O'Brien details clashes with Webber

[AleksandarN]

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2008/basketball/nba/01/21/obrien.webber.ap/index.html?eref=si_nba

PHILADELPHIA (AP) -- Chris Webber never really fit in Philadelphia, dissatisfied with his role, the offensive system and all the losing in nearly two ill-fated years with the 76ers.
Former coach Jim O'Brien saw all the unhappiness early in Webber's tenure, shortly after the former All-Star forward was acquired from Sacramento near the 2005 trade deadline.

"He clearly was toward the end of his career," O'Brien said Monday.
O'Brien, now in his first year coaching Indiana, was fired after only one season in Philadelphia. Webber played 21 games for the Sixers that year, but rarely hid his distaste about playing for O'Brien. The pair clashed almost from the beginning and Webber called the final 21 games "timeout times 50," a reference to his infamous gaffe at Michigan in the 1993 national championship game.
"It became very apparent he wasn't going to give the 76ers everything we had hoped for," O'Brien said.

Speaking openly about Webber for the first time since he was fired at the end of 2005, O'Brien said before Indiana's game at Philadelphia that the forward was never interested in practice or truly committed to the offensive scheme.

"Webber didn't practice at all that year prior to coming to us," O'Brien said. "He didn't practice at all the previous six weeks. I think he was just at the point where he didn't necessarily feel where he was in need of practice, or could practice, or couldn't practice and play at the same time."
O'Brien said he wanted to actively use Webber, who had lost some mobility and agility after microfracture knee surgery, in the low post to open up shots for 3-point threat

"He said, 'Coach, I don't do the low-post thing anymore,"' O'Brien recalled. "We just made a major trade to bring in this 6-11 guy and he said, 'No.' I said, 'Yes, you do."'
Webber's unhappiness forced him to meet with O'Brien to express his grievances with his role. O'Brien was fired three weeks after the Sixers were eliminated by Detroit in the playoffs -- the organization's last playoff appearance -- and replaced by former Sixer Maurice Cheeks.
Cheeks is coaching the final year of a three-year contract.

"I just think it would have been a very difficult group to coach the following year, quite frankly," O'Brien said. "I'm just glad Maurice Cheeks had that opportunity instead of me."
Webber bounced back under Cheeks in 2005-06 with solid averages of 20.2 points, 9.9 rebounds and 3.4 assists in 75 games. But he fell out of favor with Cheeks early last season, was benched in several fourth quarters and accepted a contract buyout in January.
He finished last season with Detroit.

O'Brien said he agreed at the time with then-team president Billy King's decision to acquire Webber.
"That move enabled us to make the playoffs," O'Brien said.
O'Brien, a Philadelphia native who played for Saint Joseph's, sat at home the last two years and collected the nearly $8 million owed to him by the Sixers. He is glad he earned another chance in Indiana.
"I was hoping I'd get another opportunity and I did," O'Brien said. "I've always been a Philadelphia fan. I hope they turn that franchise around."

 

[VF21]

Nice how O'Brien doesn't mention that Webber was, in fact, the reigning PLAYER OF THE MONTH at the time he went to Philadelphia. This sounds like petty whining to me... and JOB should be thinking about the trainwreck he's currently in charge of in Indiana.

 

[Glenn]

Sour grapes on a slow news day.

 

[uolj]

Still, it highlights some of the things that were so frustrating about Webber. Not wanting to work in the low post even though he still had the ability to help there, and not being able to practice (presumably because of the knee).

And then of course you can see how somebody like Adelman might get the most out of Webber. In some cases he'll acquiesce to the star. And for more important things he won't say, "Yes, you do." He'll be a little more massaging of that ego to get what he needs.

 

[VF21]

"Webber didn't practice at all that year prior to coming to us," O'Brien said. "He didn't practice at all the previous six weeks. I think he was just at the point where he didn't necessarily feel where he was in need of practice, or could practice, or couldn't practice and play at the same time."

While Webber wasn't participating in strenuous full contact practices every single day, if memory serves, it wasn't - as O'Brien tries to make it sound - that he thought he was above practicing.

Frustration about Webber aside, I think it's pretty apparent O'Brien resented Webb ever even donning a Sixers uniform which was obvious right from the start.

It was a horrible trade and a horrible time and I think O'Brien bears more than just a smidgeon of blame.

 

[Warhawk]

It was a horrible trade and a horrible time and I think O'Brien bears more than just a smidgeon of blame.

I think it's one of those that all parties involved would like a do-over on.

 

[VF21]

I think possibly a "don't do" rather than a "do over" but I get your point.

 

[bozzwell]

Why is JOB even going there around the time that Webber is looking to join an NBA team for one last time? It's like being petty "times 50".

 

[VF21]

My guess is he doesn't have much else to talk about. O'Neal is out with a recurring knee problem (or at least that's what is being reported); Harrison has been sitting out for a violation of the league substance abuse rules; Tinsley is ... ... scary; and the Pacers fans are NOT a happy lot right now, with a number of them in the same "why don't we just pack it in and hope for a lottery pick" philosophy some have around here.

I honestly think the coaches in the mold of JOB are on the way out. He's like a neurotic accountant and it just doesn't seem to play well with a large number of the players he's supposed to form into a cohesive productive team.

 

[kennadog]

Why now? So petty. As I recal, Matt Barnes was very unhappy with the Sixers, too.

 

[beb0p]

If what JOB said is true, then GP is even more justified in trading Webber. I do not want a slow, unathletic, injury-prone PF who doesn't want to "do the low post thing anymore" and also doesn't practice; grumpy knee or not. I have never heard of a franchise player who doesn't practice. Have you?

I can't believe some of you are making excuses for C-Web not practicing. Everyone practices. Even Shaquille O'Neal drags his overweight rearends and cranky ankles to practices.

 

[uolj]

That might be true, especially over the long haul, but the fact remains that the Kings were winning and Webber was helping them win. They traded Webber and they have won less and less ever since.

He was far from perfect, but his positives at the time sure seem to have outweighed the negatives.

 

[Arkitect]

A hobbled Webber that doesn't practice and plays on the perimeter is still better than Mikki Moore and Kenny Thomas, which is what we have instead.

 

[VF21]

If what JOB said is true, then GP is even more justified in trading Webber. I do not want a slow, unathletic, injury-prone PF who doesn't want to "do the low post thing anymore" and also doesn't practice; grumpy knee or not. I have never heard of a franchise player who doesn't practice. Have you?

I can't believe some of you are making excuses for C-Web not practicing. Everyone practices. Even Shaquille O'Neal drags his overweight rearends and cranky ankles to practices.

WEBBER PRACTICED; he just didn't do all the stuff sometimes because of the knee. JOB is a piece of **** for these comments IMHO. Webber going to him and saying he didn't do the low post wasn't Webb being difficult. It was, as I pointed out earlier, Webber admitting he could no longer do some of the post moves he once had in his repertoire. If you're going to try and rewrite history to justify Webber's trade, at least get your freaking facts straight.

 

[LPKingsFan]

A hobbled Webber that doesn't practice and plays on the perimeter is still better than Mikki Moore and Kenny Thomas, which is what we have instead.

And would have been a massive expiring contract this summer

 

[beb0p]

WEBBER PRACTICED; he just didn't do all the stuff sometimes because of the knee. JOB is a piece of **** for these comments IMHO. Webber going to him and saying he didn't do the low post wasn't Webb being difficult. It was, as I pointed out earlier, Webber admitting he could no longer do some of the post moves he once had in his repertoire. If you're going to try and rewrite history to justify Webber's trade, at least get your freaking facts straight.

Who's rewriting history here?

On the one hand, a former NBA coach said Webber didn't practice, and didn't practice even when he was in Sacramento.

On the other hand, there's you making excuses about why Webber didn't try to do his job.

What you have to know is, it doesn't matter what reasons Web had for wanting to play small; the bottom line is GP was smart to get rid of a $20 millions slow, soft, injury-prone, big man who doesn't practice.

 

[beb0p]

A hobbled Webber that doesn't practice and plays on the perimeter is still better than Mikki Moore and Kenny Thomas, which is what we have instead.

I hope you're joking. Judging from the Webber that I saw last season, Miki would have a career game against him. Hell, the semi-comatose KT would have a career game against Webber.

Even the Lakers preferred Mbenga to C-Web. That should tell you something.

 

[VF21]

Who's rewriting history here?

On the one hand, a former NBA coach said Webber didn't practice, and didn't practice even when he was in Sacramento.

On the other hand, there's you making excuses about why Webber didn't try to do his job.

What you have to know is, it doesn't matter what reasons Web had for wanting to play small; the bottom line is GP was smart to get rid of a $20 millions slow, soft, injury-prone, big man who doesn't practice.

Sorry, dude, but O'Brien said Webber didn't practice the whole year and that's patently UNTRUE. You just like seeing Webber bashed. I'd prefer to read the truth. To each his own...

 

[ParniValjak]

WEBBER PRACTICED; he just didn't do all the stuff sometimes because of the knee. JOB is a piece of **** for these comments IMHO. Webber going to him and saying he didn't do the low post wasn't Webb being difficult. It was, as I pointed out earlier, Webber admitting he could no longer do some of the post moves he once had in his repertoire. If you're going to try and rewrite history to justify Webber's trade, at least get your freaking facts straight.

Oh please!

Webber could commit a crime and he would be innocent in your book! So it was OK for Webb to dog out JOB at the time but once JOB sets the record straight down the track its petty. Double standards!

I will ALWAYS be greatful for what Webber brought to my team and I will always look back at those memories with much joy and respect but he is NOT a saint or as your are trying to portray him in your post as a reasonable person for admitting he could no longer do low post!

 

[VF21]

To each his own. I'm not going to get into a battle of insults over Chris Webber. The whole situation in Philadelphia was horrible and JOB was fired so I wasn't the only one who thought he stunk up the place. I would present more facts but you wouldn't beleive them anyway so I'm bowing out. Have a nice day.

 

[Arkitect]

I hope you're joking. Judging from the Webber that I saw last season, Miki would have a career game against him. Hell, the semi-comatose KT would have a career game against Webber.

Even the Lakers preferred Mbenga to C-Web. That should tell you something.

Two seasons ago he was still putting up 20 and 10 on a team not much better than ours is now. Detroit finished last season on an incredible hot streak because they had Webber. Webber finished last year averaging 12 and 7 in about 30 min of playing time on a championship contending team. In the same minutes Moore is putting up 8 and 6 on a lottery team. I know Webber is not the defensive presence he used to be and has basically no vertical anymore, but he is still a better player than Moore. The fact is you would get more points and rebounds out of Webber than you do out of Moore.

 

[beb0p]

Two seasons ago he was still putting up 20 and 10 on a team not much better than ours is now. Detroit finished last season on an incredible hot streak because they had Webber. Webber finished last year averaging 12 and 7 in about 30 min of playing time on a championship contending team. In the same minutes Moore is putting up 8 and 6 on a lottery team. I know Webber is not the defensive presence he used to be and has basically no vertical anymore, but he is still a better player than Moore. The fact is you would get more points and rebounds out of Webber than you do out of Moore.

There's a reason why numbers sometimes lie. Webber's 20-10 season in Philly was by means of jacking up a lot of shots (mostly from outside 18 feet) and making very few of them. If you give Mikki Moore 25 shots a game and is ok with him shooting only 43%, Mikki can put up 20 pts a game too. As for the rebounding, Mikki averages 6.0 playing next to a guy who averages 9.0 a game. Webber got 6.7 playing next to a guy who averages 7.3. There's very little difference. But Mikki will give you energy, athleticism, a healthy body, a little defense, and he actually practices. Webber will give you none of them.

The bottom line is, if the Lakers can have Mikki Moore for the league minimum, no way would they choose Mbenga over him.

 

[beb0p]

Sorry, dude, but O'Brien said Webber didn't practice the whole year and that's patently UNTRUE. You just like seeing Webber bashed. I'd prefer to read the truth. To each his own...

And you'd know that...how?

 

[uolj]

I think O'Brien meant he didn't practice that calendar year. Notice that he clarified in the next sentence and said six weeks, which was how any weeks had passed in that year before the trade.

I think the reason that teams might not jump for Webber is not because he's not good any more, but because he does not bring a role player mentality that someone else might bring.

 

[acisking]

There's a reason why numbers sometimes lie. Webber's 20-10 season in Philly was by means of jacking up a lot of shots (mostly from outside 18 feet) and making very few of them. If you give Mikki Moore 25 shots a game and is ok with him shooting only 43%, Mikki can put up 20 pts a game too. As for the rebounding, Mikki averages 6.0 playing next to a guy who averages 9.0 a game. Webber got 6.7 playing next to a guy who averages 7.3. There's very little difference. But Mikki will give you energy, athleticism, a healthy body, a little defense, and he actually practices. Webber will give you none of them.

The bottom line is, if the Lakers can have Mikki Moore for the league minimum, no way would they choose Mbenga over him.

wow...how do you know that the lakers chose mbenga over him...the lakers have been going after webb for the past few seasons...it could simply be the case that he didn't want to sign with them (which was actually being reported on ESPN, because he doesn't view them as viable championship contenders)

 

[VF21]

And you'd know that...how?

Because I know people who were actually present at practices. Believe me or not. I couldn't possibly care less.

 

[sidney]

Chris was playing major minutes and dealing with the limitations his body had at the time.

JOB was so unaware about Chris' limitations that instead of working with Chris to find how his strengths could help the 6ers he chose to be offended proves to me that he was clueless as I thought him to be at the time.

This is like Theus trying to get Bibby to block more shots and draw up plays for Miller's post moves and them resisting. Would Bibby and Miller be to blame? No, it would be horrible coaching.

 

[kennadog]

Webber could commit a crime and he would be innocent in your book! So it was OK for Webb to dog out JOB at the time but once JOB sets the record straight down the track its petty. Double standards!

Darn right it's petty. If he wanted to spill all this to the press, the time to do it was then or right after he was fired, if he just had to tell. JOB should be over it by now and exactly what purpose is it supposed to serve now? Make him feel better? Place the blame for his failure elsewhere? Get even? Then its not only petty and ancient history, it's self-serving....even if every word were gospel truth.

 

[beb0p]

wow...how do you know that the lakers chose mbenga over him...the lakers have been going after webb for the past few seasons...it could simply be the case that he didn't want to sign with them (which was actually being reported on ESPN, because he doesn't view them as viable championship contenders)

Lakers is one of the teams Webber would join, as reported on ESPN.

Are the Spurs going to sign Webber? No. Are the Pistons? No. The Suns? No. The Celtics? No. The Mavs? Slight chance, but probably not. Orlando? Maybe. So if not the Lakers, tell me what team is going to sign him that is better than the Lakers?

 

[beb0p]

Chris was playing major minutes and dealing with the limitations his body had at the time.

JOB was so unaware about Chris' limitations that instead of working with Chris to find how his strengths could help the 6ers he chose to be offended proves to me that he was clueless as I thought him to be at the time.

This is like Theus trying to get Bibby to block more shots and draw up plays for Miller's post moves and them resisting. Would Bibby and Miller be to blame? No, it would be horrible coaching.

There's a big difference between a player who can't play in the low block, and one who doesn't want to. And JOB's point is that Webber was the later.

Web is not Brad Miller, he could play in the post and in fact, he should. Even Mikki Moore and Brad Miller go down low a few times a game. Unless Webber's knee injury also cuts a few inches from his height, there's no reason why he couldn't do it. He just didn't want to.

And in fact, the Sixers made the playoff with JOB forcing Webber to play big. Then he was fired, C-Web got his wish and just shoot jumpers, and we know the rest of the story.