Who should we get with the MLE?

[CaminoChaos]

http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/news/story?page=2008freeagents

The 2008 free-agent crop could be loaded. Here's how the list looks as of April 17.
Key: ETO = Early Termination Option; P = Player Option; T = Team Option; '07 QO's = BOLD
Atlanta Hawks
Restricted: Josh Childress, Jeremy Richardson, Josh Smith, Salim Stoudamire, Mario West
Unrestricted: None
Limited Salary Protection: None
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Boston Celtics
Restricted: Tony Allen
Unrestricted: P.J. Brown, Sam Cassell, Eddie House, Scot Pollard, James Posey (P)
Limited Salary Protection: Leon Powe
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Charlotte Bobcats
Restricted: Jermareo Davidson (T), Ryan Hollins, Emeka Okafor
Unrestricted: Derek Anderson, Earl Boykins, Othella Harrington (T)
Limited Salary Protection: None
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Chicago Bulls
Restricted: Luol Deng, Demetris Nichols, Ben Gordon
Unrestricted: Shannon Brown, Chris Duhon
Limited Salary Protection: JamesOn Curry
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Cleveland Cavaliers
Restricted: Daniel Gibson, Dwayne Jones, Delonte West
Unrestricted: Devin Brown
Limited Salary Protection: Lance Allred, Billy Thomas
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Dallas Mavericks
Restricted: Jose Juan Barea
Unrestricted: Malik Allen, Devean George, Eddie Jones (P), Juwan Howard, Tyronn Lue, Jamaal Magloire, Antoine Wright
Limited Salary Protection: Brandon Bass
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Denver Nuggets
Restricted: Yakhouba Diawara, J.R. Smith
Unrestricted: Anthony Carter, Allen Iverson (ETO), Eduardo Najera
Limited Salary Protection: Bobby Jones, Taurean Green
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Detroit Pistons
Restricted: Alex Acker, Walter Herrmann
Unrestricted: Juan Dixon, Jarvis Hayes, Lindsey Hunter, Theo Ratliff
Limited Salary Protection: None
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Golden State Warriors
Restricted: Kelenna Azubuike (P), Andris Biedrins, Monta Ellis, C.J. Watson
Unrestricted: Matt Barnes, Austin Croshere, Baron Davis (ETO), Patrick O'Bryant, Mickael Pietrus
Limited Salary Protection: None
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Houston Rockets
Restricted: Carl Landry, Steve Novak (T)
Unrestricted: Steve Francis (P), Dikembe Mutombo
Limited Salary Protection: Mike Harris, Loren Woods
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Indiana Pacers
Restricted: Stephen Graham (T), David Harrison, Andre Owens
Unrestricted: Flip Murray, Jermaine O'Neal (ETO), Kareem Rush
Limited Salary Protection: None
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Los Angeles Clippers
Restricted: Paul Davis, Nick Fazekas, Shaun Livingston, Marcus Williams
Unrestricted: Elton Brand (ETO), Dan Dickau, Corey Maggette (ETO), Smush Parker, Quinton Ross
Limited Salary Protection: Josh Powell
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Los Angeles Lakers
Restricted: DJ Mbenga, Ronny Turiaf, Sasha Vujacic
Unrestricted: Trevor Ariza (P), Chris Mihm (P), Ira Newble
Limited Salary Protection: Coby Karl
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Memphis Grizzlies
Restricted: Andre Brown, Juan Carlos Navarro
Unrestricted: Kwame Brown, Casey Jacobsen
Limited Salary Protection: Aaron McKie
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Miami Heat
Restricted: Blake Ahearn, Chris Quinn, Kasib Powell, Dorell Wright
Unrestricted: Earl Barron, Ricky Davis, Shawn Marion (ETO), Alonzo Mourning, Jason Williams
Limited Salary Protection: Joel Anthony, Alexander Johnson, Stephane Lasme
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Milwaukee Bucks
Restricted: Ersan Ilyasova, Awvee Storey (T)
Unrestricted: Royal Ivey, Michael Ruffin, Jake Voskuhl
Limited Salary Protection: Ramon Sessions
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Minnesota Timberwolves
Restricted: Ryan Gomes, Craig Smith, Chris Richard, Kirk Snyder, Sebastian Telfair
Unrestricted: Michael Doleac
Limited Salary Protection: None
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
New Jersey Nets
Restricted: Nenad Krstic
Unrestricted: Darrell Armstrong, DeSagana Diop, Bostjan Nachbar, Stromile Swift (P)
Limited Salary Protection: Keith Van Horn
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
New Orleans Hornets
Restricted: None
Unrestricted: Chris Andersen, Ryan Bowen, Melvin Ely (P), Jannero Pargo (P), Bonzi Wells
Limited Salary Protection: None
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
New York Knicks
Restricted: Randolph Morris
Unrestricted: Fred Jones, Stephon Marbury (ETO)
Limited Salary Protection: None
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Orlando Magic
Restricted: James Augustine
Unrestricted: Carlos Arroyo, Keith Bogans (P), Keyon Dooling, Maurice Evans, Adonal Foyle (P), Pat Garrity
Limited Salary Protection: Marcin Gortat
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Philadelphia 76ers
Restricted: Louis Amundson, Herbert Hill, Andre Iguodala, Shavlik Randolph, Louis Williams
Unrestricted: Calvin Booth (P), Kevin Ollie
Limited Salary Protection: None
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Phoenix Suns
Restricted: None
Unrestricted: Gordan Giricek, Grant Hill (P), Linton Johnson, Sean Marks, Eric Piatkowski, Brian Skinner
Limited Salary Protection: D.J. Strawberry
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Portland Trail Blazers
Restricted: Von Wafer
Unrestricted: James Jones (P), Raef LaFrentz (ETO)
Limited Salary Protection: None
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Sacramento Kings
Restricted: None
Unrestricted: Ron Artest (ETO), Kenny Thomas (ETO), Beno Udrih, Anthony Johnson, Lorenzen Wright
Limited Salary Protection: None
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
San Antonio Spurs
Restricted: None
Unrestricted: Brent Barry (P), Michael Finley, Robert Horry, DerMarr Johnson, Damon Stoudamire, Kurt Thomas, Jacque Vaughn (P)
Limited Salary Protection: None
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Seattle SuperSonics
Restricted: Mickael Gelabale, Robert Swift
Unrestricted: Ronald Dupree, Francisco Elson
Limited Salary Protection: Adrian Griffin
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Toronto Raptors
Restricted: Jose Calderon, Carlos Delfino
Unrestricted: Primoz Brezec, Rasho Nesterovic (P)
Limited Salary Protection: Jamario Moon
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Utah Jazz
Restricted: C.J. Miles, Paul Millsap (T)
Unrestricted: Jason Hart (P)
Limited Salary Protection: None
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Washington Wizards
Restricted: None
Unrestricted: Gilbert Arenas (ETO), Antawn Jamison, Roger Mason
Limited Salary Protection: None

 

[fnordius]

I'd imagine we'll get Beno.

 

[kennadog]

I'd imagine we'll get Beno.

Bingo!

 

[CaminoChaos]

I'm not sure that Beno is worth the full MLE. I would think he could be gotten for less.

Another thing. I thought if a player resigns with a team it does not go against the MLE. I could be wrong.

 

[Vlade4GM]

Nobody, unless it's only a two year deal.

 

[hrdboild]

Jamario Moon! That's the only player I would throw the MLE at. I'm a big Moon fan. I don't even care that we already have a billion SFs, this is Jamario (Ninja Kick!!!) Moon we're talking about. He can play PF. If that doesn't work out, I'd make an offer to Carl Landry, but I suspect Houston will match. Maybe Keyon Dooling as a backup PG, especially if we lose Beno. I wouldn't give Beno the full MLE. He's earned a new contract, but not the full MLE.

 

[kennadog]

I'm not sure that Beno is worth the full MLE. I would think he could be gotten for less.

Another thing. I thought if a player resigns with a team it does not go against the MLE. I could be wrong.

It appears that a team can use the "non-bird" exception to re-sign it's own free-agent for up to 120% of his previous salary, even if they have no cap room. To give him more than that we'd have to use some or all of the MLE. I think that's right? CAn anyone confirm?

I don't think Beno will sign for 120% of his current salary (as I recall it's pretty low), so using the MLE or part of it is the only way we will be able to sign him, if we have no cap room. Isn't most of our cap room going to be eaten up by Martin's new contract?

http://members.cox.net/lmcoon/salarycap.htm#30

(Trying to decipher the mysteries of the CBA gives me a headache.)

 

[fnordius]

I really like Moon too, although at 6'8" and barely 200 pounds, I don't think he'd match up well with most PFs. Then again, he might still do better than Mikki... but then Mikki's contract would become an albatross like KT's... and we'd totally suck with no PG.

Chalk me up as in favor of the idea only if we have a massive roster shakeup this summer. Otherwise, no way. We're too close to an all SG/SF team already.

 

[creAtivetfh]

throw the MLE at Elton Brand

 

[fnordius]

It appears that a team can use the "non-bird" exception to re-sign it's own free-agent for up to 120% of his previous salary, even if they have no cap room. To give him more than that we'd have to use some or all of the MLE. I think that's right? CAn anyone confirm?

I don't think Beno will sign for 120% of his current salary (as I recall it's pretty low), so using the MLE or part of it is the only way we will be able to sign him, if we have no cap room. Isn't most of our cap room going to be eaten up by Martin's new contract?

http://members.cox.net/lmcoon/salarycap.htm#30

(Trying to decipher the mysteries of the CBA gives me a headache.)

Pretty much every cent of our cap room is going to pay Kevin, yes. And Beno is working for chicken feed ($761K), so I agree that he won't take 120%, or even close. I think that your reading of the CBA is correct, although I couldn't swear to it.

I think we might have the bi-annual exception available to us this year, although that's only $1.9M, and every exception we use forestalls our digging ourselves out of the payroll mess.

Unless the bi-annual exception is available, and Beno feels like $1.9M is enough, then I don't think we're going to be able to pick up anything more than him and a couple of dirt cheap benchwarmers. I really cannot see us going all next year with no PG.

 

[Vlade4GM]

What do you guys think about going after Ramon Sessions?

 

[Gary]

huh? Says on Hoopshype he is signed through 09.. $700k next season..

I am not sure we can sign him unless that info is wrong.. Although hoopshype isn't always correct.. Isn't he signed though?

 

[Gary]

Jamario Moon! That's the only player I would throw the MLE at. I'm a big Moon fan. I don't even care that we already have a billion SFs, this is Jamario (Ninja Kick!!!) Moon we're talking about. He can play PF. If that doesn't work out, I'd make an offer to Carl Landry, but I suspect Houston will match. Maybe Keyon Dooling as a backup PG, especially if we lose Beno. I wouldn't give Beno the full MLE. He's earned a new contract, but not the full MLE.

Not moon.. Wouldn't be able to match up with any PFs in the west. We already have a Moon like stats man in Moore, and Moore can guard bigger PFs more easily than Moon can.

 

[Arby's Roast Beef]

I know everyone loves to pick on Milwaukee, but they'd be foolish not to keep onto Ramon Sessions--a rookie who gets double digit assists out of nowhere despite being near the end of the season, plus a 20-20 game no less--that's definitely worthy of keeping. And btw, he only has a limited salary protection, so I don't know how we're supposed to get him? Probably not possible anyways.

Same goes for Moon--Toronto's infatuation with the unsung hero and/or international player probably makes him keep-worthy. They probably see him as the Tayshaun Prince w/out the jumpshot for their team. I think Calderon could be possible, though--if somehow the deal with Udrih doesn't work out, the glut of Calderon-Ford will force the Raps to move one of them, most likely Calderon because he's a free agent anyway. For PG, Chris Duhon would not be a bad choice either--unheralded defensive player, underrated passer, improving but forever streaky shooter--but hey, that's an upgrade over Anthony Johnson.

I like several bruisers on that list--Craig Smith and Leon Powe. Both are of the same ilk, and although I doubt we can get Powe because he's a key cog of a championship team, Smith looks feasible. Not a shotblocker, but gifted offensive player, dishes out the dirty work, but unnoticed playing bench minutes on a bad team. The real big men we covet with athleticism and shotblocking are probably of the DeSagana Diop and Chris Andersen mold, and we probably would take a look at them.

 

[Vlade4GM]

huh? Says on Hoopshype he is signed through 09.. $700k next season..

I am not sure we can sign him unless that info is wrong.. Although hoopshype isn't always correct.. Isn't he signed though?

Hmm..Maybe, I just kind of assumed he was on a 1 year deal. Nevermind then.

 

[Gary]

If Ramon Sessions was that good then what about Fazekas? Why not try to lure him from the Clips this offseason with a 1mil deal?

 

[AriesMar27]

i guess it would depned most on what happens with beno, artest and our draft pick... but im all for letting beno walk, trade salmons and morrt to tor for tj ford, trading artest to any team that will take him, trading hawes and williams to the bulls for ty thomas and fillers then drafting deandre jordan.... with part of the mle sign jr smith and not use the rest on gerald green... we'd still suck but we would be way more athletic and fun to watch... with that line up martin would be our least athletic starter...

 

[hrdboild]

Same goes for Moon--Toronto's infatuation with the unsung hero and/or international player probably makes him keep-worthy. They probably see him as the Tayshaun Prince w/out the jumpshot for their team. I think Calderon could be possible, though--if somehow the deal with Udrih doesn't work out, the glut of Calderon-Ford will force the Raps to move one of them, most likely Calderon because he's a free agent anyway. For PG, Chris Duhon would not be a bad choice either--unheralded defensive player, underrated passer, improving but forever streaky shooter--but hey, that's an upgrade over Anthony Johnson.

The real big men we covet with athleticism and shotblocking are probably of the DeSagana Diop and Chris Andersen mold, and we probably would take a look at them.

Apparently Moon signed a two-year contract? I was under the impression he was a free agent. I would think Toronto wants to keep him, but if he is a free agent there's nothing wrong with offering him a deal. I was half kidding when I said he could play PF. But regardless of where he plays, he gives us something we're not getting anywhere else on the roster -- rebounding, shot blocking, weak-side help, unreal athleticism, entertaining basketball -- so we'd find a spot for him.

I don't think there's much point bringing in a veteran point guard to play backup. Anthony Johnson is only here this year as an expiring contract. I only advocate Keyon Dooling as a possible signing because he's a great defensive player and maybe having him play for a few years in Sacramento would help to change the culture here. He could be a good example for whoever we bring in as a young PG.

God no, not Chris Anderson. Oh, and if Tyrus Thomas is even a remote possibility, do it! I think he's going to be really good.

 

[BMiller52]

I'm pretty sure Moon's a free agent.

 

[bajaden]

throw the MLE at Elton Brand

I suspect he would throw it back...

 

[bajaden]

i guess it would depned most on what happens with beno, artest and our draft pick... but im all for letting beno walk, trade salmons and morrt to tor for tj ford, trading artest to any team that will take him, trading hawes and williams to the bulls for ty thomas and fillers then drafting deandre jordan.... with part of the mle sign jr smith and not use the rest on gerald green... we'd still suck but we would be way more athletic and fun to watch... with that line up martin would be our least athletic starter...

No Comment.................

 

[AriesMar27]

No Comment.................

its that good huh?

 

[bajaden]

A guy I might take a flyer on, only if its on the cheap is Patrick O'Bryant. He's really never had a chance at GS. Give him a mil a year for 2 yrs with the second year being the team option. He could be a back up to Hawes down the road..

 

[LPKingsFan]

Pretty sure we don't have Beno's Bird rights, so we'd have to use some/all of the MLE to resign him. I wouldn't offer him more than the MLE anyway, and I don't want Geoff to sign any more middling free agents, so I guess it works out, now, doesn't it.

 

[ParniValjak]

Beno!

 

[Warhawk]

Pretty sure we don't have Beno's Bird rights, so we'd have to use some/all of the MLE to resign him. I wouldn't offer him more than the MLE anyway, and I don't want Geoff to sign any more middling free agents, so I guess it works out, now, doesn't it.

I think this is correct.

 

[CruzDude]

Yep, I see the MLE going to Beno, in whole or part. And Kevin does not eat up all of the cap space. The Kings drop $11M this summer with the 3 guys from ATL (Lue, Anthony and Wright) leaving some cap space.

I think Kings have their core, now they need the additional pieces to get to the next level. Beno/Kevin in backcourt, Brad, RonRon and a PF to be named later in the front court plus Cisco off the bench.

Don't forget the geriatric crowd at San Antonio are do for a downer, the Suns could implode if they don't go far in the playoffs, the Mavs may implode just on general principals (if Avery and Cuban don't kill each other first!!), the Nuggets are... well the nuggets. Next year you'll see the Kings and Blazers step up into those spaces.

 

[fnordius]

And Kevin does not eat up all of the cap space. The Kings drop $11M this summer with the 3 guys from ATL (Lue, Anthony and Wright) leaving some cap space.

Cap space breakdown:

Kevin's pay goes from $1.8M to around $9M: -$7.2M
Atlanta oldsters leave: +$9.6M (Lue $3.5M, AJ $2.86M, Wright $3.24M)
Raises due to players under contract: -$4.2M
Expiring contracts of Beno, 3Will, Danhtay and Orien Greene: less than +$2.4M, depending on how much of those were guaranteed.
Net: somewhere between -$1.75M and +0.65M

So if we're going to gain even one undrafted rookie's worth of cap space, it's going to have to come from the NBA's raising the cap.

EDIT: silly me, I forgot the paychecks for a first round and two second round picks. That's $1.6M just for the first rounder. Forget about being under cap at all. :-(

 

[bajaden]

Cap space breakdown:

Kevin's pay goes from $1.8M to around $9M: -$7.2M
Atlanta oldsters leave: +$9.6M (Lue $3.5M, AJ $2.86M, Wright $3.24M)
Raises due to players under contract: -$4.2M
Expiring contracts of Beno, 3Will, Danhtay and Orien Greene: less than +$2.4M, depending on how much of those were guaranteed.
Net: somewhere between -$1.75M and +0.65M

So if we're going to gain even one undrafted rookie's worth of cap space, it's going to have to come from the NBA's raising the cap.

EDIT: silly me, I forgot the paychecks for a first round and two second round picks. That's $1.6M just for the first rounder. Forget about being under cap at all. :-(

I think your right. I know I figured it out a few weeks ago and came up with similar figures. The cap will go up some, but not enough to make a difference. Now if Ron opts out, that changes things. I still think we'll be stuck until after the 2010 season.

 

[ovrush]

no vets! no more Mikki Moores. We are a losing team so we wont get any starts with the MLE. If you can get a young talented guy who just didnt fit in his last spot go for it, if not don't throw away the money, cap space, and pt for young guys.