Maloofs QUIT arena talks!!

#61
Cuz I like their music... The Nets have Jay Z...
that seems like silly logic to me. the deftones, counting crows, third eye blind, and u2 are among my favorite bands. i absolutely love their music...but i'm not dying for any of these guys to step in and own the basketball team i root for. i'd prefer they just continued to make the music i enjoy so much.

the nets may have jay-z (as a part owner), but that doesn't mean every hip hopper out there is a basketball expert.
 
#63
I do not understand why most of you see parking as a non-issue. Warhawk is dead on this one! I live in Truckee and have two young boys. I am not considering public transportation as an option. And I am just plain not going if it is $25 a pop.

Parking is a point in these negotiations that the Maloofs have decided (IMO) they can not lose. And I would imagine with good reason. For the Maloofs, as someone pointed out, this is a NBA franchise not a revitalization project. With the amount of $$$ that they would put on the line, parking seems like a good place to hold the line to me. Remember, walking away from the table and saying that the negotiations are over is a common negotiation tactic. Especially if the other side is being unreasonable.

I think the comments about the Maloof Monopoly downtown are a little premature. Truth is that we really only know what each side wants to use as propaganda - no more.

I still think building an arena without the Kings is a bluff. Although, would Stern allow 3 teams in LA? And stop bothering with the Vegas statements - Aneheim has made them a great offer with no gambling issues and that is where they will go if they leave Sacramento.
 
#64
Here's what I'm advocating -
At this point it really matters not if the Maloofs have plans to run. This town needs a new arena - period. The only way to get that is to vote yes on Q & R. If there is a change in mind as far as the Maloofs, then fine. If there are any other teams that think Sac is a great place for their franchise - you still need the new building beacuse that team will insist on it.
I hate George Shinn with a passion, but if New Orleans is a dead end like it appears to be and OKC just bought the Sonics... well it's an opening.
So the plan is to pass these measures anyway, get the process started for a new building. Offer the Maloofs a quit claim on the deed to Arco so that the new team has a place to play for a year or two. Move into the new building and sell off Arco to pay the 70 million debt. It's all so easy.
 
#65
more...

VOICES

"We want it there, we support it there, we think it's great for the city. But we're not going to go into an area that puts the franchise in jeopardy."

Joe Maloof, Sacramento Kings owner, on the downtown railyard site for a new arena
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"We respect the Maloofs and applaud all they have done, but this isn't their decision and it's not their arena. The community has decided that the railyards is where it's going to be and this committee is committed to moving mountains to make it happen."

Sandy Smoley, the former Sacramento County supervisor who is chairing the Yes on Q & R campaign
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"If we can't get clarification about the railyard plans, it will definitely impact our decision to be supportive. We need this to be on track because it's the best opportunity to see positive development for both sides, the arena and countywide. If it doesn't go forward, more than a sports and entertainment facility will be lost."

Michael Ault, executive director for the Downtown Sacramento Partnership
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"This is all a bit of a mystery to us as to why what we've already negotiated is suddenly in play. ... We're still supportive of these measures. That is, on the assumption that we can work through these issues quickly -- that stands."

John Thomas, Maloof Sports and Entertainment president, who said Wednesday the Maloofs still plan to contribute money to the Yes on Q & R campaign
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Measures Q & R's success Nov. 7 "doesn't hinge on the Maloofs' financial contribution or their participation, although we certainly do hope that they contribute."

Doug Elmets, Yes on Q & R campaign spokesman
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"All along we've said that this isn't just about basketball. The campaign and the negotiations need to be kept separate. We have seen in other communities that these negotiations can't be done in public."

Matt Mahood, chief executive officer, Sacramento Metropolitan Chamber of Commerce, and Q & R campaign co-chairman, who advocates that the ballot campaign press forward even if the Maloofs and city/county negotiators don't resolve differences
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"I believe this is worth moving foward with in any case. We have a need for an entertainment facility in this region of this size and quality. If the Kings are not a part of it, it is presumed that they are not part of our community. They made that pretty clear. If that happens, the most likely scenario is that Arco Arena would be demolished, leaving this region without an entertainment venue."

John Dangberg, Sacramento assistant city manager
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"If these guys don't get things straightened out and the team leaves, Sacramento will go from being one of the top NBA cities back to being like Fresno. The Kings are a major part of what the town has to offer. I need them."

Doug Dean, owner of Top Notch Limousine and Executive Service, who says 70 percent of his fleet's trips involve Arco Arena events, mostly Kings games
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- Jon Ortiz and Mary Lynne Vellinga, Bee staff writers

About the writer: The Bee's Mary Lynne Vellinga can be reached at (916) 321-1094 or mlvellinga@sacbee.com.

Believe me, YOU DON'T WANT THIS TO HAPPEN!!!! ;)
 
#66
Again, I never said MSE is right and the County is wrong, I'm just saying everyone is jumping on the anti-MSE bandwagon today on the basis of exactly what? Tough negotiations that both sides don't want to back down from? Accusations from both sides that sound a bit far-fetched?

You always ask for more than you need and back down a bit to get what's reasonable. It's happening on both sides. Doom and gloom isn't warranted yet.

As far as statements being percieved negatively - you are absolutely right. But it your perception, not the truth, that you are reacting to.

Truth is, nobody has a deal yet to develop the railyards. The deal is for funds, not a guaranteed project at that location. They are working on the aspects of the arena location in order to sign off on a project if the railyards site is ultimately available.

I also don't see why MSE would kick in $$$ for promoting the "pro" campaign if the side MSE is trying to help "win" is stabbing them in the back (essentially reducing agreed-upon parking revenues by over 50% ) behind closed doors and then bad-mouthing MSE in public. Again, this is a hypothetical, but that is all we have to go on right now....
Warhawk, you’ve made comments that only can be seen as pro MS&E, implying the city is, and has been at fault for things not getting done. You’ve brushed aside MS&E’s grievances as just them looking out for themselves, while not giving the city the same leeway. That is why I made the comment I did, and I’m not attacking you, so no offense.

And you're right; there is no deal outside of how to fund the project. So why are the Maloofs walking away from the negotiation table, effectively putting the funding measures in jeopardy.
 

Entity

Hall of Famer
#67
This whole situation feels like the Maloofs think we need them more than they need us and they dangle the Kings over our heads to remind us of it.

If they are so profit savvy they'd realize that taking the Kings from this AMAZING fan base is not the best idea.

It's nice to see the city taking a stand instead of taking it in the... well, you know.
They also know that they could sell out a Vegas arena every night as well. So therefore they will get EXACTLY what they want or we will not be in Sacramento much longer.
 

Warhawk

Give blood and save a life!
Staff member
#68
All of you near Sacramento might want to listen (and call in?) to Grant and Mike tomorrow from 5-6. Joe and Gavin will be on air and taking calls.
 
#69
I do think the NBA would approve Anaheim. They were talking about how the Clippers used to play 8 games a year in Anaheim and always sold out. Believe me, Orange County is a totally separate market from LA and humongous.

Everyone needs to remember that what was signed between the City/County and MSE was an intent to enter into an agreement that only outlined the major deal points, not the details. The voters were promised that there would be a detailed agreement so they could know all the facts of the deal before they vote.

We are running out of time. This deal has a max of two weeks to be signed. However, I am still in favor of Q & R. All along I've said that I think a new arena is good and important for Sacramento. With or without the MSE or the Kings, I believe that.

On the radio they were talking about how the Giants stadium in SF seats 40,000 and has 5,000 parking spaces and the parking lot is never full. As much as possible, its been the city's express desire for many years to reduce the number of people driving cars into downtown.

I do understand MSE to a degree. They've lost money 5 out of 8 years and, as a business, the Kings are hardly a cash cow. This is largely because of the small market and lack of a corporate base. Maybe the financing and the plan really does not work for the franchise. (Money on an NBA team is made out of the growth in value over time-equity.)

Losing the Kings/Monarchs will hurt me big time. But losing an entertainment venue to replace Arco would hurt even more.

Arena Skeptic: So pro sports are a money pit? Most of the things people spend there money on for entertainment are money pits. Anything that is not a "need" could be classified that way. And while I would agree that millions in donations by the Maloofs is overstating it, your $1 million is understating it. And because we have an NBA franchise here, its a lot more if you add in the donations from the NBA through the "Reading to Achieve Program." There are also may non-monetary charitable contributions from the Maloofs, players and the NBA/WNBA.

Sorry this is rambling all over. I'm exceedingly tired. :(
 

Warhawk

Give blood and save a life!
Staff member
#70
Warhawk, you’ve made comments that only can be seen as pro MS&E, implying the city is, and has been at fault for things not getting done. You’ve brushed aside MS&E’s grievances as just them looking out for themselves, while not giving the city the same leeway. That is why I made the comment I did, and I’m not attacking you, so no offense.

And you're right; there is no deal outside of how to fund the project. So why are the Maloofs walking away from the negotiation table, effectively putting the funding measures in jeopardy.
No offense taken at all. I'm playing devil's advocate more than anything with everyone else here lining up taking potshots at MSE! ;)

The arguements are all pretty one sided here today, especially with none of us in there listening to negotiations to know what's really going on. I thought there needed to be a little balance to the doom and gloom.

Do I want the city/county to bow down at the feet of MSE? No, but neither do I want MSE to be kissing pavement either. The truth is, both need to work together. Slashing parking arbitrarily is a very stupid move and guaranteed to frustrate MSE. Walking out of the talks won't do anyone any good either, and forging ahead with or without MSE as a partner is good, since we do need that facility here.
 
#72
Sacramento vs. Fresno

VOICES

"If these guys don't get things straightened out and the team leaves, Sacramento will go from being one of the top NBA cities back to being like Fresno. The Kings are a major part of what the town has to offer. I need them."

Doug Dean, owner of Top Notch Limousine and Executive Service, who says 70 percent of his fleet's trips involve Arco Arena events, mostly Kings games

Sorry dude, you're wrong. You lose the Kings, you don't go back to being like Fresno... you go a few notches below Fresno. Keep this in mind Sactown kid... We have Division 1 college athletics that has a nationally respected football team (that you aren't close to ever having), on top of Triple A baseball (which you have), a minor league hockey team (which you don't have), and a professional Arena Football team (something else you don't have).

Fresno also has a state of the art on-campus arena (Save Mart Center) that has hosted Madonna, Britney Spears, Aerosmith... almost every big name person in the music industry.

Someone get me this dude's number. He really pi$$ed me off.

Sacramento deserves everything we have here. As a former Sacramento resident, I PRAY the arena deal works out. You guys deserve the best pro sports has to offer. I'm still amazed that there isn't another pro sports franchise in SAC yet.
 
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VF21

Super Moderator Emeritus
SME
#73
I have been guilty of something I try very hard not to do, and that's to jump blindly off conclusion cliff.

There are two sides to every story. I'm feeling a little badly about my ranting and I'm going to wait and get "the rest of the story..." And I have a strong feeling (hint, hint, nudge, nudge) it will be forthcoming shortly.

Keep the faith, fellow Kings fans.
 

Warhawk

Give blood and save a life!
Staff member
#74
I have been guilty of something I try very hard not to do, and that's to jump blindly off conclusion cliff.

There are two sides to every story. I'm feeling a little badly about my ranting and I'm going to wait and get "the rest of the story..." And I have a strong feeling (hint, hint, nudge, nudge) it will be forthcoming shortly.

Keep the faith, fellow Kings fans.
So you are saying I might have been right all along? :D

A lone voice crying out in the wilderness? A rugged pioneer in the vast frontier? A Voyager leaving the solar system on a trek into the unknown? A...







OK, OK, I'll stop. Shhesh. ;)
 

VF21

Super Moderator Emeritus
SME
#75
A lone voice crying out in the wilderness? A rugged pioneer in the vast frontier? A Voyager leaving the solar system on a trek into the unknown? A...
Oh, saints preserve us. I'm hearing Star Trek music - from the ORIGINAL series.

If you start talking like Capt. James T. Kirk, I'm going to send my minions down from the forest to hunt you down and hurt you. (If you don't think it can be done, just keep in mind what they did to Karl Malone...*)























*obscure reference to a masterpiece of work posted some time ago by our own Bricklayer.

:p
 

Warhawk

Give blood and save a life!
Staff member
#77
Oh, saints preserve us. I'm hearing Star Trek music - from the ORIGINAL series.

If you start talking like Capt. James T. Kirk, I'm going to send my minions down from the forest to hunt you down and hurt you. (If you don't think it can be done, just keep in mind what they did to Karl Malone...*)























*obscure reference to a masterpiece of work posted some time ago by our own Bricklayer.

:p
Hey, don't mess with V'ger. :eek: :)



If you can dig up that Malone thing, let me know. I missed it.
 
#80
I have been guilty of something I try very hard not to do, and that's to jump blindly off conclusion cliff.

There are two sides to every story. I'm feeling a little badly about my ranting and I'm going to wait and get "the rest of the story..." And I have a strong feeling (hint, hint, nudge, nudge) it will be forthcoming shortly.

Keep the faith, fellow Kings fans.
I have felt the same way about myself today and I hope that I am proven a fool (its not hard to do). In our defense, however, it is a natural reaction to the brazen behavior the Maloofs have been exhibiting in the last 2 weeks.
 
#83
full story = Spin. This should not even be a discussion at this point by any sides. This plays into the ANTI-Arena crowds hand.

Again what I don't understand is why is this going on now? Wait until the vote... To me I perceive this as a side not wanting the vote to pass. Nobody has presented a logical explanation. This is politics 101 IMO and all stuff that can be handled after a yes vote.
 

VF21

Super Moderator Emeritus
SME
#84
full story = Spin. This should not even be a discussion at this point by any sides. This plays into the ANTI-Arena crowds hand.

Again what I don't understand is why is this going on now? Wait until the vote... To me I perceive this as a side not wanting the vote to pass. Nobody has presented a logical explanation. This is politics 101 IMO and all stuff that can be handled after a yes vote.
As I just said, perhaps you need to reserve judgment until you've heard the full story - and I don't mean spin. You're asking for a logical explanation. I strongly suggest you wait a few hours and see what develops.
 
#86
As I just said, perhaps you need to reserve judgment until you've heard the full story - and I don't mean spin. You're asking for a logical explanation. I strongly suggest you wait a few hours and see what develops.

Of course I am willing to do that.. But what about the damage that is already done. Thats what concerns me here
 
#87
So, the Kings had this Arena drama talk for nearly a year or so now they quit Arena talks? talk about being kicked to the curb. i'm just glad this whole thing is over with and we can focus on the team. however the Maloofs are losing my respect...
 
#89
.........................


Also... The Maloofs haven't paid out "millions" to local charities; Maybe $1 million, but not "millions."...........

Your facts are awesome I have to say. I just love how you just pick "facts" out of the air to justify your "stuff"

Fact meet Arena Skeptic, Arena Skeptic meet Fact. You two should talk for awhile.

The Maloofs have contributed approximately TWELVE MILLION DOLLARS since they have been here. THe George Maloof Cup, Which gives $250,000 to a selected charity is held every preseason since they took over. Thats 2-2.5 right there! Thats just the money that theres absolute concrete proof of. Thats not mentioning alot of other charities they've contributed to in the area.
 
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#90
Okay I over-reacted. Disregard any emotional statement I made in this thread.

I have a few problems in that the Maloofs are known as savvy business people. Well this should of been in writing.

With that fact aside. The developer is a POS, we have known this by the failed attempts to develop by this group before.

Anyway will pick up with more thoughts in the 1140 Alert thread. Just wanted to say I went a little to far before knowing both sides of the story and I came here to say that.