If the Draft Were Today...

[Joshoua]

I’ve only watched clips and read articles on Nesmith, but nbadraft.net had Buddy ranked higher in passing, ball handling, and defense. He might improve in those areas if he stayed in college longer. Just saying, I’m not sold on him but hope whoever picks looks him over.

Scary indeed, I’d like to find a better site though as I don’t trust draft.net at all. Most I’ve been reading say he has a very good IQ which is good and at his size he can be passable at defense at worst.

Speaking of Buddy I just realized again, with vlade gone and him being a Bogi guy maybe we’re gonna keep buddy and start him. Let go of bogie so that might impact our pick.

 

[jiimbob]

Scary indeed, I’d like to find a better site though as I don’t trust draft.net at all. Most I’ve been reading say he has a very good IQ which is good and at his size he can be passable at defense at worst.

Speaking of Buddy I just realized again, with vlade gone and him being a Bogi guy maybe we’re gonna keep buddy and start him. Let go of bogie so that might impact our pick.

It wouldn’t mind a refresher course in favourite sites and sources from some of the more dialled in college fans here. I always enjoyed nbadraft.net but a lot of that is their website , no opinion on their expertise. RealGM ??
Yeah, Buddy was Vivek’s guy so it will be interesting to see how Vlades departure effects Buddys status. I know there has been much discussion about trading him but I’d be curious of Vivek’s take.

 

[ESP47]

I think Nesmith is a pretty safe pick since his main skills are easily translatable to the NBA. My main worries are his defense and crazy low assist rate. His assist rate is essentially equal to Bagley's. The good thing is that he's not a ball stopper who has to shoot the ball anytime it comes in contact with his hands. He moves the ball around just fine but he can be kind of a "oh crap, you figure it out" kind of passer, which can make teammates worse instead of making them better.

 

[Folsomkingsfan]

I agree with you. That's what I was saying and why someone like Hayes wouldn't be a good fit. To me it's like re-creating the George Hill dynamic with development as your only hope. Remember those 5 apg were supposed to really help too. Fox is what he is and it could work out very, very well for you if you use him for what he is rather than trying to turn into something he's not. Of course, that seems to be the plan under this current coaching staff.

You'd think after passing on Doncic we'd stop worrying about fit.

 

[jiimbob]

You'd think after passing on Doncic we'd stop worrying about fit.

I arrived at that conclusion with Mitchell.
If Kira Lewis is on board at 12 and looking like the BPA take him. I don’t care if he plays Fox’s position.

 

[bajaden]

I think Nesmith is a pretty safe pick since his main skills are easily translatable to the NBA. My main worries are his defense and crazy low assist rate. His assist rate is essentially equal to Bagley's. The good thing is that he's not a ball stopper who has to shoot the ball anytime it comes in contact with his hands. He moves the ball around just fine but he can be kind of a "oh crap, you figure it out" kind of passer, which can make teammates worse instead of making them better.

I'd like to point out that Nesmith, is also constantly moving without the ball as well. He needs to tighten up his handles and work on making the safe pass. His handles sometimes get him into bad positions where he has to pass the ball, and it ends up being a turnover. Look, there is no perfect player in this draft. They all have a couple of warts somewhere. As I've said, I look for players that are really really good at at least one thing, and not too bad at some others. Nesmith fits that description. Most of his flaws are correctable.

Nesmith doesn't come with the reputation of being a bad defender. Actually, some opposing coaches commented on him being a good defender. He's a good athlete with a good wingspan. If you draft him, he has some skills that can get him on the floor right away, and you hope you can develop the rest of his game. People have to remember that there isn't a lot of individual practice time in college. Once in the NBA a players growth should accelerate. If he puts in the work.

 

[Joshoua]

I'd like to point out that Nesmith, is also constantly moving without the ball as well. He needs to tighten up his handles and work on making the safe pass. His handles sometimes get him into bad positions where he has to pass the ball, and it ends up being a turnover. Look, there is no perfect player in this draft. They all have a couple of warts somewhere. As I've said, I look for players that are really really good at at least one thing, and not too bad at some others. Nesmith fits that description. Most of his flaws are correctable.

Nesmith doesn't come with the reputation of being a bad defender. Actually, some opposing coaches commented on him being a good defender. He's a good athlete with a good wingspan. If you draft him, he has some skills that can get him on the floor right away, and you hope you can develop the rest of his game. People have to remember that there isn't a lot of individual practice time in college. Once in the NBA a players growth should accelerate. If he puts in the work.

This is why I want him he has potential to be a good defender especially with his size and wingspan. Now add in his shooting yes he can’t dribble but when you constantly move like that and are a great shooter you bring attention to you

 

[bajaden]

I arrived at that conclusion with Mitchell.
If Kira Lewis is on board at 12 and looking like the BPA take him. I don’t care if he plays Fox’s position.

Well I'm a big Kira Lewis fan, so I would be fine with his selection. He's also one of the youngest players in the draft, if not the youngest. Remember that Joseph only has one more year left on his contract, and Yogi is likely gone. That would leave us with only one PG on the roster after next season, so drafting Lewis wouldn't be a stretch. He would have a year on the team to get acquainted with the NBA. Plus, I think he's starter material, so if Fox were to be injured, you wouldn't have a big drop off in production. Particularly since his game is almost identical to Fox's.

 

[bajaden]

This is why I want him he has potential to be a good defender especially with his size and wingspan. Now add in his shooting yes he can’t dribble but when you constantly move like that and are a great shooter you bring attention to you

There has been a lot of players in the NBA that wern't known for their ball handling, but they were stars, or in many cases, the number 2 option on their team. Kevin Martin had a very nice career for us when he was on the Kings, and no one mistook him for a shot creator. He moved without the ball, and came off screens. He also got to the line a lot, which made him an efficient scorer. It wasn't unusual for Martin to score 24 pt's on 10 shots.

When people think of Reggie Miller, their first thought isn't what a great ball handler he was. What they remember is him coming off double screens and putting an arrow through your heart. Ditto JJ Redick.

 

[SacTownKid]

You'd think after passing on Doncic we'd stop worrying about fit.

Unless that player is like a clear superstar then yes, worry about fit. And even then, worry about making a change if it becomes apparent that the pieces do not fit. If Hayes were 6'8" and looked like a star on the wing then it would be a different story. He's not. He's much more like a George Hill than a Doncic and we've already seen what that looks like. Doncic had other skills outside of his ability to run an offense that showed you all the ways he could work with Fox. They would never reach their full production potential together likely but again, yeah, cross that bridge when you get there.

 

[ESP47]

I'd like to point out that Nesmith, is also constantly moving without the ball as well. He needs to tighten up his handles and work on making the safe pass. His handles sometimes get him into bad positions where he has to pass the ball, and it ends up being a turnover. Look, there is no perfect player in this draft. They all have a couple of warts somewhere. As I've said, I look for players that are really really good at at least one thing, and not too bad at some others. Nesmith fits that description. Most of his flaws are correctable.

Nesmith doesn't come with the reputation of being a bad defender. Actually, some opposing coaches commented on him being a good defender. He's a good athlete with a good wingspan. If you draft him, he has some skills that can get him on the floor right away, and you hope you can develop the rest of his game. People have to remember that there isn't a lot of individual practice time in college. Once in the NBA a players growth should accelerate. If he puts in the work.

He looks like 2018-2019 Buddy Hield off the ball to me. Always moving and looking for the open shot. He definitely has a high level knack for that. I don't expect any player to be perfect, which is why we're talking his strengths and weaknesses. It's just his ability to get assists is very strange to me.

Lets say we comp him to other non ball handling 3 point snipers like Redick, Korver, Bertans, McDermott and Harris. These guys all average about 2-3ast per36 whereas Nesmith in his breakout season averaged 1ast per40 (using basketball reference). That's just an odd anomaly to me. It could be nothing but it could be a sign that passing the ball to him in a situation that doesn't generate a shot could mean that he puts your team on it's heels because he can't generate scoring situations for others. You would think at minimum that you would average over 1 assist every 40 minutes by just routinely swinging the ball around and having the next guy you pass it to just shoot it and make it.

 

[jiimbob]

Unless that player is like a clear superstar then yes, worry about fit. And even then, worry about making a change if it becomes apparent that the pieces do not fit. If Hayes were 6'8" and looked like a star on the wing then it would be a different story. He's not. He's much more like a George Hill than a Doncic and we've already seen what that looks like. Doncic had other skills outside of his ability to run an offense that showed you all the ways he could work with Fox. They would never reach their full production potential together likely but again, yeah, cross that bridge when you get there.

I don’t know, there are only so many players that look like clear superstars entering the draft. The Kings history is rich in picking fit first and messing it up. 2012 Robinson over Lillard, 2017 passing on Mitchell at 10, trading down and going with fit.
I don’t suppose anyone knew just how good Lillard or Mitchell would be today, but they both looked good then and like stars to me now.

 

[SacTownKid]

I don’t know, there are only so many players that look like clear superstars entering the draft. The Kings history is rich in picking fit first and messing it up. 2012 Robinson over Lillard, 2018 passing on Mitchell at 10, trading down and going with fit.
I don’t suppose anyone knew just how good Lillard or Mitchell would be today, but they both looked good then and like stars to me now.

Eh Robison was far from a fit pick though. Remember, he was added to a plethora of other bigs none of which fit next to the franchise guy. And while I was in the just draft Mitchell camp I for sure know the Mitchell you see in Utah in all of his high usage glory wouldn't have been that here. Especially after seeing the kind of roles carved out for players like Buddy and Bogdan. I wouldn't be surprised if the Kings single-handedly sent his career head first into the garbage can had he been drafted here TBH. And as sad as it is, with that said, I don't think anyone knows how good any of the Kings core pieces now in Fox, Buddy, and Bagely can be. I do know time is running out though.

 

[NewArena]

You are making to much sense here . Bottom line is some people want to make a panicked, knee jerk reaction and deal Hield for pennies on the dollar. Terrible idea.

Those same people will turn around and crucify the front office for doing so. That’s the hilarious part here

 

[gunks]

I'm down with trading Buddy. That guy does not play winning basketball at all. Stud shooter. But he shoots the team in the foot as much as he shoots 3s. Never mind the bad attitude and stupid contact Vlade gave him.

But trade him for a middling pick in a bad draft? That's just silly. I reckon a decent GM (where for art thou?) could get better value for Buddy. He does have an elite skill. Put him in a system that uses him correctly, and he is easily a 22+ ppg scorer again.

 

[jiimbob]

I'm down with trading Buddy. That guy does not play winning basketball at all. Stud shooter. But he shoots the team in the foot as much as he shoots 3s. Never mind the bad attitude and stupid contact Vlade gave him.

But trade him for a middling pick in a bad draft? That's just silly. I reckon a decent GM (where for art thou?) could get better value for Buddy. He does have an elite skill. Put him in a system that uses him correctly, and he is easily a 22+ ppg scorer again.

I just read a Sactown Royalty article where trading Buddy and Parker to the Sixers for Tobias Harris was proposed. I believe trading for Tobias has been brought up in the past here, I forget the feedback. Anyways, its looking like the Sixers will shake things up a bit and Buddy should be a good fit there. Tobias is 28 but not a bad 3 point shot and ball handler for a forward.

 

[dude12]

I'm down with trading Buddy. That guy does not play winning basketball at all. Stud shooter. But he shoots the team in the foot as much as he shoots 3s. Never mind the bad attitude and stupid contact Vlade gave him.

But trade him for a middling pick in a bad draft? That's just silly. I reckon a decent GM (where for art thou?) could get better value for Buddy. He does have an elite skill. Put him in a system that uses him correctly, and he is easily a 22+ ppg scorer again.

Seriously, if you put him in Atlanta with Trae and all Buddy has to do is catch and shoot and get out that break like with Joerger, Atlanta should be all over it. Give me pick at 6 and Reddish. We can add a second rounder.....do what needs to be done salary wise if necessary if a player with a contract needs to come back.

 

[dude12]

I just read a Sactown Royalty article where trading Buddy and Parker to the Sixers for Tobias Harris was proposed. I believe trading for Tobias has been brought up in the past here, I forget the feedback. Anyways, its looking like the Sixers will shake things up a bit and Buddy should be a good fit there. Tobias is 28 but not a bad 3 point shot and ball handler for a forward.

Yes but does that keep Barnes at SF? I think both Barnes and Harris are small ball PFs. It does help balance things out I suppose but I’d want Thybulle as well somehow, someway.

 

[LPKingsFan]

Yes but does that keep Barnes at SF? I think both Barnes and Harris are small ball PFs. It does help balance things out I suppose but I’d want Thybulle as well somehow, someway.

I don’t know that the issue with Barnes was his inability to play SF as much as him being a better fit at PF than our other options. I think it would work ok with Barnes and Harris at the forward spots, especially if you try to stagger them some. His contract really is the biggest concern.

 

[King Baller]

Tobias Harris reminds me a bit of Rudy Gay. Good player but never been on a really good team.

 

[gunks]

I just read a Sactown Royalty article where trading Buddy and Parker to the Sixers for Tobias Harris was proposed. I believe trading for Tobias has been brought up in the past here, I forget the feedback. Anyways, its looking like the Sixers will shake things up a bit and Buddy should be a good fit there. Tobias is 28 but not a bad 3 point shot and ball handler for a forward.

Isn't his contact super nuts though? I mean, I'm down but only if he just has 2 years left or so as I'm all about tearing this roster down. Keep Fox and Bags (in the off chance he isn't an injury riddled bust).... nuts to everyone else haha.

Best case, Vlade's "superteam just young" is a perennial first round exit. And that's assuming Fox gets an outside shot, Bagley gets over his osteoporosis, and Buddy grows a brain. These cats need to visit the wizard of Oz or something.

 

[Hoovtrain]

Thoughts ?
12. Sacramento Kings
Patrick Williams | 6-8 forward/wing | 18 years old, freshman | Florida State
Williams was a bench player for Florida State this year, but he’s rising up draft boards the more teams go back and watch what he showed this year and in his AAU days. He has very real upside and instinctual awareness on defense mixed with a frame that should allow him to take on tough defensive assignments. His frame should allow him to play relatively quickly in the NBA on that end of the floor.
At 6-foot-8, 225 pounds, with barrels for shoulders and a strong core, Williams looks like he’s going to fill out and become one of the stronger players for his size in the NBA. Having said that, the next key for him will be ironing out the offensive skill set. It’s all flashes right now versus any sort of real consistency. He can occasionally knock down shots, but is streaky. He showed some point forward abilities on the AAU circuit, but hasn’t shown them against higher level competition. Williams is a bit of a project, but he profiles into a high-level role player if the team that picks him takes its time and just irons out what we’ve already seen. The Kings could use more help on the wing, and Williams would be an interesting player to take a shot on.

 

[ESP47]

Seriously, if you put him in Atlanta with Trae and all Buddy has to do is catch and shoot and get out that break like with Joerger, Atlanta should be all over it. Give me pick at 6 and Reddish. We can add a second rounder.....do what needs to be done salary wise if necessary if a player with a contract needs to come back.

At first I thought Atlanta would consider it but now that I think more about it, that would be potentially the worst defensive backcourt of all time.

 

[Groovygreg]

Saddiq Bey at #12, if available.

 

[jiimbob]

Yes but does that keep Barnes at SF? I think both Barnes and Harris are small ball PFs. It does help balance things out I suppose but I’d want Thybulle as well somehow, someway.

Yeah I really don’t know.
However I am pretty convinced Philadelphia is kicking themselves for signing both Harris and Horford to ridiculous contracts then getting swept. If they want out of Harris’s contract and value Buddy more than Thybulle make them cough up some trade incentive. I would gladly take Thybulle in our backcourt.

 

[midtowner]

I would draft a time machine and fix some blunders

 

[dude12]

Thoughts ?
12. Sacramento Kings
Patrick Williams | 6-8 forward/wing | 18 years old, freshman | Florida State
Williams was a bench player for Florida State this year, but he’s rising up draft boards the more teams go back and watch what he showed this year and in his AAU days. He has very real upside and instinctual awareness on defense mixed with a frame that should allow him to take on tough defensive assignments. His frame should allow him to play relatively quickly in the NBA on that end of the floor.
At 6-foot-8, 225 pounds, with barrels for shoulders and a strong core, Williams looks like he’s going to fill out and become one of the stronger players for his size in the NBA. Having said that, the next key for him will be ironing out the offensive skill set. It’s all flashes right now versus any sort of real consistency. He can occasionally knock down shots, but is streaky. He showed some point forward abilities on the AAU circuit, but hasn’t shown them against higher level competition. Williams is a bit of a project, but he profiles into a high-level role player if the team that picks him takes its time and just irons out what we’ve already seen. The Kings could use more help on the wing, and Williams would be an interesting player to take a shot on.

Haven’t watched him but reading the description I like the physicality description. Anything that gets us more physical, longer and or quicker.

 

[kb02]

I just read a Sactown Royalty article where trading Buddy and Parker to the Sixers for Tobias Harris was proposed. I believe trading for Tobias has been brought up in the past here, I forget the feedback. Anyways, its looking like the Sixers will shake things up a bit and Buddy should be a good fit there. Tobias is 28 but not a bad 3 point shot and ball handler for a forward.

The problem with Harris is his salary. See here: https://www.spotrac.com/nba/philadelphia-76ers/tobias-harris-8070/
He has $147M remaining on his contract. With an average annual salary of $36M per year.

Buddy and Jabari are owed $86M collectively. Basically about a $60M difference without including incentives, etc.

Harris is considered one of the worse contracts in the league. There is a viable argument that a team with cap space may be able to get him for a late second or that at some point the Sixers may even pay to get rid of that contract.

 

[24 rick barry]

Scary indeed, I’d like to find a better site though as I don’t trust draft.net at all. Most I’ve been reading say he has a very good IQ which is good and at his size he can be passable at defense at worst.

Speaking of Buddy I just realized again, with vlade gone and him being a Bogi guy maybe we’re gonna keep buddy and start him. Let go of bogie so that might impact our pick.

Buddy must start. He will continue to be unhappy if he is not a starter.

Also, if you are down 3 in overtime, with the ball after a time out with less that 15 second left, and Buddy-after becoming the 3 point champion, is not on the court, Buddy deserves to be unhappy. It happened this year. I was there and couldn't believe my eyes.

 

[Livinthedream]

Buddy must start. He will continue to be unhappy if he is not a starter.

Also, if you are down 3 in overtime, with the ball after a time out with less that 15 second left, and Buddy-after becoming the 3 point champion, is not on the court, Buddy deserves to be unhappy. It happened this year. I was there and couldn't believe my eyes.

Bogi was throwing the same fit about being a bench player earlier in the year. Are they both malcontents?

Neither are all around players, but only Buddy has a skill that is elite. I'd lean towards him, over an inconsistent Bogi.

https://nba.nbcsports.com/2019/10/2...not-content-remaining-kings-backup-long-term/