the status of the Kings and where the Maloofs have left us.

Cuban gambled and failed by blowing up their roster after they won it all. Some turnover would have made sense, but he really lost it by letting Chandler walk.

Now his comments just look ridiculous.

As for us, no way I'd deal for Marion and the 13th pick.

The only way draft picks "jam up our bench with mediocrity" is if they are bad picks. Otherwise, role players that fit the scheme and compliment the starters/high level players is exactly what every team needs to succeed. Miami, even with their big three struggled the first year because of their lack of depth. Indiana, San Antonio and Memphis (their struggles against the Spurs notwithstanding) have gotten meaningful contributions from quite a few roleplayers.

Guys like Gorgui Dieng, Reggie Bullock, Sergei Karasev, Tony Snell, Allen Crabbe etc could fill needs on this Kings team.

And Rainmaker hit the nail on the head, Dallas DID do a great job of assembling a competitive roster to win a ring, but I don't view them as being on a different level than the Kings right now. Sure, they might clear the capspace to make a run at Howard or Chris Paul, but why would either of those guys want to go to the Mavs? To play with a 35 year old Nowitzki who looked out of shape and a step slow after the lockout and only slightly better this year? They have NO big talent and no pieces to surround a star with. They gambled and lost and in retrospect would have done better to bring back all the main pieces from their championship team to try again.

Depending on what Vivek and company do this offseason I think the Kings can certainly have a brighter short AND long term future than the Mavs.

 

[Glenn]

The only way draft picks "jam up our bench with mediocrity" is if they are bad picks. Otherwise, role players that fit the scheme and compliment the starters/high level players is exactly what every team needs to succeed. Miami, even with their big three struggled the first year because of their lack of depth. Indiana, San Antonio and Memphis (their struggles against the Spurs notwithstanding) have gotten meaningful contributions from quite a few roleplayers.

Guys like Gorgui Dieng, Reggie Bullock, Sergei Karasev, Tony Snell, Allen Crabbe etc could fill needs on this Kings team.

And Rainmaker hit the nail on the head, Dallas DID do a great job of assembling a competitive roster to win a ring, but I don't view them as being on a different level than the Kings right now. Sure, they might clear the capspace to make a run at Howard or Chris Paul, but why would either of those guys want to go to the Mavs? To play with a 35 year old Nowitzki who looked out of shape and a step slow after the lockout and only slightly better this year? They have NO big talent and no pieces to surround a star with. They gambled and lost and in retrospect would have done better to bring back all the main pieces from their championship team to try again.

Depending on what Vivek and company do this offseason I think the Kings can certainly have a brighter short AND long term future than the Mavs.

I was assuming anyone picked in the low first round in a bad draft year is mediocre. If that's not true, that's great. As of now we have 12 people under salary. Two more low 1st rounders gives us 14 and not much wiggle room. If we sign our 2nd rounder, that's 15.




Ooops, this assumes qualifying offers to Tyreke, Douglas, and JJ, the latter of which is very unlikely. Just the same it doesn't leave much room for the unlikely chance a FA would want to come here.

 

[bajaden]

It was a single speculation by Ford that Cuban wants to enter Paul-Howard sweepstakes. In that scenario Dallas would dump Marion with $9.3 million left using their #13. No team can absorb Marion on their own with cap space right now, it will require two(only if those are Suns and Kings) or even three teams together. The only team with big enough TPE is Orlando. But the main argument would be, why would Mavs do anything without knowing that they have even a slightest chance to succeed. If they don't do this pre-July, 1st, then they will have to put an agreement to take someone for other team, but he will have to satisfy Dallas as well, since they would be stuck with the prospect if deal doesn't go through. So you see, the idea becomes more complicated as you go deep into detail. In other words, it's not happening and probably wasn't seriously entertained by Mavs FO at all.

I just read an article with quotes from Cuban about his short and long term plan. It was suggested in the article that Cuban wanted to buy out Marion, and then resign him for a lesser amount after making their run at certain freeagents. Mainly CP3 and D12. He admitted that there were no guarantees and he was willing to settle for some second tier players in lieu of one or both of those players. He also suggested that they might just use the 13th pick on a european player and let him play in europe for a year to save money. However, I believe a cap hold is put against your salary cap if you use your first round pick and fail to sign him.

Apparently he's already worked out a deal with Dirk to resign him for a much smaller contract in order to improve the roster. I guess we'll see how it all plays out. people can criticize Cuban for blowing up the team, but he did it with the idea in mind of having a ton of money to work with this offseason, and he does. Hey, he as a championship and we don't, so I'm not about to criticize him too much.

 

[bajaden]

I was assuming anyone picked in the low first round in a bad draft year is mediocre. If that's not true, that's great. As of now we have 12 people under salary. Two more low 1st rounders gives us 14 and not much wiggle room. If we sign our 2nd rounder, that's 15.




Ooops, this assumes qualifying offers to Tyreke, Douglas, and JJ, the latter of which is very unlikely. Just the same it doesn't leave much room for the unlikely chance a FA would want to come here.

God forbid that JJ returns. Remember that Aldrich is an unrestricted freeagent as well, and IT is a team option. so we really only have 8 players under guaranteed contracts. I can't imagine the team not picking up IT's option. He only makes a little over 800 thousand a year, so he brings a lot of bang for the buck. JJ and Douglas are probably gone, although I'd love to keep Douglas. Anyway, if we retain both IT and Tyreke, that brings us to 10 players and we can have up to 15 on the roster, so making room is not the problem, but finding the money to sign players under the cap is the problem.

There are other options as well. We could buy out Outlaw, and spread his payments out over a longer period of time, which would help the cap. We could amnesty Salmons, but would only do so if we had a player targeted. And of course, there's always the possiblity of making a trade.

By the way, this isn't a bad draft, its just doesn't have anyone with superstar potential at the top of the draft. But the talent level is still good, and fairly equal all the way down to the bottom of the first round. Which is why I don't think making what is perceived to be a reach in this draft is that bad an idea. If we stop looking at the draft as a quick fix, but as a developmental tool, I don't think we'd be as disappointed with some of the players. Sometimes, its takes time for a player to contribute. Personally I think we sometimes do damage to a player by throwing him into the fire and expecting him to perform like a seasoned pro.

 

[funkykingston]

I was assuming anyone picked in the low first round in a bad draft year is mediocre. If that's not true, that's great. As of now we have 12 people under salary. Two more low 1st rounders gives us 14 and not much wiggle room. If we sign our 2nd rounder, that's 15.




Ooops, this assumes qualifying offers to Tyreke, Douglas, and JJ, the latter of which is very unlikely. Just the same it doesn't leave much room for the unlikely chance a FA would want to come here.

Yeah, right now the players we have under contract are: Cousins, Thompson, Salmons, Thornton, Thomas (once his option is picked up), Patterson, Fredette, Hayes, and Outlaw. And there's no guarantee that all 9 of those guys will still be on the roster or that Tyreke will be re-signed.

And lots of free agents would come to Sacramento for right contract and opportunity. Not Dwight Howard or Chris Paul but that just puts us in the same boat as 25-28 other teams in the league. But a guy like Dorrell Wright who could be a 3 point threat and defender at SF certainly might. THOSE are the types of signings I want (and somewhat expect) to see.

As for players picked in the late first of a bad draft, last year's draft was very similar to this years. No real franchise players but the potential for a lot of good role players. Anthony Davis being a slightly more talented/polished Nerlens Noel, Bradley Beal being very similar to McLemore, Michael Kidd-Gilchrist being a versatile but offensively challenged SF like Otto Porter etc. In general last year's was stronger/deeper but in both drafts I think you can find players that will help a team.

As a point of reference, the Warriors grabbed three rookies last year at #8 (Harrison Barnes), #30 (Festus Ezeli) and 335 (Draymond Green) all of whom played a big role in the Warriors success this year. Barnes was the starting SF who was a decent athlete, decent shooter, decent defender and in general just did the job asked of him. Ezeli was a backup center pressed into a starting job by Bogut's lingering injury. He is a big body defender with very little offensive game. And Draymond Green was one of my favorite rookies. He is a tweener forward without great athletic gifts who didn't excel at anything but just did so many little things right. Just a phenomenal glue guy.

I don't envision the Kings getting three rookies that contribute to that extent but there ARE guys in this draft, even late in the first or early in the 2nd. Stars? There's always a chance, but less so than normal in this draft. But definitely guys that can bring certain valuable skill sets to be key role players off the bench or even role playing starters.

 

[Gilles]

I just read an article with quotes from Cuban about his short and long term plan. It was suggested in the article that Cuban wanted to buy out Marion, and then resign him for a lesser amount after making their run at certain freeagents. Mainly CP3 and D12. He admitted that there were no guarantees and he was willing to settle for some second tier players in lieu of one or both of those players. He also suggested that they might just use the 13th pick on a european player and let him play in europe for a year to save money. However, I believe a cap hold is put against your salary cap if you use your first round pick and fail to sign him.

Apparently he's already worked out a deal with Dirk to resign him for a much smaller contract in order to improve the roster. I guess we'll see how it all plays out. people can criticize Cuban for blowing up the team, but he did it with the idea in mind of having a ton of money to work with this offseason, and he does. Hey, he as a championship and we don't, so I'm not about to criticize him too much.

Quote from Larry Coon:

A cap hold for the "scale" amount for the team's unsigned first round draft pick(s) (see question number 50). This amount begins to apply to team salary immediately upon selection in the draft1. This amount can be excluded from the team salary for the current season if, before the season starts, the team and player agree in writing that the team will not sign the player during that season.