Spencer Hawes Will Not Play Tonight

[Kingstime]

Yeah I just think they both do, the losing and such is taking a toll on all these guys. They just need to finish this year out on a positive note and all these guys who are coming back next year need to work on things PW included.

Hawes need to make this situation a positive, complaining and whining isn't gonna get him minutes. He seems like a smart dude I just wish he puts it together as I really like him as a player, I always enjoy seeing when he gets positive things going on the court.

 

[ParniValjak]

[yt=PW postgame comments]mj7Sb4R_ZMA[/yt]

Well, this is what PW had to say.

Pretty childish by Westphal to be honest! He doesn't need to be a smartass about it with the remarks "At least he knows his role"!

I suspect coach as a personal situation he is dealing with but he needs to be above what he is showing here. This is coming across very Theus-esque! He is not a egoistical type of guy but he sure as hell is coming across as one here.

Poor effort! I expected better from the coach!

 

[JB_kings]

Mistakes are not so easy to define. There are mistakes that are made and ones that are made over and over. For example you are told that Prince will go to his left and make sure you play him to force him right, that's what I call a very easy thing to learn. So when should the coach pull Casspi? After the first, second, third... so on? I after the third time I was yelling at the TV to pull him! I thought coach was more than patient.

Mistakes are normal, learn and move on. If you flat can't get it done time and again, you should have a seat and watch somebody else do it instead.

As for poor fragile Spencer, how many chances does he deserve? Last two games, 33 total minutes of play and TWO - YES TWO rebounds. I'm 5-11 and 48 years old and a bit pudgy... I could go out on an NBA court with those players and probably manage two rebounds and I promise you I would have committed at least 9-12 fouls trying to get the ball. Spencer wants to be coddled and handed the starting job and never pulled for not doing his job? Then spouts off to the media that he cant figure out what coach is doing? Yeah he can sit and think for a while until he gets it.

 

[VF21]

I just got home form the game and wanted to add my personal observation. Whatever happened that led up to Hawes being inactive for tonight's game, you couldn't see so much of a hint of anything amiss from the time the team came out of the tunnel until the end of the game. Hawes was clapping and cherring for his teammates, participating in every single time out, and - once Brockman left at the half - Hawes was on the very end of the bench in the front row talking to his teammates and trying, it seemed to me, to be very supportive and positive.

I also suspect that Amick has, as mentioned earlier in the threasd, gotten his last comments "off the record" from anyone associated with the team. This isn't the first time a player has been disciplined because something they said was either overheard by Amick or told to him and it ended up on the Internet in the blink of an eye.

Being a beat reporter isn't what it used to be...and I personally think that if this all wasy primarily the result of Amicki tellling tales out of school that he should be shunned by the team for the rest of the year.

But that's just my two cents.

 

[rhythmless]

Mistakes are not so easy to define. There are mistakes that are made and ones that are made over and over. For example you are told that Prince will go to his left and make sure you play him to force him right, that's what I call a very easy thing to learn. So when should the coach pull Casspi? After the first, second, third... so on? I after the third time I was yelling at the TV to pull him! I thought coach was more than patient.

Mistakes are normal, learn and move on. If you flat can't get it done time and again, you should have a seat and watch somebody else do it instead.

As for poor fragile Spencer, how many chances does he deserve? Last two games, 33 total minutes of play and TWO - YES TWO rebounds. I'm 5-11 and 48 years old and a bit pudgy... I could go out on an NBA court with those players and probably manage two rebounds and I promise you I would have committed at least 9-12 fouls trying to get the ball. Spencer wants to be coddled and handed the starting job and never pulled for not doing his job? Then spouts off to the media that he cant figure out what coach is doing? Yeah he can sit and think for a while until he gets it.

Bingo. Two rebounds is no mistake. There sure are a lot of namby pambys out there who want to absolve Spence of his lack of effort. At the end of the clip, PW says, "no excuses." Wouldn't it be a better team/NBA/world if we actually adopted that instead of trying to find out why a mobile 7 foot big man who is in the prime of his athletic career cannot find the muster to grab more than 2 balls out of the air in 30 minutes of pt? Spencer exhibits no effort, no grit, no desire, and no sense of pride. I don't care how eloquently he can throw out reasons he isn't playing well. Put up, or shut up.

 

[ParniValjak]

I just got home form the game and wanted to add my personal observation. Whatever happened that led up to Hawes being inactive for tonight's game, you couldn't see so much of a hint of anything amiss from the time the team came out of the tunnel until the end of the game. Hawes was clapping and cherring for his teammates, participating in every single time out, and - once Brockman left at the half - Hawes was on the very end of the bench in the front row talking to his teammates and trying, it seemed to me, to be very supportive and positive.

I also suspect that Amick has, as mentioned earlier in the threasd, gotten his last comments "off the record" from anyone associated with the team. This isn't the first time a player has been disciplined because something they said was either overheard by Amick or told to him and it ended up on the Internet in the blink of an eye.

Being a beat reporter isn't what it used to be...and I personally think that if this all wasy primarily the result of Amicki tellling tales out of school that he should be shunned by the team for the rest of the year.

But that's just my two cents.

Oh Please!

So not a reporter is not supposed to do his job so that our poor precious players don't get in trouble! Give me a break!

Amick is a journo, his job is to report what he knows, now if Hawes is dumb enough to tell a reporter something off the record, then he sure as hell deserves what he is getting. I am sick and tired of people blaming our problems on others. Amick's job is to report what he knows or finds out. Part of the responsibility that the player carries around is to not speak out of school and give anway anything that shouldn't be given away. It would be like saying to a taxman that you just did a dodgy deal to wash some money.

This mess is not on Amick, this mess is entirely on the Kings.

Spencer is not the only player to have spoken to the press and let the dog out so to speak, and he certainly won't be the last one. But regardless, the way Westphal as come across in all this is less that complementary. Its Theus-esque!

 

[Packt]

[yt=PW postgame comments]mj7Sb4R_ZMA[/yt]

Well, this is what PW had to say.

Dayum.

I agree there should be some leeway with young players, but at the same time they need discipline also. You can't just have players messing up and there be no consequences. I have no problem with what happened. If a player is out of line for whatever reason, do what you have to do.

I suspect this isn't just about the Amick article. How ticked off Westphal sounded doesn't match up with the quotes. Something else must've happened as others who made statements were able to suit up.

 

[Kings Faithful]

I see all of this eventually leading to Spencer being traded to a team and fanbase that actually understands he is 21 years old and appreciates what he brings... in turn causing him to flourish into a 20,9,and 5 player. 21 people! I refuse to believe its lack of effort. Its more like lack of toughness... he has a problem grabbing rebounds over guys who are 50 pounds heavier than he is. Its a weakness.... just like Jason can't seem to figure out how to put the ball in the hoop when he is 1 foot away. To get these guys to improve we have to play them and keep them happy... not bench them for wanting to know their roles. I like Westphal but I can't condone benching Spencer, especially for more than 1 game if he chooses to take that path.

 

[mac]

The biggest thing is why Spencer? Were his comments out of line? Perhaps, but as many above have said, May and Tyreke said the same things. So what did Spencer do differently that he gets the short end of the stick while the rest go scratch free?

 

[Padrino]

That's what's strange to me. At the beginning of the season he seemed to understand that quite well. In fact, I thought it was his biggest strength as a coach - his patience with the young players, and his allowing them room for mistakes and time to develop. Now it seems as if this has completely shifted in the opposite direction, and I have no idea why.

the answer is staring us all right in the face: 18-39

the kings are not the worst team in the nba this season. they're the fourth worst team in the nba this season. when the kings were playing near-.500 ball through their first 30 games or so, westphal was more patient and a more willing teacher. his lineups were erratic even then, but the team was making huge strides, and the wins came more frequently than anybody could have expected, so there were few visible complaints. the kings were dubbed cinderellas, tyreke evans was considered the frontrunner for rookie of the year, and westphal was being talked up as a potential coach of the year candidate. but then the soft schedule gave way to some tougher opponents, and the losses started to pile up. since then, kevin martin was traded, stephen curry moved into the rookie of the year discussion (though evans will probably still manage to win it if he keeps vaulting past the rookie wall) and westphal has been forgotten as a coach of the year candidate...

after enough losing, all of the little things float to the surface. every minor frustration is magnified, and all of the major frustrations look insurmountable. its the coach's job to manage those frustrations, but westphal had been away from the nba for quite awhile before returning to coach the kings. he seems to have forgotten that his job is to keep the team together. he's entitled to make mistakes just like his young team is entitled to make mistakes, but he needs to be very careful not to lose the trust and confidence of his incredibly impressionable team. conventionally, the best way to keep a team together is to establish clear roles. the problem with this benching spencer business is that spencer does NOT know what his role is on the team. many of the kings don't know what their role is. some of that is due to circumstance. kevin martin was traded. carl landry was added. francisco garcia just came back from injury. but so much of it is due to westphal's schizophrenic lineups...

he really needs to exercise his coach's right to choose a consistent rotation. there's always room to occasionally adjust that rotation to account for matchups, but, more often than not, it should be the same guys starting and the same guys coming off the bench to spell those starters. this isn't armchair coaching that we're doin' here. its simply years of proven basketball convention. the kings are lottery-bound. that much is certain. so just pick a rotation. ANY rotation. it doesn't have to "work" in the sense that we see results in the win column. it just needs to be given time to develop consistency and chemistry...

PG tyreke evans
SG francisco garcia
SF omri casspi
PF carl landry
C jason thompson

beno udrih
donte greene
spencer hawes

i'm not necessarily making an argument for the above rotation. i'm just creating a scenario in which the kings might find success in consistency, if not success in the win/loss column. the above rotation is bound to frustrate paul westphal, because it is young and defensively-challenged. but there is a lot of effort in that rotation. there is occasional offensive brilliance in that rotation. there are opportunities to learn in that rotation. this summer, its up to the GM to add the pieces that catapult the rotation from maddeningly mediocre to consistently rewarding. in the meantime, its up to the coach to work with what he has, and not suck all the life out of the team and the fanbase...

 

[Uncia03]

This is a very young team. Spencer, JT, and Donte are all very young. Westphal was really tough on Donte and told it to him straight: "Play defense, Play Smart, and you get playing time."

Westphal it seems has also been tough on Spencer. "Play with aggression, Play Physical, and Play Defense, and you get playing time."

If Donte and Spencer were 26+ years old I might have a problem with this, but considering that he's trying to maximize their upside and make sure that they bring the tough brand of basketball needed for playoff success I'm completely in favor of his methods.

Now, he gives Tyreke a free reign, but let's be honest. Tyreke plays the way you need to play to have playoff success, so I don't have a problem with the preferential treatment.

I agree with everyone who's said that this entire season has almost been like a training camp. And with the three new additions it isn't going to let up at all. I would also imagine that Geoff wants to see as many player combinations as possible to help him decide what to do with the roster. Do we keep a guy like Dominic? Do we have to decide between Brockman and Dorsey, or do we keep both?

I want a consistent rotation as much as everyone else so that on-court chemistry can be developed. But let me point something out. Towards the end of last year, after the Miller trade, JT and Hawes were developing fantastic chemistry. They were just playing incredibly well together.
This season.....that chemistry has completely disappeared. I don't know what happened, but the chemistry those two developed has not been on display at all this year.
So there is no guarantee that chemistry developed this year will necessary resonate next season.

Because of that, I'd rather all the hard lessons be learned this year while we are losing. I'd rather that we see a lot of player combinations so that Geoff will have as much information at his disposal as possible when it comes to both the draft and free-agency. These guys are all incredibly young, so provided that they are learning how to do things the right way, and getting playing time to develop their skills, I have no issues with what Westphal is trying to instill in these young players.

 

[Hoovtrain]

Man I couldn't agree more! Maybe Spencer will know his role is to STFU and rebound the ball! He is the LEAST of all the players on the team who should be opening his mouth about playing time... considering what he does with his playing time... One friggin rebound is TOTAL BS!!

I agree with this. Spencer seems to have this sense of entitlement. The kid is 21 years old, but the way he talks you would think that he is putting up 20-10 each night. I'm all for confidence, but I would like to see more than 4 good games at a time before he starts spouting off about playing time. This isn't the first time this has happened. When he first lost his starting spot he was on the rise guys, and while he wasn't outright defiant about, he was still a bit pissy about it. As much as I dislike Grant, he made a great point today: This is an 18 win team, no one should have a gripe about their playing time.

 

[swisshh]

Westphal's rotations need a sense to them. Earlier they were based on who was playing well, who was hot. Right now, they just seem desperate. The team has yet to score 90 points since the trade. You have everyone trying to prove they need more playing time, but because the rotations are so random and the leash so sudden, you got players coming in and trying to do too much. Tyreke commented on this in the Amick article. There is a lack of cohesion on the team, and I think it goes beyond the locker.

 

[Krunker]

21 people! I refuse to believe its lack of effort. Its more like lack of toughness...

If it's lack of toughness I think that is worse than lack of effort. Age 21 is pretty much when one is feeling like a badass, and if he is not tough enough now I don't see him getting tougher as he gets older.

 

[SacTownKid]

That's what's strange to me. At the beginning of the season he seemed to understand that quite well. In fact, I thought it was his biggest strength as a coach - his patience with the young players, and his allowing them room for mistakes and time to develop. Now it seems as if this has completely shifted in the opposite direction, and I have no idea why.

We started losing, and he started to panic. This is what happens when you don't have a coherent system or anything close to resembling a rotation this late in the season. Early in the year you can catch teams off guard and out hustle them into wins. We are now into the meat of the season, teams have settled in, scouting reports are out, you can't just surprise teams anymore. You have to play your game. What's ours???

 

[NewArena]

I dont agree with Westphals latest decision making either, but lets not forget the the Kings are a very tight lipped organization. There could very well be a lot of things going on behind the scenes that we dont know about.

My guess is coach and Hawes probably got into a little shouting match/disagreement that didn't go over to well. Guess we will find out soon enough.

 

[Widowmaker2k]

"Some of the worst days of my life," said Westphal. What's going on with him? Something about a family-related emergency?

 

[LPKingsFan]

I also suspect that Amick has, as mentioned earlier in the threasd, gotten his last comments "off the record" from anyone associated with the team. This isn't the first time a player has been disciplined because something they said was either overheard by Amick or told to him and it ended up on the Internet in the blink of an eye.

Being a beat reporter isn't what it used to be...and I personally think that if this all wasy primarily the result of Amicki tellling tales out of school that he should be shunned by the team for the rest of the year.

But that's just my two cents.

This is a pretty big deal, what leads you to have that suspicion?

 

[NewArena]

I just hope people dont get all carried away talking about firing the guy. There is no way in the world we should do that without finding out all the details of whats truly going on. I mean...people wonder why we suck? Part of the reason is lack of stability. How in the world are players going to develop if we keep changing the coaching staff every 5 seconds?

Its similar to changing your offensive coordinator every year in football. Look where that got Alex Smith.

 

[MizzouKing]

I dont agree with Westphals latest decision making either, but lets not forget the the Kings are a very tight lipped organization. There could very well be a lot of things going on behind the scenes that we dont know about.

That was exactly my point (much) earlier. A lot of folks here are all too willing to latch onto what they know/see and assume that's the whole picture. There's usually a lot more happening beneath the surface than meets the eye.

 

[Rug King]

Actually, I think Spencer got put in his place. It's time for him to quit with the pissy attitude and play in the direction coach says.

 

[Grawlix]

Westphal may have been wrong to retaliate the way he did, but he is not off base.

The Coach's job is to hold the players accountable for their conduct and their play.

Spencer needs to grow up. He should not be talking or blaming anyone but himself. Plus, Westphal may be pissed still about his skipping of summer league.

 

[NoBonus]

Nemama always used to say: 'Spare the stick, spoil the Spencer'

Paul's job is to figure out who is going to be a part of this team's long term success and weed out the others... if the Kings like Spencer (and I think they do) this is the correct move. This sends a message to Spencer: Get on board and pitch in like a pro, if you do not want to do that you are finished.

Spencer needs to get his head right and I would rather Paul address it swiftly and sternly than let it drag on and become a larger issue that impacts other players on the team.

Remember, Spencer is outspoken and all of, what? 21 years old?

 

[Kingstime]

Nemama always used to say: 'Spare the stick, spoil the Spencer'

Paul's job is to figure out who is going to be a part of this team's long term success and weed out the others... if the Kings like Spencer (and I think they do) this is the correct move. This sends a message to Spencer: Get on board and pitch in like a pro, if you do not want to do that you are finished.

Spencer needs to get his head right and I would rather Paul address it swiftly and sternly than let it drag on and become a larger issue that impacts other players on the team.

Remember, Spencer is outspoken and all of, what? 21 years old?

^^^^
This


Spencer has to learn that's what this whole season has been about. He is seen as our 5 of the future, he needs to take that responsibility to improve and give the team the effort they need from their 5. It doesn't mean Spencer has to do so by jumping out of his character. I've seen plenty of games last year where he looked GREAT, he was working hard on D, grabbing boards and shooting 3's it was fun to watch.

This year it's just seen in spurts as he had as a couple of great games this year, on the road nonetheless. He just has to handle his short leash like an adult, prove to the coach he is who he was last year. He's far too young to go around pouting like Brad Miller it's annoying.

I see Spencer putting it all together in a Kings uni or somewhere else within the next couple years, I hope it is with us.

 

[Prince_XY]

Remember, Spencer is outspoken and all of, what? 21 years old?

It looks like our "future center", the 7-footer potential bust, who seemingly thinks he is all that good is kind of starting a little INSURRECTION within the Kings Kingdom.

I knew it. This Kid will be synonimous with the word trouble. He had always looked like a politician than a basketball player to me. All talks and plays like a soggy waffle. I wish the Kings traded him with Martin for a defensive "BIG" even if that big would have been be another long term project.

We got one non-defending softie ( Martin ) out of Sacramento already. I hope the last remnants of the softiness of this team ( Hawes and Beno ) get traded this summer.

Bring Thabeet to Sacramento!

 

[Kingstime]

Haha Beno is far from soft, he's been our most consistent player all year hands down. He has his midrange game down to a science. Although his contract is stupid, it's not like he's not earning it.

 

[Spike]

Haha Beno is far from soft, he's been our most consistent player all year hands down. He has his midrange game down to a science. Although his contract is stupid, it's not like he's not earning it.

Whoah. I thought that read Hawes for a second, and I was going to tear you a new one. You are correct about Beno - he has been consistent.

 

[Rookie]

Haha Beno is far from soft, he's been our most consistent player all year hands down. He has his midrange game down to a science. Although his contract is stupid, it's not like he's not earning it.

personally I don't think his contract is stupid...maybe last year but this year and hopefully next year it has proven to be worth it.

 

[Kingstime]

Only reason I've never agreed with his contract is because I see that type given to a legit starting PG, not a backup. But Beno is definately a legit great option for a backup no matter where he goes, I'm glad we have him here now especially now that we all know Beno included that that's where he belongs.

 

[kennadog]

I don't like players or coaches taking problems to the press, but I think this is more Spencer's fault, than Westphal's. What's amazing to me is most people here have been complaining about Spencer's lack of maturity, lack of work ethic, lack of toughness and his whiny, cry-babiness. But now we want to blame the coach for showing some of the same irritation with Spencer, however ill-advised?

I don't like how Westphal did this, but c'mon, PW's been sending "messages" to Hawes ever since he got here. To me Hawes's quotes were just the final straw and that's why he got benched and not the other players.

I'm still hoping Spence will get it, but I've thought from the beginning he acted pretty immature for his age. He also acts like he thinks the starting center position was his by right, after Brad was gone.

I don't feel like Spencer has made much progress in three seasons in either maturity, attitude or work ethic. This isn't Spencer's first coach and assistant coaches in the NBA. No one has gotten or seems to be getting much improvement or consistency out of Spencer.

He's still only 21, and I still think its too early to pass any final judgements, but this kid needs to act like a responsible, mature man. He's overdue on that front. He needs to take responsibility for his game and quit pointing fingers.