Sac/Den/NYK

whozit

whozit

Starter
Denver sends to Sacramento:

PG A. Miller $8,633K (expiring)
C M. Camby $7,800K
PF E. Najera $4,571K who Sac agrees to waive so he can return to Denver
_______
~ $20,004K


Sacramento sends to Denver:

PG M. Bibby $12,500K
PF K. Thomas $ 6,720K
C Potapenko $ 3,674K (expiring)
_________
~ $22,894K


Denver sends to NYK:

C Potapenko $ 3,674K (expiring)
PF K. Martin $11,818K
__________
~ $15,592K

NYK sends to Denver:

SG Q. Richardson $6,690K
SG S. Anderson $8,500 (expiring)
_______
~ $15,460


Net Denver gains:

PG M. Bibby
PF K. Thomas
SG Q. Richardson
SG S. Anderson (expiring)

......and around 2.75 million in addition salary that could be nearly eliminated PF Jerome Willams was substituted for SG S. Anderson.

Net Denver losses:

PG A. Miller (expiring)
C M. Camby
PF K. Martin


Net Sacramento gains:

PG A. Miller (expiring)
C M. Camby

Net Sacramento losses:

PG M. Bibby
PF K. Thomas
C Potapenko (expiring)


Why NYK does this:

Well besides that they are NY, they get some size and I had thought there was some reports at one point of them being interested in Martin. I also thought (?) there were some reports of them wanting to get out from Q. Richardson's contract.

Why Sacramento does this:

Gets out from the cloud about Bibby excercising his ETO. Gets out of Thomas's contract and gets rid of his attitude. Camby could cover a lot of Miller's weaknesses if playing beside him. The loss of Bibby should be more than covered by the improvement on the defensive end. Camby would fit nicely with the team.

Why Denver does this:

Gets out from K Martin's contract AND attitude. They take a hit defensively with Camby but get upgrades at the PG position and SG postion. Their offensive being more balanced should cover the defensive hit.







The reason this is all hogwash:

Nothing happens with the NYK, rumored or factual, without everyone knowing about it!:)
 
I'd do that. Like Camby a lot. I'll take his 60 games a year for what the guy still supplies to both ends of the court. Also, Miller is an underrated PG.
 
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something tells me not to many teams are gonna want to listen to
anyone from the Denver camp about martin unless anthony is part of it. Besides you need to come up with a better argument then "well theyre NYK."
They got Curry, Frye, and Lee at the 4 spot, all are young. no reason to load down your team with a way over priced player whose coming off a major injury.
 
No. And why would we waive 4.5 million? That doesn't come off the books and the extra cap room we'd gain wouldn't really enable us to sign anyone, just keep us out of the luxury tax. Plus Miller is going to want a raise, or do we let him walk?
 
BigSong said:
something tells me not to many teams are gonna want to listen to
anyone from the Denver camp about martin unless anthony is part of it. Besides you need to come up with a better argument then "well theyre NYK."
They got Curry, Frye, and Lee at the 4 spot, all are young. no reason to load down your team with a way over priced player whose coming off a major injury.
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They have done a number of questionable moves to say the least. I would agree about not being too many teams that would be interested in him. I was simply going on recollection (not sure about my memory) that there were some reports of NYK being interested in him. But then again, according to the media it seems they're interested in about anyone who is a big name (as in name recognition).
 
pdxKingsFan said:
No. And why would we waive 4.5 million? That doesn't come off the books and the extra cap room we'd gain wouldn't really enable us to sign anyone, just keep us out of the luxury tax.
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The waiving of Najera would be an agreed upon thing. I don't see them giving up Miller, Camby and Najera for Bibby, Thomas and Potapenko. It could be done without Potapenko and Najera, but that would add nearly 4 million to Denver's bottom line and I'm doubtful of them even doing what I had proposed. Najera's contract is for this year with a players option for next.

The main objective is Camby. The Kings payed Price $5million a year for a couple(?) to stay home in order to get Bibby. It has been done before.
 
Very interesting.

But I believe that Mike Bibby is going to be in a salary drive and have a huge season. He has a lot to prove and a lot to lose. I am sure he wants to sign one more big contract before he begins the other side of his career. And the fact that he has never been an All Star and has kind of fallen in the eyes of the national spotlight I think will drive him into an unbelievable season. A season we may not have seen since the 00-01 Chris Webber season.

I think Bibby is capable of 25ppg and 6 to 7 assist with a healthy, happy and complete Ron Artest. So because of that I would not part with Bibby just yet.:D
 
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'Dre hit his peak five years ago, during the 01-02 season at Cleveland. He's still an above average PG who acts as a serviceable scorer and quality passer, of course, but none of his later seasons compare with 16.5 ppg and 10.9 apg. And of course, he lacks range; he has some offensive moves, but most involve getting himself closer to the basket. He's a downgrade over Bibby, but getting Camby would somewhat make up for it. But of course, only if the guy can stay healthy.
 
Arby's Roast Beef said:
'Dre hit his peak five years ago, during the 01-02 season at Cleveland. He's still an above average PG who acts as a serviceable scorer and quality passer, of course, but none of his later seasons compare with 16.5 ppg and 10.9 apg. And of course, he lacks range; he has some offensive moves, but most involve getting himself closer to the basket. He's a downgrade over Bibby, but getting Camby would somewhat make up for it. But of course, only if the guy can stay healthy.
Click to expand...
Yes, he is. In general, you have to give in order to get. Camby, despite his injury history, represents a huge upgrade for the Kings. Likewise, his loss would have to be considered a downgrade for the Nuggets.

The Kings would have to count on the "other" shooters on the team such as Garcia (hopefully he will find the range) and Douby along with Price to make up for Bibby's shooting. The playmaking abilities should be able to be easily covered by both Miller and the abundance of ballhandlers the Kings have.

The Nuggets would have to look to both the upgrades in both the point guard and shooting guard positions to rationalize the loss. They have an abundance of bigs but are sorely lacking in the small department and are nearly out of roster spots. This trade would on paper make their team more balanced.
 
I do not understand why you would give up Bibby for Miller. Bibby is better and his passing is almost just as good. Bibby would be averaging about the same as miller if he had Carmelo and so many big men to pass the ball to. I think Denver is going to get rid of a couple of big men and we could offer someone. I think Bibby stays for this season and i hope he realizes that the amount of money he makes each year is A LOT and chances are he won't get more than what he makes now.
 
If you are looking at why I think the Kings should give up Bibby for Miller, then I would ask you why Denver should give up Camby for Thomas? Both teams would be upgrading in one area and taking a hit in another. I think both teams would be better off as a whole despite the hit each would take.

This of course is all IMHO.
 
I would do Garcia and Thomas (maybe even a draft pick) for Camby. I don't know all the financial things and how the $ matches.
 
Financially, it would work. Thomas makes around $6.7 million and Camby around $7.8. Overlooking the luxery tax (which I did in my original suggestion in terms of Denver), Denver could take in nearly ten million dollars in salary and Garcia doesn't make anywhere near $3.3 million.

I would probably do it, despite the upside I think Garcia has.
 
Kevin Martin/Kenny Thomas for Marcus Camby.

Works for both teams. We have a bunch of guards who can play the two-spot. We get help up front. We maintain whatever chemistry was born last season between Artest and Bibby. If Artest is to continue playing some point-forward, Bibby is an ideal PG to have in the backcourt. Would even be better if we re-signed Bonzi. I believe we'd be able to crack open the window just slightly and make a serious push this year and next.

Bibby/Hart/Price/Douby
Bonzi/Salmons/Garcia/Douby
Artest/Garcia/Salmons
Miller/Shareef/Williams
Camby/Miller/Potapenko

Denver gets an up-and-coming two guard who should fit perfectly in between Melo and Andre Miller-- Kevin can slash and has the range to take pressure off Melo, and can catch and hit Miller's kick outs. Nene can start at the 5, with Smith backing him, Kenyon at the four, with KT and Evans backing him.

It’s a give and take for both teams, with pros and cons all over the place-- Size and age for youth and range. IMO, both teams would be better overall. Kings fans won’t like giving up Kevin (a potential 15-17 ppg scorer with range), but Denver fans won’t like bringing in another 4, while not moving Kenyon. That would make for a drama filled frontcourt.

Why Kevin instead of Garcia? Because Garcia is still unproven and would fall into the same category as Denver’s other young guards. To trade Camby, and bringing in another contract player to an already crowded 4 spot, Denver would want someone who has shown more.
 
Why would Denver want another pf in Thomas, at this moment they already have 3 (Nene, Kmart, and Evans). I think if a trade where to happen it would have to have Miller and with a combiation of Bibby, Bonzi or Martin. Many would disagree but i would like a deal that would have Miller and Bibby for A. Miller and Camby. We would be greatly improved on D but loss some on the offence end.
 
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DaMan said:
Why would Denver want another pf in Thomas, at this moment they already have 3 (Nene, Kmart, and Evans). I think if a trade where to happen it would have to have Miller and with a combiation of Bibby, Bonzi or Martin. Many would disagree but i would like a deal that would have Miller and Bibby for A. Miller and Camby. We would be greatly improved on D but loss some on the offence end.
Click to expand...

You forgot Joe Smith and Najera, both natural Forwards, and Jamaal Sampson who can also play there. Some of those guys will have to spend significant time at the 5 though.

But why would Denver take on Thomas- as far as the deal I mentioned- because Kevin is exactly what they need and is too good of a player for them to pass up. If anyone is to have reservations, it'd be us. And for the record, I do have reservations.

A deal where Andre Miller replaces Bibby would be disastrous if Artest is to handle the ball in the half-court- which he wants to do. We have ball handlers on the team already, and Andre’s lack of range would be a huge negative. Your only real outside threat would be at the 2 spot since Artest will play lots of minutes at the 3, and the 4 & 5 aren't outside threats. You’d have no flexibility spreading the floor. If Andre has a lesser role, it's more likely he would leave in the off-season, and you'd get less back in any potential S&T.
 
Think Denver would actually prefer Garcia+sweenter (pick? Douby?) to Martin because of their extreme lack of shooters.
 
If Petrie could somehow pull off a Camby for Thomas, Garcia, and a pick.A starting lineup of Bibby, Martin, Artest, Camby, and Miller isn't something i would want to face at anytime. I think Garcia could be really surprising this season, if given minute consistently. Plus the Nuggs need a shooter and Garcia is a good one, but inconsistent. Even if we don't do anything else for the rest of the season, i still like our roster, unlike some of you fans out there ;)
 
I agree ^. He and Diawara for the Nuggs could be a fun athletic team-playing combo off the bench. I think we'd need another PF though.

Amundson or Williams/Corliss could fill in for the short-term behind SAR though.
 
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why are we trading youth and draft pick for a old injury prone center/pf. i'm sure we could do better by dumping salary and going out on the free agent market to nab a big man.

old injury prone big = putting a band aid on a wound. this is not solving anything for the long term... we're not contending for the championship anytime soon.... so no thanks
 
KMart23 said:
why are we trading youth and draft pick for a old injury prone center/pf. i'm sure we could do better by dumping salary and going out on the free agent market to nab a big man.

old injury prone big = putting a band aid on a wound. this is not solving anything for the long term... we're not contending for the championship anytime soon.... so no thanks
Click to expand...

I think we are contending for a chamionship instead of building for the future, past and current moves have proved this. Trading for artest, signing sar to a 5 year contract, signing Salmon to a 5 year contract to play back up point instead of a young Douby or Price, trading for wells last year and then trying to resign him to a mulit year deal. All this tends to prove that we are not building for the future but contending now.

And how do you intend on dumping salary? We would have to either let go of one of our core players, mainly brad or bibby, in hopes (key word there is hope) that a big men is open. And looking at how bad the kings are at getting f/a's and also how decent big men are so far in between which makes many teams over pay for them, makes the chances of landing a big men almost impossible.

And before the injury, Camby was most likely the 3rd best center in the leauge and was a sure fire all star. He is a good shoot blocker, good rebounder, and has a decent jumper; he would be a great fit for this team. And the good thing about this Thomas, Garcia, and a pick for Camby deal (even though i think that Denver is getting riped off and it doesn't make any sense for them either. And would have to be high to do it) is that we did not give up brad and he could be put in the starting line up if anything happens to Camby.
 
I'd love Camby, but, he makes Webber + Peja's lovechild look like Cal Ripken Jr in terms of injuries.

The guy is injured daily almost.
 
I think we are contending for a chamionship instead of building for the future, past and current moves have proved this. Trading for artest, signing sar to a 5 year contract, signing Salmon to a 5 year contract to play back up point instead of a young Douby or Price, trading for wells last year and then trying to resign him to a mulit year deal. All this tends to prove that we are not building for the future but contending now.

i tend to disagree.

trading for artest?

that was a must trade situation. peja was gonna leave anyway-

trading 4 bonzi then trying to resign him?

bobby jackson was wanted a fat paycheck and would have left for more $$$. that trade was necessary. as far as trying to resign bonzi.. of course! some KF.com member said we are bleeding talent every year w/ nothing in return.

signing SAR?

he was the best cheap available big out there! look at our pathetic frontcourt. its a no brainer to pick up a slight upgrade at that position.

signing salmon?

we need some insurance bibby will be getting some rest w/ a capable backup 4 him since douby nor price is ready to contribute on a consistent basis.

And how do you intend on dumping salary? We would have to either let go of one of our core players, mainly brad or bibby, in hopes (key word there is hope) that a big men is open.

dumping salary is an option. i'm sure NYK wouldn't mind having brad for their penny hardaway contract and possibly a draft pick. there are dumb GMs out there.

And looking at how bad the kings are at getting f/a's and also how decent big men are so far in between which makes many teams over pay for them, makes the chances of landing a big men almost impossible.

big deal if we can't get a FA. we'll just suck it up for a year or two w/ some salary cap. the suns sucked it up for a year or two and got amare in the lottery... look where at where they are now?

>And before the injury, Camby was most likely the 3rd best center in the leauge and was a sure fire all star. He is a good shoot blocker, good rebounder, and has a decent jumper; he would be a great fit for this team. And the good thing about this Thomas, Garcia, and a pick for Camby deal (even though i think that Denver is getting riped off and it doesn't make any sense for them either. And would have to be high to do it) is that we did not give up brad and he could be put in the starting line up if anything happens to Camby.

that's great if he's healthy. if not, we'll have the coolest unathletic slow front court in miller and SAR. :D
 
that was a must trade situation. peja was gonna leave anyway-
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If we are not trying to contend for the title why did we trade for Artest? Why not trade peja for some young guys, exp contracts and or picks and see how kmart would play in the starting lineup?

bobby jackson was wanted a fat paycheck and would have left for more $$$. that trade was necessary. as far as trying to resign bonzi.. of course! some KF.com member said we are bleeding talent every year w/ nothing in return.
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If we had to trade bobby and we weren't contending why do we go out and trade for Bonzi. Granted it was expring, we did have to young guys in Evan and Martin who could have fought for the sg spot. And If we are not contending why not just outright give the spot to the young guy in Martin instead of trying to resign bonzi.

he was the best cheap available big out there! look at our pathetic frontcourt. its a no brainer to pick up a slight upgrade at that position.
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LoL, if we weren't contending we would have just let the front court suck it up the whole season and get the best pick we can get to get a big. And there were 3 reasons why sar came to Sac. The first being he could not go to NJ. Second being that he thought he was going to start. And the 3 being that he wanted to play for a contending team, if the kings weren't going to why would sar come here.

we need some insurance bibby will be getting some rest w/ a capable backup 4 him since douby nor price is ready to contribute on a consistent basis.
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If we are not contending why not give the young guys a chance to play. They won't learn anything playing little to no mins off the bench, just ask darko.

dumping salary is an option. i'm sure NYK wouldn't mind having brad for their penny hardaway contract and possibly a draft pick. there are dumb GMs out there.
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I just like when people say if you want to dump salary trade with NY. I really think that GM has already learned his lesson, espeaitly with his job being on the line. And by the why, Penny is gone he was part of the Franics deal.

big deal if we can't get a FA. we'll just suck it up for a year or two w/ some salary cap. the suns sucked it up for a year or two and got amare in the lottery... look where at where they are now?
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The point of all this is that we have chosen to obiviously contend instead of build for the future. The kings have had plenty of chances to wave the white flag and suck it up but instead we have chosen to trade for Artest, sign sar, and do other moves to contend. Trust me i am from orlando and I know when a team is building for the future or is contending.

that's great if he's healthy. if not, we'll have the coolest unathletic slow front court in miller and SAR. :D
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LOL, how many teams in the leauge could say that they have a backup center in the leauge that could start or even a decent starting center. If we ever have that luary we should never complain.
 
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