Free Agency

roasthawg

roasthawg

Starter
#2,071
#2,071
KingsFan80 said:
My last post on this subject...I would have done it. A Young SG is going to make that much from here on out. It was a much needed position for us and he is solid and can shoot. I would much rather have him than Tolliver, Barnes and Temple combined. The high salaries are just new for us. In two years Cousins will probably make $30-$35 mil a season. The thought that David West is making $1.5 mil a year and we are paying Tolliver $8 Mil gives me a headache.
Click to expand...
The salaries for guys like Crabbe will come down in year three once things stabilize I believe. If the cap goes up thirty percent then eventually that'll mean roughly thirty percent increases across the board. Was Crabbe a $12mil guy before the cap increase? I don't think so.

If you're gonna overpay do it this year and next.... Some of these teams will really be regretting these deals come year three.
 
E

ESP47

All-Star
#2,072
#2,072
KingsFan80 said:
My last post on this subject...I would have done it. A Young SG is going to make that much from here on out. It was a much needed position for us and he is solid and can shoot. I would much rather have him than Tolliver, Barnes and Temple combined. The high salaries are just new for us. In two years Cousins will probably make $30-$35 mil a season. The thought that David West is making $1.5 mil a year and we are paying Tolliver $8 Mil gives me a headache.
Click to expand...
Are you new to being a Kings fan? I mean I somewhat agree with the roster moves you'd like to make but it seems as if you think that the Kings decided to take a bunch of low level guys over actual good players just for the hell of it. The good players don't want to come here. The team sucks and the city isn't fun. It's just the way it goes for Sacramento. We acquire good players through trades or the draft. That's it. When we were good, we had David West type players signing with us. But the fact is that we aren't good and the city is still Sacramento so a guy like Crabbe is going to chose Brooklyn over us based on the city alone. You have to understand that when we don't land players it's not for lack of trying. It's simply because they don't want to be here and there's not a damn thing we can do about it.

Crabbe might wind up being a really good player or he might wind up being just a solid spot up shooter. Adding offense is all the Kings have done for years and it's gotten them no where. Right now it's time to add defense and change the teams philosophy. We were the 3rd best offense last year with the worst defense. Adding Crabbe keeps our offense up there and does nothing to our defense. Another losing season ensues. I'd much rather have the 15th best offense and 15th best defense and see where we wind up over doing the same old crap that hasn't worked for a decade.
 
itzcoatl

itzcoatl

Bench
#2,073
#2,073
KingsFan80 said:
My last post on this subject...I would have done it. A Young SG is going to make that much from here on out. It was a much needed position for us and he is solid and can shoot. I would much rather have him than Tolliver, Barnes and Temple combined. The high salaries are just new for us. In two years Cousins will probably make $30-$35 mil a season. The thought that David West is making $1.5 mil a year and we are paying Tolliver $8 Mil gives me a headache.
Click to expand...

Haha. That David West example is apples and oranges. David West took a big paycut so he could ride Warrior coattails to a ring.
 
twslam07

twslam07

All-Star
#2,075
#2,075
The_Jamal said:
No it isn't. There's no reason Casspi can't be 13-15 PPG in 30-35 MPG in the above team construction. Dude has flat out become a good player the last 2 seasons and he's shown when he gets minutes, he's a valuable contributor on both ends of the floor. Also doesn't hurt he's shown obvious chemistry with our franchise guy. And people might not want to believe this, but Casspi was BETTER than Rudy last season, PPG be damned.

Team construction actually works better when you don't have 3 guys dominate the ball as we have the last 4 years while the other 2 fight for scraps. It's a big reason why every SG has faltered when they've come here; there's no room for them on the offensive end of the floor.

Cavs are a perfect example. Everything opened up when they reduced Love's role and let Kyrie/Bron operate with defenders/spacers on the floor.
Click to expand...
The Casspi at starting SF is always an interesting discussion. I wouldn't mind him playing there if we found good value for Gay, but it would be a downgrade at the position.

I've posted this before, but Casspi is actually much better at PF than he is at SF, and Gay is much better at SF than he is at PF.

SF - On/Off
Gay = +4.2 pts per 100 poss.
Casspi = -1.2 pts per 100 poss.

PF - On/Off
Gay = -7.7 pts per 100 poss.
Casspi = +9.3 pts per 100 poss.

It's one of the reasons the Barnes signing made some sense in my eyes. You keep Gay at SF the entire game with Barnes as the primary backup. Then you have Casspi acting more as the backup PF behind Cauley-Stein in the rotation.

EDIT: I essentially see him as a Marvin Williams type player who can knock down 3s, rebound, get out and run, & handle the ball/pass well for a stretch big.
 
Last edited:
G

Gilles

Starter
#2,077
#2,077
twslam07 said:
The Casspi at starting SF is always an interesting discussion. I wouldn't mind him playing there if we found good value for Gay, but it would be a downgrade at the position.

I've posted this before, but Casspi is actually much better at PF than he is at SF, and Gay is much better at SF than he is at PF.

SF - On/Off
Gay = +4.2 pts per 100 poss.
Casspi = -1.2 pts per 100 poss.

PF - On/Off
Gay = -7.7 pts per 100 poss.
Casspi = +9.3 pts per 100 poss.

It's one of the reasons the Barnes signing made some sense in my eyes. You keep Gay at SF the entire game with Barnes as the primary backup. Then you have Casspi acting more as the backup PF behind Cauley-Stein in the rotation.

EDIT: I essentially see him as a Marvin Williams type player who can knock down 3s, rebound, get out and run, & handle the ball/pass well for a stretch big.
Click to expand...
Season, during which effort and fighting spirit experienced huge fluctuations, is going to present a lot of skewed statistics:
  • combination of Rudy and Omri worked marvelously at 3 and 4 with Boogie (1047 poss., +.103 ppp) and WCS (only 176 poss., +.153 ppp), but were bad with double-K (518 poss., -.043 ppp);
  • at the same time combination of Omri at PF, KK at C with a guard instead of Rudy at SF was wonderful (344 poss., +.061 ppp), while Boogie/Omri as bigs were just solid (only 268 poss., +.027 ppp), and Willie/Omri bigs' combo was pretty bad (just 198 poss., -.031 ppp).
  • Only Casspi's presence at 4 brought any kind of success for Koufos in his Kings tenure: miserable -.095 ppp over the rest 2670 possessions.
And the fact is without Koufos on the floor Kings scored more than allowed! Just a note: the only team, that didn't make POs, doing the same, was Utah.

Anyway, who's a 3, and who's a 4, when both Rudy and Omri were both on the floor?
 
L

LA King Fan II

Bench
#2,084
#2,084
Rudy requested it by quitting on the floor last year. He might wake up a lil with great players him, but he is far from a 2nd or 3rd option in the NBA. Looking forward to getting someone who wants to play.
 
ParniValjak

ParniValjak

All-Star
#2,090
#2,090
kingsboi said:
Even if that is the case, I think it's pretty obvious to Rudy and the organization that they both are better off parting ways. This has been known since the end of the season IMO.
Click to expand...
Public perception is not always the reality. I think Gay wants to play for Joerger and coach most likely want him on the team. He certainly mentioned it in his press conference.


Now putting Gay on the trade table is a strategic move. He is 30 so his best years are most likely behind him in a year or two. He is signed to a great deal money wise BUT he is practically an expiring deal which means if we are to keep him, we will have to pay something close to $20 million a season which affects our plans going forward.

I think Kings are looking to get younger and hopefully get a player signed to a similar deal money wise as Rudy is on currently but longer. The team is probably a couple of years away from being a real contender at which point Rudy is on the decline. Kings are trying to jump ahead of the curve here and trade him while there is still value for a piece that fits into that timeframe.

Ideally its someone like Bledsoe but would not be surprised if the deal is for a younger player who is a contributor next season with bigger scope for improvement going forward.

This is not that Kings want to get rid off him at all costs because he doesn't fit or because he hates what Joerger is implementing. This is a different situation to Karl last season. Had we kept Karl, no doubt Rudy would have asked for a trade as would have Cousins.
 
ockingsfan

ockingsfan

Starter
#2,091
#2,091
I wonder if a team like OKC would consider a trade of Gay for Cameron Payne and Andre Roberson?

If OKC is going to try and keep Westbrook, they need fire power to replace Durant.

The kings go young with Cameron Payne as a future pg. Rumor was vlade really like Payne last year and tried to get another 1st round pick to get him.
 
roasthawg

roasthawg

Starter
#2,092
#2,092
ockingsfan said:
I wonder if a team like OKC would consider a trade of Gay for Cameron Payne and Andre Roberson?

If OKC is going to try and keep Westbrook, they need fire power to replace Durant.

The kings go young with Cameron Payne as a future pg. Rumor was vlade really like Payne last year and tried to get another 1st round pick to get him.
Click to expand...
Wouldn't be a bad idea for okc... I don't like it for us though.
 
kingsboi

kingsboi

Hall of Famer
#2,093
#2,093
Čarolija said:
Public perception is not always the reality. I think Gay wants to play for Joerger and coach most likely want him on the team. He certainly mentioned it in his press conference.


Now putting Gay on the trade table is a strategic move. He is 30 so his best years are most likely behind him in a year or two. He is signed to a great deal money wise BUT he is practically an expiring deal which means if we are to keep him, we will have to pay something close to $20 million a season which affects our plans going forward.

I think Kings are looking to get younger and hopefully get a player signed to a similar deal money wise as Rudy is on currently but longer. The team is probably a couple of years away from being a real contender at which point Rudy is on the decline. Kings are trying to jump ahead of the curve here and trade him while there is still value for a piece that fits into that timeframe.

Ideally its someone like Bledsoe but would not be surprised if the deal is for a younger player who is a contributor next season with bigger scope for improvement going forward.

This is not that Kings want to get rid off him at all costs because he doesn't fit or because he hates what Joerger is implementing. This is a different situation to Karl last season. Had we kept Karl, no doubt Rudy would have asked for a trade as would have Cousins.
Click to expand...
I mean the way I see it, the only Kings player that's been constantly in trade rumors is Gay. Ben was linked to Cleveland last trade deadline but other than that, it's Rudy trade rumors. I don't think that's a coincidence and I can't sit here and say they are all fake rumors, albeit some are. It boils down to whether the return warrants a trade. If not, then you have a expiring contract coming up and move him in February if the deals don't come to fruition in the summer time.
 
kingsboi

kingsboi

Hall of Famer
#2,094
#2,094
ockingsfan said:
I wonder if a team like OKC would consider a trade of Gay for Cameron Payne and Andre Roberson?

If OKC is going to try and keep Westbrook, they need fire power to replace Durant.

The kings go young with Cameron Payne as a future pg. Rumor was vlade really like Payne last year and tried to get another 1st round pick to get him.
Click to expand...
I see no reason at all for OKC to trade for Gay. They are going to be trading Westbrook, it's just a matter of when, not if. They are going in a full out rebuilding phase after that trade is complete so they will be holding on to their young assets for the foreseeable future.
 
K

KingsFan80

Guest
#2,099
#2,099
ESP47 said:
Are you new to being a Kings fan? I mean I somewhat agree with the roster moves you'd like to make but it seems as if you think that the Kings decided to take a bunch of low level guys over actual good players just for the hell of it. The good players don't want to come here. The team sucks and the city isn't fun. It's just the way it goes for Sacramento. We acquire good players through trades or the draft. That's it. When we were good, we had David West type players signing with us. But the fact is that we aren't good and the city is still Sacramento so a guy like Crabbe is going to chose Brooklyn over us based on the city alone. You have to understand that when we don't land players it's not for lack of trying. It's simply because they don't want to be here and there's not a damn thing we can do about it.

Crabbe might wind up being a really good player or he might wind up being just a solid spot up shooter. Adding offense is all the Kings have done for years and it's gotten them no where. Right now it's time to add defense and change the teams philosophy. We were the 3rd best offense last year with the worst defense. Adding Crabbe keeps our offense up there and does nothing to our defense. Another losing season ensues. I'd much rather have the 15th best offense and 15th best defense and see where we wind up over doing the same old crap that hasn't worked for a decade.
Click to expand...
I would say I am some what fairly new yes. I moved to the area about 7 years ago and had never really followed the NBA before. I really got into the Kings because they were close to me so I went to some games then I was hooked.
 
ockingsfan

ockingsfan

Starter
#2,100
#2,100
Bricklayer said:
Alan Crabbe:
2016-17 $18.5mil
2017-18 $18.5mil
2018-19 $18.5mil
2019-20 $18.5mil

Demarcus Cousins:
2016-17 $15.765mil
2017-18 $16.784mil
Click to expand...
Here is the GREAT thing about all these teams using up their cap space this year on these massive 4 year contracts....

In two summers, DMC will be a free agent and not many teams will have cap space, because they used it up this year and the rest will probably use it up next year.

By the time DMC has to make a free agency decision in the summer of 2018, the salary cap won't be jumping like crazy, like this and next year.

Therefore, IF DMC decides to leave us in the Summer of 2018, hopefully we can at least get a sign and trade for some good players or draft picks.

Unlike OKC, who got screwed because of the huge salary cap jump, Durant left without any chance they got anything back, because almost every team had ample max money cap space.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.