Summer League Kings Vs. Bobcats Gameday Thread
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We didn't bring him in for a workout and now look what happened 
alright, so after 1 summer league game, Honeycutt got hurt and never made it to town, Whiteside hasn't come around, Jimmer still looks overwhelmed at this level, and TRob may be a SF/tweener...
Just testing something out: sign TWill, bid on Brendan Haywood:
C- Cousins, Haywood
PF- Thompson, Hayes (TRob as stretch)
SF- TWill, TRob, Cisco
SG- Evans, Thornton
PG- IT, Salmons
hmm...would fix some things. We'd gain size, athleticism, defenders. But...still in desperate need of a consolidating trade or two to clear out the clutter and competition.
We'll see what the team comes up with in the next 4 games. It does no good to play TRob the way he played tonight. He has to play PF. They need to find someone else to rescue Jimmer when he falls apart. If it turns out he has SF skills and can take over that position, that is fine and dandy but I'd place him at PF for now and let's see what can be made of his unusual skill set down low. Let's put him in a position where he can rebound. I suspect going into this game NO ONE supected Jimmer would be so inept nor would Hassan be so inept. I suspect they thought Hassan could take over the rebounding duties and strangely he DID rebound. It's the rest of the game that just creates confusion as he wanders the court.
I think this game just highlighted how badly we need TWill.
I think this game just highlighted how badly we need TWill.
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This game was just sloppy, Bobcats pressing the whole game, and our guys not having a clue how to beat a press. It wasn't really Jimmers fault because he passed out and usually T Rob would just try and go on a coast to coast run, hence the eight turnovers. After one game T Rob at SF does look like an interesting idea. He is quick on the perimeter, and his upper body strenght is off the charts for a rookie. With Cousins, T Rob, and Tyreke we have 3 bullies at their respective positions, Even Thornton has that strong bully body.
I don't see Robinson playing the 3 at all. He's going to be a stretch 4. He will face his man and shoot or drive to the basket. In that regard, he's going to be a quicker version of Thompson. He doesn't have the ballhandling skills to be a 3, and the 8 TOs are indicative of that. Not playing with an adequate pg really hurt his game tonight imo. Robinson does not have the playmaking abilities of an MKG and needs someone to set him up. At least at this point in his career. I think when he has IT to play with and Cousins he should be given a clearly defined role which does not have him dribbling the basketball 25 feet away from the basket. Eventually, like Thompson, he should get an inside game, but he's just not that player now, so I don't know what the broadcast guys are talking about. It's not like you're going to throw it to him in the post on a regular basis. If they were anticipating that he would do that then of course they are dissapointed, but it just shows their ignorance of his game.
What dissapointed me tonight about Robinson was his defense. He didn't guard anybody tonight. He allowed guys to dribble to the basket in the paint with no resistance. I sure hope this is an aberration because when he gets to the NBA he'll be destroyed with that kind of D. There's no reason he shouldn't be better on D with his athleticism, but it wasn't on display tonight.
What dissapointed me tonight about Robinson was his defense. He didn't guard anybody tonight. He allowed guys to dribble to the basket in the paint with no resistance. I sure hope this is an aberration because when he gets to the NBA he'll be destroyed with that kind of D. There's no reason he shouldn't be better on D with his athleticism, but it wasn't on display tonight.
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He's 6'9 in shoes, with regular pf standing reach, above average NBA wingspan and very good athleticism. He's not undersized.
Check these starting pf heights listed (which is w/shoes).
6'7": Maxiell
6'8": Bass, Faried, Battier, Diaw, Millsap, Booker
6'9": Smoove, White, Boozer, Jamison, DLee, Scola, West, Blake, Zbo, Humpries, Allen, Hickson, Johnson,
6'10": Gooden, Love, Ibaka, Anderson, Morris,
6'11": Stat, JT
7'0" : Dirk, Pau, Smith
6'7" (1)
6'8" (6)
6'9" (13)
6'10"(5)
6'11"(2)
7'0" (3)
Average is 6'9, Median is 6'9
Let's stop w/the kneejerk reactions and using the "undersized" crap as a reason why Robinson cannot be successful as a 4.
Everyone was scared that he would be 6'8 in shoes, which is slightly undersized and puts you squarely in Millsap/West as a best case, with Landry as a worst case (in regards to Robinson). Lo and behold he measured out 6'9 in shoes with good wingspan, and (they thought) solidified himself as a top 3 pick.
Check these starting pf heights listed (which is w/shoes).
6'7": Maxiell
6'8": Bass, Faried, Battier, Diaw, Millsap, Booker
6'9": Smoove, White, Boozer, Jamison, DLee, Scola, West, Blake, Zbo, Humpries, Allen, Hickson, Johnson,
6'10": Gooden, Love, Ibaka, Anderson, Morris,
6'11": Stat, JT
7'0" : Dirk, Pau, Smith
6'7" (1)
6'8" (6)
6'9" (13)
6'10"(5)
6'11"(2)
7'0" (3)
Average is 6'9, Median is 6'9
Let's stop w/the kneejerk reactions and using the "undersized" crap as a reason why Robinson cannot be successful as a 4.
Everyone was scared that he would be 6'8 in shoes, which is slightly undersized and puts you squarely in Millsap/West as a best case, with Landry as a worst case (in regards to Robinson). Lo and behold he measured out 6'9 in shoes with good wingspan, and (they thought) solidified himself as a top 3 pick.
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I stand corrected.
Despite his average size I still wonder how his offensive game develops. On the break I think he's going to be great around the basket, but I think it's possible that the size of the league and his skill set will force him towards more of a perimeter role in the half court. Same thing happened to Beasley and Williams despite their size and athleticism. Maybe that just makes him a stretch or face up four, or perhaps just a work in progress in need of a more refined post game. I also wonder if defensively, even if he isn't undersized, if he would be better off at sf. It's going to be interesting to see where he's effective this year.
Despite his average size I still wonder how his offensive game develops. On the break I think he's going to be great around the basket, but I think it's possible that the size of the league and his skill set will force him towards more of a perimeter role in the half court. Same thing happened to Beasley and Williams despite their size and athleticism. Maybe that just makes him a stretch or face up four, or perhaps just a work in progress in need of a more refined post game. I also wonder if defensively, even if he isn't undersized, if he would be better off at sf. It's going to be interesting to see where he's effective this year.
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C
Wish I could recall the source but there was a quote/tweet/something that Dunlap was intending on rotating 10 players per quarter. Not sure if that was a reference to SL only or once he gets into the season. I personally don't know how it could be sustainable either but in reality, the Cats are going to probably be one of the youngest if not the youngest teams in the league this year and now have a lot of high energy/defensive minded guys. Don't be shocked if the Cats run something less than conventional on defense at times this year.
As for the comments about this being their (Charlotte's) starting five, it's close but not totally. I will be amazed if Gerald Henderson isn't starting at the 2, MKG probably very well will start along w/ Kemba, Biyombo and I'd assume Tyrus Thomas (unless we do pull off a PF acquisition). So yes, you were playing against three starters for the Cats tonight.
As for TRob tonight - I saw it as nerves. I think he truly thought he was going the Bobcats on draft night and I wouldn't be surprised if he wanted to bring it just a wee bit more than he would otherwise for his pro debut. I think that bled over into the interview too. But he seems like a tremendous guy & talent and my guess is that he's going to be a great addition to the Kings. I know that a lot of Charlotte had high hopes he was coming here (in-part due to the misdirection that had noone looking MKG's way) and really found his to be a compelling story.
-- just some insights from across the country --
As for the comments about this being their (Charlotte's) starting five, it's close but not totally. I will be amazed if Gerald Henderson isn't starting at the 2, MKG probably very well will start along w/ Kemba, Biyombo and I'd assume Tyrus Thomas (unless we do pull off a PF acquisition). So yes, you were playing against three starters for the Cats tonight.
As for TRob tonight - I saw it as nerves. I think he truly thought he was going the Bobcats on draft night and I wouldn't be surprised if he wanted to bring it just a wee bit more than he would otherwise for his pro debut. I think that bled over into the interview too. But he seems like a tremendous guy & talent and my guess is that he's going to be a great addition to the Kings. I know that a lot of Charlotte had high hopes he was coming here (in-part due to the misdirection that had noone looking MKG's way) and really found his to be a compelling story.
-- just some insights from across the country --
I didn't see the game last night, bit late, but since i first saw Hassan he always seems lost, like someones just dropped him from space onto a basketball court and said "do something" he just sort of wanders around and sets random screens on anyone.
I don't know if it was the same last night... sure hope not.
I don't know if it was the same last night... sure hope not.
I love how you don't even have Jimmer in your scenario.
The biggest problem with this lineup is Evans/Thornton sharing time at the 2. I don't think that would work out. One of them needs to go.
The biggest problem with this lineup is Evans/Thornton sharing time at the 2. I don't think that would work out. One of them needs to go.
I would play it out similar to how Brick put it, but I may start Robinson over Twill so Twill can play some backup PG. The sub pattern would also be pretty important. If you sub out Thomas somewhat early you can have Evans play the PG until Thomas eventually comes back in for him.
In a lot of ways, making Tyreke into an SF was a more drastic role change than moving Robinson to SF would be. That's kind of important to note. We've moved guys around in the past. I'd even say Robinson has better SF skills than Evans. He can certainly shoot it better. He can take advantage of smaller SF's. Evans couldn't do either of those things. Evans is clearly a better ball handler, but he couldn't even use that as a strength when he was playing SF. I'm willing to bet Robinson would also be a better SF defender than Evans just because of his size. Big post SF's gave us fits all season.
A lot of the Robinson comparisons out of pre-summer league camp was how he attacks the basket like Lebron ... what position is Lebron?
I have said from the beginning that Robinson had the athleticism to play SF, but he needed to improve his skill level in some areas. One of those was ball handling. However, based on last night, he's farther along in that area than I thought. Despite a several turnovers, he looks to have very good passing skills as well. If he can become consistent with his jumpshot, I can see him playing SF full time. He's rough around the edges, but he played pretty good defense on the perimeter last night. Had at least two steals that I can remember. I like your lineup. Play Robinson when needed at PF but give him most of his time at SF.
Ironic that everyone was impressed with Robinson's ballhandling skills, and you wern't. Don't let the results distort his abilities. Because he had 8 turnovers doesn't mean he can't handle the ball. It means he tried to do too much, and some of those turnovers came because of bad passes and not his ballhandling. Defense wise, if you separate his perimeter defense from his post defense, then you have two different stories, and one of those stories points to his being better at SF. He was very good out on the perimeter staying in front of his man, and he had at least two steals. In the post he seemed overwhelmed by the size of the Bobcats. Now put him out there with Cousins, and it may be an entirely different story.
Don't know if anyone has mentioned it or not, but the Bobcats had three of last years starters in their lineup. If you add in Gilchrist, who is penciled in as a starter, the Kings were esentially playing against the regular starting lineup the Bobcats. I think everyone now knows why I was so high on both Gilchrist and Jeffery Taylor. The fact that Petrie made no effort to aquire Taylor really pisses me off. His defense last night was outstanding, as was his shooting.
Don't know if anyone has mentioned it or not, but the Bobcats had three of last years starters in their lineup. If you add in Gilchrist, who is penciled in as a starter, the Kings were esentially playing against the regular starting lineup the Bobcats. I think everyone now knows why I was so high on both Gilchrist and Jeffery Taylor. The fact that Petrie made no effort to aquire Taylor really pisses me off. His defense last night was outstanding, as was his shooting.
I think TRob did just fine offensively for not handling the ball all that much in college. Jimmer seemed to be abhorrent handling the ball and it was frustrating to watch TRob in that position but alas if there is anyone who will work his *** off to adjust to the NBA game it is him. He is a workhorse. He needs to work on his defensive game big time. This will also come with time.
M
Interesting.... Ross and Jones play on opposite teams in their first pro games....they were on the same high school team. Ross was Oregon Player of the Year as a sophomore over Jones. He spent junior year at a prep school and returned for his senior year only to be barred from playing because of 'transfer" rules.
The undrafted guys didn't really stand out at all. Michael Lee nailed a few treys and didn't show any hesitation when he had those open shots. That was nice to see.
Hassan just doesn't look like he knows what he's doing on the court. It's so frustrating to watch because he has all the size, athleticism, and shot blocking ability you'd ever want, but he just doesn't put it to use. I mean, there were MANY times in the game yesterday where he was down by the basket, a Bobcat would be driving in for a dunk or a layup, and he'd just watch. CONTEST THE BASKET! It's summer league! Foul somebody. Toughen the **** up!
Anyhow, as mentioned earlier, Jimmer just doesn't look good. His ball handling is average, his shot has seemingly vanished, and his lack of athleticism is really starting to show through. I have severe questions about him ever developing into a PG, even one that comes off the bench.
All this talk of Thomas Robinson at the SF spot should stop. Coaching staff doesn't want him there, and I think he's better suited at PF, by FAR. It was only ONE summer league game guys. The Bobcats full court press the entire game kind of dictated how much T-Rob had to handle the ball and the Kings pretty much NEVER got into their offense.
What was very pleasing and what I haven't seen anyone really mention is that T-Rob got to the stripe 15 times. That's very encouraging.
In tonight's game, I hope to see better play all around. I am rooting for Michael Lee to be a guy who can score the trey and defend. I want to see Thomas Robinson in the post, Hassan get 10 boards and 5 legit blocks, and I want to see Jimmer look like an NBA player and not a college player.
Oh and Steve Kerr guaranteed that Jared Sullinger would have a better season than Thomas Robinson. Such an idiotic thing to say after this point in the season.
Hassan just doesn't look like he knows what he's doing on the court. It's so frustrating to watch because he has all the size, athleticism, and shot blocking ability you'd ever want, but he just doesn't put it to use. I mean, there were MANY times in the game yesterday where he was down by the basket, a Bobcat would be driving in for a dunk or a layup, and he'd just watch. CONTEST THE BASKET! It's summer league! Foul somebody. Toughen the **** up!
Anyhow, as mentioned earlier, Jimmer just doesn't look good. His ball handling is average, his shot has seemingly vanished, and his lack of athleticism is really starting to show through. I have severe questions about him ever developing into a PG, even one that comes off the bench.
All this talk of Thomas Robinson at the SF spot should stop. Coaching staff doesn't want him there, and I think he's better suited at PF, by FAR. It was only ONE summer league game guys. The Bobcats full court press the entire game kind of dictated how much T-Rob had to handle the ball and the Kings pretty much NEVER got into their offense.
What was very pleasing and what I haven't seen anyone really mention is that T-Rob got to the stripe 15 times. That's very encouraging.
In tonight's game, I hope to see better play all around. I am rooting for Michael Lee to be a guy who can score the trey and defend. I want to see Thomas Robinson in the post, Hassan get 10 boards and 5 legit blocks, and I want to see Jimmer look like an NBA player and not a college player.
Oh and Steve Kerr guaranteed that Jared Sullinger would have a better season than Thomas Robinson. Such an idiotic thing to say after this point in the season.
The TRob as SF thing has two fronts. 1) he really did show a lot of SF esqe skills. That ability to handle and pass off the dribble was especialy SFesque.; but 2) he showed NO PF skills. No rebounding. No interior defense. No post play.
As far as our coahcing staff, or Shareef (himself a weenie tweener who probably likes the concept despite having one of the lowest winning percentgaes for a major player in NBA history) who is now assistant GM I think, we would be smallball loving fools to put the player that was out there yesterday at PF in the NBA. I am very interested to see what happens in these next few games. In this Lakers game there won't be one NBA level big man on the court during the entire game for the Lakers. If TRob is not able to establish himself as an interior force against THESE guys, we may have to talk, especially if he again shows a propensity and skills around the perimeter.
As far as our coahcing staff, or Shareef (himself a weenie tweener who probably likes the concept despite having one of the lowest winning percentgaes for a major player in NBA history) who is now assistant GM I think, we would be smallball loving fools to put the player that was out there yesterday at PF in the NBA. I am very interested to see what happens in these next few games. In this Lakers game there won't be one NBA level big man on the court during the entire game for the Lakers. If TRob is not able to establish himself as an interior force against THESE guys, we may have to talk, especially if he again shows a propensity and skills around the perimeter.
After listening to the announcers, I get the perception that the NBA has of the Kings. The fact that they are accurate is besides the point sadly. I think it was mentioned several times that players that were picked would do well or bad depending on who picked them. Whether those were the exact words I think the meaning was clear. It is a death sentence to be drafted by Sacramento. If announcers will say that, you can imagine what is said off camera. I didn't hear the Sullinger reference but I suspect it was thought Sullinger would do better because he wasn't on the Kings. It had nothing to do with the skill level of the athletes and obviously was meant as a huge dig at the Kings organization. The fact they picked Sullinger who plummetted in value from last year to this was just to drive home the point.
Sell the damn team.
Sell the damn team.
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right ok reading whats above have i got this right...
How did T-Rob do - Did well but turned it over alot... might be in wrong position
How did Jimmer do - Not very well
How did Whiteside do - Doesnt know what to do
How did the kings do - Best not to talk about this one
and did anyone impress you who wernt drafted and could be a steal for a team - In 3 games only one guy stood out??? Michael Lee :/
Have i got this right??
How did T-Rob do - Did well but turned it over alot... might be in wrong position
How did Jimmer do - Not very well
How did Whiteside do - Doesnt know what to do
How did the kings do - Best not to talk about this one
and did anyone impress you who wernt drafted and could be a steal for a team - In 3 games only one guy stood out??? Michael Lee :/
Have i got this right??
Pretty good except I think you exaggerated a bit about Michael Lee. Actually TRob showed flashes of skill but when the opposition comes out in a full court press against a team of inferior quality that has had only hours of practice, this is what you get: a terrible performance by the Kings.
Not being a homer here but I think the use of the full court press was bush league.
Not being a homer here but I think the use of the full court press was bush league.