State of the Kings Pre-trade Deadline Edition
- Thread starter iowamcnabb
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The reality is regardless their usage of him has been terrible for his value. I'm not sure why they've handled him with kiddie gloves and play him 25 mpg still. 35 and you're talking 20 and 10 nightly. The Kings sit him to watch Holmes play and build value for FA while also attempting to get Bjelica to build value back up from the bottom while still losing in the process. If nothing with Bjelica happens trade wise they lost all their bets hands down. They've almost made it to where they can't afford to ship him out. The value is apparently not there. Good job Kings for continuing to sit in the middle and watch almost every team pass you by going in both directions.
The smart call is they move Holmes (since there is a cap on what the Kings can pay), Bjelica, and Whiteside at the deadline and use the rest of the season to see what Bagley can do.
The smart call is they move Holmes (since there is a cap on what the Kings can pay), Bjelica, and Whiteside at the deadline and use the rest of the season to see what Bagley can do.
I can’t really get behind trading Holmes or Barnes, both good character vets with skills that would be hard to replace. Along with Fox, Haliburton and one or two good fits I’d think we are respectable.
Buddy, Bagley and of course Joseph and Bjelica can all go. Someone posted a recent photo of rookie Isaiah Stewart in Detroit on another thread. I’m sure he’s a work in progress but damn...reminiscent of Ben Wallace. Recon Bagley would look just fine in Detroit blue.
Buddy, Bagley and of course Joseph and Bjelica can all go. Someone posted a recent photo of rookie Isaiah Stewart in Detroit on another thread. I’m sure he’s a work in progress but damn...reminiscent of Ben Wallace. Recon Bagley would look just fine in Detroit blue.
While I totally agree with you about how poorly Bagley has been used, you lost me at trade Holmes.
And honestly, I’d only play Bags to showcase.
Fact is, players like Bagley don’t move the needle anymore, at least not in the right direction. He’d have been a great prospect in the early 2000s, which is probably why Vlade drafted him. Nowadays, if a big isn’t elite at passing or defense, they aren’t starting on a legit playoff team.
And honestly, I’d only play Bags to showcase.
Fact is, players like Bagley don’t move the needle anymore, at least not in the right direction. He’d have been a great prospect in the early 2000s, which is probably why Vlade drafted him. Nowadays, if a big isn’t elite at passing or defense, they aren’t starting on a legit playoff team.
And shooting. And not taking away from your star guards. And Rim protecting. And being able to defend the perimeter.. and...
Being a big in today's NBA is incredibly hard. Unless you're a unicorn offensive talent (Jokic, Embiid, KAT) it's almost never worth to have your team built around a big. Randle and Sabonis make it work because they've developed so much as a passer, but those dudes are still a tier below the top guys. And neither guys team is a serious title contender.
Holmes is the one vet I want to resign and keep around. He's a flawless fit next to Fox/Hali and he's a legitimately great role player on both ends of the court. It's rare to find that sort of a skill-set in a non-star big.
Being a big in today's NBA is incredibly hard. Unless you're a unicorn offensive talent (Jokic, Embiid, KAT) it's almost never worth to have your team built around a big. Randle and Sabonis make it work because they've developed so much as a passer, but those dudes are still a tier below the top guys. And neither guys team is a serious title contender.
Holmes is the one vet I want to resign and keep around. He's a flawless fit next to Fox/Hali and he's a legitimately great role player on both ends of the court. It's rare to find that sort of a skill-set in a non-star big.
This is a major concern. Frankly I don't think we would break the bank on him which makes him movable, but he does seem to like it here so if he would take a reasonable contract I am fine keeping him. I do think once people started to expect things from him he has fallen more into the disappointing category though. His first 3 months or so were great. Since then I can take or leave him.
Could be both.
Walton has always had an affinity for small ball (as do a ton of coaches), so one big was always going to get shafted and it wasn't going to be Holmes.
McNair is wishy-washy at best on Bagley according to Amick, and although he's open to re-evaluating him, he does not actively consider him part of the core as of this moment.
Walton has always had an affinity for small ball (as do a ton of coaches), so one big was always going to get shafted and it wasn't going to be Holmes.
McNair is wishy-washy at best on Bagley according to Amick, and although he's open to re-evaluating him, he does not actively consider him part of the core as of this moment.
Well, it sounds like McNair is trying to hedge his bets, and that doesn't help anyone. If he doesn't commit to Bagley, he can't get the most out of him to see if he's worth keeping, and he can't maximize his trade value if he doesn't want him. Let Walton feature Holmes in the offense and drive up his stats, then there is a risk of pricing yourself out of resigning him in free agency.
I mean, that is the question...
If he ends up getting offered more than we want to match and we lose him for nothing it’ll suck.
But I’d rather wait it out and see if we can sign him up a contract with good value. Maybe try and work a sign and trade off the price gets too high.
I think McNair should worry about jettisoning Buddy’s awful contract first, then we can worry about the future cap hold of guys like Holmes on a new deal,
If he ends up getting offered more than we want to match and we lose him for nothing it’ll suck.
But I’d rather wait it out and see if we can sign him up a contract with good value. Maybe try and work a sign and trade off the price gets too high.
I think McNair should worry about jettisoning Buddy’s awful contract first, then we can worry about the future cap hold of guys like Holmes on a new deal,
He is for sure top half in my opinion. I imagine he goes somewhere between Jakob Poeltl 3 year 27 million and Woods 3 year 41 million. After looking at recent center signings that is what I’ve come up with and I’m comfortable with those numbers.
Also, if we hold on to Barnes I am sliding him to the 4 next year and looking for a new wing (hopefully in the draft)
Also, if we hold on to Barnes I am sliding him to the 4 next year and looking for a new wing (hopefully in the draft)
Because he isn’t though? No ones afraid of driving right into the paint when he’s in. Don’t get me wrong, I can’t/won’t blame much of it on Holmes because there are bigger problems everywhere else on the D, but to say he’s a rim-protector? Ehhhhhh, it’s a stretch at best.
Hassan is a rim protector. People change their game even after blowing past our terrible defense when he’s back there.
Hassan is a rim protector. People change their game even after blowing past our terrible defense when he’s back there.
One thing doesn't necessarily negate the other. Moving Holmes would likely improve their ability to showcase Bagley since most of the plays they are running for Holmes could be run for Bagley. Bagley has had to mold his game around the other pick and roll big and it's hurting his productivity. Now, the positive is he's developed that corner 3 to a decent level but no matter what, turning him into a spot big that stretches for your center isn't going to do anything to help showcase his potential.
The thing about Holmes is he's proving his worth and if a team comes up empty on other options, they might want to gamble on him. And at this point would it even be much of a gamble? I've seen articles that put him under the MLE on a re-sign. Well, if true great, but I'd be surprised because that would mean there are about 29 other GM's that don't know their butt from a hole in the ground. This could turn into another Bogdan situation even though it sounds like Holmes would like to stay. I think Bogdan was done long before he left.
The thing about Holmes is he's proving his worth and if a team comes up empty on other options, they might want to gamble on him. And at this point would it even be much of a gamble? I've seen articles that put him under the MLE on a re-sign. Well, if true great, but I'd be surprised because that would mean there are about 29 other GM's that don't know their butt from a hole in the ground. This could turn into another Bogdan situation even though it sounds like Holmes would like to stay. I think Bogdan was done long before he left.
Does he though? He's the same coach that has stuck with big starting lineups since he got here. Last year it was Bjelica and Bagley/Holmes, and now it's Bagley/Holmes. While both units have done good almost every good 5 man advanced lineup worth a darn has had Barnes at the 4 from day 1 of Waltons tenure yet they don't get the majority share of the minutes.
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