Tyreke Evans ROTY & 20/5/5 Watch
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Link to that dbag's comments? Jennings just seems like a jerk all the way around. He's so bitter about his horrible shooting percentage and his crappy 2nd half of the season he's acting like a jerk to anyone and everyone, any of you see him talking trash to KG in the tunnel after they beat the Celtics the other day? Now he's saying the Kings and Warriors suck. Yeah Jennings, your team would too if you played against the WC.
Jennings is a punk and not the type of guy you want to have on your team when things start going bad. He will definitely be the source of problems and some major friction on whatever teams he plays for in the coming years.
However I am actually happy that Jennings talked trash to KG because nobody deserves it more than KG.
Kevin Garnett is the biggest phony in the league. He is a fake tough-guy who constantly bullies and takes cheap shots on point guards. Any time anybody near his size fights back he runs away and looks for people to "hold me back".
KG is always running his mouth about how much heart he has but yet he spends most of his time bullying small 2nd-tier guards and he's also afraid of taking big shots in the 4th quarter (he lets Pierce do it for him)
Guys that truly have heart don't have to always going around telling everybody about it.....their game speaks for itself. So while Jennings is without question a punk....it was nice to see him stick it to KG.
However I am actually happy that Jennings talked trash to KG because nobody deserves it more than KG.
Kevin Garnett is the biggest phony in the league. He is a fake tough-guy who constantly bullies and takes cheap shots on point guards. Any time anybody near his size fights back he runs away and looks for people to "hold me back".
KG is always running his mouth about how much heart he has but yet he spends most of his time bullying small 2nd-tier guards and he's also afraid of taking big shots in the 4th quarter (he lets Pierce do it for him)
Guys that truly have heart don't have to always going around telling everybody about it.....their game speaks for itself. So while Jennings is without question a punk....it was nice to see him stick it to KG.
ESPN about Curry
"However, it's worth noting that his team's fast pace helps him out tremendously in two other area in which he has made a huge impact, steals and assists. He'd be a great source of steals and assists on any team, but not quite at the level he is at now."
ESPN about Evans
"Most observers believed there would be some sort of transition period for Evans, but in watching Kings games, it has become abundantly clear that Evans is just really good at scoring. He is not, however, so great at the other things one might want to see a point guard do well. His assist rate is comparable to that of players such as Nate Robinson and Allen Iverson, so he doesn't appear to be the pure distributor, a quality that many seek in a point guard. He's a great rebounder from the guard spot, but that statistic is easy to make up elsewhere"
So let me get this straight... while the author recognizes how Curry's stats are inflated by the team he is on he still calls him a "great source of rebounds and assists". However when talking about Evans he only says his assist rates are "comparable to that of Nate Robinson and Allen Iverson" even though Curry and Evans are both equal in the ast column...
I should note that the author is talking about fantasy rankings but its still a good example of some ridiculous bias that is floating around against Evans.
The author also said this about Evans
"it seems pretty clear that at some point the Kings will have to shift him over to shooting guard if they're going to encourage any sort of team success. As a result, his assists will drop off a bit, and he won't be quite the all-around player he's been to this point."
So your saying we should move him to the SG because he wont be the "all-around" player he is as a PG and some how that makes us better as a team? That makes sense...
"However, it's worth noting that his team's fast pace helps him out tremendously in two other area in which he has made a huge impact, steals and assists. He'd be a great source of steals and assists on any team, but not quite at the level he is at now."
ESPN about Evans
"Most observers believed there would be some sort of transition period for Evans, but in watching Kings games, it has become abundantly clear that Evans is just really good at scoring. He is not, however, so great at the other things one might want to see a point guard do well. His assist rate is comparable to that of players such as Nate Robinson and Allen Iverson, so he doesn't appear to be the pure distributor, a quality that many seek in a point guard. He's a great rebounder from the guard spot, but that statistic is easy to make up elsewhere"
So let me get this straight... while the author recognizes how Curry's stats are inflated by the team he is on he still calls him a "great source of rebounds and assists". However when talking about Evans he only says his assist rates are "comparable to that of Nate Robinson and Allen Iverson" even though Curry and Evans are both equal in the ast column...
I should note that the author is talking about fantasy rankings but its still a good example of some ridiculous bias that is floating around against Evans.
The author also said this about Evans
"it seems pretty clear that at some point the Kings will have to shift him over to shooting guard if they're going to encourage any sort of team success. As a result, his assists will drop off a bit, and he won't be quite the all-around player he's been to this point."
So your saying we should move him to the SG because he wont be the "all-around" player he is as a PG and some how that makes us better as a team? That makes sense...
It's funny how Kings fans and Warrior fans alike get so defensive about their prospective rookies and attempt to discredit what the other team's rookie does.
From listening to the radio shows and reading this board, I'm sensing a lot of insecurity on the part of Kings fans in that they try to unfairly discredit Stephen Curry and somehow feel that Tyreke is getting slighted (when clearly he is not)
Sometimes I wonder if some Kings fans ever bother to actually watch other teams play (except for when they play the Kings of course). Whether Kings fans like it or not, Steph Curry is going to be a great player.
Will Steph Curry be rookie of the year? Nope.
Will Steph Curry be better than Tyreke? Probably not
I'd put the odds at 70-30 that Tyreke Evans turns out to be the better player of the two......but I think they are both going to be great players (albeit different types of players).
Clearly Tyreke is the better of the two at getting to the basket and finishing near the basket. Tyreke is a special player in that regard. Curry is better than people think and way better than a lot of people thought off the dribble, but he is no where near Tyreke and that's mainly due to the fact that Tyreke is a complete freak-of-nature in that department and almost un-guardable.
You only need one hand to count the number of players in the league that are better at getting to the basket than Tyreke and that is scary for opposing teams in the future considering he is a rookie, 20 years old, and still doesn't have a reliable jump shot (which means teams sag off right now).
Tyreke is also the better defender right now and will continue to be in the future in large part to his strength and great anticipation on the defensive end. Steph Curry is again a lot better defender than people thought he would be and also has great anticipation but he just doesn't have the size or strength to ever be an elite defender like Tyreke will be.
Tyreke will also continue to be the better rebounder due to his size, strength, and toughness (willingness to mix it up to grab a board)
There are two areas where Steph Curry is better than Tyreke right now and he will continue to be in the future.
One is obvious in outside shooting. While I expect Tyreke to improve and probably become a good (hopefully great) shooter with time....he will never be Steph Curry in terms of shooting touch or range. I don't think anybody would argue this.
The other area where Steph Curry is better and I believe will continue to be better in the future is PASSING. A lot of Kings fans don't want to admit this but Stephen Curry is the better passer. He has better court vision than Tyreke, he makes better passes, and most importantly he is more willing to pass the ball. If you watch several Warriors games it's pretty obvious that Stephen Curry is actually a gifted passer. Often times it's not even so much the number of assists that he gets but just some of the incredible passes he makes that only true point guards with great vision can make. I think Curry surprised everybody in that regard in that he has true point guard passing ability. Again watch the games and you will see for yourself.
Now I know people are thinking......"but Swaze Curry and Tyreke have the same assist numbers". That's only partially true and there is a lot more to it than that.
Over his last 20 Games Steph Curry is averaging:
41.2 Minutes
20.2 pts
7.3 Assists
1.6 steals
First of all so much for the notion that he plays 48 Minutes every night. While he has played 5 games of 48 minutes during that stretch of games....he has also had several games in the 30 mpg range.
You have to remember during the first few months of the season, Steph Curry was not receiving heavy or consistent minutes and more importantly Monta Ellis was the primary ball handled.
Over the last 20+ games, Curry has become the primary ball handler and sure enough his assists have risen accordingly to the 7+ during that time frame.
While it is true that Curry plays in a uptempo Don Nelson offense.....it's also equally important that during the last 20 games, 3/5 of Golden State's starting lineup has been composed of NBA D-League Players.
To average 7+ assists when the majority of the guys you are passing to are D-Leaguers is very impressive. No team has been hit harder by injuries than Golden State and I have to believe that if you gave Steph Curry legitimate NBA talent in that starting lineup he'd be averaging around 9 assists since he became the primary ball handler.
So the real numbers indicate that Curry is the better passer and like I said before if you watch a game it's pretty obvious that Curry is a much better passer than Tyreke Evans.
I actually think the biggest question with Evans is going to be his passing ability and thus ability to make teammates better. It's pretty much a given that Tyreke will develop a solid jumper.....almost all of the great ones do and he works too hard for him not to become at least a pretty good shooter.
Passing is different though. While his assist numbers will increase, the big question is how much and more importantly will it increase in key moments of the game. You can only learn passing to an extent. A lot of it is instinctual and you either have it or you don't. You're pretty much born with "court vision" and the ability to see/feel players come open ahead of time or without actually looking at them.
Lebron has always had that gift and it was talked about when he came into the league. The same goes to a slightly lesser extent with Dwayne Wade. Jordan always had it and Phil always knew he did, it just took a while to get him to trust his teammates.
The question with Tyreke is does he have better court vision in terms of passing than he is letting on? Hopefully the answer is yes and then it's just a matter of getting him to use it and trust his teammates.
From listening to the radio shows and reading this board, I'm sensing a lot of insecurity on the part of Kings fans in that they try to unfairly discredit Stephen Curry and somehow feel that Tyreke is getting slighted (when clearly he is not)
Sometimes I wonder if some Kings fans ever bother to actually watch other teams play (except for when they play the Kings of course). Whether Kings fans like it or not, Steph Curry is going to be a great player.
Will Steph Curry be rookie of the year? Nope.
Will Steph Curry be better than Tyreke? Probably not
I'd put the odds at 70-30 that Tyreke Evans turns out to be the better player of the two......but I think they are both going to be great players (albeit different types of players).
Clearly Tyreke is the better of the two at getting to the basket and finishing near the basket. Tyreke is a special player in that regard. Curry is better than people think and way better than a lot of people thought off the dribble, but he is no where near Tyreke and that's mainly due to the fact that Tyreke is a complete freak-of-nature in that department and almost un-guardable.
You only need one hand to count the number of players in the league that are better at getting to the basket than Tyreke and that is scary for opposing teams in the future considering he is a rookie, 20 years old, and still doesn't have a reliable jump shot (which means teams sag off right now).
Tyreke is also the better defender right now and will continue to be in the future in large part to his strength and great anticipation on the defensive end. Steph Curry is again a lot better defender than people thought he would be and also has great anticipation but he just doesn't have the size or strength to ever be an elite defender like Tyreke will be.
Tyreke will also continue to be the better rebounder due to his size, strength, and toughness (willingness to mix it up to grab a board)
There are two areas where Steph Curry is better than Tyreke right now and he will continue to be in the future.
One is obvious in outside shooting. While I expect Tyreke to improve and probably become a good (hopefully great) shooter with time....he will never be Steph Curry in terms of shooting touch or range. I don't think anybody would argue this.
The other area where Steph Curry is better and I believe will continue to be better in the future is PASSING. A lot of Kings fans don't want to admit this but Stephen Curry is the better passer. He has better court vision than Tyreke, he makes better passes, and most importantly he is more willing to pass the ball. If you watch several Warriors games it's pretty obvious that Stephen Curry is actually a gifted passer. Often times it's not even so much the number of assists that he gets but just some of the incredible passes he makes that only true point guards with great vision can make. I think Curry surprised everybody in that regard in that he has true point guard passing ability. Again watch the games and you will see for yourself.
Now I know people are thinking......"but Swaze Curry and Tyreke have the same assist numbers". That's only partially true and there is a lot more to it than that.
Over his last 20 Games Steph Curry is averaging:
41.2 Minutes
20.2 pts
7.3 Assists
1.6 steals
First of all so much for the notion that he plays 48 Minutes every night. While he has played 5 games of 48 minutes during that stretch of games....he has also had several games in the 30 mpg range.
You have to remember during the first few months of the season, Steph Curry was not receiving heavy or consistent minutes and more importantly Monta Ellis was the primary ball handled.
Over the last 20+ games, Curry has become the primary ball handler and sure enough his assists have risen accordingly to the 7+ during that time frame.
While it is true that Curry plays in a uptempo Don Nelson offense.....it's also equally important that during the last 20 games, 3/5 of Golden State's starting lineup has been composed of NBA D-League Players.
To average 7+ assists when the majority of the guys you are passing to are D-Leaguers is very impressive. No team has been hit harder by injuries than Golden State and I have to believe that if you gave Steph Curry legitimate NBA talent in that starting lineup he'd be averaging around 9 assists since he became the primary ball handler.
So the real numbers indicate that Curry is the better passer and like I said before if you watch a game it's pretty obvious that Curry is a much better passer than Tyreke Evans.
I actually think the biggest question with Evans is going to be his passing ability and thus ability to make teammates better. It's pretty much a given that Tyreke will develop a solid jumper.....almost all of the great ones do and he works too hard for him not to become at least a pretty good shooter.
Passing is different though. While his assist numbers will increase, the big question is how much and more importantly will it increase in key moments of the game. You can only learn passing to an extent. A lot of it is instinctual and you either have it or you don't. You're pretty much born with "court vision" and the ability to see/feel players come open ahead of time or without actually looking at them.
Lebron has always had that gift and it was talked about when he came into the league. The same goes to a slightly lesser extent with Dwayne Wade. Jordan always had it and Phil always knew he did, it just took a while to get him to trust his teammates.
The question with Tyreke is does he have better court vision in terms of passing than he is letting on? Hopefully the answer is yes and then it's just a matter of getting him to use it and trust his teammates.
Considering that Reke just got a triple double and has had assist numbers that have been steadily increasing, I think the answer is yes.
I find it kind of funny how two "combo guards" (Reke and Curry[People considered Curry a sg/pg hybrid akin good ole Monta in the days leading up to the draft if memory serves me correct]) have both gotten triple doubles whereas the other hyped pg (Jennings) hasn't.
I find it kind of funny how two "combo guards" (Reke and Curry[People considered Curry a sg/pg hybrid akin good ole Monta in the days leading up to the draft if memory serves me correct]) have both gotten triple doubles whereas the other hyped pg (Jennings) hasn't.
In the last 20 games BTW Reke's assists averaged are 6.8. In a normally paced non run n gun system, starting half the games alongside a fellow PG.
As an aside, Ast/48:
Lawson 7.4
Flynn 7.3
Curry 7.2
Evans 7.1
Holiday 6.9
And I thought this draft was deep in PGs. Turns out the whole damn crew is a bunch of SGs.
As an aside, Ast/48:
Lawson 7.4
Flynn 7.3
Curry 7.2
Evans 7.1
Holiday 6.9
And I thought this draft was deep in PGs. Turns out the whole damn crew is a bunch of SGs.
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I never discredited what Curry does and can do. I never said he can't be great or he isn't putting up great numbers. All I said was that Reke is the better player RIGHT NOW and despite the last 2 or 3 months Reke has still put up the better numbers. Jennings had 1 or 2 months of ridiculous numbers too... now everyone see's that he's fallen off the ROY map. It doesn't mean he won't be good later on but for now no one disagrees that Tyreke is better. Its the same situation with Curry but Curry decided to catch on fire towards the end of the season as opposed to the beginning like Jennings. Tyreke has been consistently kick *** since the beginning.
As far as the insecurity goes... its not from us having doubt in Tyrekes abilities over Currys. Our insecurity comes from the fact that were Kings fans and have a history of being screwed and dissapointed... If Tyreke were to get robbed of ROY I probably wouldn't even be surprised.
As far as the insecurity goes... its not from us having doubt in Tyrekes abilities over Currys. Our insecurity comes from the fact that were Kings fans and have a history of being screwed and dissapointed... If Tyreke were to get robbed of ROY I probably wouldn't even be surprised.
In the last 20 games BTW Reke's assists averaged are 6.8. In a normally paced non run n gun system, starting half the games alongside a fellow PG.
As an aside, Ast/48:
Lawson 7.4
Flynn 7.3
Curry 7.2
Evans 7.1
Holiday 6.9
And I thought this draft was deep in PGs. Turns out the whole damn crew is a bunch of SGs.
As an aside, Ast/48:
Lawson 7.4
Flynn 7.3
Curry 7.2
Evans 7.1
Holiday 6.9
And I thought this draft was deep in PGs. Turns out the whole damn crew is a bunch of SGs.
that's insane. i guess we picked the right draft to need a pg.
http://nbaplaybook.com/2010/03/11/howd-he-do-that-tyreke-evans-triple-double/
Thought this was interesting.
Thought this was interesting.
Grant and Jerry both pointed out during the game broadcast, that the 9th assist was not really a legit one. However, as the article also points out, a lot of stats recorded for a lot of players have been questionable. Most think Collison's supposed 20-assist game was more like a legitimate 16-assist game.
So, if every team does this to some extent, then Evans is being treated the same as others and his triple-double may be just as legitimate as most triple-doubles.
Or maybe they counted it as a 1/2 assist and just rounded it up to a whole number.
So, if every team does this to some extent, then Evans is being treated the same as others and his triple-double may be just as legitimate as most triple-doubles.
Or maybe they counted it as a 1/2 assist and just rounded it up to a whole number.
Hmmm, his average comes out to be 4.95, so they rounded up. I guess if it averages 4.95 or higher, they automatically round up to 5. So I guess we can officially say Reke is averaging at least 20-5-5 a game; 20.5 points, 5.0 rebounds, and 5.5 assists
Here's a fun fact:
- Oscar Robertson played 3,012 minutes in 71 games = 42.4 minutes a game
- Michael Jordan played 3,144 minutes in 82 games = 38.3 minutes a game
- LeBron James played 3,190 minutes in 79 games = 39.5 minutes a game
Reke right now has only played 2,231 minutes in 60 games. If he continues this pace, he'll become the rookie to average at least 20-5-5 with the least amount played a game - 37.2 minutes.
Note: Be aware Reke's averages aren't as high as the other played though; Big O averaged 30.5-10.1-9.7 - still baffles me.
Here's a fun fact:
- Oscar Robertson played 3,012 minutes in 71 games = 42.4 minutes a game
- Michael Jordan played 3,144 minutes in 82 games = 38.3 minutes a game
- LeBron James played 3,190 minutes in 79 games = 39.5 minutes a game
Reke right now has only played 2,231 minutes in 60 games. If he continues this pace, he'll become the rookie to average at least 20-5-5 with the least amount played a game - 37.2 minutes.
Note: Be aware Reke's averages aren't as high as the other played though; Big O averaged 30.5-10.1-9.7 - still baffles me.
I agree. And really what's happened is the collpase of his shakiest aspect -- the jumper. Started with the FT woes, and abruptly expanded so that now he basically has no jumper. Not just a shaky one. But no jumper at all. No feel, no touch. There's 10 guys down at the park right now with a better shot. So he's losiing a couple points a night off the missed FTs. Now he's losing maybe 2-3 jumpers a night he would have gotten. AND teams are figuring this out and have gotten even more incredibly packed in in the middle against his drives. I guess the positive might be that this just about seals a complete reconstruction of that mess this summer. But in the short term it is emerging as a threat. Will help thought once we quit our tour of the best defensive teams int he NBA. OKC and Portland twice each in the space of 10 days will overexpose just about anybody's weaknesses.