The truth

Truth is we suck and GP needs to do something and quickly! I had all night at work to think about it and it doesn't feel any better this morning.:(
 
Nice post, VF. Well stated; hits home. I was at the game last night. How embarrasing - tld my wife as we were driving home that it just might be time for a paper bag next game - the *unknown* fan.... Geesh.

Highlight of the game was the ovation for Pollard. That's damn sad. Oh ya, and my most enjoyable, if blatantly sarcastic, cheering moment was rooting for the guy to sink the half court shot during time out.

Time for change. Do him a favor and fire Adelman. Assign Turner as interim coach. Either that, or completely overhaul the team with trades that actually fit into what Adelman runs (Princeton O, etc.), hope for a top lottery pick, and re-tool for next year. Heck, do both - but do SOMETHING!
 
Wuster said:
To allow time to evaluate him and/or bring in new blood.
Click to expand...

Quite frankly, Elston has shown very little. Doesn't seem to have any answers himself, and is theoretically our defensive coach (along with Dunn) -- both defensive specialist guards back in the 80's. Being the defensive coach of the Kings is not something I would exactly hang my hat on.

One of those moves that teams do sometimes, but just no hope. That assistant has been there all year. Team already knows him. ALready knows his voice. Not even going to get an artificial "show off" bump out of the guys. If Rick is a problem, the assistants are likely just as much. Different if you have some young hotshot over there chomping at the bit. But Elston?

If you're looking for a shakeup, why not just shake it up and go hire Porter or whatever? if you're not looking for a shakeup, might as well just let Adelman coahc out the string and leave at the end of the year.
 
I'm okay with the Porter strategy. At this point, the major shake-up is needed. I also doubt Turner is the answer. I wouldn't go so far at to say no hope; rather look at it as a means to a better coaching end. That end may be far off and certainly someone else.
 
Bricklayer said:
Quite frankly, Elston has shown very little. Doesn't seem to have any answers himself, and is theoretically our defensive coach (along with Dunn) -- both defensive specialist guards back in the 80's. Being the defensive coach of the Kings is not something I would exactly hang my hat on.

One of those moves that teams do sometimes, but just no hope. That assistant has been there all year. Team already knows him. ALready knows his voice. Not even going to get an artificial "show off" bump out of the guys. If Rick is a problem, the assistants are likely just as much. Different if you have some young hotshot over there chomping at the bit. But Elston?

If you're looking for a shakeup, why not just shake it up and go hire Porter or whatever? if you're not looking for a shakeup, might as well just let Adelman coahc out the string and leave at the end of the year.
Click to expand...

indeed

the kings do need a shakeup. this much is evident. it is simply a matter of "when" GP gets around to it and "who" GP trades/fires/acquires. things are bleak, but they could be looking up come next season if the right moves are made. we don't have anything to build on, really, but a few pieces are in place. an effort should be made to re-sign bonzi wells at a reasonable salary. he's no superstar, but he's got the attitude and desire we want to prevail in the lockerroom and on the court. SAR, at his price, is worth keeping. i'm only in favor of keeping him, though, if we move him to starting SF, to the bench, or if we acquire a defensive/rebounding madman at center. otherwise, he's just another defensive liability. bibby, as flawed as he is, has the mentality of a champion. he's worth keeping, though he's not a lock to return, either. with miller, it's the same. like bibby, great offensive presence, but no defense to speak of. i say keep him, but only if the kings pursue a PF with some interior defensive presence and some rebounding ability.

now, one of the most controversial topics to hit kingsland in a while: the peja stojakovic situation. i say trade him for whatever talent you can get. it's not necessary to trade him for starting material, because i'm in favor of starting rahim at the SF, where his defensive and rebounding weaknesses will be less noticeable. i still say a peja to chicago for deng is one of the most beneficial [and likely] trades conceivable. the draft is important, too. draft a young BIG MAN with upside who you can bring in for limited minutes off the bench. we'll be in the lottery, most likely, but we won't have a top 5 pick, so an impact player will likely out of reach. but we can still look to the future. now, the bench needs a revamping as well, but, imo, a more balanced starting unit is most necessary. the situation with the kids needs to be resolved by the end of the season as well. martin and garcia are both, essentially, shooting guards with some raw talent, but limited comfort in the nba. we've got two young guys who do basically the same thing. the kings need to decide which one they wanna keep, and package the other in a trade. they also need to find a way to dump thomas' contract.

brad miller
[defensive PF]
shareef abdur rahim
bonzi wells
mike bibby

brian skinner
luol deng
kevin martin OR francisco garcia
ronnie price
...

this, to me, is an acceptable, and reasonable, start going into next season. i don't know who the starting defensive PF is going to be. it can be brian skinner, for all i care. just give me a guy who will contest shots in the lane and pull down a reasonable amount of rebounds for the position. it's not a championshipn team, and it only accounts for one possible trade scenario (peja for deng), bu i guarantee it'd be a team over .500. that's all i'm willing to ask for from now to next off season: changes that will put this team above .500.
 
Padrino said:
indeed

the kings do need a shakeup. this much is evident. it is simply a matter of "when" GP gets around to it and "who" GP trades/fires/acquires. things are bleak, but they could be looking up come next season if the right moves are made. we don't have anything to build on, really, but a few pieces are in place. an effort should be made to re-sign bonzi wells at a reasonable salary. he's no superstar, but he's got the attitude and desire we want to prevail in the lockerroom and on the court. SAR, at his price, is worth keeping. i'm only in favor of keeping him, though, if we move him to starting SF, to the bench, or if we acquire a defensive/rebounding madman at center. otherwise, he's just another defensive liability. bibby, as flawed as he is, has the mentality of a champion. he's worth keeping, though he's not a lock to return, either. with miller, it's the same. like bibby, great offensive presence, but no defense to speak of. i say keep him, but only if the kings pursue a PF with some interior defensive presence and some rebounding ability.

now, one of the most controversial topics to hit kingsland in a while: the peja stojakovic situation. i say trade him for whatever talent you can get. it's not necessary to trade him for starting material, because i'm in favor of starting rahim at the SF, where his defensive and rebounding weaknesses will be less noticeable. i still say a peja to chicago for deng is one of the most beneficial [and likely] trades conceivable. the draft is important, too. draft a young BIG MAN with upside who you can bring in for limited minutes off the bench. we'll be in the lottery, most likely, but we won't have a top 5 pick, so an impact player will likely out of reach. but we can still look to the future. now, the bench needs a revamping as well, but, imo, a more balanced starting unit is most necessary. the situation with the kids needs to be resolved by the end of the season as well. martin and garcia are both, essentially, shooting guards with some raw talent, but limited comfort in the nba. we've got two young guys who do basically the same thing. the kings need to decide which one they wanna keep, and package the other in a trade. they also need to find a way to dump thomas' contract.

brad miller
[defensive PF]
shareef abdur rahim
bonzi wells
mike bibby

brian skinner
luol deng
kevin martin OR francisco garcia
ronnie price
...

this, to me, is an acceptable, and reasonable, start going into next season. i don't know who the starting defensive PF is going to be. it can be brian skinner, for all i care. just give me a guy who will contest shots in the lane and pull down a reasonable amount of rebounds for the position. it's not a championshipn team, and it only accounts for one possible trade scenario (peja for deng), bu i guarantee it'd be a team over .500. that's all i'm willing to ask for from now to next off season: changes that will put this team above .500.
Click to expand...

Well, but you can see what happens there -- maybe the same sort of paralysis effecting Geoff. As you go down the list, and there's alwasy SOMETHING to like about each guy, you end up throwing almost all fo them into the "keep" bin and not changing much at all.

If you want to have a hope of being good again -- and by good I don't mean 500 or hoping to sneak back to 50 wins, but good as in mattering, MOST of he major pieces of this team have to be swapped out. Not necessarily all -- but 80% of the same lineup isn't going to get it done, and 60% probably not either. And of course its the same thing if you decide to tear it down and rebuild. Which may actually be the way to go. You don't rebuild with a whole stack of old vets up ahead squishing your kids. You move those vets for picks and youngsters and see what you have, while keeping no more than 2 or 3 of the vets around to try to maintain order.

Now in another thread on this board I just got done arguing Bonzi coould/should be one of those vets. But if you're rebuilding from the ground up, I think the last few weeks have shown why you could make a good case for keeping just the Miller/Mike pair and going young everyone else. Two old guys who can play well off each other and give a sense of order to a bad team. Also play maybe the two hardest positions to find. But in any case, just a couple of guys to provide a mini-skeleton, then completely rebuild. Half measures will only get you half results. Or worse -- might end up like we are right now.
 
IMO if you look at this team, it consists of a bunch of good players that are being forced into a system that does not work anymore. I think this team deserves a new coach and some trades to get things back in order. I think one of the reasons Peja was not traded instead of C-Webb was because the team thought Peja was on the rise of becoming an allstar calibar player and that he would lead the team the way he did in his 03-04 year but obviously there were other players like Doug, Bobby, and Vlade who helped him put those kind of MVP numbers. To me, that was the biggest mistake this team made.
 
SoupIsGood said:
I'm sorry but this would have been perfect, brawl jokes can't be going outta style can they
Click to expand...

What's NOT in style around here is creating phony quotes so you can ridicule them or use them as a basis for ... well, why you did it escapes me.

Come on, Soup. I expect that from some posters; I didn't expect it from you.
 
The other thing different this year is the media coverage. Where are the Maloofs? Where is Geoff Petrie? They are keeping verrrrrry quiet. They should be talking about how they're going to fix things. Talk about putting heads in the sand!

I say, ditch Petrie and the whole coaching staff.......(my umbrella is now UP)
 
twodogmac said:
The other thing different this year is the media coverage. Where are the Maloofs? Where is Geoff Petrie? They are keeping verrrrrry quiet. They should be talking about how they're going to fix things. Talk about putting heads in the sand!

I say, ditch Petrie and the whole coaching staff.......(my umbrella is now UP)
Click to expand...

Thank God for small miracles.

The last thing the Maloofs and/or Petrie needs to do is say ANYTHING to the local rabid media. If they have things to say and do, I hope they say and do them as FAR away from the news hounds as possible until every i is dotted and t is crossed.

One of the BIGGEST problems this team has had in years was fueled primarily by "reporters" who couldn't wait to put the latest dirt out in front of the public, without a regard to what it might do to the team, and whether or not it was even correct.

Just because you can't see the earthquake doesn't mean it's not gonna hit.
 
VF21 said:
What's NOT in style around here is creating phony quotes so you can ridicule them or use them as a basis for ... well, why you did it escapes me.

Come on, Soup. I expect that from some posters; I didn't expect it from you.
Click to expand...

Huh?

I was not ridiculing (sp?) anyone, I was poking a little fun at the Pacers.

Oops?
 
VF21 said:
Just because you can't see the earthquake doesn't mean it's not gonna hit.
Click to expand...

I couldnt agree more, VF. But I think the real question is: If a tree falls in the forest, does...ah, nevermind.;) Be patient people...it will happen.
 
kingsfan52miller said:
oh, u changed my quote and i thought u were trying to say that i put that
Click to expand...

Oh, no ;) Sorry yo

Is it bad that everytime I read an opposing fan say "I was scared to move down to the front seats" that I think of wacko Jacko? :o lol
 
Sorry, Soup. I misunderstood your post...

Self-deprecating humor isn't only for Kings fans, I suppose, and who better than Pacer fans to prove it?

;)
 
VF21 said:
Sorry, Soup. I misunderstood your post...

Self-deprecating humor isn't only for Kings fans, I suppose, and who better than Pacer fans to prove it?

;)
Click to expand...
You learn to appreciate self-deprecating humor when you your entire season gets yanked out from under your feet by the same dude for two years straight...... grumble grumble



What's that saying? Something like Tradgedy + Time = Comedy? (I think I just butchered that one) Guess that's where I'm at. :cool:
 
SoupIsGood said:
You learn to appreciate self-deprecating humor when you your entire season gets yanked out from under your feet by the same dude for two years straight...... grumble grumble

What's that saying? Something like Tradgedy + Time = Comedy? (I think I just butchered that one) Guess that's where I'm at. :cool:
Click to expand...

Here's a deep and insightful quote for you (from one of my two all-time favorite movies):

It's easy to grin
When your ship comes in
And you've got the stock market beat.
But the man worthwhile,
Is the man who can smile,
When his shorts are too tight in the seat.
Click to expand...
 
piksi said:
If the fans were better organized (like in Europe) it would be easier to be heard
Click to expand...

It would be awesome to see kings fans singing songs for the kings during the game. Instead of the crappy *** bass music every time the team runs up and down the floor. A packed house chanting kings songs(which dont exist). Then again kings fans are good nba fans but still rookies when in comparrison to Manchester United, Liverpool, or Newcastle football fans.
 
Last edited:
If I wanted to be a good football/soccer fan, I'd follow football/soccer. Sorry, but I would prefer to be cheering the play of my team on the court rather than singing songs to the players.

;)

EDIT: Correct, SIR HENRY!
 
GreenKing said:
It would be awesome to see kings fans singing songs for the kings during the game. Instead of the crappy *** bass music every time the team runs up and down the floor. A packed house chanting kings songs(which dont exist). Then again kings fans are good nba fans but still rookies when in comparrison to Manchester United, Liverpool, or Newcastle football fans.
Click to expand...

Different sport. Much more time to be singing songs to soccer players because nothing much is actually happening on the field. :p Have to do SOMETHING to stay awake. ;)
 
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