SAR Fails Physical

[captain bill]

http://www.realgm.com/src_wiretap_a...abdur_rahim_fails_his_physical_with_the_nets/


4th August, 2005 - 11:11 pm

New York Times - The Nets had scheduled a news conference for Thursday morning to introduce their prized off-season acquisition, power forward Shareef Abdur-Rahim. Instead, Rod Thorn, the Nets' president, announced that the trade for Abdur-Rahim was in limbo because of an unresolved matter in connection with his physical on Wednesday.

Thorn would not specify why the 6-foot-9 Abdur-Rahim did not pass the physical, but he said that the problem did not involve a pre-existing condition.

Abdur-Rahim, a nine-year veteran who spent the past season and a half with Portland and had become a free agent, had signed a contract with the Nets, but it will not become official until the Nets are satisfied with his physical condition. The six-year deal to bring him to New Jersey, worth close to $39 million, was part of a sign-and-trade deal with the Trail Blazers.

The Nets are seeking other medical opinions. If they do not complete the trade by Aug. 12, it will fall through.

"It was a shock," Thorn said of the development. "We had scheduled a press conference. Obviously, we did not think there was going to be anything wrong whatsoever."

Abdur-Rahim, who is in Atlanta, was also stunned, Thorn said.

Abdur-Rahim had surgery on his right elbow last season and missed 28 games.

"He had a knee operation when he was in high school," Thorn said. "He's never missed a game with the knee problem in the N.B.A.; never missed a practice or game. The only thing he's ever missed any games for in the N.B.A. was for an elbow operation."

When asked if the condition was career-threatening, Thorn said, "That's not for me to say, one way or the other."

If the deal falls through, it would be an enormous blow to the Nets. Abdur-Rahim, 28, was considered the best power forward on the free-agent market. He averaged 16.8 points and 7.3 rebounds last season and was an All-Star in 2002 with Atlanta.

The Nets were hoping to play him alongside Jason Kidd, Vince Carter, Richard Jefferson and Nenad Krstic. All five players averaged 10 or more points last season.

"He was a big piece to our puzzle and a quality player," Thorn said. "So if it works out that we don't complete the trade, then we've lost a quality player."

Thorn said he remained hopeful that Abdur-Rahim would wear a Nets uniform this season, but that a contingency plan was already in motion.

"We've started looking at other options because players that we may have an interest in are either signing every day or they are about to sign," Thorn said.


___________

If this does fall through, does anyone know what the procedure for him is? Can he just not play until he passes a physical? I assume at this point that if he plays it will be in NJ, but you never know. I had a feeling this story wasn't done yet.

 

[SlimKid15]

Maybe he'll still end up in a sac uniform next year. Hey you never know.

 

[Bricklayer]

Maybe he'll still end up in a sac uniform next year. Hey you never know.

Man, we're not out of the woods yet on this one. New Jersey was trying to save us from ourselves. Hope this doesn't cause us to pause/stop whatever other efforts we have been making waiting to see how this pans out.

 

[bozzwell]

Man, we're not out of the woods yet on this one. New Jersey was trying to save us from ourselves. Hope this doesn't cause us to pause/stop whatever other efforts we have been making waiting to see how this pans out.

Amen. I don't want no SAR when he is healthy, let alone now. And isn't SAR like some nasty bird flu? Bad pun intended.

 

[SacTownKid]

If the Maloofs get a guy with a bad knee to replace another bad knee, I can only imagine the reaction to that!

 

[nbrans]

Should the Nets balk on this one I'm not sure that I see the downside to the Kings getting him on the cheap, except, you know, his knee falling off and rendering him useless. It's not like there are any good PFs left in free agency, and this wouldn't preclude any trades involving the core or anybody else on the team. Why not take a gamble?

 

[6th]

I don't get it. Why would Geoff Petrie want to go after someone who has just failed a physical? And, if he failed a physical for the Nets, why would he pass ours?

 

[piksi]

I did not know that these exams are so hard

They should make them "multiple choice" or "true false"

 

[whozit]

I don't get it. Why would Geoff Petrie want to go after someone who has just failed a physical? And, if he failed a physical for the Nets, why would he pass ours?

Because it is a six year deal and they may be getting cold feet. If the Nets backed out and we could get him on the cheap and for a shorter length term, why not? Known options are dwindling.

Gads, that sounds desperate.

 

[VF21]

God, someone shoot me now.

We are to the point where some of you want to pick up someone who failed his physical...over a potentially BAD KNEE?

Does the irony of that totally escape everyone else?

 

[whozit]

No, it doesn't. That was what the frown was for.

One difference however is in the contract. Cheap and short works for me.

Another difference is that the supposed problem has reportadly been there from before he became a pro.

 

[Crvena Zvezda]

God, someone shoot me now.

We are to the point where some of you want to pick up someone who failed his physical...over a potentially BAD KNEE?

Does the irony of that totally escape everyone else?

There is a slight difference between a guy who has had a knee reconstruction and a guy who has never missed an NBA game due to knee problems.

 

[VF21]

There is a slight difference between a guy who has had a knee reconstruction and a guy who has never missed an NBA game due to knee problems.

There's also a slight difference between zucchini and sea urchins. What's your point?

SAR failed his physical. We traded away a 20/10/5 player because SOME people were afraid his reconstructed knee might fail. Webber PASSED his physical for the trade to the Sixers.

Now, some are seriously thinking we should try and get SAR on the cheap because he FAILED his physical and won't be going to the Nets? Yeah, that'd be money well spent.

Why don't we just have the Maloofs take a few million dollars and set fire to them in the middle of the Arco parking lot?

 

[dukeswh]

Guys, I found this article in Fox Sports. It mentions the Nets' concern regarding Reef's knee: http://msn.foxsports.com/nba/story/3867462

"Shareef Abdur-Rahim has scar tissue in his knee that the Nets want further examined to see if the knee could become arthritic. 'Reef has been playing with the scar tissue his whole career and has said it is a non-issue. The Nets should look very seriously at who else is out there at the power forward spot and then take Shareef. Dale Davis? Croshere? We don't think Tractor Traylor is going to be catching any J-Kidd oops. It's bad out there. .."

 

[funkykingston]

There's also a slight difference between zucchini and sea urchins. What's your point?

There's a big difference between zucchini and sea urchins. They're from different Kingdoms (plant & animal)

The difference is smaller between the knees of Reef and Webber, but it IS significant. If Reef has scar tissue from a surgery in high school, then there is no immediate danger in terms of losing him to injury. That's different from a tragic knee injury that robs a player permanently of the explosiveness he once had.

The danger with Abdur-Rahim isn't short term (which is what matters considering the ages of our current starters) but would worry me in terms of accelerating his breakdown in years 4-6 of his contract.

Up until last season, when he missed a number of games after surgery to clean out his elbow, SAR had missed only 7 games in 8 years. In fact, two seasons ago he played in 85 regular season games because of the midseason trade.

That being said, I still return to my original opinion on having Reef in a Kings uniform: If it's as the starting PF, no thank you. If it is as the starting SF with Peja being dealt for a quality big, then absolutely.

 

[VF21]

Scasr tissue apparently can lead to arthritis, which is the concern based on the article dukeswh found.

The chances of either SAR or Webber going down to catastrophic knee injury is probably about the same, regardless of what some may want to believe. The horrible thing is either of them - or anyone else in the league - could go down with a career-ending injury to the OTHER knee without any advance warning.

I'm not worried, however, because I really don't think Petrie had his eye on SAR. He doesn't get "damaged goods." He deals them away...

 

[Bricklayer]

Uh oh, the New York Post is reporting this morning that the Nets bumbling here has turned the suddenly sensitive Rahim off to the offer now. Good lord. For about 24 hours there we were free and safe from the two nightmare power forwards who would most appeal to Geoff's weakness for soft players. 24 hours. And then boom, he might be right back out on the market to seriously tempt us.

As an aside, the Nets are being pretty ridiculous here -- more cold feet.

 

[SoupIsGood]

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

http://www.nypost.com/sports/nets/26727.htm

'I DON'T WANT TO BE A NET'

By LENN ROBBINS
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

August 7, 2005 -- The Nets have bigger problems than the condition of Shareef Abdur-Rahim's right knee. The team's handling of medical concerns growing from his physical have alienated the power forward to the point where he on longer wants join the team.
"Right now I don't feel I want to be a Net," Abdur-Rahim told The Post last night by telephone.

"I can go somewhere else and play my career out. This is not an emotional thing. I've got to stand up for myself."

When the Nets announced on Thursday that their deal with the Trail Blazers for Abdur-Rahim had been put on hold, the 6-foot-9 power forward said he understood the franchise was doing it's due diligence.

But when the situation wasn't resolved by yesterday and Abdur-Rahim was overwhelmed by phone calls from concerned friends and family saying they had read newspaper and Internet accounts of him failing his physical, he became more upset.

By 8 o'clock last night, Abdur-Rahim had yet to go out and celebrate his fifth wedding anniversary. He was on the phone discussing his options with his agent, Aaron Goodwin, and telling The Post how disenchanted with the Nets he had become.

"At this point I feel they're doing me a disservice," said Abdur-Rahim. "Look at my history. I've never missed a game because of my knees. They could have asked the team that drafted me [Vancouver] or any of the teams that have traded for me [Atlanta, Portland]. Instead, they're putting it out there like I failed the physical and I'm damaged goods.



"I don't want to be there," continued Abdur-Rahim. "We can just part ways and I'll find another situation where I'll have to do some damage control."

Abdur-Rahim doesn't have the power to stop the deal, but as Goodwin pointed out, "If you were the Nets, why would you bring in a player who no longer wants to be there?"

The Nets had a news conference scheduled for Thursday morning to introduce Abdur-Rahim, but an MRI found scar tissue in his right knee resulting from an injury he suffered in high school. He underwent arthroscopic surgery in 1993 and has never missed a game in college or during his nine-year NBA career because of a knee injury.

But because the Nets are investing $38 million and six years in Abdur-Rahim, they put the trade on hold.

Net President Rod Thorn never said Abdur-Rahim failed the physical - rather that the team had a concern.

"We're trying to gather all the information and make as informed a decision as we can," Thorn told The Post last night. "It's something that came out of the blue. It's something that we were not at all aware of."

A source told The Post the Nets sent copies of the MRI to three of the most prominent sports orthopedic surgeons in the nation - Dr. David Altcheck, Dr. Russ Warren, the Giants' team doctor, and Dr. James Andrews, who pioneered what is now known as Tommy John surgery.

Goodwin told The Post on Friday that Altcheck agreed with the power forward that the condition is not one for concern. The Nets agreed to send a 2006 protected first-round lottery pick and the team's $4.9 million trade exception to Portland for Abdur-Rahim.

The Nets have until Friday to complete the deal.

 

[Bricklayer]

Nets are really pissing me off. I was intending to try to get to the Kings lone appearance vs. the Nets this year, but if they end up scewing this up and dumping another softie in Sacto, I think I may have to refrain just to deprive them of the ticket sales.

 

[nbrans]

Nets are really pissing me off. I was intending to try to get to the Kings lone appearance vs. the Nets this year, but if they end up scewing this up and dumping another softie in Sacto, I think I may have to refrain just to deprive them of the ticket sales.

Brick, why the hate on SAR? I mean, I can understand some grumbling if the Kings were giving up something significant in return or if they were signing him to a huge contract. But if the deal with the Nets is off, the Kings are going to get SAR at a reduced price. What's the harm in adding a very good player to the roster? It's not like there are any other good players left in free agency, the Kings aren't getting KG no matter how many trade proposals we come up with and besides, this wouldn't preclude any deals. I would think that even the most ardent SAR haters would have to admit that signing SAR would improve the team.

 

[jay dubb]

Hey I would love to get SAR for the full MLE. He didn't fail the physical, he just has scar tissue in his knee from an operation he had back when he was in high school. He has been playing with it for years without any problems. He is an upgrade at the 4 and he has a great post game. Yes I would like a better more athletic defender but people lets be real here, currently NONE ARE AVAILABLE!!! and we probably aren't going to trade any of the big 3(Peja, Mike, and Brad) for anyone so I say if he wants to come to Sac then sign him.

 

[kingsofnba]

as far as SAR, if the kings can get him on the cheap, maybe 4-5 years, $20mil, then i would take him... and $20mil over say 4-5 years is what webb would had made in 1 year, so the risk is not as great....

as far as the scar tissue is concerned, any knee that has had surgery will have scar tissue... and looking at his never missing a game due to the knee in 8 years, that should tell you it is not a problem... i think this is more an issue of new jersey getting cold feet on a $36mil deal... as far as becoming an arthritic knee, i think that will be more of an issue when he gets much older, not so much for the next 4-5 years...

look what is left on the unrestricted FA market... steven hunter, tractor traylor, dale davis... even eddie griffin is apparently off the market to minni... not much left folks... and this would not neccessarily preclude the kings from making another trade, it might actually enhance the chances, because they will have more depth to work with...

this guy has been an all star and avg. 20pts/9-10reb/1 blk/ 1 steal per game, before he arrived in the abyss called portland... I SAY GIVE REF A CHANCE!!!

 

[jay dubb]

as far as SAR, if the kings can get him on the cheap, maybe 4-5 years, $20mil, then i would take him... and $20mil over say 4-5 years is what webb would had made in 1 year, so the risk is not as great....

as far as the scar tissue is concerned, any knee that has had surgery will have scar tissue... and looking at his never missing a game due to the knee in 8 years, that should tell you it is not a problem... i think this is more an issue of new jersey getting cold feet on a $36mil deal... as far as becoming an arthritic knee, i think that will be more of an issue when he gets much older, not so much for the next 4-5 years...

look what is left on the unrestricted FA market... steven hunter, tractor traylor, dale davis... even eddie griffin is apparently off the market to minni... not much left folks... and this would not neccessarily preclude the kings from making another trade, it might actually enhance the chances, because they will have more depth to work with...

this guy has been an all star and avg. 20pts/9-10reb/1 blk/ 1 steal per game, before he arrived in the abyss called portland... I SAY GIVE REF A CHANCE!!!

I AGREE with ^

 

[Kings113]

as far as SAR, if the kings can get him on the cheap, maybe 4-5 years, $20mil, then i would take him... and $20mil over say 4-5 years is what webb would had made in 1 year, so the risk is not as great....

as far as the scar tissue is concerned, any knee that has had surgery will have scar tissue... and looking at his never missing a game due to the knee in 8 years, that should tell you it is not a problem... i think this is more an issue of new jersey getting cold feet on a $36mil deal... as far as becoming an arthritic knee, i think that will be more of an issue when he gets much older, not so much for the next 4-5 years...

look what is left on the unrestricted FA market... steven hunter, tractor traylor, dale davis... even eddie griffin is apparently off the market to minni... not much left folks... and this would not neccessarily preclude the kings from making another trade, it might actually enhance the chances, because they will have more depth to work with...

this guy has been an all star and avg. 20pts/9-10reb/1 blk/ 1 steal per game, before he arrived in the abyss called portland... I SAY GIVE REF A CHANCE!!!

Eddie Griffin isn't off the market. His "agreeing to a deal", doesn't mean he is signed, and I haven't seen the agreement, nor him being signed (because he hasn't) reported on RealGM, tickers, ESPN tv/website, nor any Griffin stuff on NBA.com. It also was once again only reported by a Minny paper (like the Griffin thing a couple weeks ago).

I think now, even though SAR/Nets aren't really near dimissed ways, SAR could be a decent candiate for the Kings PF. Even if he isn't the player the Kings need, but with the free-agent market of PFs quite thin now (Evans/Griffin/O. Harrington), who knows.

Ultimately though, I think we'll get a PF through a trade, or sign up Griffin (subject for a trade if he does sign with Minny too) or Reggie Evans from free-agency.

 

[Bricklayer]

Brick, why the hate on SAR? I mean, I can understand some grumbling if the Kings were giving up something significant in return or if they were signing him to a huge contract. But if the deal with the Nets is off, the Kings are going to get SAR at a reduced price. What's the harm in adding a very good player to the roster? It's not like there are any other good players left in free agency, the Kings aren't getting KG no matter how many trade proposals we come up with and besides, this wouldn't preclude any deals. I would think that even the most ardent SAR haters would have to admit that signing SAR would improve the team.

For the same reson that in nearly every single post on the subject you absolutely ignore the FACT that a soft PF will never win anything, in particular on an already soft team. And of course not surprisingly SAR never HAS won anything. Mark Cuban is WRONG in his 12 name players is better than 5 approach. And gets proven wrong again every year. For us, SAR is the wrong player at the wrong time for the wrong team.

Quite frankly I think you are dazzled by the numbers in fantasy ball fashion. But you're looking at the wrong numbers, and totally ignoring the needs of this team. There is only one thing that SAR brings which this team could use, and that is some post ability. But even there, he is a better post player against SFs than he is against PFs. And meanwhile is outmuscled, outtoughed, and outhustled by almost every PF he meets. A good talent, but nearly worthless to a serious team as a starter. When the Wallace boys and Duncan are going to war next June, SAR will be off hiding in the bathroom somewhere.

And the second part of course is that I do not trust Geoff, or Rick for that matter, to see beyond his ability to score. If I believed that they would actually sign him to a cheap contract and bring him off the bench as a SF/PF 6th man -- like Walker, his best potential role on an elite team (what San Antonio had in mind for him in fact) -- then fine. Be a nice talent off your bench, albeit there would still be the reeking softness problem rising off the whole team. But I don't trust them to do that. Nor do I think he would willingly sign with us in such a role. No, if he comes, he comes as a starting PF. Which is garbage to us. Four of our five big minute starters would be softies who don't defend, rebound, hustle, bang, or like to get physical. We have SAR's talent (scoring) in spades. And he would just be in the way of us picking up someone not afraid to break a nail to actually COMPLEMENT our numerous soft shooters with hustle and heart rather than duplicate their strengths and weaknesses.

We should have a mantra:

Soft big men do NOT win championships....
Soft big men do NOT win championships....
Soft teams...

You get the idea.

 

[bye_bye_bjax24]

The Nets can sign him for the agreed contract and send him to us for darius songalia with a starting salary within 125%?

SAR will space the floor ...pass and cut ....we'd average 110 points a game!

Rebounding? Defense? Well...lets just hope the opponent is having an off night.

Front line of Peja, Miller, SAR....Ooh I feel for our guards already. Thomas and Bibby as defenders in the rotation too... OUCH .Worst defensive team since the infamous Powder Blue Days!

 

[Kings113]

For the same reson that in nearly every single post on the subject you absolutely ignore the FACT that a soft PF will never win anything, in particular on an already soft team. And of course not surprisingly SAR never HAS won anything. Mark Cuban is WRONG in his 12 name players is better than 5 approach. And gets proven wrong again every year. For us, SAR is the wrong player at the wrong time for the wrong team.

Quite frankly I think you are dazzled by the numbers in fantasy ball fashion. But you're looking at the wrong numbers, and totally ignoring the needs of this team. There is only one thing that SAR brings which this team could use, and that is some post ability. But even there, he is a better post player against SFs than he is against PFs. And meanwhile is outmuscled, outtoughed, and outhustled by almost every PF he meets. A good talent, but nearly worthless to a serious team as a starter. When the Wallace boys and Duncan are going to war next June, SAR will be off hiding in the bathroom somewhere.

And the second part of course is that I do not trust Geoff, or Rick for that matter, to see beyond his ability to score. If I believed that they would actually sign him to a cheap contract and bring him off the bench as a SF/PF 6th man -- like Walker, his best potential role on an elite team (what San Antonio had in mind for him in fact) -- then fine. Be a nice talent off your bench, albeit there would still be the reeking softness problem rising off the whole team. But I don't trust them to do that. Nor do I think he would willingly sign with us in such a role. No, if he comes, he comes as a starting PF. Which is garbage to us. Four of our five big minute starters would be softies who don't defend, rebound, hustle, bang, or like to get physical. We have SAR's talent (scoring) in spades. And he would just be in the way of us picking up someone not afraid to break a nail to actually COMPLEMENT our numerous soft shooters with hustle and heart rather than duplicate their strengths and weaknesses.

We should have a mantra:

Soft big men do NOT win championships....
Soft big men do NOT win championships....
Soft teams...

You get the idea.

Aside from 4/5 starters comment (excluding SAR)...

Absolutely agreed, and just about sums it up about SAR.

 

[Kings113]

The Nets can sign him for the agreed contract and send him to us for darius songalia with a starting salary within 125%?

SAR will space the floor ...pass and cut ....we'd average 110 points a game!

Rebounding? Defense? Well...lets just hope the opponent is having an off night.

Front line of Peja, Miller, SAR....Ooh I feel for our guards already. Thomas and Bibby as defenders in the rotation too... OUCH .Worst defensive team since the infamous Powder Blue Days!

Which is why it's doubtful to happen. I hope this was a sarcastic/non-serious post.

 

[bye_bye_bjax24]

I would trade Darius for SAR in a heartbeat if the Nets deal falls through.

Defense is a bit overstated on this board....by the likes of V-21, Bricklayer, etc...(who make their share of fair points and respect them even though I say they are often off base).

It could be argued (granted hypothetically) the Suns failed against the Spurs b/c they lost JJ....not b/c Spurs were so superior on the defense. The Suns had the Spurs on their heals before JJ went down. The Spurs did not rise to status of NBA Champions again until they became a much more dynamic offensive team with Manu and Parker. And the Spurs beat the Pistons b/c they were the better offensive team.

The Kings did not get eliminated by the Lakers in 2002 for lack of defense. They choked away key offensive possessions, and missed free throws. Besides a defensive spark here and there by B-Jax Hedo or D.C., a little muscle by Pollard or quick hands of C-Webb (pre-injury) that team was no defensive juggernaut.

The point is if you put together a real potent offensive team (Wells Bibby Peja Miller SAR would be a handful to keep under 110 points a night) you compensate for what you lack, and you put as much pressure as you can on your opponent to keep up. The rules of the league have changed too to help the offense. I think the philosophy of Petrie and Adleman is until the second coming of Hakeem Olajuwon comes along, the best chance to win and advance deep in the playoffs is to run up the scoreboard. Put shooters and passers at every position, and put the onus on the 9/10 player core to come together and make stops.

Besides if you can score 115 points a night, you only have to hold your opponent to 114

 

[captain bill]

I'm convinced that for this team to win, we need to get much better defense off the bench. The 03 squad had a lot of energy and defensive intensity off the bench, and those bench minutes can mean holding an opponent to maybe 3-6 less points, which on any given night can be the difference in the game. Hart/Price are (supposedly) defensive upgrades, Skinner may provide some help on D, and if we can lengthen the bench to get some solid stoppers on there that could make the difference between a soft shoot-first team and a high scoring team that can get down and work hard on defensive when it needs to, which is also the difference between playoffs and contention. So I'd welcome SAR, so long as we continue to address D elsewhere.