Steve Nash MVP again?

[vladetomiller]

um...that coach was there during the 21 win season. Went 21-40 with Shawn Marion, Amare, Joe Johsnon all on the roster. Then next season gets Nash as his captain, his leader, his engine, and suddenly wins 62.

I dont think they played the same scheme before nash got there. Nash played with a much better group of players with mavs and he couldnt get anything done, except run around in circles. They couldnt even handle the kings when he was part of the mavs team

 

[Bricklayer]

The same doubt is there for Jordans shot pushing of / beating russel of the dribble to win the game against jazz. That likeliehood is there for many of the great plays and thats what makes them great. I am sure it will get legendary treatment saying that Kobe owned the two time MVP.

Legendary in the greater L.A. smog basin maybe.

Let's see, gee, Michael Jordan's walkoff shot to win his 6th title, or Kobe Bryant's offensive foul running over a 190lb PG in a game in the middle of a first round playoff series? Truly the stuff of legends.

 

[vladetomiller]

The comparison was about the offensive foul chances or the doubt over the play.

Obviously your hatred for the lakers and kobe would make you look at the play as an offensive foul. And as I have said many times before, refs seldom call those plays for the fear of being wrong and they always call a block.

Same goes for the steal by bibby from manu in the last game, it was a foul but they wouldnt call it, was martin bumped by duncan after that, absolutely but they wouldnt call that either. Same thing, you cannot look at the rules book when you watch the nba, you have to understand this is nba and they have their own set of rules which are not printed in the rules book.

 

[Gargamel]

Given the liklihood that that was an offensive foul, I have a feeling it may not quite get the legendary treatment.

Someone counters your point and you then switch to the "MJ's shot was more important" card, as if the given likelihood that that was an offensive foul no longer matters when the subject isn't Kobe. That shows your Bean bias.

 

[kingkung]

unbelieveble no way Nash deserves it over Kobe. What Kobe did this year is amazing. Look at the team the only other player on the Laker team that has talent is Lamar.

Kobe Bryant shouldn't be the MVP for one conclusive reason: LeBron James has him beat in every facet of the MVP criteria.

LeBron James has led his team to a better record, has arguably the worse team (he has no one of Odom's caliber; Hughes has constantly been injured) with a more inexperienced coach and is a better all around player, having more assists and rebounds along with scoring over 30 a game.

The only thing you can argue is that Kobe has a worse team, but both teams are pretty pathetic without their stars. Even if you take that criterion out, James has Kobe beat in every other facet. I can understand why Nash deserves MVP, but Kobe does not deserve to win the MVP award over LeBron James, end of story.

 

[Bricklayer]

Someone counters your point and you then switch to the "MJ's shot was more important" card, as if the given likelihood that that was an offensive foul no longer matters when the subject isn't Kobe. That shows your Bean bias.

I'm being accused of Bean bias by a Lakers fan? Now I KNOW there are mirrors in L.A. Lots of them. Take a glance.

The timing of Jordan's shot is ABSOLUTELY 100% CRITICAL in why it is still remembered, and always will be. The timing of Kobe's shot is ABSOLUTELY 100% CRITICAL in why it will NOT be by anyone outside of the land of nip and tuck.

Deal with it. And please don't bore me with MJ might once have committed an offensive foul a decade ago so everybody should just ignore it when Kobe does it too.

 

[kingkung]

I'm sorry, I thought this thread was about Steve Nash being the MVP. Silly me... assuming the title of the thread matches the content of the posts...

 

[GoGoGadget]

I'm sorry, I thought this thread was about Steve Nash being the MVP. Silly me... assuming the title of the thread matches the content of the posts...

And you've been around here for how long?

That is silly.

 

[Venom]

Gargamel is right. That poster shot by Kobe absolutely WILL be remembered in the same way that the Dream Shake on Robinson is remembered. Plus, the Lakers are going to take the series after Kobe altered his play in order to beat the Suns. Steve Nash is a very nice player. Kobe is a legend.

 

[Padrino]

Gargamel is right. That poster shot by Kobe absolutely WILL be remembered in the same way that the Dream Shake on Robinson is remembered. Plus, the Lakers are going to take the series after Kobe altered his play in order to beat the Suns. Steve Nash is a very nice player. Kobe is a legend.

indeed

 

[Gargamel]

I think that, more and more, those who vote are looking at the players ability to help their team place well. A 7th position is not enough when you have other players who have their team near the top of the league. I really think it came down to that.

Media doesn't like Kobe. Root cause. He avg'd 30/7/6 in 2003, 40 pt streak took LA back from brink of missing playoffs, they won 50 games. He got extremely little consideration then too.

 

[Padrino]

Media doesn't like Kobe. Root cause. He avg'd 30/7/6 in 2003, 40 pt streak took LA back from brink of missing playoffs, they won 50 games. He got extremely little consideration then too.

that seems so odd to me. he and lebron are, basically, the poster boys for the nba. the media loves lebron, but hates kobe?! i agree with you, but i also find it strange...

 

[Bricklayer]

that seems so odd to me. he and lebron are, basically, the poster boys for the nba. the media loves lebron, but hates kobe?! i agree with you, but i also find it strange...

Not so strange -- nobody was sure at that time he even necessarily the MVP of his TEAM, let alone the league. And the Lakers disappointed, rtaher than overacheived. There is always a feel good aspect to any award. Anybody feel good about he fall of a three time champion in 2003 besides Kings fans? They fell apart, and many in and around the Lakers themselves pointed at Kobe/Shaq as aroot cause. Not the backdrop you need for an MVP.

Here's the way it works. If Kobe had the year he had and the Lakers win 60, Kobe is MVP. The Cavs win 60, LeBron is MVP. The Cavs and Lakers both win 60? Eh...probably LeBron becuase he doesn't have lingering bad teammateitis hangin over him, but wouldn't be surprised either way. Kobe wins 45 = not nearly enough. LeBron wins 50 = closer, but still not enough despite being only the 5th guy in history to average his numbers (plucked from TV).

 

[kingkung]

Kobe Bryant shouldn't be the MVP for one conclusive reason: LeBron James has him beat in every facet of the MVP criteria.

LeBron James has led his team to a better record, has arguably the worse team (he has no one of Odom's caliber; Hughes has constantly been injured) with a more inexperienced coach and is a better all around player, having more assists and rebounds along with scoring over 30 a game.

The only thing you can argue is that Kobe has a worse team, but both teams are pretty pathetic without their stars. Even if you take that criterion out, James has Kobe beat in every other facet. I can understand why Nash deserves MVP, but Kobe does not deserve to win the MVP award over LeBron James, end of story.

 

[AriesMar27]

kobe doesnt make his team mates better, the suns not having any bigmen does that for him.... diaw is their starting center..... nash deserved the award amd kobe did commit a foul that should have been called.... that is some serious laker love going on from the refs....

i really dont care for lebron, as good as he is... i just dont... watching the cavs/wiz series makes it even more clear that lebron shouldnt have been the mvp... short of the team winning 60 games and leading the league in assists.... he wouldnt deserve it....

 

[KevinMartin'sShotDoctor]

Gargamel is right. That poster shot by Kobe absolutely WILL be remembered in the same way that the Dream Shake on Robinson is remembered. Plus, the Lakers are going to take the series after Kobe altered his play in order to beat the Suns. Steve Nash is a very nice player. Kobe is a legend.

If Kobe altered his play to beat the Suns, doesn't that count as an argument against him as MVP? The award is for the regular season.

I still would go with LeBron.

If Nash has a year like this next year, that would make him a premier player over a five year period. Not quite an era, but not bad. Two MVPs in a row, or even total, seems excessive for him, but the arguments in support of Nash winning each year have some validity.

 

[vladetomiller]

Lebron had to have the refs to help him out on a travel call to win a game.

 

[VF21]

vladetomiller - Your vast conspiracy theories are getting very old. You really need to get new material or find an audience that hasn't heard it all before.

 

[vladetomiller]

kobe doesnt make his team mates better, the suns not having any bigmen does that for him.... diaw is their starting center..... nash deserved the award amd kobe did commit a foul that should have been called.... that is some serious laker love going on from the refs....

....

Diaw is their starting center because their coach chose to do that. They have Nikoloz Tskitishvili or pat burke to use if they wanted to or even Brian grant at power forward / center. They use diaw cos he can shoot the three pointer. Dont bring that as an excuse for the suns, they chose to play that way.

I see some serious laker hatred going on here

 

[BigWaxer]

No Sleep = Dumbass Me

 

[vladetomiller]

vladetomiller - Your vast conspiracy theories are getting very old. You really need to get new material or find an audience that hasn't heard it all before.

Thats not a conspiracy theory, thats just a plain statement about a game that was decided based on a missed call. Was trying to see if that missed call got any attention here.

If you interepreted something else thats not my fault

 

[6th]

I see some serious laker hatred going on here

Well, duh!!!!!! How's this for Laker hatred?.........

DIE LAKER SCUM!!

 

[Bricklayer]

Gargamel is right. That poster shot by Kobe absolutely WILL be remembered in the same way that the Dream Shake on Robinson is remembered.

Uh...no.

Dropping the shake on a DPOY candidate in the WCF >>>> dunking over (let alone the offensive foul part) a small PG in the first round. The one proves, and says, a lot. The other could be done by any swingman with hops.