A least there is progress this year, slowly but progress
- Thread starter CruzDude
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Yeah, I'm sure my opinion will rub a few people the wrong way but I don't care. Not in the slightest. I have been a Kings fan for 26 years now, ever since I was 5, and for 80% of that time they sucked balls and yet here I am. And I can see the direction this team is headed and even though there isn't instant gratification (which is what everyone seems to want, and while I agree it would be nice to have it is just not feasible) I can see the big picture and know that 'this too shall pass'.
That's why I'm amazed that people want to fire Westphal at this point. If they did, they'd only replace him with a low rent coach who'd be as bad or worse than Westphal. this team has been trying to solve things with coaching for 5 years now. You'd think at some point, folks would realise...IT'S NOT THE COACH THAT'S THE PROBLEM!!! Lol
WestFail is a major part of the problem. Yes Theus and Muss would be better choices at this point. They failed because they tried to put structure on a vet team who resisted. Westfail would have been a better coach for those teams with his laid back attitude. This team needs structure and discipline more than anything. Last year set the franchise back with Westfail coddling Evans.
I still say the team screwed up by hiring Muss and moving away from Elston Turner. Then they made an even bigger one not hiring Brooks after Muss. Bad decisons on the coach has continued to set the team back. Westfail was the cheap option and it shows.
I still say the team screwed up by hiring Muss and moving away from Elston Turner. Then they made an even bigger one not hiring Brooks after Muss. Bad decisons on the coach has continued to set the team back. Westfail was the cheap option and it shows.
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A bit negative? Are you kidding me? Thats about all that comes out of your mouth. You seldom find anything to say soomething good about. You claimed on another thread that you were one of three real kings fans. Hopefully your were being sarcastic. I've been with the Kings from day one and I don't need you or anyone to question my loyality to the team. Do you think that I, or Cruzdude or any of us that are tying to look at the positiive side, like the losing? Don't you think were in just as much pain with each loss as you claim to be.. Do you really think that your enlightening us with your posts.
I've been watching NBA and college basketball for over 50 years. I doubt that there's anything you can tell me about basketball that I don't know. I know when a team is playing badly. I know when they stink. I don't need you or anyone else on this fourm to enlighten me on the poor play. As matter of fact, the last thing I need sometimes, is to listen to a bunch of negative posters pontificate on every stinking bad thing they can think of, and pretend they have special insights that the rest of us don't have. Who the hell do you think your preaching to?
Do you think Petrie is listening in? That he's going to become enthralled with your vision of the Kings? I mean just what is your purpose. To just ***** about everything? What the hell does that help. The only people that enjoy it are your fellow bitchers. I love talking about the things that are wrong. What needs to change in order for the team to become a contender. But the discussion has to based in some sort of reality for me, or its just pointless. We can agree or disagree on anything, but please give me solid arguments other than the whole team is just crap, and there's no hope because Petire is crap and the Maloof's are crap.
I know I'm exaggerating a little. But after a while all this negativism gets tiresome. And make no mistake, being critical of the team or the coach, or a particular player isn't necessarily being negative. I've done my share of being critical of Westphal. But I give my reasons for being critical. And I'm sure there are many that disagree with me. And thats alright. But with some of you guys, the whole sky is falling. How do you have an intelligent conversation about how to stop the sky from falling?
Four years ago, maybe less. Almost everyone on this fourm was screaming for the team to stop using its mid level exception year after year, and to start the rebuild. Stop trying to recapture the glories of the past, and clean out the house. Get rid of all the big salaries that weren't leading us anywhere and get under the cap so when the time presented itself, we would have the money to make a significant move. To rebuild through the draft. At least start there. I and many others warned at the time that it would require patience. That it would get worse before it got better.
The problem with rebuilding through the draft is that it takes time. There aren't any quick fixes, unless you luck out and get a couple of your important pieces in the same year, the way the Thunder did with Durant and Green. Then it might move a little faster. Especially if one of them turns out to be a superstar, a status that Durant is approaching rapidly.
My point is, that this is what I expected. I expected us to have brainless moments on the court. I expected last minutes losses because of mistakes. Maybe I didn't expect it to be quite this bad, but I'm not shocked by it. And if you are, then you just have yourself to blame for having too high of expectations. Because this is what a rebuild looks like. Its no accident that almost all the bottome dwellers are mostly young teams without experience. Now those are the facts! You can howl at the moon all your want, but its not going to change anything. Only time and reasonable additions to the team will. If you don't have the patience for that, then I have nothing for you other than go find another team to root for. But I hope you don't do that.
I've said this before, so sorry if it bores you. But we have a saying in the Marine Corps. Its used on people we really trust. " I'll share my foxhole with you anytime". I'll tell you this. The last person I want in my foxhole with me is someone thats yelling "Were all going to die".
I've been watching NBA and college basketball for over 50 years. I doubt that there's anything you can tell me about basketball that I don't know. I know when a team is playing badly. I know when they stink. I don't need you or anyone else on this fourm to enlighten me on the poor play. As matter of fact, the last thing I need sometimes, is to listen to a bunch of negative posters pontificate on every stinking bad thing they can think of, and pretend they have special insights that the rest of us don't have. Who the hell do you think your preaching to?
Do you think Petrie is listening in? That he's going to become enthralled with your vision of the Kings? I mean just what is your purpose. To just ***** about everything? What the hell does that help. The only people that enjoy it are your fellow bitchers. I love talking about the things that are wrong. What needs to change in order for the team to become a contender. But the discussion has to based in some sort of reality for me, or its just pointless. We can agree or disagree on anything, but please give me solid arguments other than the whole team is just crap, and there's no hope because Petire is crap and the Maloof's are crap.
I know I'm exaggerating a little. But after a while all this negativism gets tiresome. And make no mistake, being critical of the team or the coach, or a particular player isn't necessarily being negative. I've done my share of being critical of Westphal. But I give my reasons for being critical. And I'm sure there are many that disagree with me. And thats alright. But with some of you guys, the whole sky is falling. How do you have an intelligent conversation about how to stop the sky from falling?
Four years ago, maybe less. Almost everyone on this fourm was screaming for the team to stop using its mid level exception year after year, and to start the rebuild. Stop trying to recapture the glories of the past, and clean out the house. Get rid of all the big salaries that weren't leading us anywhere and get under the cap so when the time presented itself, we would have the money to make a significant move. To rebuild through the draft. At least start there. I and many others warned at the time that it would require patience. That it would get worse before it got better.
The problem with rebuilding through the draft is that it takes time. There aren't any quick fixes, unless you luck out and get a couple of your important pieces in the same year, the way the Thunder did with Durant and Green. Then it might move a little faster. Especially if one of them turns out to be a superstar, a status that Durant is approaching rapidly.
My point is, that this is what I expected. I expected us to have brainless moments on the court. I expected last minutes losses because of mistakes. Maybe I didn't expect it to be quite this bad, but I'm not shocked by it. And if you are, then you just have yourself to blame for having too high of expectations. Because this is what a rebuild looks like. Its no accident that almost all the bottome dwellers are mostly young teams without experience. Now those are the facts! You can howl at the moon all your want, but its not going to change anything. Only time and reasonable additions to the team will. If you don't have the patience for that, then I have nothing for you other than go find another team to root for. But I hope you don't do that.
I've said this before, so sorry if it bores you. But we have a saying in the Marine Corps. Its used on people we really trust. " I'll share my foxhole with you anytime". I'll tell you this. The last person I want in my foxhole with me is someone thats yelling "Were all going to die".
I'm not buying it. The more I watch this team, the less I think Westphal is the problem. There isn't a coach on the planet that could win with this roster. Realistically, they probably have the least talented overall roster in the NBA, or at least in the bottom 5. What is Westphal, or any other coach going to do with that? Lose a butt load of games, that's what.
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I'm really tired of beating this horse, but at least for me, its not about another coach coming in and taking us to the playoffs, its about overall imporvement of the team. As I already said, you and I will just have to agree to disagree. But in football, if a team keeps making the same mistakes over and over again, the coach gets the blame. Its the coaches job to teach and get results. Good coaches pay attention to the smallest details. When its just a player, or even two players that are screwing up, then you deal with those two players. But when the entire team takes turns miaking mistakes, that falls on the coach. I mean, just what is the job of a coach? Its to teach and get the best out of his players. If the whole class fails. You blame the teacher, because the entire class isn't stupid.
Having said that, I don't think firing Westphal will change anything significantly. It might give us something else to talk about, but were not going to the playoffs. I do think that Ellie has a better smile though.
Having said that, I don't think firing Westphal will change anything significantly. It might give us something else to talk about, but were not going to the playoffs. I do think that Ellie has a better smile though.
You see regression, I see injury. Tyreke isn't healthy. We need a healthy Evans to make this train go. How did the Heat look when DWade was hurt? Pretty f'in bad.
If you look at the list of potential free agents, it's pretty grim. The draft will be the way to go. Slow and steady will put us in a good place for the long term.
If you look at the list of potential free agents, it's pretty grim. The draft will be the way to go. Slow and steady will put us in a good place for the long term.
If this team was bad all the time, I'd look to the coach as a possible problem. But this team isn't bad all the time. They generally play about 30 to 40 minutes of good basketball per game where guys look in sync, are running plays, etc. It's when the pressure rises and it's time to close out a game that they fail. That says one of two things to me, either they're just mentally weak and crack under pressure, or they just don't have enough talent to compete in crunch time when other teams turn things up a notch.
Neither of those would be problem that a coach can do anything about. If they’re just cracking under pressure because they’re mentally weak as a group, there isn’t a whole lot you can do. You can’t teach/coach mental toughness. It’s either something you have or you don’t.
If it’s not having enough talent to complete once games intensify, that isn’t a coaching problem either. Add some talent, preferably experienced talent, and all of a sudden Westphal will look a whole lot better.
Talk about developing players all you want, there’s only so much you can do with a team full of mediocre vets and young guys who outside of Evans and Cousins, are pretty unspectacular.
Neither of those would be problem that a coach can do anything about. If they’re just cracking under pressure because they’re mentally weak as a group, there isn’t a whole lot you can do. You can’t teach/coach mental toughness. It’s either something you have or you don’t.
If it’s not having enough talent to complete once games intensify, that isn’t a coaching problem either. Add some talent, preferably experienced talent, and all of a sudden Westphal will look a whole lot better.
Talk about developing players all you want, there’s only so much you can do with a team full of mediocre vets and young guys who outside of Evans and Cousins, are pretty unspectacular.
It seems like you don't put any value in the coach's job. Let, just for the sake of argument, assume that you are right and Westphal is not the problem, meaning he has no negative impact on the team. But can you point to any area in which Westphal has a visibly positive impact on the team? Anything?
If you don't think the coach can do anything to help the team, why bother having a coach and shedding $2mil into his salary then? Wouldn't that money be better spent going to charity or something?
If you don't think the coach can do anything to help the team, why bother having a coach and shedding $2mil into his salary then? Wouldn't that money be better spent going to charity or something?
I agree, but the more I see of the rest of the team, the more I'm convinced that they don't have adequate role players. The only one who has been good on a consistent basis is Beno. Everyone else, in all honestly, is probably in the bottom ten percentile of NBA talent. think a lot of people, myself included, talked themselves into believing that Casspi, Greene, Thompson, Landry, and Garcia were whole lot better than they really are.
It breaks downs like this. Every single player on the team other than Evans and Cousins is a guy who would make a great 6th, 7th, 8th, or 9th option. They’re trying to make some of those guys 3rd, 4th, and 5th options but they just aren’t that good.
A bench of Greene, Beno, Thompson, Landry, Garcia, Casspi would be pretty nice. But when you’re trying to make those guys your starters and your goal is to be a good team, you’re in trouble.
It breaks downs like this. Every single player on the team other than Evans and Cousins is a guy who would make a great 6th, 7th, 8th, or 9th option. They’re trying to make some of those guys 3rd, 4th, and 5th options but they just aren’t that good.
A bench of Greene, Beno, Thompson, Landry, Garcia, Casspi would be pretty nice. But when you’re trying to make those guys your starters and your goal is to be a good team, you’re in trouble.
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Well I'm pretty sure the rules require them to have a coach. Plus it's necessary to keep up appearances. beyond that though, yeah, I'd say if they aren't going to bring the talent up a reasonable NBA level, then they might as well not even have a coach. Think of a coach as a carpenter. You wouldn't give a carpenter shoddy materials and cheap tools and expect him to build a good house. So why would you give a coach shoddy players with cheap contracts and expect him to build a good team? I know that's not a perfect analogy, but I think it makes the point.
Okay, maybe bottom ten percentile was an exaggeration, but... I've watched the rest of the league enough to know that no one on this team is even top 10 in the league at their position. No one. Name any Kings player and I'll name you 10 players who are better at their position, without even trying. If things pan out, Evans and Cousins could be top 10 at their positions in the future but no one on the rest of the team is even close.
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