Post game thoughts 12/7

[SacTownKid]

It is going to seem that I'm trying to pick on you but I'm really not; this is going to be a bit of a rant about what I've been seeing the past few weeks/months. Artest isn't going anywhere. And Miller probably isn't either. And Bibby will most likely be a King for the rest of the season. Shotblockers don't grow on trees, point guards can't be picked out of the ground and superstars aren't grown with magic beans. There is not a magic basketball field from which to pick or barter high level NBA players. Please stop.

Actually they almost do. While I don't know the reasons so I can't justify, nor discredit the decision, we signed a fairly good one in Loren Woods but let him go after playing a grand total of 500 seconds in the preseason. I watched the replay of the Cavs-Raptors game where Lebron scored 56 the other day on NBATV, and I must say, we could have used some of that! Loren was doing a good job of protecting the rim just with his presence.

The beauty of it is I think all the Kings need is a body that will protect the rim. Don't need a guy that can put up 20 and 10 every night, in fact, the way this team is built personnel wise that 20 may even be a problem for the other players who want shots. We need a guy that will show some resistance at the hoop.

 

[Mr. S£im Citrus]

On one positive note. We are still fairly competative right now when you consider Ron Artest is playing the worst ball of his career...

Ron Artest is not playing the worst basketball of his career. Hell, he's playing better now than he was last season after we traded for him: More points, more rebounds, more steals and more blocks, while shooting a better percentage from the field, and committing fewer turnovers and fewer fouls.

... Mike Bibby is playing the worst ball of his career...

Maybe in terms of decision making... maybe. But not statistically; statistically, this isn't even his worst season as a King.

... If these guys simply put up their career averages we could be a scary good team!

If the games were played on paper, the US Mens Basketball team would have won the Olympics.

 

[thatguy]

Okay, Loren Woods is the answer. Silly me. Justin Williams anyone? How about Manute Bol? Or Mark Eaton? Or Billy Joe Bob the Freakishly Tall Hillbilly?

 

[DaMan]

Okay, I guess I'll just say you are wrong.

Skill wise, since webber has left he shown nothing that would say he was more then a secondary player. He has been very inconstenist, not good defender, not a good leader, can't get teammates involved, and has not shown his clutchness for awhile now.

 

[Mr. S£im Citrus]

Actually they almost do. While I don't know the reasons so I can't justify, nor discredit the decision, we signed a fairly good one in Loren Woods but let him go after playing a grand total of 500 seconds in the preseason. I watched the replay of the Cavs-Raptors game where Lebron scored 56 the other day on NBATV, and I must say, we could have used some of that! Loren was doing a good job of protecting the rim just with his presence.

He did such a good job that James scored 12/24 on two-point field goals, and Drew Gooden scored on 10/16.

Yup... defintely gotsta get some more of that!

 

[Bricklayer]

Or Billy Joe Bob the Freakishly Tall Hillbilly?

How's his jumper?

 

[thatguy]

Skill wise, since webber has left he shown nothing that would say he was more then a secondary player. He has been very inconstenist, not good defender, not a good leader, can't get teammates involved, and has not shown his clutchness for awhile now.

Wow. We see things differently.

 

[SacTownKid]

Ron Artest is not playing the worst basketball of his career. Hell, he's playing better now than he was last season after we traded for him: More points, more rebounds, more steals and more blocks, while shooting a better percentage from the field, and committing fewer turnovers and fewer fouls.

Maybe in terms of decision making... maybe. But not statistically; statistically, this isn't even his worst season as a King.

If the games were played on paper, the US Mens Basketball team would have won the Olympics.

Well, while I am sure Bibby, Artest, and Miller have played worse in their careers, I don't remember them all doing just about that ALL AT THE SAME TIME!!!

And I don't know what stats you are looking at but their shooting is really killing us. Ron is shooting 39% and 23% from three. Not good when he has taken 52 in 13 games thusfar. Mike Bibby is shooting 35% and 25% from 3, which is his main weapon. Brad is shooting 31% and 10% from 3. This is from one of the most efficient jumpshooters in the league most of the time. That would pretty much sink any team in the league.

 

[thatguy]

How's his jumper?

Better than Vitaly's. Which is saying he could possibly hit the broadside of a barn with luck.

 

[SacTownKid]

He did such a good job that James scored 12/24 on two-point field goals, and Drew Gooden scored on 10/16.

Yup... defintely gotsta get some more of that!

You can't deny the positives he showed while he was in. If a team out shoots you thats going to happen. I didn't notice a consistent layup line when he was in. On the other hand, I pretty much notice that on a nightly basis with these Kings.

 

[twocents]

Indeed, he's Pippen.

And which is why fo course the threads over int eh Personnel sectiojn about Martin/Miller or Martin/Bibby for KG. KG/Artest = defensive forward pairing for the ages. Of course unless Kevin figures this out pretty quick thoughts along those lines may have to be scuttled.

artest is not pippen; pippen was a great player. maybe defensively they are on the same level, but artest's offense is nowhere near pippen's. anyway, maybe i am missing sarcasm here; late for you, early for me.

as for kg/artest; how long "they" would last, i wonder? kg is 30, is he not?

your last sentence, even though i tried hard to decipher, is still beyond my comrehension which kevin?

 

[thatguy]

your last sentence, even though i tried hard to decipher, is still beyond my comrehension which kevin?

McHale.

 

[Mr. S£im Citrus]

Well, while I am sure Bibby, Artest, and Miller have played worse in their careers, I don't remember them all doing just about that ALL AT THE SAME TIME!!!

Well, this is the first time all three of them started a season together, so how would you know? Were you really tracking Artest and Miller's numbers when they were in Chicago and Bibby was in Vancouver?

And I don't know what stats you are looking at but their shooting is really killing us. Ron is shooting 39% and 23% from three. Not good when he has taken 52 in 13 games thusfar. Mike Bibby is shooting 35% and 25% from 3, which is his main weapon. Brad is shooting 31% and 10% from 3. This is from one of the most efficient jumpshooters in the league most of the time. That would pretty much sink any team in the league.

Our problems are worse than a lack of scoring.

 

[Bricklayer]

artest is not pippen; pippen was a great player. maybe defensively they are on the same level, but artest's offense is nowhere near pippen's. anyway, maybe i am missing sarcasm here; late for you, early for me.

as for kg/artest; how long "they" would last, i wonder? kg is 30, is he not?

your last sentence, even though i tried hard to decipher, is still beyond my comrehension which kevin?

Martin -- a few more weeks of this and his trade value will sink like a stone as teams begin thinking he was a flash in the pan. We need him to recover to help our own team, but certainly if you were going to dangle him to get KG you also pretty much need him to be wearing his cape.

As an aside -- Ron/KG 3-4 years. Long enough to take a couple of real good shots at it. Refill the stands, be all over national TV, and have some memorable May showdowns again, no matter which way they turn out.

 

[thatguy]

Our problems are worse than a lack of scoring.

The problems are greater, but the lack of scoring should be the main concern with this team.

 

[thatguy]

Martin -- a few more weeks of this and his trade value will sink like a stone as teams begin thinking he was a flash in the pan. We need him to recover to help our own team, but certainly if you were going to dangle him to get KG you also pretty much need him to be wearing his cape.

I called that one wrong.

 

[Bricklayer]

I called that one wrong.

Well rereading it McHale works too. That guy has been an incompetent boob as a GM, why can;t he jsut do it once for us?

 

[thatguy]

Well rereading it McHale works too. That guy has been an incompetent boob as a GM, why can;t he jsut do it once for us?

No kidding. One can only hope for a Joe Smith moment.

 

[LPKingsFan]

As an aside -- Ron/KG 3-4 years. Long enough to take a couple of real good shots at it. Refill the stands, be all over national TV, and have some memorable May showdowns again, no matter which way they turn out.

...get momentum going for another arena push...

 

[SacTownKid]

Well, this is the first time all three of them started a season together, so how would you know? Were you really tracking Artest and Miller's numbers when they were in Chicago and Bibby was in Vancouver?

Our problems are worse than a lack of scoring.

Gimme a break! I know enough to know they can play much much better than this. Go to NBA.com and look up their career stats. There you will find your answer.

As for the scoring aspect. Of course they are not the only problem but first and foreskin people are complaining about winning and losing. If your main weapons shoot this poorly odds are not in your favor if you are trying to win.

Oh and BTW it's not really scoring that's always the problem. It's the effieciency in doing so.

 

[GoGoGadget]

Okay, Loren Woods is the answer. Silly me. Justin Williams anyone? How about Manute Bol? Or Mark Eaton? Or Billy Joe Bob the Freakishly Tall Hillbilly?

Tag retired.

 

[GoGoGadget]

Skill wise, since webber has left he shown nothing that would say he was more then a secondary player. He has been very inconstenist, not good defender, not a good leader, can't get teammates involved, and has not shown his clutchness for awhile now.

I disagree.

Consistency, and some iffy decision making (which I've always attributed to an often justified lack of trust in his teammates) have been legitimate issues with Mike's game in recent months. I'll grant that much.

However, I'd argue that post-Webber and pre-Artest, Mike was EASILY our best, most valuable, most reliable, most solid player and the only guy on the team who looked like he gave even one half of a damn about winning every night. Those are the qualities, I think, that have every bit as much to do with being the man as actual, statistical, provable talent. He's got 'em.

That being said, I don't think he wants to be the first option, and therefore wouldn't flourish in the role for any length of time, but I agree with thatguy that he does have the skills to do so.

 

[Mr. S£im Citrus]

Gimme a break! I know enough to know they can play much much better than this. Go to NBA.com and look up their career stats. There you will find your answer.

I did look up their stats... That's how I knew that they aren't playing the worst basketball of their careers.

As for the scoring aspect. Of course they are not the only problem but first and foreskin people are complaining about winning and losing. If your main weapons shoot this poorly odds are not in your favor if you are trying to win.

"First and foreskin?"

I get the distinct impression that more people have been complaining about the fact that we have no interior defense, and the fact that we have been getting outcoached than in simply winning and losing.

Oh and BTW it's not really scoring that's always the problem. It's the effieciency in doing so.

Defense is still the problem; good defensive teams find ways to win, even when the offense is not good. Too bad we're not a good defensive team...

 

[thatguy]

"First and foreskin?"

I got a pretty healthy chortle out of this...

 

[thatguy]

Tag retired.

I'm talking about his cousin.

 

[Cal-Kings]

I think a lot of us got too excited about K-Mart when he was playing so well in the beginning of the season... I agree K-Mart is another Hamilton at best.

I'd actually be very happy to have a Rip Hamilton on this team and I think Kevin could be better than Rip in time.

Kevin is still a kid with a lot to learn and I saw last night'ss game as a great experience for his future. He managed to get open, to create his shots against a good defense that was trying to stop him. He only stopped himself with his hesitation and "thinking too much".

He will learn from that and mature. I still expect great things from him.

For now, we need to be counting on Bibby, Artest, and Miller and so far, they've all been injured. If we can stabalize the starting line-up again and get some chemistry going, we won't stay this awful.

 

[nbrans]

I'd actually be very happy to have a Rip Hamilton on this team and I think Kevin could be better than Rip in time.

Kevin is still a kid with a lot to learn and I saw last night'ss game as a great experience for his future. He managed to get open, to create his shots against a good defense that was trying to stop him. He only stopped himself with his hesitation and "thinking too much".

He will learn from that and mature. I still expect great things from him.

For now, we need to be counting on Bibby, Artest, and Miller and so far, they've all been injured. If we can stabalize the starting line-up again and get some chemistry going, we won't stay this awful.

This stretch is very good for Kevin, and Musselman really needs to leave him out there even if he's struggling (which is why I'm still angry about the Clippers game -- anyone still think benching him was a good idea?). Getting better is a process of adjustments, and now he has to adjust to defenses focusing on him. The only way to get past that is by struggling, finding the things that work and pushing through. It may be ugly for a little while, but Kevin has always bounced back better than before, and I think we'll see that again. All this attention on him will make him better in the long run.

 

[Cal-Kings]

This stretch is very good for Kevin, and Musselman really needs to leave him out there even if he's struggling (which is why I'm still angry about the Clippers game -- anyone still think benching him was a good idea?). Getting better is a process of adjustments, and now he has to adjust to defenses focusing on him. The only way to get past that is by struggling, finding the things that work and pushing through. It may be ugly for a little while, but Kevin has always bounced back better than before, and I think we'll see that again. All this attention on him will make him better in the long run.

Exactly! Which is why Kevin's "learning experience" is something positive I took from that game last night.

 

[Burrito06]

I have to agree. You don't walk away from this one feeling good. In my book, this "almost win" was the worst loss so far...

Yeah it didn't feel good. I was at the game and had to deal with an idiot screaming at Muss for not calling a timeout on that last possession.

 

[reyes13]

Exactly! Which is why Kevin's "learning experience" is something positive I took from that game last night.

I hope so because he is reminding me of another one dimentional player we use to have. (#16) I like the kid, but the words out against him now.