Now that we know the draft order, who do we draft? (New thread)

I feel Collins/Monk could be left

Philly is too high and I see every other team having a SG or preferring one of the truer PGs.

Every team past 6 arguably doesn't need a center.

Justin Jackson had his first workout in Sacramento. Good trade back candidate and have to appreciate his determination to be out here
 

hrdboild

Moloch in whom I dream Angels!
Staff member
The closer we get to draft night, the less excited I am about Isaac and Tatum at #5. I just don't have a good feeling about either one. Tatum is the classic jack of all trades master of none wing for me. He's got good size and a go-to mid-post turnaround jumper but what else suggests he'll develop into a leading scorer? I see his best-case scenario somewhere around Tobias Harris level which is a nice player but not someone you build your team around. And Isaac scares me even more. I think people look at his size and his ball skills and get a little starry eyed talking about potential but how many times have we already been fooled by these stick-thin combo forwards with "next KD" hype in the past? Remember Perry Jones and Quincy Miller? Isaac looks good statistically and he checks all the boxes for people who think defense is more about wingspan and foot speed than strength, intelligence, and anticipation but we don't even really know who he is yet as a player. Almost every year I talk myself into some super long bouncy wing prospect and they go nowhere. He might be a star, he might be Marvin Williams. I can't tell and that's what scares me. And while I still think Dennis Smith Jr. has got a great chance to be an All-Star in the NBA he's more likely to be a Damian Lillard type of scoring point than an all-around team leader. I don't think we want to lock ourselves into years of mediocrity like Portland has by committing to a core group of players who don't put in enough effort on defense.

So where does that leave us? Fultz is off the board in the top 4 for sure. Hopefully Ball is too. He'd be fun to watch for 4 years but then what? If De'Aaron Fox and Josh Jackson both go 3/4 as expected (or the Lakers take one of them and Philly/Phoenix clean up the rest) we're looking at a situation where I don't really want any of the consensus best players on the board (Tatum, Isaac, Smith, Monk). Almost every year we see players penciled into the lottery because that's where everyone else has them who are mediocre at best in the league while players picked much later become stars. Who wants anything to do with Jahlil Okafor now? Does anyone still think Dante Exum or Marcus Smart are going to be All-Stars? Remember when Ben McLemore was briefly ranked as the best player in the 2013 draft? I really don't want this to be us (again). So if that's the situation I'm passing on all of them right now and taking Frank Ntilikina at #5. My primary goal in the draft is to swing for the fences and I think Frank is the only guy left up there who fits all of my criteria: (1) Is he already a difference maker on defense? Yes. (2) Can he develop into a two-way star if he maxes out his potential? Yes. (3) Does he fit the direction of the team? He can play on the ball or off the ball, he can shoot from outside, and he's an active pest on defense with the potential to guard all three perimeter positions. I'd say that's a yes.

Realistically speaking, we're a long way from competing. We can afford to take one of the youngest players in the draft and bring him along slowly. I also feel like we're relatively safe picking him over somebody like Smith, Tatum, or Isaac because if those guys don't reach their potential they're wasted picks. Smith becomes a black hole on offense who gets his points but doesn't help the team win. Tatum becomes a low-efficiency volume scorer who teases with good defensive effort every 5th game or so. Isaac can't get off the bench behind Skal and plateaus as a Donte Greene level tease. What's the worst-case for Ntilikina? Well I suppose he could stay overseas, but assuming that's not a problem his worst case is probably a rotational wing with Nic Batum size and 3 and D skills. That's still a valuable player to have in your rotation. I've been conditioned to hope for the best but expect the worst in the draft and by this criteria Ntilikina doesn't look like a big reach at #5. Honestly, weren't we all hyped up about Isaac and Tatum mostly because they fit a position of need anyway? Every year there's at least one top wing worth drafting. If Miles Bridges had stayed in the draft the situation would be different, but as it is I'm more concerned that we get this one pick right instead of trying to package two perfect picks in a row.
 
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Kingster

Hall of Famer
The closer we get to draft night, the less excited I am about Isaac and Tatum at #5. I just don't have a good feeling about either one. Tatum is the classic jack of all trades master of none wing for me. He's got good size and a go-to mid-post turnaround jumper but what else suggests he'll develop into a leading scorer? I see his best-case scenario somewhere around Tobias Harris level which is a nice player but not someone you build your team around. And Isaac scares me even more. I think people look at his size and his ball skills and get a little starry eyed talking about potential but how many times have we already been fooled by these stick-thin combo forwards with "next KD" hype in the past? Remember Perry Jones and Quincy Miller? Isaac looks good statistically and he checks all the boxes for people who think defense is more about wingspan and foot speed than strength, intelligence, and anticipation but we don't even really know who he is yet as a player. Almost every year I talk myself into some super long bouncy wing prospect and they go nowhere. He might be a star, he might be Marvin Williams. I can't tell and that's what scares me. And while I still think Dennis Smith Jr. has got a great chance to be an All-Star in the NBA he's more likely to be a Damian Lillard type of scoring point than an all-around team leader. I don't think we want to lock ourselves into years of mediocrity like Portland has by committing to a core group of players who don't put in enough effort on defense.

So where does that leave us? Fultz is off the board in the top 4 for sure. Hopefully Ball is too. He'd be fun to watch for 4 years but then what? If De'Aaron Fox and Josh Jackson both go 3/4 as expected (or the Lakers take one of them and Philly/Phoenix clean up the rest) we're looking at a situation where I don't really want any of the consensus best players on the board (Tatum, Isaac, Smith, Monk). Almost every year we see players penciled into the lottery because that's where everyone else has them who are mediocre at best in the league while players picked much later become stars. Who wants anything to do with Jahlil Okafor now? Does anyone still think Dante Exum or Marcus Smart are going to be All-Stars? Remember when Ben McLemore was briefly ranked as the best player in the 2013 draft? I really don't want this to be us (again). So if that's the situation I'm passing on all of them right now and taking Frank Ntilikina at #5. My primary goal in the draft is to swing for the fences and I think Frank is the only guy left up there who fits all of my criteria: (1) Is he already a difference maker on defense? Yes. (2) Can he develop into a two-way star if he maxes out his potential? Yes. (3) Does he fit the direction of the team? He can play on the ball or off the ball, he can shoot from outside, and he's an active pest on defense with the potential to guard all three perimeter positions. I'd say that's a yes.

Realistically speaking, we're a long way from competing. We can afford to take one of the youngest players in the draft and bring him along slowly. I also feel like we're relatively safe picking him over somebody like Smith, Tatum, or Isaac because if those guys don't reach their potential they're wasted picks. Smith becomes a black hole on offense who gets his points but doesn't help the team win. Tatum becomes a low-efficiency volume scorer who teases with good defensive effort every 5th game or so. Isaac can't get off the bench behind Skal and plateaus as a Donte Greene level tease. What's the worst-case for Ntilikina? Well I suppose he could stay overseas, but assuming that's not a problem his worst case is probably a rotational wing with Nic Batum size and 3 and D skills. That's still a valuable player to have in your rotation. I've been conditioned to hope for the best but expect the worst in the draft and by this criteria Ntilikina doesn't look like a big reach at #5. Honestly, weren't we all hyped up about Isaac and Tatum mostly because they fit a position of need anyway? Every year there's at least one top wing worth drafting. If Miles Bridges had stayed in the draft the situation would be different, but as it is I'm more concerned that we get this one pick right instead of trying to package two perfect picks in a row.
That's pretty gutsy, going with Ntilikina at #5. One thing to keep in mind is that if the Kings do take a small forward at #5, and only Fultz and Ball as point guards have been taken before them, it pushes down the remaining point guards in the draft, potentially putting Ntilikina to #10. I don't know whether Ntilikina is going to be good or not, but as you indicate above, there's a lot of info out there to indicate his is project, which is ok if you're down in the draft, but not so much at #5. I doubt that Vlade would pick him at #5.
 

hrdboild

Moloch in whom I dream Angels!
Staff member
That's pretty gutsy, going with Ntilikina at #5. One thing to keep in mind is that if the Kings do take a small forward at #5, and only Fultz and Ball as point guards have been taken before them, it pushes down the remaining point guards in the draft, potentially putting Ntilikina to #10. I don't know whether Ntilikina is going to be good or not, but as you indicate above, there's a lot of info out there to indicate his is project, which is ok if you're down in the draft, but not so much at #5. I doubt that Vlade would pick him at #5.
That's a good point and I had the same idea until this weekend. Ultimately though I just don't like the small forwards in this draft all that much after Josh Jackson. Miles Bridges was my guy and he pulled out. We're going to be bad next year no matter what. I don't think we're so desperate for a SF that we have to use a top 10 pick on one this year. We might be able to get Bridges next year or maybe we could trade that #10 pick for a SF. In any case, I don't want to burn a top 5 pick on somebody unless I'm totally sold on them. Tatum and Smith are good prospects but I don't like them all that much for this team. I think we want to go as much as possible for unselfish playmakers who have shown that they're committed to playing defense. And Isaac at #5 is a riskier pick than Ntilikina I think. He's got all the physical tools you would want but someone is going to have to teach him how to play basketball now on both ends and that's a scary gamble at 5th overall.

The pool of players we're picking from at 5 isn't all that different from what we'd get at 8 (unless Jackson or Fox slip in which case those are easy picks to make). The main advantage of moving up from 8 to 5 is that we now have the luxury of picking the guy we like the best instead of waiting to see who drops. I don't see Smith/Ntilikina making it past New York and Dallas to pick #10 with both of them needing point guards. So the choice isn't really Tatum or Isaac and a PG it's Tatum, Isaac, Smith or Ntilikina. None of them will be there at 10. And of those 4 players, I actually like Ntilikina the best. He doesn't have the scorer's mentality of Smith or Tatum but he seems like a team player and his defense will keep him on the floor if he manages to be at least solid on offense. I'm still hoping for Fox at #5 but if that doesn't happen, I like Ntilikina the best of the options we'll have.
 

dude12

Hall of Famer
The closer we get to draft night, the less excited I am about Isaac and Tatum at #5. I just don't have a good feeling about either one. Tatum is the classic jack of all trades master of none wing for me. He's got good size and a go-to mid-post turnaround jumper but what else suggests he'll develop into a leading scorer? I see his best-case scenario somewhere around Tobias Harris level which is a nice player but not someone you build your team around. And Isaac scares me even more. I think people look at his size and his ball skills and get a little starry eyed talking about potential but how many times have we already been fooled by these stick-thin combo forwards with "next KD" hype in the past? Remember Perry Jones and Quincy Miller? Isaac looks good statistically and he checks all the boxes for people who think defense is more about wingspan and foot speed than strength, intelligence, and anticipation but we don't even really know who he is yet as a player. Almost every year I talk myself into some super long bouncy wing prospect and they go nowhere. He might be a star, he might be Marvin Williams. I can't tell and that's what scares me. And while I still think Dennis Smith Jr. has got a great chance to be an All-Star in the NBA he's more likely to be a Damian Lillard type of scoring point than an all-around team leader. I don't think we want to lock ourselves into years of mediocrity like Portland has by committing to a core group of players who don't put in enough effort on defense.

So where does that leave us? Fultz is off the board in the top 4 for sure. Hopefully Ball is too. He'd be fun to watch for 4 years but then what? If De'Aaron Fox and Josh Jackson both go 3/4 as expected (or the Lakers take one of them and Philly/Phoenix clean up the rest) we're looking at a situation where I don't really want any of the consensus best players on the board (Tatum, Isaac, Smith, Monk). Almost every year we see players penciled into the lottery because that's where everyone else has them who are mediocre at best in the league while players picked much later become stars. Who wants anything to do with Jahlil Okafor now? Does anyone still think Dante Exum or Marcus Smart are going to be All-Stars? Remember when Ben McLemore was briefly ranked as the best player in the 2013 draft? I really don't want this to be us (again). So if that's the situation I'm passing on all of them right now and taking Frank Ntilikina at #5. My primary goal in the draft is to swing for the fences and I think Frank is the only guy left up there who fits all of my criteria: (1) Is he already a difference maker on defense? Yes. (2) Can he develop into a two-way star if he maxes out his potential? Yes. (3) Does he fit the direction of the team? He can play on the ball or off the ball, he can shoot from outside, and he's an active pest on defense with the potential to guard all three perimeter positions. I'd say that's a yes.

Realistically speaking, we're a long way from competing. We can afford to take one of the youngest players in the draft and bring him along slowly. I also feel like we're relatively safe picking him over somebody like Smith, Tatum, or Isaac because if those guys don't reach their potential they're wasted picks. Smith becomes a black hole on offense who gets his points but doesn't help the team win. Tatum becomes a low-efficiency volume scorer who teases with good defensive effort every 5th game or so. Isaac can't get off the bench behind Skal and plateaus as a Donte Greene level tease. What's the worst-case for Ntilikina? Well I suppose he could stay overseas, but assuming that's not a problem his worst case is probably a rotational wing with Nic Batum size and 3 and D skills. That's still a valuable player to have in your rotation. I've been conditioned to hope for the best but expect the worst in the draft and by this criteria Ntilikina doesn't look like a big reach at #5. Honestly, weren't we all hyped up about Isaac and Tatum mostly because they fit a position of need anyway? Every year there's at least one top wing worth drafting. If Miles Bridges had stayed in the draft the situation would be different, but as it is I'm more concerned that we get this one pick right instead of trying to package two perfect picks in a row.
Frank at 5? If your enamored with him, you trade down a bit because he's not going that high. No way you take a risk like that. Take whomever is remaining from Fox, Smith, Jackson, Tatum. All 4 fit top profile and fit a need and with less risk....with the understanding that every pick has some risk. Frank? Love him at 10, would hate him at 5
 
As we all should know by now, draft position is meaningless after maybe the first pick. If we were to go back and redraft the last 10 years none would match the original. Divac and his team appear to have made some solid choices in the draft so I'll trust their judgement. FOX FOX FOX FOX! haha
 
http://www.cbssports.com/nba/news/n...or-paul-george-kings-trade-up-for-daaron-fox/

What do you think about this possible deal with Philly, getting Okafor at the #3? IMO, I'd rather have Jackson if the Kings did this deal.
I would do that trade with Philli if it assured Fox. I'm not a fan of Okafor, but hes on a 4mil a year rookie contract, we can lose him in a year or so.
The 10th pick trade with Detroit makes no sense as Gbiniji is another guard. If it was Stanley and the 12th for our 10th, I would be interested.
 

hrdboild

Moloch in whom I dream Angels!
Staff member
We can't trade McLemore, he's a restricted free agent. I can see a scenario where we want to make a trade to ensure we can pick Fox but it's going to require us to give up some actual assets and considering we already owe Philly an unprotected pick in 2019 I don't see what those assets might be.

A more realistic scenario is the trade down with Detroit from 10 to 12 if Monk is available that was proposed in that same mock draft (I would ask for a better player or a future pick though) or some kind of deal with Portland that gets us one of their picks plus one of their overpaid wings for prime buyout candidate Arron Afflalo.
 
I am ready to say if Fox goes Top 4 (50/50 odds) , the Kings will draft Jonathan Isaac at #5.

You heard it here first Kings fans! I see potential for greatness in this kid, and so does this NBA Scout:

You can make an argument (as one NBA scout did to me) that Isaac has the highest upside in this entire draft. The scout said Isaac, if he adds muscle, could someday be spoken of in the same "physically off the chart" tier as LeBron or Paul George.

Per CBS Sports


And as I outlined previously there is a case to be made to PASS on Fox even if he does fall to #5, since it will be easier to get PG help at #10 after drafting a SF at #5 than it will to get a SF at #10 after drafting a PG at #5.
 
http://www.cbssports.com/nba/news/n...or-paul-george-kings-trade-up-for-daaron-fox/

What do you think about this possible deal with Philly, getting Okafor at the #3? IMO, I'd rather have Jackson if the Kings did this deal.
That trade In this article makes no sense. Ben McClemore is a free agent and can't be traded. Furthermore, Ben does not get you 2 spots higher in a draft and then also getting the #3 player from the 2015 draft too??? Whoever wrote this mock draft does not know basketball.
 
Would anyone here be interested in trading with the Lakers to get the # 2 spot and drafting Lonzo Ball?

http://www.lakersnation.com/lakers-draft-rumors-l-a-open-to-trading-down-from-no-2-pick/2017/06/05/
I would strongly consider trading up to #2 for Lonzo Ball if we were able to pick up another mid 1st round pick by doing a salary dump trade with Portland or San Antonio.

It would probably take our #5 and #10 to move up to #2, so I would want to secure another 1st, if I were to trade #10 to move up.

If we draft Ball at #2 and we pick up another 1st, like #15 from Portland in a salary dump, I would target SF OG anunby or SF Justin Jackson with the #15.

The Kings would be a pretty exciting team:

PF: Skal / KK
SF: OG anunby/ temple/ harkless
C: WCS / Papa G / Leonard
SG: Heild/ Bogdan / Richardson
PG: Ball/ DC/ Galloway
 

kingsboi

Hall of Famer
And as I outlined previously there is a case to be made to PASS on Fox even if he does fall to #5, since it will be easier to get PG help at #10 after drafting a SF at #5 than it will to get a SF at #10 after drafting a PG at #5.
We need to take BPA at #5, period!

If Fox is BPA at #5, you take him and figure out who we take or do at #10 when that spot comes up.
 
Trading up to 2 doesn't have to involve moving both our lottery picks, but maybe taking on a lot of salary like Deng/Clarkson. I would take those rumors with a grain of salt though
 
New DX mock has us taking Tatum at 5 and then has Dennis Smith Jr. falling to 10 and us taking him there. While I'd love to get Smith all the way down at 10 I have a hard time believing he'll fall that far. He does have an injury history and seems disinterested on defense at times so maybe that's enough to push him down.
 
New DX mock has us taking Tatum at 5 and then has Dennis Smith Jr. falling to 10 and us taking him there. While I'd love to get Smith all the way down at 10 I have a hard time believing he'll fall that far. He does have an injury history and seems disinterested on defense at times so maybe that's enough to push him down.
I just cannot believe that Phoenix drafts Fox. Bledsoe, Fox, Knight, and Ulis is too much talent to ammas at one spot. Especially since having Booker basically eliminates the option of doing a platoon at 1-2.

In this draft, the top 5 players are excellent and can somewhat be shuffled. What I mean is that if the Suns were to draft Tatum over Fox they wouldn't be hurting themselves at all. While I believe Fox is better overall, for the Suns, Tatum is better. And to me, it does not a create a choice of BPA versus fit because of how talented they both are.

Therefore I cannot believe that Phoenix would pick Fox. To me, Phoenix will either trade up to 3 to get either Jackson or Tatum or trade down a few spots to take one of the more talented big men. I'd almost guarantee that Phoenix will take a three, four, or five. I do believe that they are the most predictable team in the draft overall.
 
I just cannot believe that Phoenix drafts Fox. Bledsoe, Fox, Knight, and Ulis is too much talent to ammas at one spot. Especially since having Booker basically eliminates the option of doing a platoon at 1-2.

In this draft, the top 5 players are excellent and can somewhat be shuffled. What I mean is that if the Suns were to draft Tatum over Fox they wouldn't be hurting themselves at all. While I believe Fox is better overall, for the Suns, Tatum is better. And to me, it does not a create a choice of BPA versus fit because of how talented they both are.

Therefore I cannot believe that Phoenix would pick Fox. To me, Phoenix will either trade up to 3 to get either Jackson or Tatum or trade down a few spots to take one of the more talented big men. I'd almost guarantee that Phoenix will take a three, four, or five. I do believe that they are the most predictable team in the draft overall.
I think it all depends on how they view Bledsoe. I would not be surprised if they dealt him in which case they would be looking for another PG as Knight is not in their plans leaving them with Ulis. I don't know how they view Bledsoe so I don't know what they might do.
 
Trading up to 2 doesn't have to involve moving both our lottery picks, but maybe taking on a lot of salary like Deng/Clarkson. I would take those rumors with a grain of salt though
For a #5 to #2 move up by taking a salary dump, you would probably need to take the horrendous contracts of both Deng and Mozgov off the Lakers hands. That would seem too much too me.
 
I can easily see Phoenix taking Fox. If you were Phoenix, would you trust Bledsoe as a key cog on your team? He's always hurt. Can't trust him as the main facilitator of your offense.
 
If Fox is on the board and the kings take someone else do the fans riot? Or do we trust Vlade to make the right selection even if its not the consensus pick?
 

bajaden

Hall of Famer
Looks like the next workout group is pretty talented.

Donovan Mitchell: 6'3", combo guard
Dominique Hawkins: 6'0", PG, posted a 44.5" max vertical and was a good defender at Kentucky
Caleb Swanigan: 6'8.5", PF. Great rebounder and shot 44% from the three
Cameron Oliver: 6'8", PF, 2.6 blocks and 8.7 rebounds. Can also shoot the three.
Erick McCree: 6'8", SF/PF.
Jabari Bird: 6'6", SG. Shot the ball well from the three.

A talented group of mostly 2nd round material.