City council vote and latest news, rumors, etc.
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Pretty insightful piece by David Aldridge. To me this whole situation is unprecedented and very complex. I don't believe it's a black and white issue like Ric Bucher or Carmichael Dave try to make it out to be for either side. We don't know all the action going on behind the scenes, but to me this feels like it has truth to it. Sac is officially back in the game with 6 weeks to go. Game On!
http://www.nba.com/2013/news/features/david_aldridge/03/04/morning-tip-kings-relocation-nbpa-future-jrue-holiday-contract-tyson-chandler-qa/index.html
http://www.nba.com/2013/news/features/david_aldridge/03/04/morning-tip-kings-relocation-nbpa-future-jrue-holiday-contract-tyson-chandler-qa/index.html
He does get one thing wrong, though. He makes it seem like the Maloofs have a choice to sell to Seattle or Sacramento. They don't anymore. They sold the team to Seattle. All that is pending is league approval. If that deal is rejected by the league, then the Maloofs are free to do whatever they want: Keep the team here as owners, sell to Mastrov, go pandhandling again looking for another deal or relocation offer (LOL).
He also says that the owners don't like to tell other owners who they have to sell their team to. But that will not be the case here. All they will be doing is saying "yes, we're OK with the sale to Seattle" or "no, we don't approve of the sale to Seattle". In no way are they telling the Maloofs who they can sell to. Granted, a "no" to Seattle leaves the Maloofs with a "backup" offer from Sacramento, but that doesn't mean they are forced to take it (although they're probably be ridiculed more - if that's even possible - if they don't take it).
He also says that the owners don't like to tell other owners who they have to sell their team to. But that will not be the case here. All they will be doing is saying "yes, we're OK with the sale to Seattle" or "no, we don't approve of the sale to Seattle". In no way are they telling the Maloofs who they can sell to. Granted, a "no" to Seattle leaves the Maloofs with a "backup" offer from Sacramento, but that doesn't mean they are forced to take it (although they're probably be ridiculed more - if that's even possible - if they don't take it).
Can the Maloofs still come out of this as decent guys? I think so...
Look, the Kings weren't "for sale" per se until somebody came along with a gigantic above-market offer. What if Hansen Ballmer said "look George, I really really mean business BUT... you gotta clam up, you gotta give me exclusivity, and in return I'll give you a price to blow your mind and a $30M deposit".
Could anyone fault the Maloofs for entering such discussions? Before the Hansen Ballmer story broke... if the Maloofs had said "we'll sell but only for a value of $525M" they might have risked embarrassment.. and weakened their bargaining position.
I know this is maybe a little far-fetched and I have done more than my share of Maloof bashing. But... now... if the Maloofs are offered a face-saving way to accept a void of the Seattle deal, get bigger dollars in return for "saving the Kings for Sacramento".... well maybe there is some diplomacy to be done on that front.
I guess I have just found a way to empathize with the Maloof position... I mean nobody would have dreamed of a $525M valuation six months ago. And a commitment to negotiate secretly and exclusively with Seattle... well.... it worked - it blew the price out of the water.
Maybe Mark Mastrov can figure out a way to actually talk this out with the Maloofs without rancor.
I think I'm in a minority but if the Kings stay, all Maloof transgressions real and imaginary... are forgiven and replaced with THANKS for a favorable Sacramento decision. Maybe we ougtta stop pissing on them from now till April 19 just in case their feelings DO in fact matter.
Look, the Kings weren't "for sale" per se until somebody came along with a gigantic above-market offer. What if Hansen Ballmer said "look George, I really really mean business BUT... you gotta clam up, you gotta give me exclusivity, and in return I'll give you a price to blow your mind and a $30M deposit".
Could anyone fault the Maloofs for entering such discussions? Before the Hansen Ballmer story broke... if the Maloofs had said "we'll sell but only for a value of $525M" they might have risked embarrassment.. and weakened their bargaining position.
I know this is maybe a little far-fetched and I have done more than my share of Maloof bashing. But... now... if the Maloofs are offered a face-saving way to accept a void of the Seattle deal, get bigger dollars in return for "saving the Kings for Sacramento".... well maybe there is some diplomacy to be done on that front.
I guess I have just found a way to empathize with the Maloof position... I mean nobody would have dreamed of a $525M valuation six months ago. And a commitment to negotiate secretly and exclusively with Seattle... well.... it worked - it blew the price out of the water.
Maybe Mark Mastrov can figure out a way to actually talk this out with the Maloofs without rancor.
I think I'm in a minority but if the Kings stay, all Maloof transgressions real and imaginary... are forgiven and replaced with THANKS for a favorable Sacramento decision. Maybe we ougtta stop pissing on them from now till April 19 just in case their feelings DO in fact matter.
I think from now on I am just not going to read/watch national media or fan boards. Proper respect just isn't there, although I know a few respected members on this board feel otherwise. Proper respect hasn't been there from the point the Maloofs weaseled out of the arena deal until now when a quality fanbase is threatened with losing its team. That the Maloofs unprecedentedly (if thats a word) backed out of that signed agreement made little national headway, still few understand it, and many still had held the city accountable for not getting something done arena wise. Now, when we are in the throws of losing our team, I know if I were an outsider looking in, I would only feel pity for a 20th media market who has whole heartedly supported this team losing its team in the face of Seattle getting another team, but as you see with Isaiah Thomas in that piece, no mention from Sacramento's point of view. I just need to not pay attention to that anymore
I'm curious! Do you believe in Santa Claus too!. You must be living in a fantasy world if you think anyone, and I mean anyone except uninformed blissful idiots, would ever think of saying thanks to the Maloofs for saving the team for Sacramento. Why preytell, would I care about their feelings, when they've demostrated that they could care less about anyone in Sacramento. I'm starting to think that your actually Gavin Maloof hiding behind an avator. You think they suddenly decided to sell because someone came knocking on their door with an offer? Kevin Johnson told them that he had people right here in sacramento that wanted to buy the team. Burkle made an attempt, and was rejected by the Maloofs.
They've been shopping the team in one form or another for the last two years. And everywhere but Sacramento! What is it that you don't get about this whole thing? The Maloofs are the scum of the earth in Sacramento, and they know it. And frankly, they ought to know it. Actions have consequences.
They've been shopping the team in one form or another for the last two years. And everywhere but Sacramento! What is it that you don't get about this whole thing? The Maloofs are the scum of the earth in Sacramento, and they know it. And frankly, they ought to know it. Actions have consequences.
I have been inclined to think this way about the Maloofs situation for some time. Personally i
I think the Maloofs would be happy to sell to the Sacramrnto group as long as they get their moey. They would never have gotten this price if they had offered the Kings for sale publicly in Sacramento. Leis hope the team stays.
I think the Maloofs would be happy to sell to the Sacramrnto group as long as they get their moey. They would never have gotten this price if they had offered the Kings for sale publicly in Sacramento. Leis hope the team stays.
10 votes to block the sale
How 'bout some speculation on the votes for the approval of the sale? We need 10 nays...
Maloof family?
They're idiots. They realise they ultimately get more money with the Sacramento deal, so they try to back out of their deal
Paul Allen?
Is owner of the Seattle Seahawks, part owner of the Seattle Sounders, maybe he doesn't want to share the Seattle market.
Apparantly has a beef with Steve Ballmer (http://www.bizjournals.com/seattle/...-allen-have-a-beef-with-ballmer.html?page=all)
AEG angle? (10 teams)
Per AEG's (http://aegworldwide.com/facilities/arenas/arenas ) the Spurs, Timberwolves, Nets, Grizzlies, Warriors, Blazers, Lakers, Clippers, Heat and Bobcats are teams playing in AEG arenas.
Seattle's Key Arena is AEG operated, the possible new arena isn't.
NHL Angle? (4 teams) These owners also own an NHL team and therefore know Burkle. I have no idea how that influences them.
Ted Leonsis (Wizards, Capitals)
Dolan (Knicks, Rangers)
Stan and Josh Kroenke (Nuggets, Avalanche)
Maple Leaf Sports and Entertainment (Raptors, Maple Leafs)
Owners with business links to Mastrov or Burkle?
Any known grudges with Hansen or Ballmer?
Any other possible angles like the reallignment of the divisions?
How 'bout some speculation on the votes for the approval of the sale? We need 10 nays...
Maloof family?
They're idiots. They realise they ultimately get more money with the Sacramento deal, so they try to back out of their deal
Paul Allen?
Is owner of the Seattle Seahawks, part owner of the Seattle Sounders, maybe he doesn't want to share the Seattle market.
Apparantly has a beef with Steve Ballmer (http://www.bizjournals.com/seattle/...-allen-have-a-beef-with-ballmer.html?page=all)
AEG angle? (10 teams)
Per AEG's (http://aegworldwide.com/facilities/arenas/arenas ) the Spurs, Timberwolves, Nets, Grizzlies, Warriors, Blazers, Lakers, Clippers, Heat and Bobcats are teams playing in AEG arenas.
Seattle's Key Arena is AEG operated, the possible new arena isn't.
NHL Angle? (4 teams) These owners also own an NHL team and therefore know Burkle. I have no idea how that influences them.
Ted Leonsis (Wizards, Capitals)
Dolan (Knicks, Rangers)
Stan and Josh Kroenke (Nuggets, Avalanche)
Maple Leaf Sports and Entertainment (Raptors, Maple Leafs)
Owners with business links to Mastrov or Burkle?
Any known grudges with Hansen or Ballmer?
Any other possible angles like the reallignment of the divisions?
The decision for each owner will be coming down to a combination of the following factors for them to weigh (assuming Sac gets it's arena term sheet finalized). I know it's not this simple, but as sports fans we love rankings.
- Freedom of owners to sell franchise vs. Uprooting an existing franchise (Adv. Seattle)
- New privately funded arena vs. New heavily publicly funded arena (Adv. Sacramento)
- #12 ranked TV market vs. #20 ranked TV market (Adv. Seattle)
- Shared market vs. Sole market (Adv. Sacramento)
- Billionaire investor with $15.2B vs. Billionaire investor with $3.1B (How much money do you really need?)
- Quality fan base vs. Quality fan base (Even)
Too close to call. Unfortunately, the emotions of the fans don't really count. I'm trying to think of how this is going to play out without getting emotions involved. I was born and raised in Sac and have always been a die hard Kings fan. I've lived in Seattle for a long period of time (during the Payton/Kemp years) which made the Sonics my 2nd team. I'd love for the Sonics to come back some day (Seattle fans deserve it), but not at the expense of losing the Kings.
- Freedom of owners to sell franchise vs. Uprooting an existing franchise (Adv. Seattle)
- New privately funded arena vs. New heavily publicly funded arena (Adv. Sacramento)
- #12 ranked TV market vs. #20 ranked TV market (Adv. Seattle)
- Shared market vs. Sole market (Adv. Sacramento)
- Billionaire investor with $15.2B vs. Billionaire investor with $3.1B (How much money do you really need?)
- Quality fan base vs. Quality fan base (Even)
Too close to call. Unfortunately, the emotions of the fans don't really count. I'm trying to think of how this is going to play out without getting emotions involved. I was born and raised in Sac and have always been a die hard Kings fan. I've lived in Seattle for a long period of time (during the Payton/Kemp years) which made the Sonics my 2nd team. I'd love for the Sonics to come back some day (Seattle fans deserve it), but not at the expense of losing the Kings.
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Bold if odd revision. The Maloofs weren't actively seeking to relocate to Las Vegas, Anaheim, Virginia Beach, etc hoping for a fantasyland, publicly-subsidized, sweetheart arena deal in which they also would reap all profits and pay no taxes. All of which was a desperate attempt to rescue their sinking financial empire while staying in the NBA owners limelight. And they didn't only cave to selling when they realized how pathetically stupid and impossible that was, negotiating a secret deal to out-of-city investors with clear plans to move the team without giving Sacramento a chance to line-up an offer, even with a billionaire (or two) waiting in the wings.
No no, Ret-Con. That's not what happened. The Maloofs were feverishly studying plans to retrofit and refurbish Sleep Train nee Power Balance nee Arco and discussing ways to better provide the "Maloof Sports and Entertainment experience to their costumers" when a knock came at the door with an offer, as responsible businessmen first, they just couldn't refuse.
They did just that.
http://www.usatoday.com/story/sport...rcus-cousins-sacramento-kings-maloof/1798287/
Dec. 30th, 2012:
"According to people with knowledge of the situation, the Maloofs continue to discuss their preferred option of relocation with several cities and have let it be known in all the appropriate circles that bidding for the unlikely sale of the club should begin at an astounding $500 million."
Saving the Kings for Sacramento? This is like intentionally starting a fire in someone's house and then wanting credit as a hero because you put it out when handed an extinguisher.
It worked because this was less of a business deal and more of a hostage negotiation. No one wanted the Maloofs to own this team and they were able to set the ransom to fit their own debt of incompetence.
The Maloofs are irrelevant at this point as are their feelings. They've sold the team and are effectively out of the picture. Our fate lies completely in the hands of the BOG. I'm confident, if the Kings stay, it will not be through any machinations of the Brothers Maloof anyway and quite probably in spite of them.
Regardless, no amount of "face-saving" at this stage could exonerate them for years of boorish, abusive and destructive behavior. Any glimmer of hope for that was lost last year when their presentation to the BOG as to why they were slithering out of the arena deal amounted to how much of a hopeless terrorscape Sacramento was. As they say, we were done professionally at that point.
No no, Ret-Con. That's not what happened. The Maloofs were feverishly studying plans to retrofit and refurbish Sleep Train nee Power Balance nee Arco and discussing ways to better provide the "Maloof Sports and Entertainment experience to their costumers" when a knock came at the door with an offer, as responsible businessmen first, they just couldn't refuse.
They did just that.
http://www.usatoday.com/story/sport...rcus-cousins-sacramento-kings-maloof/1798287/
Dec. 30th, 2012:
"According to people with knowledge of the situation, the Maloofs continue to discuss their preferred option of relocation with several cities and have let it be known in all the appropriate circles that bidding for the unlikely sale of the club should begin at an astounding $500 million."
Saving the Kings for Sacramento? This is like intentionally starting a fire in someone's house and then wanting credit as a hero because you put it out when handed an extinguisher.
It worked because this was less of a business deal and more of a hostage negotiation. No one wanted the Maloofs to own this team and they were able to set the ransom to fit their own debt of incompetence.
The Maloofs are irrelevant at this point as are their feelings. They've sold the team and are effectively out of the picture. Our fate lies completely in the hands of the BOG. I'm confident, if the Kings stay, it will not be through any machinations of the Brothers Maloof anyway and quite probably in spite of them.
Regardless, no amount of "face-saving" at this stage could exonerate them for years of boorish, abusive and destructive behavior. Any glimmer of hope for that was lost last year when their presentation to the BOG as to why they were slithering out of the arena deal amounted to how much of a hopeless terrorscape Sacramento was. As they say, we were done professionally at that point.
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The thing is, this would not be the Sonics "returning" - it would be the wiping out of one of the original basketball franchises (one of the oldest basketball clubs still in existence - since the 1920's!) in order to move the team to a city that didn't put forth any effort (not the fans, the CITY) to keep the NBA team it had. Sacramento wouldn't be just "losing" a team.
The fans in both cities deserve a team.
The fans in both cities deserve a team.
I agree wholeheartedly. I think you misunderstood. If it did happen, the Kings would be killed and the Sonics would be resurrected. I've had friends up here say, "Well, at least, you could still root for the Kings versus if they moved somewhere else." I tell them the Kings would no longer exist.
Yes, the City of Seattle didn't want to work to help build a new arena and that is Sacramento's main strength in this battle. Sac has a mayor and city council that are showing undeniable support for the Kings and the NBA.
Yes, the City of Seattle didn't want to work to help build a new arena and that is Sacramento's main strength in this battle. Sac has a mayor and city council that are showing undeniable support for the Kings and the NBA.
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I'm a Saints fan, so I'm now well versed in how little the national media actually knows about any one situation. They are like sheep and go with what is first reported and most popular at the time. No research is done. Once they latch on to the initial story, they are reluctant to admit they are wrong. Even this Aldridge piece is a reluctant attempt at changing his tune. Sort of admitting Sac has a chance, but then saying not really because the Maloofs can do what they want.
The only thing that the least popular side of the story can possibly have is a pit bull of a reporter who 100% figured it out and is not afraid to hammer home the point until the rest of the media finally capitulates. The Saints had that and it eventually forced media one by one to dig deeper. Sacramento has this with Aaron Bruski. Be grateful for him. CD is not a reporter, but he has been serving the same purpose as well.
My advise to you is to sit back and enjoy watching the tide turn as more and more truth comes out about Sacramento's chances of keeping their team. It's already happening.
The only thing that the least popular side of the story can possibly have is a pit bull of a reporter who 100% figured it out and is not afraid to hammer home the point until the rest of the media finally capitulates. The Saints had that and it eventually forced media one by one to dig deeper. Sacramento has this with Aaron Bruski. Be grateful for him. CD is not a reporter, but he has been serving the same purpose as well.
My advise to you is to sit back and enjoy watching the tide turn as more and more truth comes out about Sacramento's chances of keeping their team. It's already happening.
John Shirey, Sac City manager on right now talking about arena deals.
http://tunein.com/radio/CBS-Sports-1140-s33038/
http://tunein.com/radio/CBS-Sports-1140-s33038/
Well ... I mean since I have my flame suit on already... it seems Keriotis, Mastrov, Burkle, etc... were late submitting their $500M + bids.
We don't know what happened in "all appropriate circles". If they said "bidding starts at $500M" and only the guys from Seattle took them seriously... well how does that make the Maloofs wrong to pursue the conversation? Unless you know for certain that they hung up on Mastrov when he called to offer $500M????
Bottom line, carrying a hateful grudge for the Maloofs won't help Sac win - and is also, as some wise man said once - like drinking poison and hoping the rats will die. I've just decided, for me, it is more efficient to keep this all about business.
As for 'forgiving the past' ... I don't think there is anybody who thinks we would be better off with last year's Railyards deal and Maloofs in charge.. as opposed to the Plaza Arena and Mastrov/Burkle in charge... so really isn't all well that ends well? It would be efficient to let them off the hook if this all ends up happy.
I really don't think it is preposterous to consider the Kings "Maloof property" and be a little mindful of the potential that - even if you believe they can't hurt us - it is definitely possible that they could HELP us by coming around. So me... I'm not gonna pee on em - I'm not in their shoes.
We don't know what happened in "all appropriate circles". If they said "bidding starts at $500M" and only the guys from Seattle took them seriously... well how does that make the Maloofs wrong to pursue the conversation? Unless you know for certain that they hung up on Mastrov when he called to offer $500M????
Bottom line, carrying a hateful grudge for the Maloofs won't help Sac win - and is also, as some wise man said once - like drinking poison and hoping the rats will die. I've just decided, for me, it is more efficient to keep this all about business.
As for 'forgiving the past' ... I don't think there is anybody who thinks we would be better off with last year's Railyards deal and Maloofs in charge.. as opposed to the Plaza Arena and Mastrov/Burkle in charge... so really isn't all well that ends well? It would be efficient to let them off the hook if this all ends up happy.
I really don't think it is preposterous to consider the Kings "Maloof property" and be a little mindful of the potential that - even if you believe they can't hurt us - it is definitely possible that they could HELP us by coming around. So me... I'm not gonna pee on em - I'm not in their shoes.
I'll try.
Basically the overwhelming consensus is that the team WILL be sold.
The city vastly prefers an arena downtown, and Shirey personally believes this is a great opportunity to revitalize downtown. He's clearly on board. Has talked with Kheriotis, but says there will be no real city investment for Natomas arena.
Understands the short timeline. Aiming for city to have Plaza arena deal together by April 1. This is the next task. City now solely focused on this task. Acknowledged that it's "just work". Says city is "nimble" and can pass stuff if there is the will. What needs to be worked out is who will pay how much, and how the revenue streams will be divided.
He's very down to earth about the logistics and finances, and that's his job. He doesn't do the negotiating. Says parking issue is important, and needs to be worked out, but that while there is a loss of spots with Plaza arena, there is also increased value in some premium spots, and that those are already built.
Says that having wealthier team owners/partners is a plus for the city. Gives more security to the venture. This is a plus, vs. the plan that was passed a year ago. When you go into a partnership with somebody, you want to be sure they can pay the bills. Potential new owners can pay the bills.
EDIT:
Says downtown is dying. Sales are down. This is the best opportunity we have to finish K street. There was a now or never, do or die, this is the time, kind of feel to his voice, but maintaining an earthy realism. Not rah rah. Solid, finance, oriented guy.
Tried to explain thoroughly the concept of leveraging the parking assets, and having to backfill the general fund. Says the city has hired a professional parking asset consultation firm to advise the city. People who "make their living" doing that. Just gave a very legit feel about the whole city's participation and process.
Basically the overwhelming consensus is that the team WILL be sold.
The city vastly prefers an arena downtown, and Shirey personally believes this is a great opportunity to revitalize downtown. He's clearly on board. Has talked with Kheriotis, but says there will be no real city investment for Natomas arena.
Understands the short timeline. Aiming for city to have Plaza arena deal together by April 1. This is the next task. City now solely focused on this task. Acknowledged that it's "just work". Says city is "nimble" and can pass stuff if there is the will. What needs to be worked out is who will pay how much, and how the revenue streams will be divided.
He's very down to earth about the logistics and finances, and that's his job. He doesn't do the negotiating. Says parking issue is important, and needs to be worked out, but that while there is a loss of spots with Plaza arena, there is also increased value in some premium spots, and that those are already built.
Says that having wealthier team owners/partners is a plus for the city. Gives more security to the venture. This is a plus, vs. the plan that was passed a year ago. When you go into a partnership with somebody, you want to be sure they can pay the bills. Potential new owners can pay the bills.
EDIT:
Says downtown is dying. Sales are down. This is the best opportunity we have to finish K street. There was a now or never, do or die, this is the time, kind of feel to his voice, but maintaining an earthy realism. Not rah rah. Solid, finance, oriented guy.
Tried to explain thoroughly the concept of leveraging the parking assets, and having to backfill the general fund. Says the city has hired a professional parking asset consultation firm to advise the city. People who "make their living" doing that. Just gave a very legit feel about the whole city's participation and process.
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That was a pretty good summary by Hammer. Shirey went into a lot of detail on what the term sheet will likely have (in general, not specific details for this particular negotiation) and on some of the parking implications with spots being taken up by the proposed arena vs. the use of those spots left as VIP parking, making them more valuable, etc.
Shirey is aiming to have the arena deal term sheet before the council March 26th (that is the date he would LIKE to have it done) but it may be April 2nd if it drags a bit getting everything put together.
Shirey is the real deal. Knows what he is doing and does a good job. Is focused, serious, and intelligent. Is also able to get in the minor digs without being insulting. I like him a lot.
Shirey is aiming to have the arena deal term sheet before the council March 26th (that is the date he would LIKE to have it done) but it may be April 2nd if it drags a bit getting everything put together.
Shirey is the real deal. Knows what he is doing and does a good job. Is focused, serious, and intelligent. Is also able to get in the minor digs without being insulting. I like him a lot.
http://www.nba.com/2013/news/featur...t-tyson-chandler-qa/index.html?ls=nbahpsplit1
alot of good videos about kings/seattle
alot of good videos about kings/seattle
But they really didn't. They always said the team was not for sale. They refused to sit with KJ or Burkle to discuss a possible sale. They talked about renovating STA. They talked about wanting to stay in Sacramento. They talked about being committed to keeping the Kings here. All lies. "Read my lips, we're not selling"...
The above is basically saying "we're not selling the team" and throwing out there an outrageous number to see if it sticks. And everyone laughed (except Hansen, I guess) because at the time it was way more than the team was valued at. But they NEVER came forward and officially declared that the team was for sale. It took a desperate billionaire to fall for their Virginia Beach bluff and offer them an amount so ridiculous that they had no choice but to accept.
The above is basically saying "we're not selling the team" and throwing out there an outrageous number to see if it sticks. And everyone laughed (except Hansen, I guess) because at the time it was way more than the team was valued at. But they NEVER came forward and officially declared that the team was for sale. It took a desperate billionaire to fall for their Virginia Beach bluff and offer them an amount so ridiculous that they had no choice but to accept.
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