JJ Hickson Bought Out

[The Hammer]

i bet we could have traded him for SOMEONE at the deadline, but it was likely just another garbage player on a worse and longer contract. maybe? it does look like some teams have interest in him right now as a FA

The type of player we might have been able trade him for we could easily pick up in free agency/amnesty/waivers. And that's not a player your going to work into the rotation (or even bother with trying to bring into the locker room) at this point in the season/our team's development, let alone be locked into any kind of contract that would go beyond this season.

What we should've tried to get was a second round pick. I'm guessing we couldn't even get that. Word on the street perhaps was that he wanted to dictate where he would go (being put out by his agent of course)/prefer free agency, which really makes complete sense from his perspective.

We gambled. We lost. 95% percent of us would have taken the same gamble, pick included.

 

[steelevt]

Omri is playing behind a D league SF named A. Gee and that pick is protected so the Kings keep it if its 1 thru 12 until 2017.

KB

If we don't make the playoffs by 2017 I'll be upset. If we make the playoffs by 2017, we lose a first round pick, I'll be upset. Hmm. Thank you petrie for making whatever the kings do bittersweet

 

[eflat]

Hickson says he and his agent began exploring an exit from Sacramento after All-Star Weekend. The former Kings forward says he didn’t personally request a trade and holds no grudge towards the team. However, Hickson did acknowledge that he and the organization didn’t see “eye-to-eye on a couple things.”

JJ speaks: http://www.cowbellkingdom.com/2012/...sses-his-departure-from-the-sacramento-kings/

 

[Section 101]

Looks like he will be signing with the Warriors.

 

[Bricklayer]

Looks like he will be signing with the Warriors.

Wish it had not been so close by. Its not entirely improbable that he put up some numbers for a new team that will make us wince at the whole sequence of events one more time.

 

[Section 101]

Wish it had not been so close by. Its not entirely improbable that he put up some numbers for a new team that will make us wince at the whole sequence of events one more time.

And we play them on Sat.

 

[kingsfan101]

Why didn't we trade him for at least a 2nd round pick or even a highly protected first round pick like the one we sent to the Cavs to get JJ?

Maybe Petrie can't get quite well these days with all the new GM's in the league.

Don't think it's that simple. As far as I understand, only a team under the cap, or with an exception, can trade for him while giving us only a pick back. Any other team shall need to return some player(s) that meet the 125% salary requirement (might be different under new CBA though).

That severely limits the options. Given that most teams are over the cap, teams shall need to send us some player(s) to match salaries. Unless it's someone we really covet (unlikely, given JJs play here), we are talking of expiring contracts again, which shall have as little meaning for us as JJ. So, unless some team is willing to give an expiring and some asset (e.g., a 2nd rounder), the owners might as well take the small savings buyouts provide.

 

[bajaden]

You know, lost in all this talk of "we traded Omri for this?" is the fact that Omri is playing like a turd sandwich this year.

I believe I mentioned that!

 

[Krunker]

Reminds me a little of the Drew Gooden buyout. We saved $2 million and it was a favor for him to go somewhere else. But now he is averaging 15 points and 7 boards.

 

[bajaden]

This is definitely a black mark on Petrie's record. He's susposed to be the guru of judging talent, and somehow he missed big time on Hickson. Bottom line, we took a mid first round pick from Houston and turned it into Casspi. We took Casspi and a future 1st round pick, barring a miracle, and turned it into nothing. There's no way to step around, or over that mistake. Whether 90% of the posters on this fourm thought it was a good deal or not, is irrevelant. We're not the one's getting paid to make informed and intelligent decisions on these matters. Petrie is! I'm not going to condemm him for life over this one deal. But his recent record has been less than stellar, when it comes to freeagency and trades.

Let me ask you all something. Would this team be a better team right now, if we had Beno still on the team. Now I mean no disrespect to Jimmer. I like Jimmer and think he'll be a good player in the league. But whom would you rather have right now. Brandon Knight, or Jimmer? Klay Thompson, who is starting for the Warriors at SF, or Jimmer? Alec Burks, another SF, or Jimmer? How about Kawhi Leonard, a SF, who is starting for the Spurs, or Jimmer? Or are you happy as a clam with John Salmons and Jimmer?

I think I know the answer to most of those questions, and we had everyone of those options available to us. Yeah, hindsight is 100%, but you and I aren't getting paid the big bucks. They don't pay you a dime for hindsight. They pay you big bucks to judge talent, and pick the best of the litter. Again, this is not an attack on Jimmer. I thought the Kings were going to pick him prior to the draft based on everything I was hearing, and I happened to be right. But he wouldn't have been my pick at number 7, which was our original spot.

Yeah, I know, its reported that Westphal fell in love with Jimmer, and also lobbied for the Salmons trade. Maybe we can blame the Hickson deal on his as well. Like I said, it appears that the tail is wagging the dog.

 

[Tetsujin]

Wish it had not been so close by. Its not entirely improbable that he put up some numbers for a new team that will make us wince at the whole sequence of events one more time.

Warriors are so depleted at big man (thanks smallball) that I would not be surprised if he starts next to Lee

 

[Spike]

Yeah, I know, its reported that Westphal fell in love with Jimmer, and also lobbied for the Salmons trade. Maybe we can blame the Hickson deal on his as well. Like I said, it appears that the tail is wagging the dog.

I wanted to focus on this point, baja. At what point do we determine if a coach is going to be around long enough to make roster demands? Shouldn't the GM mold the vision until we've got a surefire "he's gonna be around a while" sort of coach? The reason I mention this is because I wonder about our offseason moves, and I wonder if Smart will have as much say as Westphal did. I don't know if it's a good or a bad thing, because if Smart pushes for some real size at the SF position as well as backup PF, then that will be telling, but my gut says otherwise.

As of right now, Outlaw has been moved up in the backup PF position as well as Donte. I don't feel good about that. While I can see that Hickson wasn't a good fit, we're now left with 4 guys above 6'9". One is Whiteside, who is a mystery wrapped inside an enigma, while another is Greene, who certainly doesn't play like a PF (as well he shouldn't.) Naturally, JT and Cousins are the others.

We keep going in the opposite direction roster wise.

 

[pshn80]

This is definitely a black mark on Petrie's record. He's susposed to be the guru of judging talent, and somehow he missed big time on Hickson. Bottom line, we took a mid first round pick from Houston and turned it into Casspi. We took Casspi and a future 1st round pick, barring a miracle, and turned it into nothing. There's no way to step around, or over that mistake. Whether 90% of the posters on this fourm thought it was a good deal or not, is irrevelant. We're not the one's getting paid to make informed and intelligent decisions on these matters. Petrie is! I'm not going to condemm him for life over this one deal. But his recent record has been less than stellar, when it comes to freeagency and trades.

Let me ask you all something. Would this team be a better team right now, if we had Beno still on the team. Now I mean no disrespect to Jimmer. I like Jimmer and think he'll be a good player in the league. But whom would you rather have right now. Brandon Knight, or Jimmer? Klay Thompson, who is starting for the Warriors at SF, or Jimmer? Alec Burks, another SF, or Jimmer? How about Kawhi Leonard, a SF, who is starting for the Spurs, or Jimmer? Or are you happy as a clam with John Salmons and Jimmer?

I think I know the answer to most of those questions, and we had everyone of those options available to us. Yeah, hindsight is 100%, but you and I aren't getting paid the big bucks. They don't pay you a dime for hindsight. They pay you big bucks to judge talent, and pick the best of the litter. Again, this is not an attack on Jimmer. I thought the Kings were going to pick him prior to the draft based on everything I was hearing, and I happened to be right. But he wouldn't have been my pick at number 7, which was our original spot.

Yeah, I know, its reported that Westphal fell in love with Jimmer, and also lobbied for the Salmons trade. Maybe we can blame the Hickson deal on his as well. Like I said, it appears that the tail is wagging the dog.

You're probably right about most of this. Hindsight always. And of course hindsight is why this thread is so long. I haven't given Petrie any demerits because of this or any of the rest. He does his job well with some hits and some misses, par for the course. There is no other life for a GM whether good or bad. Like someone above said most of us would make these same moves when Petrie did.

I know we have to do these threads but 72 and counting on the Hickson buy out? Too much. Way too much. Hickson didn't work out Thompson did. You only have five players on the floor at once. Go Kings!!!!

 

[Section 101]

You're probably right about most of this. Hindsight always. And of course hindsight is why this thread is so long. I haven't given Petrie any demerits because of this or any of the rest. He does his job well with some hits and some misses, par for the course. There is no other life for a GM whether good or bad. Like someone above said most of us would make these same moves when Petrie did.

I know we have to do these threads but 72 and counting on the Hickson buy out? Too much. Way too much. Hickson didn't work out Thompson did. You only have five players on the floor at once. Go Kings!!!!

The problem is it wasn't hindsight for many of the people who saw this coming. Seems like Petrie didn't do enough due diligence in the scouting department.

 

[NoBonus]

The problem is it wasn't hindsight for many of the people who saw this coming. Seems like Petrie didn't do enough due diligence in the scouting department.

maybe, but at that time, Omri was as close to demanding a trade as he could have been without publicly saying he was demanding a trade. Kind of put the Kings in a bad spot to trade him.

 

[Section 101]

maybe, but at that time, Omri was as close to demanding a trade as he could have been without publicly saying he was demanding a trade. Kind of put the Kings in a bad spot to trade him.

But he didn't have to give away a protected pick. We would have been better off letting Omri walk with not picking up his option.

 

[Capt. Factorial]

But he didn't have to give away a protected pick. We would have been better off letting Omri walk with not picking up his option.

We didn't "give away" a protected pick. Obviously we thought Hickson was going to be good. Many around here including myself thought he would start in front of JT. We attempted to get value for a protected pick. It didn't work out.

 

[King Baller]

JJ was the starter at PF to begin the season lest we forget. The team played so poorly to start the season that every player was run in and out of the line up to reach the point we are at now. Hayes injured his shoulder, JT just plain outplayed JJ and JJ was shown the bench. I think JJ can be a pretty good third Big for the W's. Good for them and good for JJ.

KB

 

[Glenn]

I wanted to focus on this point, baja. At what point do we determine if a coach is going to be around long enough to make roster demands? Shouldn't the GM mold the vision until we've got a surefire "he's gonna be around a while" sort of coach? The reason I mention this is because I wonder about our offseason moves, and I wonder if Smart will have as much say as Westphal did. I don't know if it's a good or a bad thing, because if Smart pushes for some real size at the SF position as well as backup PF, then that will be telling, but my gut says otherwise.

As of right now, Outlaw has been moved up in the backup PF position as well as Donte. I don't feel good about that. While I can see that Hickson wasn't a good fit, we're now left with 4 guys above 6'9". One is Whiteside, who is a mystery wrapped inside an enigma, while another is Greene, who certainly doesn't play like a PF (as well he shouldn't.) Naturally, JT and Cousins are the others.

We keep going in the opposite direction roster wise.

Worrisome isn't it? There are a lot of big guys available in the draft. I have also made other suggestions that would force Smart away from small ball. The trouble is, if we go away from small ball and Smart fails, WHAT KIND OF DUMB A$$ BUSINESS ARE THEY RUNNING?

It seems like the coach and GM should work in concert and I have to assume that Petrie and the Maloofs are happy with small ball or they wouldn't have done what they have been doing. Perhaps the failure of Hickson is the failure of Smart. Who knows? If the latter is true, we are in trouble. Cousins numbers are going down.

 

[kingsfan101]

Let me ask you all something. Would this team be a better team right now, if we had Beno still on the team. Now I mean no disrespect to Jimmer. I like Jimmer and think he'll be a good player in the league. But whom would you rather have right now. Brandon Knight, or Jimmer? Klay Thompson, who is starting for the Warriors at SF, or Jimmer? Alec Burks, another SF, or Jimmer? How about Kawhi Leonard, a SF, who is starting for the Spurs, or Jimmer? Or are you happy as a clam with John Salmons and Jimmer?

How about Kenneth Faried, who went to Denver at 22? Yikes.

 

[Spike]

Worrisome isn't it? There are a lot of big guys available in the draft. I have also made other suggestions that would force Smart away from small ball. The trouble is, if we go away from small ball and Smart fails, WHAT KIND OF DUMB A$$ BUSINESS ARE THEY RUNNING?

It seems like the coach and GM should work in concert and I have to assume that Petrie and the Maloofs are happy with small ball or they wouldn't have done what they have been doing. Perhaps the failure of Hickson is the failure of Smart. Who knows? If the latter is true, we are in trouble. Cousins numbers are going down.

That's OK, everyone else's are going up!



(Don't worry Glenn, I see your position and I'm worried as well. I think we see eye to eye on this one.)

 

[Spike]

How about Kenneth Faried, who went to Denver at 22? Yikes.

Faried was a bajaden favorite, IIRC. Of course, everyone seems to be a favorite of his this time of year.

 

[Bricklayer]

Again let me point out that post All Star break last year Hickson seemed to have turned a corenre and averaged 16.8pts 10.8rebs for the second half of the season. I don't think there is any magic to the move we made -- it was Thornton Pt II. Find the young kid who looks o be on the cusp of blowing up and try to nab him. We are 1-1 now on those moves. No crocodile tears about OMri either. He's fallen apart badly enough his NBA career is now in question. The pick is the problem. Or actually my own probelm with it was the muddledheadedness and lack of focus. Hickson put up strong numbers after the break..but as a #1 interior option who was startig. We started Daly the back half of last year to great effect. So even at the tiem we go Hickson there was a ? haning over it. As in how many offensive players do you think we need Geoff? Did you just defacto replace Daly's defense with Hickson's offense? You do realize that can't work and Cousins is the man in there right? And Hickson off the bench isn't 17 and 11, and isn't going to be an impact guy because he's not built to be a roleplayer etc.

P.S. at the time of the Jimmer fascination it ws reported that he had come in for his workout and our entire staff and owners were there anfd got all giggly. Can't blame that just on Westphal. this was just after the Maloofs had embraced their latest enthusiasm and decided Juan Juan Barea was how you win titles. We basically bought into the hype from top to bottom (and can still here Jerry forcing the gushing) and disrespected the solid veteran for the new toy.

 

[Glenn]

That's OK, everyone else's are going up!



(Don't worry Glenn, I see your position and I'm worried as well. I think we see eye to eye on this one.)

I am not THAT worried about Cousins especially with JT's numbers going up. I just wonder what's up (or down). I mentioned once that maybe Cousins is blocking out the two bigs from the other team or at the least drawing all their attention which allows JT freedom. Surprise, folks, JT is up to it. I'm inclined to leave this all up to Clifford Ray as I have faith in him. He balances Smart's small ball training, I hope. If Ray is verbal, maybe he will be able to get a word in to convince Smart that big guys are important also.

I look forward to tonight's game.

 

[Gliesian]

Our rebuild would be pretty much DONE if we still had Beno. ****. The Hickson trade was just bad luck.

 

[The Hammer]

Again let me point out that post All Star break last year Hickson seemed to have turned a corenre and averaged 16.8pts 10.8rebs for the second half of the season. I don't think there is any magic to the move we made -- it was Thornton Pt II. Find the young kid who looks o be on the cusp of blowing up and try to nab him. We are 1-1 now on those moves. No crocodile tears about OMri either. He's fallen apart badly enough his NBA career is now in question. The pick is the problem. Or actually my own probelm with it was the muddledheadedness and lack of focus. Hickson put up strong numbers after the break..but as a #1 interior option who was startig. We started Daly the back half of last year to great effect. So even at the tiem we go Hickson there was a ? haning over it. As in how many offensive players do you think we need Geoff? Did you just defacto replace Daly's defense with Hickson's offense? You do realize that can't work and Cousins is the man in there right? And Hickson off the bench isn't 17 and 11, and isn't going to be an impact guy because he's not built to be a roleplayer etc.

P.S. at the time of the Jimmer fascination it ws reported that he had come in for his workout and our entire staff and owners were there anfd got all giggly. Can't blame that just on Westphal. this was just after the Maloofs had embraced their latest enthusiasm and decided Juan Juan Barea was how you win titles. We basically bought into the hype from top to bottom (and can still here Jerry forcing the gushing) and disrespected the solid veteran for the new toy.

Would you have done the move? Would you have moved Casspi and the protected first for Hickson at that time, if it was offered to you?

 

[The Hammer]

I am not THAT worried about Cousins especially with JT's numbers going up. I just wonder what's up (or down). I mentioned once that maybe Cousins is blocking out the two bigs from the other team or at the least drawing all their attention which allows JT freedom. Surprise, folks, JT is up to it. I'm inclined to leave this all up to Clifford Ray as I have faith in him. He balances Smart's small ball training, I hope. If Ray is verbal, maybe he will be able to get a word in to convince Smart that big guys are important also.

I look forward to tonight's game.

Me too!

 

[Bricklayer]

Would you have done the move? Would you have moved Casspi and the protected first for Hickson at that time, if it was offered to you?

The pick made me nervous. I thought Omri for Hickson was a good talent save, but it was not what I would have been looking for ideally. I wanted a Cousins/Daly/JT frontcorut this year. Hickson never fit into that picture. Would I have done it? Maybe. It seemed off to me, lacking in feel or plan given our team. But I wouldn't have called it a terrible trade if some other differently constructed team had made it. Guess it would have depended what else Omri could have brought back.

I would have given the trade a B- if another team did it, a C or C- for us.

 

[The Hammer]

The pick made me nervous. I thought Omri for Hickson was a good talent save, but it was not what I would have been looking for ideally. I wanted a Cousins/Daly/JT frontcorut this year. Hickson never fit into that picture. Would I have done it? Maybe. It seemed off to me, lacking in feel or plan given our team. But I wouldn't have called it a terrible trade if some other differently constructed team had made it. Guess it would have depended what else Omri could have brought back.

I would have given the trade a B- if another team did it, a C or C- for us.

Really. Cause I seem to distinctly remember you saying this trade was a no brainer. Sorry to have to call you out good buddy. Just doin my job. You're now waffling!!

 

[Bricklayer]

Really. Cause I seem to distinctly remember you saying this trade was a no brainer. Sorry to have to call you out good buddy. Just doin my job. You're now waffling!!

Well here was trade thread:

http://www.kingsfans.com/forums/sho...under-for-JJ-Hickson&highlight=Hickson+Casspi

Here was my inital repsonse when all that had been reported was Omri for Hickson without mention of the pick:

If true that is a very good trade, but...starting Cousins and Hickson? That would, hands down, be the worst defensive frontcourt in the NBA. By far. Now a significant reason why this franchise has been irrelvant for most of the past 50 years is its rather sick refusal to address the defensive side of the ball. But this one...this one is just too damn obvious for anybody who watched those guys play last year. Just has to be a plan to get at least one defensive payer involved in the mix there, or we make the Raptors look like a serious contender.

Here was the no brainer remark:

Originally Posted by LWP777
Why did the Cavs want to trade him? Just seems weird to trade a young, athletic big who started tearing it up the last part of the season.

That is a good question, and perhaps as close to a red flag as you're going to get on a deal that is this much of a no-brainer. They are rebuilding too.

this was my last on the substance of the trade:

Well got these quotes at least from this article:

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/201...tml?xid=si_nba

"This is a chance to acquire a young player that has already proven himself to a pretty decent level in the league and someone who can strengthen our roster," Kings GM Geoff Petrie said, adding he had trade talks with the Cavs before and during the draft. "There is still a lot of upside there. A lot of the players taken in the draft a week ago are not that much younger than J.J. and he has had three years in the league and he was getting more productive each year."
Kings coach Paul Westphal is excited about the Hickson-Cousins-Thompson trio.

"He is a really good fit," Westphal said. "All three of those players can play a little bit (of) center and power forward. It gives us a very solid rotation. (Hickson) has shown versatility and ability to fit in. I don't think that you necessarily have to run every play for him to have him be effective. But at the same time, he can be effective if you run plays for him. Which on that last one there is a hint there of calling Cousins/Hickson/JT the rotation."

Which if true has talent, and also has Westphal unemployed in 12 months after the Maloofs latest brainiac brainstorm that hey, defense matters too, and its time for us to swing our childish enthusiasm over to that side of the ball again and fire another coach for front office decisions.