Tyreke Evans or Brandon Jennings?

[ElRey]

I think you can discard the possibility, actually. I really don't think he has the quickness to guard NBA point guards, nor do I think his game is particularly suited to PG, other than the fact that he needs to pound the ball to be effective. He's a lot like John Salmons in this regard. He'll probably do a lot of ballhandling a la Salmons and Brandon Roy because he can penetrate and making things happen, but I really struggle to see him as an NBA point guard.

Do you think Derrick Rose is quick? Evans seemed to have held his own against Rose in one of their high school games... even juked him real bad on one of the plays. Check out this youtube clip.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SrF0oE94yIg

 

[HighTopKicks]

And your certainly entitled to your opinion. I know that Jennings is the majoritys second choice after Rubio, but I wonder if anyone remembers comments by Petrie when asked if anyone else in europe blew his socks off while over there ( I'm loosely paraphrasing). His answer was no. Jerry Reynolds was asked about european players of value after Rubio and he said none would warrant being taken that high. Now they could just be throwing up a smoke screen, or they could be telling the truth.

If they're telling the truth, then I would assume that Jennings is off the draft board at the 4 spot. If so, then this thread, while fun, is irrelevant.

Jennings team wasn't playing at the time GP was in Europe. Their playoffs had been temporarily delayed by some kind of challenge.

It will be interesting to see if GP goes back when they start up again. Or, if Jennings will be at any of the camps since his team may still be playing.

 

[Vlade4GM]

Well we can debate his ability to play the point endlessly without a winner. What I don't understand is your belief that he's not quick. I don't have my quick meter handy, but the one thing no one has criticized him for (except you) is his lack of quickness. The reason he's able to get to the basket so easily is because of his quickness, combined with a deadly crossover. He also has terrific handles.

I'm always befuddled when a player that played point guard in highschool, comes to college and is asked to play out of position at the two and doesn't look that good doing it. (aka Holiday) Then, when moved back to his normal position plays well, but is still labeled a shooting guard by critics.

Well, to be fair, he didn't say he wasn't quick, he said he wasn't quick enough to guard PG's. Which I don't know if I agree with, but I think he has the athleticism and length to be at least adequate.

 

[Merdiesel]

Martin is always injured though...

...Evans could show enough to make our biggest trade chip expendable.

Not really a smart way to GM a team though, drafting a guy on the assumption that the player he'll back up will get injured giving him time, as well as the assumption that he'll shine in the minutes he gets. All to make the legit player trade bait.

...So uh.

I guess I'll take Jennings.

Martin is always injured because he always has to make a shot for himself...

If we get a guy who can spread the floor and can actually run our team the load will be way lighter for Martin.

 

[Merdiesel]

We might be underestimating this kid Jennings...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dath2wAhJbg


kid could end up being the steal of the draft.

 

[dj3ptspecialist44]

This is too damn hard to choose and like I've said before I wouldn't want to have to choose between either. You have youtube clips of Evans breaking off D Rose then you have Jennings doing the Harlem Globetrotters stuff it's ridculous. I like both of them and if either one of their names are called if we don't get Rubio I'll be happy. Evans has a slight edge, because of size and he can play the PG let's just put that to rest.

 

[ntn9107]

jennings

 

[CaAllDay]

i like both of these players still dont know, wanna see some workout videos, but i think the # 4 has to be between the 2.

 

[bajaden]

Jennings team wasn't playing at the time GP was in Europe. Their playoffs had been temporarily delayed by some kind of challenge.

It will be interesting to see if GP goes back when they start up again. Or, if Jennings will be at any of the camps since his team may still be playing.

It would be a waste of time since Jennings isn't on the playoff roster. Don't know about the camps. I would think he'd have to get his team to give him a release.

 

[beb0p]

And your certainly entitled to your opinion. I know that Jennings is the majoritys second choice after Rubio, but I wonder if anyone remembers comments by Petrie when asked if anyone else in europe blew his socks off while over there ( I'm loosely paraphrasing). His answer was no. Jerry Reynolds was asked about european players of value after Rubio and he said none would warrant being taken that high. Now they could just be throwing up a smoke screen, or they could be telling the truth.

If they're telling the truth, then I would assume that Jennings is off the draft board at the 4 spot. If so, then this thread, while fun, is irrelevant.

You could be on to something. I think Petrie is the type who would choose not to comment instead of lying outright. Smokescreen or not. He was asked a similar question last year and he said Gallinari impressed him and the Italian would go high. No smokescreen there.

Maybe it's because I've actually seen Jennings play. But there's no way he's a #4 pick. He was not ready for professional bball in Italy, and judging by his play, he would have been just barely ready for college. If he had gone to college, he would have been urged to stay at least another year.

Btw, Douby played PG during his soph year in college.

 

[nbrans]

Do you think Derrick Rose is quick? Evans seemed to have held his own against Rose in one of their high school games... even juked him real bad on one of the plays. Check out this youtube clip.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SrF0oE94yIg

Evans is really crafty with the ball, so it doesn't surprise he he can take points off the dribble. That's not the same thing as guarding them on the other end, and even in that youtube video you can see Rose going right around him without much trouble.

 

[hrdboild]

Maybe it's because I've actually seen Jennings play. But there's no way he's a #4 pick. He was not ready for professional bball in Italy, and judging by his play, he would have been just barely ready for college. If he had gone to college, he would have been urged to stay at least another year.

I seriously doubt he would not have been ready for college. His problems in Rome seemed to be directly related to lack of playing time and being forced to play out of position off the ball. Can you imagine putting a high school PG on an NBA team, then making him play SG and yanking him every time he makes a mistake? It would be a disaster. Just because he's not ready at 18 doesn't mean he'll never be a good PG. And in the end, the result of that trial by fire means he probably make less mistakes as a first year player in the NBA. We've never seen high school prospects play in the Euroleague before so there's no basis for comparison. Even some of last year's elite prospects like Rose and Mayo struggled in their first couple months in college. Every mistake is magnified when you're playing on a professional team.

 

[Kingster]

Well we can debate his ability to play the point endlessly without a winner. What I don't understand is your belief that he's not quick. I don't have my quick meter handy, but the one thing no one has criticized him for (except you) is his lack of quickness. The reason he's able to get to the basket so easily is because of his quickness, combined with a deadly crossover. He also has terrific handles.

I'm always befuddled when a player that played point guard in highschool, comes to college and is asked to play out of position at the two and doesn't look that good doing it. (aka Holiday) Then, when moved back to his normal position plays well, but is still labeled a shooting guard by critics.

I agree with you about Evans. He is definitely quick. I'm also skeptical of him being labeled as an overdribbling Salmons when he is one year out of college. To me he drips of talent, including defensive talent, but you've got to get a read on his work ethic to see if he will spend the time to revamp his shot and work to become great. Given Petrie's bias toward shooting, I doubt he picks Evans, but I'd like to see it.

 

[nbrans]

He's quick for a SG, but he's not quick for a PG. That's not really his fault, he's 6'5"/6'6" and little guys are normally faster. I just don't think he could really chase PGs all over the floor.

Also, the Salmons comparison, which I made previously, wasn't really meant as a detraction. I like Salmons just fine. But the reason for the comparison is that both are somewhat inconsistent outside shooters who pound the ball, test the defense, get into the paint, and make things happen. Neither guy is particularly effective spotting up or making things happen without the ball.

At the end of the season in one of the game threads I said that Evans was looking like a nascent Brandon Roy -- and I think that's the best case, a versatile 2 guard who can handle the ball, pass, and get into the lane. He's got a ways to go, but that's the best case scenario.

I still just don't think he's a PG. It was a college gimmick out of necessity, not something sustainable in the NBA. He'd get killed on defense chasing speedy PGs around, and I don't think it's where his future lies.

 

[beb0p]

I seriously doubt he would not have been ready for college. His problems in Rome seemed to be directly related to lack of playing time and being forced to play out of position off the ball. Can you imagine putting a high school PG on an NBA team, then making him play SG and yanking him every time he makes a mistake? It would be a disaster. Just because he's not ready at 18 doesn't mean he'll never be a good PG. And in the end, the result of that trial by fire means he probably make less mistakes as a first year player in the NBA. We've never seen high school prospects play in the Euroleague before so there's no basis for comparison. Even some of last year's elite prospects like Rose and Mayo struggled in their first couple months in college. Every mistake is magnified when you're playing on a professional team.

If I had come here and say we must use the #4 pick on a raw PG with low ball IQ, who can't shoot and lost his backup PG job midway through the season, and I don't say he's Brandon Jennings, I think a lot of you would tell me to get lost.

Let's not sugarcoat it, Jennings had a bad season. I know he's young but that's far from reassuring, it's not like no young player had ever played well there.

With Griffin, Rubio, Thabeet, Harden, and Hill; you get a pretty solid range of how good they'll be. With Jennings, it's all over the map. He is a huge gamble, with the emphasis on gamble. The point is not that Jennings doesn't have potential, he certainly does; the point is he is a high risk raw player. He is not bust-proof, in fact, he is one of the riskiest players in this draft. My point is, I doubt any team will take that kind of gamble with the #4 pick.

 

[bajaden]

He's quick for a SG, but he's not quick for a PG. That's not really his fault, he's 6'5"/6'6" and little guys are normally faster. I just don't think he could really chase PGs all over the floor.

Also, the Salmons comparison, which I made previously, wasn't really meant as a detraction. I like Salmons just fine. But the reason for the comparison is that both are somewhat inconsistent outside shooters who pound the ball, test the defense, get into the paint, and make things happen. Neither guy is particularly effective spotting up or making things happen without the ball.

At the end of the season in one of the game threads I said that Evans was looking like a nascent Brandon Roy -- and I think that's the best case, a versatile 2 guard who can handle the ball, pass, and get into the lane. He's got a ways to go, but that's the best case scenario.

I still just don't think he's a PG. It was a college gimmick out of necessity, not something sustainable in the NBA. He'd get killed on defense chasing speedy PGs around, and I don't think it's where his future lies.

If a kid played point guard in highschool, then how is it a college gimmick to play him at that position. I find that confusing. To me the gimmick was playing him at the two spot, because you already had a starting point guard.

Based on your description of him and your appraisal of whats necessary to play the pt position in the NBA, I assume then that you would pass on Magic Johnson if he were available today.

 

[bajaden]

If I had come here and say we must use the #4 pick on a raw PG with low ball IQ, who can't shoot and lost his backup PG job midway through the season, and I don't say he's Brandon Jennings, I think a lot of you would tell me to get lost.

Let's not sugarcoat it, Jennings had a bad season. I know he's young but that's far from reassuring, it's not like no young player had ever played well there.

With Griffin, Rubio, Thabeet, Harden, and Hill; you get a pretty solid range of how good they'll be. With Jennings, it's all over the map. He is a huge gamble, with the emphasis on gamble. The point is not that Jennings doesn't have potential, he certainly does; the point is he is a high risk raw player. He is not bust-proof, in fact, he is one of the riskiest players in this draft. My point is, I doubt any team will take that kind of gamble with the #4 pick.

I will be stunned if the Kings select Jennings with the fourth pick. I agree with you that he's just too big a risk at that spot. I know a lot of people want to swing for the fences and hit a homerun. But being an ex-ballplayer I can tell you that you seldom hit homeruns when your trying. They just happen. More than likely, that when your swinging for the fences, you'll strike out.

Now having said that. If its the bottom of the ninth and the bases are loaded and were down three, and the dude hangs a curve, well, I'm going to try and send it to Fresno. But thats not where we are. Lets just swing for a good solid hit, and who knows, maybe we'll hit a homerun.

Im happy to bore you with stuff all day long if you want...

 

[Widowmaker2k]

Obama Advises Maloofs on Draft Prospects, Likes Evans

"Phil asked him who we (the Maloof-owned Sacramento Kings) should take in the NBA draft," George Maloof said. "He liked Blake Griffin, of course; (Hasheem) Thabeet from Connecticut and he loved the kid from Memphis -- Tyreke Evans," the consensus national freshman of the year choice.

http://www.lvrj.com/news/46215342.html

 

[Sptsjunkie]

http://www.lvrj.com/news/46215342.html

I saw this too and had no idea what to make of this. I like Obama and I know he knows basketball better than an average President. But I really hope the Maloofs aren't going to overrule Petrie just cause Obama can put together a good PowerPoint presentation.

 

[bajaden]

I saw this too and had no idea what to make of this. I like Obama and I know he knows basketball better than an average President. But I really hope the Maloofs aren't going to overrule Petrie just cause Obama can put together a good PowerPoint presentation.

I think that as long as the King's don't accept a bailout, their fine.

 

[Sptsjunkie]

I think that as long as the King's don't accept a bailout, their fine.

Well, if he wants to bail us out with Lebron James, Dwight Howard and Dwayne Wade then he can choose our draft picks every year as far as I'm concerned.

 

[FakeInjury]

R u guys serious.....Jennings is going to be like Telfair, good for PR bad for the duration of his rookie contract. Maybe, im not totally against Jennings, but if you look at both dudes, pound for pound, Evans has more to offer in terms of durability rebounding and cieling.

 

[hammystyle]

If a kid played point guard in highschool, then how is it a college gimmick to play him at that position. I find that confusing. To me the gimmick was playing him at the two spot, because you already had a starting point guard.

Based on your description of him and your appraisal of whats necessary to play the pt position in the NBA, I assume then that you would pass on Magic Johnson if he were available today.

Tyreke Evans just isn't a PG. He could bring the ball up the court for 10% of the game because he's got a good handle and can pass, but he's just not a PG. Magic was a singular talent who broke the mold. There's never been a guy even remotely like him since, and trust me Tyreke Evans ain't the next one.

Memphis runs a one on one offense and they got better when he took over PG, because it was easier for him to play with the ball in his hands at the start of the play and he was their best player. BTW - their offense really wasn't very good, they won because they were the best defensive team in the nation.

 

[Kingster]

He's quick for a SG, but he's not quick for a PG. That's not really his fault, he's 6'5"/6'6" and little guys are normally faster. I just don't think he could really chase PGs all over the floor.

Also, the Salmons comparison, which I made previously, wasn't really meant as a detraction. I like Salmons just fine. But the reason for the comparison is that both are somewhat inconsistent outside shooters who pound the ball, test the defense, get into the paint, and make things happen. Neither guy is particularly effective spotting up or making things happen without the ball.

At the end of the season in one of the game threads I said that Evans was looking like a nascent Brandon Roy -- and I think that's the best case, a versatile 2 guard who can handle the ball, pass, and get into the lane. He's got a ways to go, but that's the best case scenario.

I still just don't think he's a PG. It was a college gimmick out of necessity, not something sustainable in the NBA. He'd get killed on defense chasing speedy PGs around, and I don't think it's where his future lies.

I just don't buy into the notion that a taller player is ipso facto going to get killed by the shorter point guards in the league. Magic Johnson got hurt by point guards like Stockton, but he hurt them right back. Harper with the Bulls was excellent as a defender. Evans has more defensive potential than Magic imo because he's quicker, and he is very long. With a taller backcourt you can "wall off" smaller point guards easier. Also, Martin and Evans can switch off on picks, making it easier to defend the pick and roll. Evans can use his size to great advantage on offense with the smaller point guards. He can post up. He can easily overpower them on drives. He can easily pass over the tiny point guards to Spencer or Thompson in the low post. He can be an excellent rebounder. There is a lot to be said for having a long backcourt.

 

[beb0p]

The question here is not whether Evans can play PG, he probably can, but whether he is a good PG, an entirely different question.

There are guys who can play PG if you put them there, guys like AI, Monta Ellis, Ray Allen (according to Doc), Jamal Crawford, Ben Gordon, even John Salmons; and they'll put up good stats but your offense becomes just packets of isolation. Evans is such a player, his best trick is scoring and his second best trick is also scoring. He's probably an ok fit for the triangle offense or in a system like the Magic where someone else is the playmaker. But Evans running the offense is not going to be much different from Beno running the offense. He'll fight for shots with KMart, ignore the post, and commit a bunch of TOs. And you'll see a lot of guys standing around while the PG tries to go one on one.

However, if we are committed to the Princeton, an argument can be made that we don't need a playmaking PG. But then the question becomes: is Evan a good fit for the Princeton, since he isn't a very motivated cuter when he doesn't have the ball. There're some things to like about Evans and there're things not to like about him. But at the end of the day, he's a scorer and he needs a lot shots to be happy. If a team doesn't offer him that role then it is pretty much wasting his talent.

 

[Kingster]

The question here is not whether Evans can play PG, he probably can, but whether he is a good PG, an entirely different question.

There are guys who can play PG if you put them there, guys like AI, Monta Ellis, Ray Allen (according to Doc), Jamal Crawford, Ben Gordon, even John Salmons; and they'll put up good stats but your offense becomes just packets of isolation. Evans is such a player, his best trick is scoring and his second best trick is also scoring. He's probably an ok fit for the triangle offense or in a system like the Magic where someone else is the playmaker. But Evans running the offense is not going to be much different from Beno running the offense. He'll fight for shots with KMart, ignore the post, and commit a bunch of TOs. And you'll see a lot of guys standing around while the PG tries to go one on one.

However, if we are committed to the Princeton, an argument can be made that we don't need a playmaking PG. But then the question becomes: is Evan a good fit for the Princeton, since he isn't a very motivated cuter when he doesn't have the ball. There're some things to like about Evans and there're things not to like about him. But at the end of the day, he's a scorer and he needs a lot shots to be happy. If a team doesn't offer him that role then it is pretty much wasting his talent.

I'm of the opinion that we don't need a typical playmaking point guard, not necessarily because of running the Princeton offense, but because the frontcourt players that we have can run the Princeton offense, or something like it, due their superior passing skills. Also, the argument is made about Evans not being a true point guard. Ultimately, one has to define what a true point guard is. Is Tony Parker a true point guard, for example? Would he be considered a pass-first set up guy, or more of a scorer? I think he's much more of a scorer, and that many of his assists are simple drop-downs to Duncan. Does that make Parker any less of a talent? No, it doesn't. Would anybody not want him on our team? Heck no.

 

[beb0p]

Even within shoot-first PG, there are different degree to their shoot-firstness.
If Evans can take care of the ball and shows the willingness to pass like Tony Parker then that answers the question - he can be a PG.

But we go back to the question: can he? It's not a given that Evans can rise to Parker's level of playmaking ability.

 

[bajaden]

Tyreke Evans just isn't a PG. He could bring the ball up the court for 10% of the game because he's got a good handle and can pass, but he's just not a PG. Magic was a singular talent who broke the mold. There's never been a guy even remotely like him since, and trust me Tyreke Evans ain't the next one.

Memphis runs a one on one offense and they got better when he took over PG, because it was easier for him to play with the ball in his hands at the start of the play and he was their best player. BTW - their offense really wasn't very good, they won because they were the best defensive team in the nation.

First off, I wan't comparing him to Magic. I was comparing Magic to the description set forth by someone else. Secondly, I think he can play the point. His skill level is good enough. Thats an entirely different issue than whether he's willing to change and adapt, which he would have to do in order to play the point in the NBA. One of the things I liked about him is that he played on a good defensive team.

BTW, I didn't say that their offense was good. I said it was better when he was at the point.

 

[Kingster]

Even within shoot-first PG, there are different degree to their shoot-firstness.
If Evans can take care of the ball and shows the willingness to pass like Tony Parker then that answers the question - he can be a PG.

But we go back to the question: can he? It's not a given that Evans can rise to Parker's level of playmaking ability.

I think that's the question with ALL these guys - what kind of player are they going to be four or five years from now? Evans is never going to have Parker's speed, but Parker is never going to have Evans' length. I don't think Parker is that great of a playmaker, so I think Evans can be as good of a playmaker as Parker. But it's a crap shoot on all of them, including Rubio, who it appears is the most popular candidate. I'd really like the Kings to take two point guards in this draft. That way they can hedge their bets a little. Maybe one of the two really turns into something special.