Kobe
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And, for the record, there were some pretty amazing shots during that game. He made some that shouldn't be able to be accomplished without smoke and mirrors. I don't care for the public persona of Kobe Bryant but his talent is unmistakeable.
I agree with Doc. You have to show respect when greatness is happening in front of you...
I agree with Doc. You have to show respect when greatness is happening in front of you...
Absolutely right
Trent Dilfer is the quarterback that future generations will remember as the great one compared to a pathetic Dan Marino.
Colts wouldnt have won the championship unless Adam Vineterri signed with them and it didnt matter if peyton manning played any kind of game and put up all kinds of numbers.
Duncan cant win unless he tags along with David or goliath (tony parker)
Michael Jordan sucks cos he couldnt even take a team to the playoffs without Scottie Pippen, whereas Scottie after Michael reached playoffs, conference finals and again playoffs. Michael in fact was the reason why the wizards didnt win the ring, else with the talent level of Rip they would have easily won as Rip proved later on that he is the one taking a team to the championship.
Udonis haslem is a better PF than malone as he won a championship with a worser supporting cast than Malone.
Lamar Odom and Kwame brown would be legitimate all star players and will be winning championships every year if not for kobe.
Trent Dilfer is the quarterback that future generations will remember as the great one compared to a pathetic Dan Marino.
Colts wouldnt have won the championship unless Adam Vineterri signed with them and it didnt matter if peyton manning played any kind of game and put up all kinds of numbers.
Duncan cant win unless he tags along with David or goliath (tony parker)
Michael Jordan sucks cos he couldnt even take a team to the playoffs without Scottie Pippen, whereas Scottie after Michael reached playoffs, conference finals and again playoffs. Michael in fact was the reason why the wizards didnt win the ring, else with the talent level of Rip they would have easily won as Rip proved later on that he is the one taking a team to the championship.
Udonis haslem is a better PF than malone as he won a championship with a worser supporting cast than Malone.
Lamar Odom and Kwame brown would be legitimate all star players and will be winning championships every year if not for kobe.
You act like it's been year after year that they've been bounced in the first round. It's only been one year.
I'm not a Laker fan, and I don't care to see them do well, but I don't think Kobe's legacy is riding on one year of losing to the #1 seed in the first round of the playoffs - in seven games, no less.
I'm not a Laker fan, and I don't care to see them do well, but I don't think Kobe's legacy is riding on one year of losing to the #1 seed in the first round of the playoffs - in seven games, no less.
Oh, more than one year. Missed the playoffs, then a first round bump, and now will be another first round bump. Definitely a question that will remain until/unless he has any real success on his own. But it still doesn't take away from this achievement. Just leaves it in question if its not more like Iverson scoring 40+ in 8 straight or whatever that was back around 2000. Do other players get better for being aroudn him? Or worse?
In any case, if he wants to be the second player (to Wilt) to go ahead and average 50, the question is mostly moot.
In any case, if he wants to be the second player (to Wilt) to go ahead and average 50, the question is mostly moot.
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Thank you.
He is a great scorer but is he a great player? We don't know yet. He's a very good player but the great ones make others around them better.
Gilbert Arenas is taking Caron Butler and Antawn Jamison to 50ish wins or something like that and probably the 2nd round or even WCF. Kobe couldn't even take Butler and Odom(who is better than Jamison) to the playoffs. Arenas' team has had just as many injuries(or close) to the amount that Kobe's team in 05 had and he's doing a lot better.
Last year he lost in the 1st round. His supporting cast isn't that bad. Are they great? Nope but they're not as bad as they're made out to be either. Odom was getting 20/10 in the playoffs last year. Kwame was playing decently. Walton is a good role player. He has Phil Jackson as a coach. And other teammates of his played better than they should last year, but in the last 3 games he stopped making his teammates better and started shooting a bunch and they get blown out. 35 shots in game 6? 16 shots or whatever in the 1st half and then he quits? Come on guys that is not being a team player. People are going to try to put him up there with Wilt and MJ now but either of those guys could've taken his team past Phoenix last year. Heck Nash could've done it too.
And now this year his team's record is mediocre(barely above .500) while his supporting cast is better(although they've been more injured) and they're probably not going to get out of the 2nd round, especially not if they play Phoenix. So yeah he's a great scorer but he's not a great player. Everyone knows Shaq was the guy on those championship teams. Everyone knows Shaq made Kobe's job a lot easier. So here Shaq goes and wins another title even though he's in the twilight of his career while Kobe doesn't get out of the 1st round.
It's obvious who the greater player is.
He is a great scorer but is he a great player? We don't know yet. He's a very good player but the great ones make others around them better.
Gilbert Arenas is taking Caron Butler and Antawn Jamison to 50ish wins or something like that and probably the 2nd round or even WCF. Kobe couldn't even take Butler and Odom(who is better than Jamison) to the playoffs. Arenas' team has had just as many injuries(or close) to the amount that Kobe's team in 05 had and he's doing a lot better.
Last year he lost in the 1st round. His supporting cast isn't that bad. Are they great? Nope but they're not as bad as they're made out to be either. Odom was getting 20/10 in the playoffs last year. Kwame was playing decently. Walton is a good role player. He has Phil Jackson as a coach. And other teammates of his played better than they should last year, but in the last 3 games he stopped making his teammates better and started shooting a bunch and they get blown out. 35 shots in game 6? 16 shots or whatever in the 1st half and then he quits? Come on guys that is not being a team player. People are going to try to put him up there with Wilt and MJ now but either of those guys could've taken his team past Phoenix last year. Heck Nash could've done it too.
And now this year his team's record is mediocre(barely above .500) while his supporting cast is better(although they've been more injured) and they're probably not going to get out of the 2nd round, especially not if they play Phoenix. So yeah he's a great scorer but he's not a great player. Everyone knows Shaq was the guy on those championship teams. Everyone knows Shaq made Kobe's job a lot easier. So here Shaq goes and wins another title even though he's in the twilight of his career while Kobe doesn't get out of the 1st round.
It's obvious who the greater player is.
I had a long reply typed up but my internet disconnected and it didn't go through.
I'm just saying his supporting cast isn't as terrible as advertised. Right now he's being talked about like he's as good as Wilt or Jordan and he hasn't even proven he can lead a team to the 2nd round of the playoffs. TMac would've loved Odom who is a 17/9/5 guy when he was in Orlando. TMac would've loved having Phil Jackson in Orlando. He had neither, threw up the same type of PPG averages, carried that team on his back to 44-45 wins per season(what Kobe is doing right now), and you don't see people mentioning him as some type of all time great. Yeah Kobe is a great scorer but he isn't proving he is an all time great player. He is one of the most explosive scorers. But he's not some type of all time great. Jordan, Wilt, Kareem, Bird, Magic, etc. could easily get that team into the 2nd round of the playoffs.
Great post BM
I dont understand why many people call Jerry sloan a great coach, all he has done was ride the coattails of malone and stockton through all those years and still couldnt win a ring. He has got Fisher now with those three rings and that team is doing good and can make some splash in the playoffs.
Agent Zero is the best the east can offer now and i dont know why people are not even considering him for the mvp race, cmon they are only talking about nash and dirk and if at all it gets to the next person its kobe. How pathetic for all these sportswriters and announcers and experts are all idiots that they are not able to understand that simple point. Zero has made butler and jamison a lot better and is carrying that team to 50 wins. Thats a huge turnaround from when he was with jamison earlier and couldnt even sniff playoffs with the warriors.
With Phil, do you have a position yet (are you saying that Phil is great, or will you come back in another topic and say that any coach can win with that team the bulls had or the lakers had ) Once you are decided on that we will talk about phil.
I cannot agree about MJ, what has he won without scottie. He couldnt even take a team to the playoffs without scottie carrying the team. That talented wizards team could have easily made the finals with rip and stackhouse and he just brought that team down. Whereas scottie onthe other hand took the rockets to the playoffs which only had washed up players like barkley and hakeem. He took that blazers team to the WCF where they lost to the eventual champions in 7 games. That team was filled with no names such as rasheed wallace, sabonis, damon etc. The way he taught rasheed is what made him an eventual champion
Absolutely Shaq is the reason why they won the ring last year, too bad they didnt give him the finals mvp. That team was shown up this year with shaq out of the line up and the finals mvp couldnt even get that team to .500.
By the way would love to hear your take on DWade, cos I think you would also agree with me about how over hyped he is and he was just riding shaqs coattails last year in the playoffs.
Interestingly one place where i would really like to tap into your wisdom is that this guy is a waste but still all players in the league keep referring to him as the best in the world now.
All these sports experts I dont know why they keep telling that his supporting cast is weak, when they clearly have lamar odom and walton who are superstars. Its not like he has made no names and no talents such as josh howard, jason terry and dampier play at a high level and maintain the best record, whose sixth man once had the scoring title for the year.
I dont know why all these guys and coaches say that playing the lakers in the playoffs would be dangerous.
I think I vaguely remember that TMac before orlando had one player on his team who then was referred as the next MJ, I think his name was vince or carter something. I dont think that team went anywhere either.
For some reason Tmac came in and the rockets miss the playoffs, I am sure that is because of yao, van gundy and all the other mis fits in the team.
Lets see what they do this year.
Thats a pretty good list you have, but please take MJ of that list, cos he showed that he couldnt even take a team to the playoffs with that super cast he had in DC. That supporting cast that MJ had was much better than what kobe has today, Stackhouse had 21.5 ppg. Rip was only worth 20 ppg
Some people say that malone is a great player, but I agree with you that he is junk, he couldnt even win a ring with Shaq, Kobe and phil.
For some reason Tmac came in and the rockets miss the playoffs, I am sure that is because of yao, van gundy and all the other mis fits in the team.
Lets see what they do this year.
Thats a pretty good list you have, but please take MJ of that list, cos he showed that he couldnt even take a team to the playoffs with that super cast he had in DC. That supporting cast that MJ had was much better than what kobe has today, Stackhouse had 21.5 ppg. Rip was only worth 20 ppg
Some people say that malone is a great player, but I agree with you that he is junk, he couldnt even win a ring with Shaq, Kobe and phil.