Training Camp, October 2023

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See_Hanks

See_Hanks

Bench
#241
#241
kingsboi said:
considering the end result, no. Regular season success is only one step towards the ultimate goal, its a process that needs constant fine tuning.
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But we have the core back. In their full first season together they took a laughing stock and put them in the 3rd seed. Do we lack players that can win a championship? If so, who? We could have won it easily last year. There were no teams that stood head and shoulders above any other team in the west.
 
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The_Jamal

Hall of Famer
#244
#244
kingsboi said:
a goal is great to set, just set some realistic ones is all I ask.
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That makes literally no sense in the context of sports. Or really any business-type venture.

If I'm leading any sort of group of people or coaching a team, I want us to shoot for the highest possible mark we can get. Will we get there? Probably not. But I sure as hell at the beginning of a year going to say "You know guys, we'll call it good if we get to the 2nd round". Or like imagine a Sales director saying "You know guys, if we just keep our numbers this quarter, that'll be just fine. Maybe like a 2% increase would be really great"

Realistically? No, we're probably not going to win a championship. We're like 1 of 8-10ish teams that are capable of doing it, absolutely, but I don't think we're top of the NBA ready yet. But I sure as hell don't want Mike Brown telling our guys "Second round is good enough yall, that's all we want this season".
 
kingsboi

kingsboi

Hall of Famer
#247
#247
Vinny Basketballerino said:
Nobody will ever come around to your understanding unless your referring to your fellow inmates in the looney bin you're in.

I showed my Nonna this thread. She said that you're "beyond the sauce". My friend that's a terrible place to be. That means not even a heaping serving of my nonna's sauce can help you. Very sad.
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time heals wounds as well as egos, I'll see you in May
 
kingsboi

kingsboi

Hall of Famer
#248
#248
See_Hanks said:
Yah but they were the 3rd seed. We owned the Lakers, were 2nd best on the road in the NBA by one game (1st in western conference) and we had the best offense by far. There weren't really any super teams last year so why on earth were the Kings not title contenders last year? Why aren't they this year? If you look at the west again this year there aren't really any super teams, just like last year. Most playoff teams this year (and play-in) will hover between .500 and about 10-15 games above .500. Do you think if we knocked out the Warriors that we couldn't have handled the Lakers? We own the Lakers, and they know it. The next step would have been playing Denver, who we were only 1-2 against in the regular season.

Personally where I think you don't get it right is that there are no super teams in the west. No dominating 60 win team. The one seed will probably have 55 wins and the last play-in team will probably have between 42-45 wins. Every team in the playoffs are title contenders, and the Kings are no different. We are a good team. A VERY good team. On paper we are as good as any team in the NBA and on the floor we have already proved we are. Do you think we will take a step back like the 2nd year of the Webber era where they were the 8 seed, barely above .500? This team, at this point in their evolution, is better than the Webber, Divac team. Not to mention teams that play together longer (meaning GOOD TEAMS) only get better. The core is back, and we added more 3pt shooting (which is kind of where the league is headed).

I am saying we will be a 55-59 win team this year and will be in the top 1st to 4th team in the west and will have another Pacific Division title.
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playing out hypothetical scenarios helps no body. The results matter. 3rd seed and a explosive offense is good but Brown always talks about taking that next step towards great, Kings aren't there yet.
 
kingsboi

kingsboi

Hall of Famer
#249
#249
Telemachus said:
When you finish 3rd in your conference and 1st in your division, any goal other than a championship would be unrealistic.
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those are regular season accolades that mean nothing but a pat on the shoulder, Kings are aiming for higher and as long as they continue to fail, they will eventually get there, one would hope at least.
 
kingsboi

kingsboi

Hall of Famer
#250
#250
The_Jamal said:
That makes literally no sense in the context of sports. Or really any business-type venture.

If I'm leading any sort of group of people or coaching a team, I want us to shoot for the highest possible mark we can get. Will we get there? Probably not. But I sure as hell at the beginning of a year going to say "You know guys, we'll call it good if we get to the 2nd round". Or like imagine a Sales director saying "You know guys, if we just keep our numbers this quarter, that'll be just fine. Maybe like a 2% increase would be really great"

Realistically? No, we're probably not going to win a championship. We're like 1 of 8-10ish teams that are capable of doing it, absolutely, but I don't think we're top of the NBA ready yet. But I sure as hell don't want Mike Brown telling our guys "Second round is good enough yall, that's all we want this season".
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you don't have to name a barometer of success such as 2nd round goal, however the wording could be changed in something along the lines of " every season we are looking to get better than the last " and leave it at that, continued strides towards the end goal is how to achieve it, not avoid everything else before it.
 
kingsboi

kingsboi

Hall of Famer
#251
#251
Turgenev said:
I don't get what the issue is. The players and coaches have identified championship contention as the standard they would like to hold themselves to. Good.
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there really is no issue, its just that I think Brown is thinking one step ahead of what the team is capable of and many believe that the team should aim higher without knowing how to get there first.
 
kingsboi

kingsboi

Hall of Famer
#252
#252
TheMobb said:
At this time last year would it have been realistic to aim for the 3rd seed and win the division?
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last year is done with. That success either will make the team better, neutral or a tad bit lower in terms of seeding due to potential injured players from last season coming back into form
 
T

TheMobb

Bench
#253
#253
kingsboi said:
last year is done with. That success either will make the team better, neutral or a tad bit lower in terms of seeding due to potential injured players from last season coming back into form
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You may be right that the Kings aren’t ready to be elite yet, but I think you missed the point of my post. Based on your logic, last year the Kings should’ve aimed for the play-in or one of the bottom seeds. There is no black and white, step-by-step progress a team is supposed to make (first year making playoffs first round, 2nd year make the 2nd round, 3rd year WCF, and so on).
 
kingsboi

kingsboi

Hall of Famer
#254
#254
TheMobb said:
You may be right that the Kings aren’t ready to be elite yet, but I think you missed the point of my post. Based on your logic, last year the Kings should’ve aimed for the play-in or one of the bottom seeds. There is no black and white, step-by-step progress a team is supposed to make (first year making playoffs first round, 2nd year make the 2nd round, 3rd year WCF, and so on).
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you are not applying my logic in the proper context. Just because you exceed expectations for one season doesn't make you an overnight contender. Especially if you don't advance in the Postseason.
 
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TheMobb

Bench
#256
#256
kingsboi said:
you are not applying my logic in the proper context. Just because you exceed expectations for one season doesn't make you an overnight contender. Especially if you don't advance in the Postseason.
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No exceeding expectations for one season doesn’t make you overnight contenders, however having the best offensive season in NBA history puts you in a position to be. There’s a reason Mike Brown is putting an emphasis on defense and physicality, because he knows with this offense if the team is anywhere close to average defensively, they are contenders.
 
Telemachus

Telemachus

Starter
#257
#257
kingsboi said:
last year is done with. That success either will make the team better, neutral or a tad bit lower in terms of seeding due to potential injured players from last season coming back into form
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Success does not follow the same formula for every team. If it did, there would be very little drama in wondering who would win every season. A team doesn't base it's goals off what happens in the post season. That is a poor barometer. There are too many factors that can dictate the outcome of any playoff series. What happens during the regular season is the best way to judge how good a team will be.
 
kingsboi

kingsboi

Hall of Famer
#258
#258
Telemachus said:
Success does not follow the same formula for every team. If it did, there would be very little drama in wondering who would win every season. A team doesn't base it's goals off what happens in the post season. That is a poor barometer. There are too many factors that can dictate the outcome of any playoff series. What happens during the regular season is the best way to judge how good a team will be.
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and did the Kings of last season show you that they were ready to take the next step?
 
kingsboi

kingsboi

Hall of Famer
#259
#259
Turgenev said:
I believe expectations are one of the key 'how to' components.
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Brown is a positive personality to be around, his energy and character is contagious. Whatever he says will be echoed by others because he knows whats necessary, if that means setting expectations that the the players can buy in to, it will be said. Whether it works out that way is another matter.
 
kingsboi

kingsboi

Hall of Famer
#260
#260
TheMobb said:
No exceeding expectations for one season doesn’t make you overnight contenders, however having the best offensive season in NBA history puts you in a position to be. There’s a reason Mike Brown is putting an emphasis on defense and physicality, because he knows with this offense if the team is anywhere close to average defensively, they are contenders.
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but how often do you have a team full of offensive minded first players become respectable on defense? wouldn't part of the solution be to play your defensive players in the regular rotation?
 
Telemachus

Telemachus

Starter
#262
#262
kingsboi said:
and did the Kings of last season show you that they were ready to take the next step?
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Absolutely. They overachieved against every challenge put to them last season. In the playoffs, they took the defending champions (probably the most experienced playoff team) to 7 games. A couple of plays go differently, and the outcome is different. The Kings didn't looked overwhelmed in the playoffs, they simply showed some inexperience.
 
M

mrlaze

Bench
#263
#263
I cant imagine my boss saying, "As long as you achieve 75% of your goal, you're good." But I think thats whats happening in the world. IMO A leaders job is to aim high and push those around them.

Also of note, I'm not saying they will or should win a ring this year. They can and that's what they should be aiming for, for the next 4-5 years.
 
SacTownKid

SacTownKid

Hall of Famer
#264
#264
Brown didn't come out and proclaim the Kings are the favorites to win the title. So, no big deal. The next logical step is to make it into that crop of 5-6 teams that have a legit shot to make it out of the West and that's the only place for a team like the Kings to go. Now, the hope is to not become a one hit wonder like the Wolves awhile back. In a league of parity that parity usually comes with one of the upper or middle teams falling.
 
kingsboi

kingsboi

Hall of Famer
#267
#267
Telemachus said:
Absolutely. They overachieved against every challenge put to them last season. In the playoffs, they took the defending champions (probably the most experienced playoff team) to 7 games. A couple of plays go differently, and the outcome is different. The Kings didn't looked overwhelmed in the playoffs, they simply showed some inexperience.
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well, if last season wasn't a flash in the pan, then that experience should elevate their game another notch then
 
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