Kingster
Hall of Famer
We're dealing with internet communications. I can't see the wry look on your face. Next time send a selfie!
Willie Cauley-Stein: the 2018-19 Season watch
- Thread starter Ozymandias
- Start date
We're dealing with internet communications. I can't see the wry look on your face. Next time send a selfie!
That's the crux of the matter. I don't think WCS has known for sure who the real WCS is either. I think he's discovering who he can be every time he steps on the court. He's growing into the player I think Vlade was hoping he could be.
Kingster
Hall of Famer
I hope so!
Willie is playing like his contract is at stake. His offense is much better. Very little faking himself out and falling down. I still think he is a marginal rebounder considering his physical skills. Against the Wizards he was slow to rotate from the weak side, slow to take a charge, and not physical enough on defense. It is odd that he has become a pretty good offensive player, but the defense and rebounding have been so-so.
Kingster
Hall of Famer
It is very odd. Until recently I didn't know that he made the Top 5 NBA Non-Finishers In the Paint list for last season He was the only center on that list, with the other four players being guards. (Of course they razzed him on the NBA channel when they were going over the list). Against Washington he held true to last year's form in that regard. (How many times did he get stopped at the rim?) Very odd. He does some defensive things outside the paint very well (switching and defending on smalls), then stuff in the paint not very well (blocked shots, interior defense, rebounding). Joerger alluded to the fact in his last presser that he sent the message to get more playing time WCS needed to shoot outside less and inside more. So far this season he has done more dribble driving against opposing centers and has been better offensively overall in the paint.
Sac.1989
Starter
Hes doing everything he needs to do to get paid and he will if we dont choose to pick up the tab. Willie as much as being in the right place at the right time personifies the new age big - springs, energy, quickness. He is very comfortable as a key custodian of our push for pace style
Joergers message along with system is a good fit once the message is adhered to which it has been
Joergers message along with system is a good fit once the message is adhered to which it has been
Kingsfan2002
Bench
Here's @THEwillieCS15 on @youngwhiteside's 24-rebound game: "His guards just let him grab every board and just leave. I'm like, 'Damn, that's nice.' I've got, like, five guards who want to come get the
? Maan he needs to not talk to the media. It sounds terrible . You are playing well, the team just won, then this .
? Maan he needs to not talk to the media. It sounds terrible . You are playing well, the team just won, then this .
As long as he's playing like a grown man he can say/do as he pleases, I don't care if guys talk if they back up that talk.
John Galt
Starter
I remember seeing DeMarcus scowl at somebody who grabbed a bunny rebound from him. I thought it was a bad look, but I guess if rebound stats are your basis for paycheck, all star voting, etc... you probably end up noticing that stuff. Like Bibby would pore over the stat sheet to make sure he got credit for all his assists.
I have to look the other way.
parker
Bench
What's the problem with the quote? He's saying his guards work for rebounds, so he isn't going to and doesn't need to pull down 24.
JCTNKINGFAN
Bench
Just a few games back I remember one of his distractors complaining that he was "stealing" rebounds from his teammates. You can never satisfy some people, always reaching for something to criticize. Frankly, I think it's good he was giving credit to his teammates for being good rebounders. I like to see good team rebounding.
Kingsfan2002
Bench
Im not sure he was complimenting them. It was screaming, he cares more about his stats, so he can get paid.
Either way once again it brings his mental state back into question. Good news is his play (minus a pathetic amount of blocks) is vastly improved and has been finally consistent.
Kingster
Hall of Famer
What impressed the heck out of me in the Heat game (something I've been waiting to see for over three years) is that he kept coming, kept coming, kept coming. He was relentless running the floor. He used his speed to the maximum extent possible. Like Joerger said, even when he didn't get the ball sometimes when he was flying down the floor he still kept running, and as a result he created open shot opportunities for his team mates. He didn't go under a rock when Whiteside was blocking his shots and getting rebounds right and left. He relentlessly kept playing the game. That's what I want to see from Willie Cauley Stein.
Kingsfan2002
Bench
the the "damn thats nice" he gets the stats. This statement could be taken another way like you are. but it looks just like his "unicorn, im looking to get paid" comments.
Kingsfan2002
Bench
he looks great no doubt. I was harshly against this guy before the start of the year. he actually looks like a way way above avg 5 in this league right now. but plenty of guys played above avg to get paid then came crashing back down to earth after. I expect he will keep it up the rest of the team seems to be holding him accountable now that Fox and friends (lol!) have emerged as leaders. These kinda comments are still concerning tho thats all. its something to keep an eye on
parker
Bench
Didn't hear the quote live, but I take it as "damn that's nice" that Whiteside doesn't have to work as hard to get 24 rebounds as Willie would, who has guards who are also attacking the glass.
I'm less concerned with what Willie is saying than how he is playing. But if you heard a longer interview after the game, not just a quote out of context, he praised his teammates and their fight, saying they have a bunch of dogs who are relentless.
Say what you will about Willie, I never got the sense he is a selfish or bad teammate.
Last edited:
bajaden
Hall of Famer
Willie may not articulate things the way you would want him to, but he was stating the truth. There are only so many rebounds available during a game, and when you have other players like Fox and Hield grabbing 5 or so rebounds a game, and Bjelica grabbing 7 or so boards a game, that means a player like Willie isn't likely to have a big night like Whiteside did. And does it matter as long as you win? Donte Greene was a great talker. He said all the right things, but didn't do squat on the floor. Talk is cheap, it's results that matter.
bajaden
Hall of Famer
First, everyone wants to get paid. Is that sin to you? I assume that you have a job, and that at the end of every pay period you want to get paid for the work you did. You make it sound like it's a bad thing when every person that goes to work goes there to do a job to get payed. Second, did you listen to any of the other interviews after the game, like his post game interview with Doug and Grant. He talked about team play, and the fun everyone was having because no one cares who scores. He didn't sound like a player that was just interested in stats.
Of course if you hate Willie, that wouldn't fit your agenda would it? Lets forget the fact that the team won, and that Willie had a very good night. No, lets see if we can find something negative to talk about. Well done there!!!!
Entity
Hall of Famer
you could easily argue that Willie stats are pretty much aligned with last years. He is just getting a little more time on the floor and with the pace more shot attempts and more opportunities for rebounds. 13 attempts per game vs 10 at 50+% is obviously yield more points per game. Last year averaged 13 ppg this year right at 18. so 5 points off 3 extra attempts plus one extra ft a game.
burekijogurt
Starter
his perimeter defense in the Heat game was aces, especially late in the game. he is on my fantasy team (cause WC$), so I say keep filling that stat sheet . I actually have Buddy, Bjelica and Bogdan on the IL so its all good from that perspective. yes very homer drafting but its paying off .
. I actually have Buddy, Bjelica and Bogdan on the IL so its all good from that perspective. yes very homer drafting but its paying off .JCTNKINGFAN
Bench
I really don’t get this constant complaining about Willie saying he wants to get paid. Nowhere did he say he thought he deserved to get a big payday because of his previous performance. He said he had been working hard on aspects of his game that would improve his performance with a goal of getting paid. What the heck is wrong with that? It’s the American way.
He also made comments to the effect that he didn’t really understand what he needed to do in previous seasons, probably didn’t listen to coaching enough and was not as prepared as he should have been. He said that was on him, but he realizes now what he needs to do. That is youth. People called him lazy for that. How many of you perfect people listened to your elders, counselors, mentors whatever when you were young and took it all to heart? How many of you thought, with the arrogance of youth, that you already knew what you were doing? It takes a while for the light bulb to go off.
It’s not like he hasn’t been working hard. He has completely reinvented himself from the player he was when he was drafted. It’s his dream, it’s who he wants to be. I hear fans say, “This is not who we drafted him to be”. Last time I checked, fans don’t draft anybody. Apparently, the front office and coaching staff have been willing to let him develop in that direction.
As for wanting to get paid, I want to get paid. I like my job, I’m good at it, respected by my peers for my contributions, but at the end of the day, I want to get paid. I want recognition for my work and I want advancements and pay increases as my performance progresses. And that is exactly what has happened over the last 43 years. I started out in the labor pool and I have worked my way up to a very well compensated position. I worked hard, applied myself, determined what was required for advancement and did it. I did not exploit or cheat anyone, although some people claimed I made them look bad. But that was not my intent. I could not help it if they did not want to put forth the effort and take on extra responsibilities to advance and felt like that made them look bad if they did not match my performance. It was not always smooth, I did not always listen to good advice or understand what was needed, especially when I was younger, much like Willie. But in the end my hard work paid off. I got advancements and increased compensation. My company got good performance from me. A win-win.
So again, what is wrong with wanting to get paid?
He also made comments to the effect that he didn’t really understand what he needed to do in previous seasons, probably didn’t listen to coaching enough and was not as prepared as he should have been. He said that was on him, but he realizes now what he needs to do. That is youth. People called him lazy for that. How many of you perfect people listened to your elders, counselors, mentors whatever when you were young and took it all to heart? How many of you thought, with the arrogance of youth, that you already knew what you were doing? It takes a while for the light bulb to go off.
It’s not like he hasn’t been working hard. He has completely reinvented himself from the player he was when he was drafted. It’s his dream, it’s who he wants to be. I hear fans say, “This is not who we drafted him to be”. Last time I checked, fans don’t draft anybody. Apparently, the front office and coaching staff have been willing to let him develop in that direction.
As for wanting to get paid, I want to get paid. I like my job, I’m good at it, respected by my peers for my contributions, but at the end of the day, I want to get paid. I want recognition for my work and I want advancements and pay increases as my performance progresses. And that is exactly what has happened over the last 43 years. I started out in the labor pool and I have worked my way up to a very well compensated position. I worked hard, applied myself, determined what was required for advancement and did it. I did not exploit or cheat anyone, although some people claimed I made them look bad. But that was not my intent. I could not help it if they did not want to put forth the effort and take on extra responsibilities to advance and felt like that made them look bad if they did not match my performance. It was not always smooth, I did not always listen to good advice or understand what was needed, especially when I was younger, much like Willie. But in the end my hard work paid off. I got advancements and increased compensation. My company got good performance from me. A win-win.
So again, what is wrong with wanting to get paid?
There's nothing wrong with wanting to get paid. The problem some people have with Willie's comments is that it gives the impression that the primary reason he's playing hard now is because he wants to get paid. And combined with his wavering effort levels throughout the first 3 years of his contract and the very likely possibility that his contract his going to be rather substantial (along the lines of the 4 year / 72 million dollar contract extension that the Pacers gave Myles Turner) the concern is that Willie will get his big paycheck and get comfortable and revert back to being a mercurial free spirit who plays hard when he wants to.
Since the season started, however, I think there are reasons for optimism regarding his future production. DeAaron Fox is showing strong leadership skills and part of that means getting on players who don't look engaged. Buddy Hield seems to have an un-extinguishable workethic and that sets a good example too. As long as this group of players sticks together I don't think Willie is going to be able to slack off without hearing it from his teammates and that's a very good thing. Also, winning is fun and playing hard leads to winning so there's a kind of reinforcing feedback mechanism which should also work as a motivating factor. This group is starting to taste success for the first time and I don't think any of them want to go back to the way things have been.
To a certain extent Willie is simply paying for his past sins as a guy who talks a big game but only brings it 1/3 of the time. But you know what? The flip side of that is that it does show that he cares. And every big game he strings together pushes the memory of the bad games further into the past. I've been especially hard on Willie because I was initially not a fan of his game at Kentucky but I bought into his energy and commitment to defense as a rookie and then he's sortof coasted since then. Call it a "fool me once, shame on you, fool me twice... " thing. But I do want to believe he's turned a corner and right now he's making me a believer so I hope he keeps it up! Guys that succeed in the NBA all realize that it's not going to happen if you don't push yourself constantly and not everybody figures that out right away.
Kingsfan2002
Bench
he may not articulate things the way I? I want to want him to?
Everyone in the NBA world was calling out and laughing at WCS on his "getting paid" rant at media day. Seriously everyone! what planet were you on when this happened? or how about when he called himself the next unicorn? lol!!! are you kidding me man? he's been a total space cadet for a long time.
WCS has earned every bit of the criticism he gets with what he's said from college to now. let me say this again. since he was in college to now. one more time. from college to now. plus forget what he says. his play has been a huge inconsistent let down from college to now. there a reason he wasn't a one and done. plus it was his "potential" more than his actual playing resume that got him picked where he did. Like all bigs, teams reach on silly athletic 7 footers.
look he's been playing great. this team is exciting and its finally fun and entertaining. but theres a history of typically non motivated players that "get paid" after exploding on a contract year only to totally destroy that teams cap space and suck after that contract is signed. its been 7 games. your defense of him here is waaaaaay too early, and this talk is cheap nonsense you speak of is nonsense. teams have to keep all of his behavior and playing history in mind when they do pay these guys big.
I think WCS will get his money. he truly does seem to have figured it out, at least I hope so. BUT again were 7 games in.
Last edited by a moderator:
jcassio
Starter
No. I don’t care what the stats may suggest. Until this year, Willie would have a good game and then disappear for one, two or even three games. There’s no escaping the eye test on that reality. This year he’s finally putting together that missing link in his game: consistency. If you’re not looking at stats that show the major uptick in his game (consistency), then I suggest you’re not looking at the right stats.
Entity
Hall of Famer
just the normal stats PPG and rpg
nothing special
whozit
Starter
Why he wasn't a one and done is probably different than the reasons you think they are. Willie is a strange cat. There were many who questioned him staying in School. He marches to his own drum or so it seems.
And no I don't know him and no I don't understand him and that's okay.
allrightythen
Starter
Thus far his "down" games are still solid which is what we all hoped for. I don't know what clicked but keep it up my man.
The Hammer
All-Star
Bigs take longer.
Similar threads
- NBC Sports BayArea
- Kings News Links
