Who would you hire as the new Kings GM?

[kb02]

Been following the back and forth. A few points: Hinkie’s runway ran out because the league didn’t want teams to adopt an either or strategy. That is a league full of a few contenders and a bunch of tankers. While Hinkie wasn’t universally loved by Sixers fans, support was high when he was pushed out. Then the league hires Jerry Colangelo, who installs his son as the GM, who then got busted by an algorithm, which caught him using a burner twitter account blasting current Sixers players. After the sons departure, the sixers hired Elton Brand, who gave like $3 billion to Al Horford and Tobias Harris even though the team already had a star center and a star PF, who moonlights as a PG.

Being out of the league a number of years isn’t an automatic sign of incompetence. There may be other reasons. Just as being continuously employed in the league isn’t a sign of competence. There may be other reasons—see Luke Walton or Dave Joeger or Bobby J, who has been a Kings assistant for like 3 different losing Kings regimes. Or Scott Perry, who has managed to screw up the Magic (read up on who he traded away) and the Knicks while earning some praise for a 3 month layover with the Kings where he signed a few retreads n help secure a workout with Fox.

Ultimately, after getting some quality REM sleep (haven’t been sleeping much because of the lil monster to my left), I think I’ve settled on the following wants:

1. A GM that has a proven history of identifying and developing talent.
2. A GM that understands Cap Space is a tool to acquire assets (draft picks, young players).
3. A GM that understands analytics and can incorporate it into the decision making process. Analytics does not need to weigh more in the decision making process than other factors, just given a voice—Luke Bornn is a big name in analytics; he ran the Kings dept; he disappeared the last few years and recently demoted himself to join Billy Beane’s SPAC. Vlade never levered that tool.
4. A GM that has connections throughout the league and has enough skill to convince 18 year old draftees to come in for a workout and the cojones to communicate honestly with a 60+ year old owner, who tends to make decisions based on whoever is closes to his ear.
5. Someone not named Scott Perry. Okay with someone not named Hinkie as well.

 

[dude12]

Agree kb02.....just don’t hire Scott Perry. He fails the simplest data of all. Wins and losses. His teams have a .320 win percentage.

 

[24 rick barry]

If you payed out a 3-5 year plan why wouldn’t you take a prospect who looked like prime Hakeem. It’s actually an advantage him missing the year you get to be drafting top 5 again. Masterful job by hinkie

Clever. It makes sense. Fits into Hinke's overall plan. Embiid gets hurt, and as a result, was picked behind Andrew Wiggins-Twolves and Jabari parker-Bucks. But Hinke knows Embiid is the best player in the draft. NBA Draft room quote referring to Embiib, "The best player in this draft when healthy. Injuries could make him fall on draft day."

Alright with Hinke, suck for one more year, one more high draft choice, and we have a game-changer- Embiid -available for the following year while we stack up some more chips.

It is like David Robinson all over again -who the Spurs had to wait 2 years after drafting for him to play due to Military Service. Tank gets a David Robinson, Tank while having an injury plagued year, David Robinson (and look what the Warriors did this year) and you get Tim Duncan.

Brilliant move by Hinke. If you don't like Hinke-then maybe look to Hinke's Protege Prodigy. oops he is with the Twolves now.

 

[Joshoua]

Clever. It makes sense. Fits into Hinke's overall plan. Embiid gets hurt, and as a result, was picked behind Andrew Wiggins-Twolves and Jabari parker-Bucks. But Hinke knows Embiid is the best player in the draft. NBA Draft room quote referring to Embiib, "The best player in this draft when healthy. Injuries could make him fall on draft day."

Alright with Hinke, suck for one more year, one more high draft choice, and we have a game-changer- Embiid -available for the following year while we stack up some more chips.

It is like David Robinson all over again -who the Spurs had to wait 2 years after drafting for him to play due to Military Service. Tank gets a David Robinson, Tank while having an injury plagued year, David Robinson (and look what the Warriors did this year) and you get Tim Duncan.

Brilliant move by Hinke. If you don't like Hinke-then maybe look to Hinke's Protege Prodigy. oops he is with the Twolves now.

Exactly, why take a Parker or Wiggins just cause Embiid will be hurt for one year. If you’re picking in the top 3 missing that on year I’m guess isn’t bad cause you’ll suck anyways.

 

[The_Jamal]

Hinkie drafted a big man with their top pick who couldn't get on the court for a couple of years because of injuries. Drafted a guard who can't shoot, who should have been drafted to play PF because that's what he is and also has a history of injuries. Neither are a stretch player at their position. These are the best players Hinkie drafted. This doesn't sound like something Kings fans today would tolerate well while trying to "trust the process. "
I understand there were other draftees and acquisitions. But the goal was to draft a superstar to build around. The stars for that team are Embiid and Simmons. What would make Kings fans tolerate this from Hinkie, but not another GM?

Embiid is a clear top 10 player in the game at age 26 and Simmons is a clear top 20 player in the game at age 24.

 

[The_Jamal]

Hinke has started and raised a $50 million dollar VC. He teaches at Stanford also.

Warriors will be back and Timberwolves have the 1st pick. Suns undefeated 8 and 0 in the reset.

Salary capped out with bad contracts, Buddy, Barnes, Joseph and Parker. Bogie to get 15mil with Fox -max and Bagley contracts looming. Since we have no real financial room for quality free agents-besides the fact why would they want to play here and adding a new twist, with the pending increase again in Individual state income tax which is already tops in the nation as is-

Are you going to use the 12th pick and 2 2nd rounders to beat out all the other teams in the west playoff hunt?

Magical powers over other GM's in the league approach?
Our gm has a wizard like ability to trade our poor players for other teams good players.

Kindly wondering, what Western division team rosters would you not exchange the whole of the Kings roster for right now?

Probably only the Spurs. While they do have nice young pieces, I'm taking Fox as a building block over their young guys. But after Fox, you could make an argument the Spurs have a far more robust young core with Murray, White, Walker, Johnson and Poeltl.

 

[Livinthedream]

Embiid is a clear top 10 player in the game at age 26 and Simmons is a clear top 20 player in the game at age 24.

Their best player is a big man who was injured his first 2 years straight, still gets injured and has a reputation for taking games off. The second best player is an often injured power forward who needs the ball in his hands to be happy, but can't shoot. They are very talented players, but these characteristics are things Kings fans would throw fits over were they on this roster.

To be clear, I have no issues with Embiid or Simmons as talents. However, what got the Sixers over the top previously was Butler. Without him, it's a team with a lot of talent, but flawed. To be kinder to Simmons and Embiid, the pairing of them is flawed. Hinkie never found his Lebron, or Leonard, or Giannis that would make them an instant contender, which was the whole point of the process. Besides, if Hinkie didn't even survive his own process, was it really a success?

 

[CaminoChaos]

After Capt. Factorial's post in the other thread regarding the Greek freak, I've come to a decision...drum roll...

Vivek needs to purchase 1 dozen roses, 1 Rolex and a contract with a blank check, go over to petrie's house with a ribbon covered Ferrari, kiss his feet and utter 3 words....

I am sorry!

Just a simple man's thoughts.

 

[kb02]

After Capt. Factorial's post in the other thread regarding the Greek freak, I've come to a decision...drum roll...

Vivek needs to purchase 1 dozen roses, 1 Rolex and a contract with a blank check, go over to petrie's house with a ribbon covered Ferrari, kiss his feet and utter 3 words....

I am sorry!

Just a simple man's thoughts.

I remember reading that a few years ago. That Petrie had an infatuation for Giannis. It may or may not be true. But, frankly, I hate hindsight, cherry picked arguments. I personally don't give it any value.

 

[CaminoChaos]

I remember reading that a few years ago. That Petrie had an infatuation for Giannis. It may or may not be true. But, frankly, I hate hindsight, cherry picked arguments. I personally don't give it any value.

I hate hindsight as well but lately I've been on this thing where you beat a dead horse until it dies...or it suffers...or it's already dead...

Oh no, the room is getting small.

Bring back Jerry Reynolds!

 

[Joshoua]

Their best player is a big man who was injured his first 2 years straight, still gets injured and has a reputation for taking games off. The second best player is an often injured power forward who needs the ball in his hands to be happy, but can't shoot. They are very talented players, but these characteristics are things Kings fans would throw fits over were they on this roster.

To be clear, I have no issues with Embiid or Simmons as talents. However, what got the Sixers over the top previously was Butler. Without him, it's a team with a lot of talent, but flawed. To be kinder to Simmons and Embiid, the pairing of them is flawed. Hinkie never found his Lebron, or Leonard, or Giannis that would make them an instant contender, which was the whole point of the process. Besides, if Hinkie didn't even survive his own process, was it really a success?

No matter how you describe Embiid he’s still a top 10 player no matter how you describe Simmons he’s better the Fox.

Jimmy butler left this year and they were still on pace for 50 wins despite having the worst constructed roster of all time. When you’re a 50+ win team continuously despite new management ****ing up the roster it’s means the process worked.

 

[steelevt]

Their best player is a big man who was injured his first 2 years straight, still gets injured and has a reputation for taking games off. The second best player is an often injured power forward who needs the ball in his hands to be happy, but can't shoot. They are very talented players, but these characteristics are things Kings fans would throw fits over were they on this roster.

To be clear, I have no issues with Embiid or Simmons as talents. However, what got the Sixers over the top previously was Butler. Without him, it's a team with a lot of talent, but flawed. To be kinder to Simmons and Embiid, the pairing of them is flawed. Hinkie never found his Lebron, or Leonard, or Giannis that would make them an instant contender, which was the whole point of the process. Besides, if Hinkie didn't even survive his own process, was it really a success?

Soo...who cares who the gm is as long as he can get jimmy butler here some way, somehow.

 

[Livinthedream]

No matter how you describe Embiid he’s still a top 10 player no matter how you describe Simmons he’s better the Fox.

Jimmy butler left this year and they were still on pace for 50 wins despite having the worst constructed roster of all time. When you’re a 50+ win team continuously despite new management ****ing up the roster it’s means the process worked.

I just call it like I see it. Not personal. Hinkie is unemployed and the Sixers are about to blow it up. Something went wrong, regardless of why. The Kings have a lot of woulda, coulda, shoulda's too. But at the end of the day, here we are. Both organizations are in a state of flux.

 

[Joshoua]

I just call it like I see it. Not personal. Hinkie is unemployed and the Sixers are about to blow it up. Something went wrong, regardless of why. The Kings have a lot of woulda, coulda, shoulda's too. But at the end of the day, here we are. Both organizations are in a state of flux.

Something did go wrong and we know what it was it was brand and colangelo. They still won’t blow it up they’re not trading Embiid/Ben and nobody is taking Horford or Harris off there hands

 

[24 rick barry]

BTW High up on the Kings GM list is Sachin Gupta. Now you know.

 

[Pacboy]

BTW High up on the Kings GM list is Sachin Gupta. Now you know.

He’s the architect behind the Kings and Sixers trade. He was also a special advisor to Morey in Houston. He would be a great addition.

 

[Joshoua]

BTW High up on the Kings GM list is Sachin Gupta. Now you know.

Source

 

[VF21]

Source

I believe his name was mentioned in one of The Athletic articles recently. The "high up on the list" part is the poster's comment as opposed to the author of the piece IIRC.

 

[Joshoua]

I believe his name was mentioned in one of The Athletic articles recently. The "high up on the list" part is the poster's comment as opposed to the author of the piece IIRC.

I took high up as in he’s on top of the list

 

[The_Jamal]

BTW High up on the Kings GM list is Sachin Gupta. Now you know.

Would absolutely love this. Hinkie's #2 man for the process Sixers and has spent a ton of time working under Morey as well. Basically their protege. VP of the Wolves last year and somehow got rid of the albatross Wiggins contract while acquiring D-Russ for only 1 top 3 protected pick and a 2nd round pick.

If there was ever a guy to just hand team control over to make smart decisions, it's this dude.

 

[Hoovtrain]

I took high up as in he’s on top of the list

I need to reread that athletic article, don’t recall his name being mentioned

 

[jiimbob]

He’s the architect behind the Kings and Sixers trade. He was also a special advisor to Morey in Houston. He would be a great addition.

yeah Vlade made him look like an absolute genius... not exactly a convincing selling point but sounds like he also fleeced Golden State with Wiggins contract. Now I’m sold.

 

[Iced Espresso]

Has there been any confirmed interviews?

 

[King Baller]

Has there been any confirmed interviews?

I would not be surprised if there had been informal discussions. With the outside firm handling the search it may be kept on the down low. Also many of the candidates hopefully work for teams still in the Playoff hunt.

 

[iowamcnabb]

I have spent a bit of time reading up on Sachin. I wonder why he has never been given the opportunity to be a GM considering nearly everyone who knows him thinks he is the smartest guy in the room? I also wonder if he has interest in leaving the Twolves considering he has never had the opportunity to see his vision (or the F0 team he was part of) through. Would he want to leave KAT, Russell, Naz Reid, Culver and the number 1 pick for Dfox Buddy Buckets and a quarter season of Bagley? If I take my purple glasses off, I don't see the Kings as the better option other than its a shot at running the show. He seems like the right type of guy to give an opportunity to however, so I hope he gets a shot

 

[kb02]

I have spent a bit of time reading up on Sachin. I wonder why he has never been given the opportunity to be a GM considering nearly everyone who knows him thinks he is the smartest guy in the room? I also wonder if he has interest in leaving the Twolves considering he has never had the opportunity to see his vision (or the F0 team he was part of) through. Would he want to leave KAT, Russell, Naz Reid, Culver and the number 1 pick for Dfox Buddy Buckets and a quarter season of Bagley? If I take my purple glasses off, I don't see the Kings as the better option other than its a shot at running the show. He seems like the right type of guy to give an opportunity to however, so I hope he gets a shot

I would worry less about who is on the Kings and more worried about who will be running the team with him, if he becomes the GM.

 

[iowamcnabb]

I would worry less about who is on the Kings and more worried about who will be running the team with him, if he becomes the GM.

Sure, that will be the top concern for any potential GM. I just have my doubts he would want to leave a better situation for a worse one with a better title. Especially in a small market

 

[Gguod]

The thought process by some around here is often times baffling.

There have been much more baffling stuff said in here than this since there are actual valid arguments for why Hinkie did good job as there are arguments against that. You only seeing the negatives and refusing to see the obvious positives he did doesnt mean its baffling if someone acknowledges the positives.

Anyone crowing about a GM because they happened to be in a draft where there was a star level player is beyond silly. Had Vlade selected #77 in 2018 would his method of madness now be considered successful?

I'm not surprised you dont see any good in Hinkie if thats your actual point of view. The crucial part of Hinkies plan wasnt to "happen to be in a draft where there was a star level player". Saying that is intentionally misrepresenting his strategy. The crucial part of his strategy was to understand that in order to draft a superstar you should have as high picks as possible in multiple drafts (since its statistically proven that its much more likely to draft a star top 2 compared to for example 4-8 range). Also part of his plan was that you should have as many picks as possible to increase your odds to land starting level players and thats important because you are in control of them for their cheap rookie contract and their second contract.

It wasnt luck with Hinkie. It was a plan based on statistics and odds. When you follow that plan for several drafts, statistically you are bound to get better results since statistically you will have higher picks and more picks. Obviously you can still miss with those picks but at least you are drafting in a position where its most likely to get a star level player. Vlade getting a huge lottery luck was great but I would never want to follow a plan that requires that we enter the draft lottery 8th and get a star level player in that draft. Its just very unlikely especially compared to entering the lottery first or second.

The dude in question has been out of an NBA job for 4+ seasons for good reason.

Thats an argument you've been saying a lot and to me him being out of the job isnt a thing that "proves" anything since there are good reasons why he hasnt work since his resignation.

First of all you must acknowledge that the league basically forced him out because of his strategy and for at least 2-3 years he basically was unhireable because of that. Also not having a gm job after that is a shady argument when there are only 30 jobs and there are some terrible franchises that hire guys like their ex player with zero experience and/or competence for the job.

I remember reading that after couple of years of his resigning, teams and owners still called him for counseling a lot. We also dont know how motivated he is working as a gm anymore since how he was treated by the league plus aparrently he has a good job outside of the game.

I don't know how high Hinkie would be on my list, or if Hinkie even wants to be a gm anymore. What I do know we could do a lot worse than him and our last gm is a good example of that.

There were some reports that agents didnt like Hinkie because he never used his cap space on guys like Zbo, Dedmon ect and he invented those multi year partially guaranteed contracts for low level players. I dont know how those relationships would affect the team once it was competitive but what I do know is that his strategy was based on data and his strategy did what it was supposed to do (multiple high draft picks, multiple extra draft picks, loads of caps space to sign guys when stars were drafted).

100 times out of 100 I would prefer a strategy based on data and being good in the future rather than gut feeling and desperation to scrap together a 37 win team year after year.

 

[KingsFanSince85]

There have been much more baffling stuff said in here than this since there are actual valid arguments for why Hinkie did good job as there are arguments against that. You only seeing the negatives and refusing to see the obvious positives he did doesnt mean its baffling if someone acknowledges the positives.




I'm not surprised you dont see any good in Hinkie if thats your actual point of view. The crucial part of Hinkies plan wasnt to "happen to be in a draft where there was a star level player". Saying that is intentionally misrepresenting his strategy. The crucial part of his strategy was to understand that in order to draft a superstar you should have as high picks as possible in multiple drafts (since its statistically proven that its much more likely to draft a star top 2 compared to for example 4-8 range). Also part of his plan was that you should have as many picks as possible to increase your odds to land starting level players and thats important because you are in control of them for their cheap rookie contract and their second contract.

It wasnt luck with Hinkie. It was a plan based on statistics and odds. When you follow that plan for several drafts, statistically you are bound to get better results since statistically you will have higher picks and more picks. Obviously you can still miss with those picks but at least you are drafting in a position where its most likely to get a star level player. Vlade getting a huge lottery luck was great but I would never want to follow a plan that requires that we enter the draft lottery 8th and get a star level player in that draft. Its just very unlikely especially compared to entering the lottery first or second.




Thats an argument you've been saying a lot and to me him being out of the job isnt a thing that "proves" anything since there are good reasons why he hasnt work since his resignation.

First of all you must acknowledge that the league basically forced him out because of his strategy and for at least 2-3 years he basically was unhireable because of that. Also not having a gm job after that is a shady argument when there are only 30 jobs and there are some terrible franchises that hire guys like their ex player with zero experience and/or competence for the job.

I remember reading that after couple of years of his resigning, teams and owners still called him for counseling a lot. We also dont know how motivated he is working as a gm anymore since how he was treated by the league plus aparrently he has a good job outside of the game.

I don't know how high Hinkie would be on my list, or if Hinkie even wants to be a gm anymore. What I do know we could do a lot worse than him and our last gm is a good example of that.

There were some reports that agents didnt like Hinkie because he never used his cap space on guys like Zbo, Dedmon ect and he invented those multi year partially guaranteed contracts for low level players. I dont know how those relationships would affect the team once it was competitive but what I do know is that his strategy was based on data and his strategy did what it was supposed to do (multiple high draft picks, multiple extra draft picks, loads of caps space to sign guys when stars were drafted).

100 times out of 100 I would prefer a strategy based on data and being good in the future rather than gut feeling and desperation to scrap together a 37 win team year after year.

There too much flawed thinking and argument for me to address here.

I’ll simply say that it’s loser’s mentality to try to lose purposely in the hopes of being saved by lottery odds. If that’s the limit of your vision cause you’re a desperate fan, more power to you.

It just isn’t for me. It’s a really poor shortcut attempt. And against the spirit of competition. This particular shortcut attempt hasn’t even proven worth the effort (or lack there of) either. So there’s that too. Nobody’s fielding g-league roster’s for 3 years with the goal of merely reaching the postseason. To go through all that it better result in a title or two. It hasn’t. Not even close.

This KINGS fan isn’t for snake oil salesman tactics. Find a GM that can discover talent no matter what position the franchise is drafting and build a team the tried, true and competitive way.

Judging from the poll results, it seems the majority feels the same way.

I’ll just try to be better about avoiding replying to posts like these in the future. There’s no upside in trying to rationalize with the irrational. They’ll never see the forest for the trees

As you were.

 

[Dime Dropper]

There have been much more baffling stuff said in here than this since there are actual valid arguments for why Hinkie did good job as there are arguments against that. You only seeing the negatives and refusing to see the obvious positives he did doesnt mean its baffling if someone acknowledges the positives.




I'm not surprised you dont see any good in Hinkie if thats your actual point of view. The crucial part of Hinkies plan wasnt to "happen to be in a draft where there was a star level player". Saying that is intentionally misrepresenting his strategy. The crucial part of his strategy was to understand that in order to draft a superstar you should have as high picks as possible in multiple drafts (since its statistically proven that its much more likely to draft a star top 2 compared to for example 4-8 range). Also part of his plan was that you should have as many picks as possible to increase your odds to land starting level players and thats important because you are in control of them for their cheap rookie contract and their second contract.

It wasnt luck with Hinkie. It was a plan based on statistics and odds. When you follow that plan for several drafts, statistically you are bound to get better results since statistically you will have higher picks and more picks. Obviously you can still miss with those picks but at least you are drafting in a position where its most likely to get a star level player. Vlade getting a huge lottery luck was great but I would never want to follow a plan that requires that we enter the draft lottery 8th and get a star level player in that draft. Its just very unlikely especially compared to entering the lottery first or second.




Thats an argument you've been saying a lot and to me him being out of the job isnt a thing that "proves" anything since there are good reasons why he hasnt work since his resignation.

First of all you must acknowledge that the league basically forced him out because of his strategy and for at least 2-3 years he basically was unhireable because of that. Also not having a gm job after that is a shady argument when there are only 30 jobs and there are some terrible franchises that hire guys like their ex player with zero experience and/or competence for the job.

I remember reading that after couple of years of his resigning, teams and owners still called him for counseling a lot. We also dont know how motivated he is working as a gm anymore since how he was treated by the league plus aparrently he has a good job outside of the game.

I don't know how high Hinkie would be on my list, or if Hinkie even wants to be a gm anymore. What I do know we could do a lot worse than him and our last gm is a good example of that.

There were some reports that agents didnt like Hinkie because he never used his cap space on guys like Zbo, Dedmon ect and he invented those multi year partially guaranteed contracts for low level players. I dont know how those relationships would affect the team once it was competitive but what I do know is that his strategy was based on data and his strategy did what it was supposed to do (multiple high draft picks, multiple extra draft picks, loads of caps space to sign guys when stars were drafted).

100 times out of 100 I would prefer a strategy based on data and being good in the future rather than gut feeling and desperation to scrap together a 37 win team year after year.

As you saw with the reply to this well-argued, evidence-backed post, you are wasting your time. Your facts are not enough to contend with their opinion.

Serious amount of projection on their part also, suggesting that you're the one that is being irrational. You couldn't write it. I would put them on ignore and save your reasoning for someone that isn't basing their opinions on emotions.