NewArena
All-Star
Sorry idk why i couldn't find it. Much appreciated
McNair gone
- Thread starter Tetsujin
- Start date
NewArena
All-Star
It took me a while to get over that DNP in game 2 of this past season in LA when the Lakers went on a 21-0 run. Just unbelievable smh
SacTownKid
Hall of Famer
Extend? Yes. Fire? Looks like no. Trade for LaVine? Who knows. The Kings had been in rumors and Monte McNair had clearly been talking with Chicago for more than a year on LaVine. There's been smoke there so I would highly doubt that McNair was shocked that LaVine ended up on the Kings or Vivek walked into his office shouting, "Zach ROCKS!!", haha. This is why it's all so confusing. McNair was supposedly the one wiping his butt with picks, yet got picks back in the LaVine deal. Which was why that trade made some degree of sense. If the Kings set fire to picks this summer to "contend" with this crew, this could very well turn into the fears of some that this will now send this franchise deeper into yet another 10 year period of stuck right in the middle.
SacTownKid
Hall of Famer
True. In fairness, Monte did try that first summer. His problem is he pulled a Vlade, when option A went by the wayside he fully committed to option B. Thankfully none of the contracts were horrendous but he made it really hard on himself to adjust the roster because of the length of some of the deals. Lyles should have been signed to a shorter deal. Barnes too. He also should have immediately traded Holmes the moment the Kings traded for Domas. That cost the Kings another 1st rounder. Monte did eventually kind of learn that though and that's probably why he wasn't going to sit once Fox was prepping for his exit. GM'ing 101 is jumping off the tracks as soon as you see the lights coming.
SacTownKid
Hall of Famer
Shoe on the other foot, some of those names cost Vivek $$$ and didn't always yield results either. I get Malone was the first real coach by that point, but the results were what they were. Walton, well that was Vlade's downfall, that was a buddy and a bad bad hire for where the Kings were at at the time. Walton was already well known for diminishing star potential and pushing gems like Kuzma. Brown wore out his welcome. It's crazy how people have already forgotten how ugly it was when they did fire Brown. He was going full blown media assualt. That's literally the last straw/nuclear option for a coach because once the team stops responding it's over. You have to go. Or change out the entire roster.
If you're talking about when Coach called out Fox for blowing his defensive assignment at the end of the Detroit game, Fox said that he wanted to be held accountable and he only told the team that he wanted out after they fired Mike Brown because he was done dealing with the coaching turnover in Sacramento.
SacTownKid
Hall of Famer
Brown wasn't just calling out Fox. In fact, Brown wasn't really calling out anyone most of the time. He was being passive aggressive, and on the floor? Making NO adjustments. Not playing someone like Keon yet complaining about defense. Brown certainly had a right to be angry and in a bygone era that flies and might even work, not anymore. Players don't play that game. They'll call their agent crying until they get their way.
Being Kings fans we've literally seen every single type of coach you can hire. We've seen all the tricks, we've seen all of it. Good cop, bad cop. X's and O's guys, emotional support types, hard a**es. Once the trickery falls flat, it's over. It's just wasting time at that point. Brown was there at his last trick, and that had NOTHING to do with Vivek. Vivek maybe could have given them more time but that was clear as day that the team had topped out, teams around them surpassed them, and it was sliding downhill. Negativity was creeping up.
The next step is far more critical than firing or hiring any coach. The Kings better not go deeper in any further. If they want to give it a summer to develop fine, but keeping a rebuild on the table has to be a priority. Whether that's this summer or the deadline. If the rebuild doesn't happen it can only be because that development did do the trick. Yes, let success be the guide, not the demands of someone like Domas who hasn't earned it because when the lights got hot, he melted. No mans land isn't success whether that's 46 wins or 40. That's no mans land especially when you look at the age of the Kings core. Those guys have no more upside to tap. They are what they are.
I think Brown survives the season and gets whacked this offseason had he not held us up for the contract in the offseason. It was a clash of egos and perhaps rash, but there was no turning things around. I want to root for this team to win games. It was a ripping the bandaid off moment. We have more bandages underneath and they are going to hurt.
But I don't think the team was on the cusp of turning it around because we were just terrible in late game situations.
Deebo was a mistake. I don't blame the player, but adding him to the roster broke us.
I'm a little irritated with Kings fan media right now though since they were instrumental in getting Brown that deal. He didn't deserve a raise after 23-24. The coaches that all got bigger paydays that his demands were predicated on are also largely fired and people aren't talking about it even though that dummy in Phoenix is a big part of it.
But I don't think the team was on the cusp of turning it around because we were just terrible in late game situations.
Deebo was a mistake. I don't blame the player, but adding him to the roster broke us.
I'm a little irritated with Kings fan media right now though since they were instrumental in getting Brown that deal. He didn't deserve a raise after 23-24. The coaches that all got bigger paydays that his demands were predicated on are also largely fired and people aren't talking about it even though that dummy in Phoenix is a big part of it.
Also seeing Evan Sidery circling like a vulture to pick at our carcass. Again why can't the guy out Vivek'ing Vivek in Phoenix get this level of grief?
Why is Windbags so happy to trash us instead of Dallas or Phoenix or Denver or Memphis, let alone a half dozen teams in the East who only look better than the Kings because you can win 36 games and make the playoffs in that conference.
I'm fine if the call is coming from our house, we deserve the right to vent but these outsiders can eff right off.
Why is Windbags so happy to trash us instead of Dallas or Phoenix or Denver or Memphis, let alone a half dozen teams in the East who only look better than the Kings because you can win 36 games and make the playoffs in that conference.
I'm fine if the call is coming from our house, we deserve the right to vent but these outsiders can eff right off.
ShastaKingsFan
All-Star
It's because it's a repeating pattern of operation since he bought the team in 2013
sactowndog
All-Star
it’s possible it wasn’t all Mikes decision but as a good soldier he would say it was.
Last edited:
If he was hands off Monte until this year - something I've seen no indication to contradict - I'd argue he was in his reasonable right to end things this season. Unfortunately, the beam team had run its course. People keep reaching back to that stupid cherry picking comment in 2014 to show how dumb he is but outside of that he even let Vlade and Brandon Williams do the basketball in 2018 which is why we're all so miserable right now.
Let's at least wait to see if Perry is just a yes man.
ShastaKingsFan
All-Star
What makes you think he hasn't been heavily involved and had the final say in every major decision?
Unless you think Perry would otherwise choose Doug Christie as his head, we will already know that he is starting as a yes man if Doug is given the job
I think Doug earned a chance so interestingly enough I’d be disappointed if he is let go but that would certainly signal something if he is.
He was the first unanimous Coach of the Year winner in league history! If he doesn't deserve a pay raise in that context than who the hell does?
Joshyjosh31
Starter
Keon did gamble a lot and it hurt the team he stopped doing it so much tho but at the beginning I definitely agree with Brown
I like the idea that the Kings organization is one endless game of telephone where nobody knows who is actually responsible for any decision other than it wasn't them. This seems like a terrific way to run a business.
coolhandluke
Starter
Like success, failure also has a lot of fathers. It was a joint effort but they keep blaming each other.I like the idea that the Kings organization is one endless game of telephone where nobody knows who is actually responsible for any decision other than it wasn't them. This seems like a terrific way to run a business.
Tetsujin
The Game Thread Dude
Vivek has acquired such a reputation that anytime someone actually screws up (I’m fairly certain Vivek wasn’t throwing down executive orders to bench the guy who is good at defense and shoots 40% from three for the guy who is pretty bad at defense and had forgotten how to shoot since the all-star break of his first season with the team) they can just play the blame game and everyone will just say “sounds about right”.I like the idea that the Kings organization is one endless game of telephone where nobody knows who is actually responsible for any decision other than it wasn't them. This seems like a terrific way to run a business.
Jdbraver137
Bench
Devin Carter can be a real one too, but his shot needs work. Still I think you take high effort players anyday over guys that disappear and reemerge with 30 points. Not hating on Levine he just needs a free flowing offense to bring his gifts out.
ShastaKingsFan
All-Star
They decided to start Huerter in hopes that he would get his value back to where it was, before his shooting fell off.
When in doubt about a decision between players, always look at their contracts first. In the case of Huerter vs Keon, it was about 17 mil vs 2.12. They were managing salaries and trying to avoid Huerter's value falling off any more than it already had, by giving him every opportunity to look like the player he was in that first season with the Kings
Yeah, and he failed to build on it the following year. Then with the new contract was 5 games under .500 31 games into the season.
There's almost always a honeymoon period at a new job. He had a great one. Fell back to earth quickly though. I think it's pretty fair to say he did not deserve a raise.
iowamcnabb
Hall of Famer
He did deserve a raise. Coaches were under paid prior to Monte Williams. Once Detroit gave out that deal there was no going back to paying established NBA coaches less than what some college programs pay.
ShastaKingsFan
All-Star
He deserved a bigger contract after he had finished the first contract that he had agreed to. But hey, if the owner wants to extend with big contracts and then fire someone a few months later and have to pay them million's of dollars to go away, that's his prerogative.
Doesn't make much sense to me, when you could at least see how the season is going for a couple months and then go ahead with an extension, if you still think it makes sense. That's not "lame duck". It's honoring the contract that you agreed to and not allowing someone to become more comfortable then they should be, within the context of where the team is and what it needs.....which is a sense of urgency.
He was 2 years into a 4 year contract. He had an opt out he could have used after the third year (it was mutual) and he chose to play it early in the media. I would say that's dirty play/
Also the guys that got these huge contracts that justified Mike Brown's demands (Bud, Monty Williams), are they still with their club?
Maybe we just saw a glitch in the system.
Vivek was forced into giving him the raise by a hostile media riling up the fanbase, I don't think he wanted to.
Now I am not sure there was any coming back from the hole we had dug by mid-December. If we had played .500 ball the next 6 weeks and were at the trade deadline 5 or 6 games below .500 and outside the play-in, is Fox not demanding a trade just because Brown is there? He's already building his new home in Texas. So in a way I think everything that happened was inevitable.
But I also think the contract negotiation created a lot of bad will because in many folks' eyes you don't demand a raise at the mid-point of a contract, that's exactly what the option in his following year was made for. He cheated everyone by flexing his option a year early.
I think it’s pretty fair to say that the players quit on him as well as the owner I guess. Red flag on the players who quit because he worked them to hard? Brown made some mistakes in hindsight but the players are 1000% to blame as much as Brown. Maybe Monte too. To put it all on Brown is wrong.
I'm not giving anyone a pass, the night before Brown was fired I said it was clear to me that Fox, Brown and Monte were done with the Kings. And obviously Vivek is emotional and impatient, but we can't change the owner. I think he is pretty strictly mid-tier and not the worst owner in the league, I do believe he actually cares about the product, wants to win, and knows their failure is viewed as his failure. Which I still think there is a fair chunk of owners who don't care at all. But he's part of how we got here too.
ShastaKingsFan
All-Star
He's bottom of the barrel for sure, in terms of doing what it takes to build a good team. I guess we could debate about who is the absolute worst, but he isn't average or middle of the pack
Similar threads
- Locked
- ClutchPoints | Sacramento Kings News
- Personnel moves
