Summer League 2023 open thread

[Rain man]

Well I think you are extremely late to the party compared to me, and obviously are lacking context, context which is easily found for free online, so I think your take is lazy and unsubstantiated, based on some absurdly small sample size. OPM? this is a matter of self amusement for you.. I've followed O-Max since recruitment, probably at least 4 years...


O-Max is a rotation guy as a rookie, Edwards is a 3rd stringer destined to be buried on the bench. You wanna write love stories about Kessler Edwards while he's literally got a case of butterfingers, so be it. Go for it, wear yourself out. Much will come from it for sure! Sounds like clearly a case of tunnel vision to me, you've searched the entire horizon and came back with Kessler Edwards as the answer to the Kings ills? Do you believe in the tooth fairy as well?

Whatever man. I hate the "I have followed x player for years, so I am the only one who can talk about him" schtick. This board is worse when people claim to have inside information or the exclusive right to have takes on a topic just because they know someone or watch someone more closely, and then try to shut down all conversation on the topic. I generally like your posts and think you bring a lot to the table, but I don't think you need to disparage other people just because you have decided you are an expert on the subject.

I may not have followed OMP for 4 years, but I also know a thing or two about basketball (most people on this board do too), and have a good idea of what skills he will NEED to succeed in the NBA (regardless of his college skill set). First, my initial post comparing OMP and Kessler's 3PT shooting in the summer was mostly tongue in cheek (because of how much people are fawning over OMP on this board), and I even noted the extremely small sample size. But I jokingly noted that if people can make dramatic predictions and conclusions based on college play and combines, then I can do the same on summer league. The point is that all of these dudes are raw and have to grow and get better. I don't know how you (or anyone) can say that OMP is a rotation player in the NBA but discount that Kessler can get there too. Kessler is a year older than OMP and spent most of his two years buried in Brooklyn.

I acknowledged that Kessler is perhaps not the answer. He has to really improve his shooting to do so. But why can't he? I don't think he is a savior, but if he shoots 40% from 3PT, he is a rotation/starter level player in the NBA. That is why I am willing to see if he can figure it out. And I don't care how much you watched of OMP in college and what his skills were in college. He absolutely HAS to develop a three point shot to be a productive NBA player, especially in Dallas. A non-shooting, dunk and D, is not a great fit for them, and will kill their spacing playing alongside their centers. So maybe that is what he did in college (I don't really know because I didn't watch him for 4 years), but watching him play now, watching the NBA, and having an idea on what I think it takes to be successful in the NBA, he NEEDS an outside shot. But he has the tools and athleticism where if he develops into a 38-40% 3PT shooter then he has a rotation/starter spot as well.

 

[mrlaze]

Everyone has an opinion on basketball and unless you're a successful NBA GM that's all it is.

I've blocked several people who have went so far as to insult other memebers. IMO thats more disrespectful than some of the things I've been reprimanded for. I assume these people have messages boxes full of Moderator warnings.

 

[Tetsujin]

Everyone has an opinion on basketball and unless you're a successful NBA GM that's all it is.

I've blocked several people who have went so far as to insult other memebers. IMO thats more disrespectful than some of the things I've been reprimanded for. I assume these people have messages boxes full of Moderator warnings.

Man, if you could only see the pages worth of reprimands I got from VF21

 

[Telemachus]

Its funny how that happens, the experts show up! hahaha.. You follow an obscure player for years, then they become popular and all of a sudden every EXPERT with an opinion thinks they know better than those following the story much closer for years..

Sure was a bunch of experts running around this forum hating on Fox for years... Meanwhile the complaints are so unsophisticated its like some 13 year old kid who eats 1000 grams of sugar everyday n hasnt picked up a basketball since gym class must've made em.

Always found that fascinating.. Meaning somewhere along the way some person goes from knowing NOTHING, to thinking they know best, but whats the catalyst for that feeling?

It's like Darius Garland.. I first saw him play when he was like 5'4... When I first saw Tyler Herro play he wasnt an inch above 6' .. But at some point unbeknownst to me, some random day it passed by without me noticing, buncha people went from knowing nothing about players like this, to knowing more than me, JUST LIKE THAT, BOOM! WHIZ! ZOOM! But how?

So as someone whos just constantly being outdueled by all these brilliant experts.. it's exasperating. no amount of prep work can ready you, but then I remember; "I'm not a politician, i'm not a salesman, think what you want!" I'm not gonna sit here and argue with you about if the sky is blue or not, believe its black or grey or green, idgaf... You sit there rehashing old news, just because itsfresh news to you, doesnt mean its fresh news to me, thats called context, far as im concerned your years late, this is more a conversation for last summer from my POV.

But thats why I like to post about the players ACTUALLY DURING THE GAMES / SEASONS.. Ya see, because at least it filters comments such as these, as in fact way late to the party.. I'm worried bout the 2026 draft more than the 2023 on at this point, slowpokes aint holding me back..

Cuz ya know what, the miserable fans who feel the need to tear into everyone elses players, they arent bright enough to be discussing O-Max during the college season, thats what I've found. They lack the attention span. They need to wait to be told whos important enough to tear into, they need their status displayed first, wait til he gets drafted, wait til SL, n then judge him on SL not his full body of work..

N really when you look at these patterns of behavior... Are we really talking basketball here? Cuz to me, this seems to be much more in the realm of PUBLIC RELATIONS/Propaganda..

I like reading some of your takes, but you have to stop pretending that you are the only one watching basketball other than the he NBA on a regular basis. And the idea that your opinion is the only correct one to the point you feel like it is necessary insult those who disagree with you is a very bad look. I have news for you. You will get some right and will still be wrong a lot. That is how it works for everyone, including those who watch a lot more basketball than you. You will find a lot of fans here who watch a lot, but don't feel the need to puff out their chest with pride to declare it to the world. Most of us do this for fun and don't feel the need constantly pat ourselves on the he back or put others down to make our point. I say this to try to help you to be more civil in your discussions. Otherwise, you will likely over time end up on most fans block list.

 

[miltonap]

I don't have any issue with him saying he knows a lot if anything it just makes me value his opinion more because obviously he watches way more basketball than most people on this board.

I think it's valid to call out posters when they say things that are wrong and to tell them they don't know what they're talking about no need to get butt hurt about it.

I mean it's just basketball it's good to learn things so I don't really care about being right or wrong just trying to learn things.

If you get offended because you got told what you said was dumb then you're taking things too personally imo

 

[Telemachus]

I don't have any issue with him saying he knows a lot if anything it just makes me value his opinion more because obviously he watches way more basketball than most people on this board.

I think it's valid to call out posters when they say things that are wrong and to tell them they don't know what they're talking about no need to get butt hurt about it.

I mean it's just basketball it's good to learn things so I don't really care about being right or wrong just trying to learn things.

If you get offended because you got told what you said was dumb then you're taking things too personally imo

I have no problem when people disagree with each other. The problem comes when they start calling others names instead of simply stating their case.

 

[mrlaze]

I wasnt even the target of the name calling. So no offence was taken on my part.

It shows immaturety and lack of civil discourse. I don't want, nor need, to be friends with everyone. So if you act immature, or say some egregious crap, you just let me know not to waste my time.

 

[Rain man]

Having an informed, but different opinion is not lazy. It is having an informed, but different opinion.

The funny thing with the debate about Prosper is that both sides can technically be right. My point has been that Prosper (and Kessler) need to develop consistent and reliable 3PT shooting, above 38%, to be rotation/starter level 3/D wing contributors in the NBA. Ozy countered that Prosper has never been a 3/D wing, but rather spent his entire college career being more of a dunk/D 4, and that picking him apart for his lack of shooting and labeling him a 3/D wing is lazy and doesn't understand the game that he played in college.

But both of those can be right. As I said in my post, I never watched Prosper in college, and I appreciate people like Ozy who watched him for 4 years and can provide that context. But I also really don't care about his role in college. I care much more about how his game translates to the NBA. I find way more value in watching how he plays in an NBA offense, with NBA players, trying to figure out how he can contribute in an NBA system, and which skills will translate. So for me, even the limited run in summer league is a valuable tool (and maybe more valuable tool than how he played in college) to figuring out how he will be as an NBA player. Bagley was an elite college player but hasn't impacted the NBA because his college skills (playing as a low-post scoring, athletic big who can neither shoot nor defend) didn't translate to the NBA and he has yet to consistently develop any skills that do. Ben McLemore didn't make it because he never developed the ball handling or defensive chops to complement the skills he used to thrive in college (shooting and athleticism). Same with Stauskas. The NBA (and Kings history) is littered with guys who had elite college skills that didn't translate.

Regardless of his role in college, I don't think Prosper can survive in the NBA as a dunk and D 4 if he doesn't develop an outside shot. The NBA doesn't really value dunk/D 4s who don't shoot unless one of his D skills is ELITE rim protection or he is paired with a 5 that can shoot and defend the rim. Prosper can be a real player in the NBA, but he needs an outside shot and become a true 3/D wing to stick in the rotation.