Looking ahead to the 2023 Draft

[Ozymandias]

so you think he will live up to the hype?

yeah he's the real deal IMO. mega star written all over him. He's gonna make a billion dollars playing ball like Bron.. The real way to judge it IMO is when you ask: 'whats he gonna look like in 4 years with 25-35lbs of muscle on him?' It's gonna be a scary sight.

I do believe Chet is a better 3pt shooter though. The whole "7'4 KD" thing is taking it too far.

The way Wembanyama is able to control his body at 7'4 is unprecedented. How he's pulling up off the dribble from 3.. No one has a snowflakes chance in hell from unseating him from that top spot.. and on the flipside; there's not a team stupid or brazen enough to pass on him.

 

[Ozymandias]

Luka didn't get as much AMERICAN hype because instead of playing 2 meaningless games againt a G-League Team in order to showcasing his talent, he was busy dominating the Euroleague at 18 years old.
That's not againt Wembanyama who I think is the next big thing but more about how you guys consider professional euro basketball.
Sorry to sound rude !

I dont think this was totally the case. With a lot of the Luka hindsight the fact that DeAndre Ayton was an extremely hyped prospect too, which was warranted, often gets overlooked. Ayton was a topshelf known commodity for many many years, just like Luka.

The Suns have won 75% of their regular season games the past 2 seasons with him and made a finals appearance too.

Jaren Jackson who was the youngest prospect, with all his physical tools and shooting 40% from 3 in college goes after Luka in that draft so its not like there was really this widespread ignorance about what Luka could do..

I think what Funky posted about Luka was more the issue. I remember seeing people question his 3pt shooting a bit too.

 

[kingsboi]

yeah he's the real deal IMO. mega star written all over him. He's gonna make a billion dollars playing ball like Bron.. The real way to judge it IMO is when you ask: 'whats he gonna look like in 4 years with 25-35lbs of muscle on him?' It's gonna be a scary sight.

I do believe Chet is a better 3pt shooter though. The whole "7'4 KD" thing is taking it too far.

The way Wembanyama is able to control his body at 7'4 is unprecedented. How he's pulling up off the dribble from 3.. No one has a snowflakes chance in hell from unseating him from that top spot.. and on the flipside; there's not a team stupid or brazen enough to pass on him.

will he have a better career than Anthony Davis in your opinion?

 

[Ozymandias]

will he have a better career than Anthony Davis in your opinion?

I mean anthony davis is 6'10, Wembanyama is half a foot taller. It's also fair to say that the state of the bad teams in the NBA have far more talent on their rosters than when AD touched down. Vic's got a much better chance at not being stuck in a horrible situation like AD was in N.O.

Once your talking 7'3 and above, youve now entered the rare territory of the tallest on the planet, people that height are far more scarce than what the league calls "seven footers" (which includes lots of 6'11 guys).

There's only been 20-something players listed at 7'3" and above in the history of the league, and Vic's 7'3" barefoot apparently. So I'd say he'll have the best career out of those giants; Yao Ming, Kristaps(is he really 7'3"?), Ralph Sampson.

He's ridiculously marketable, the most marketable player whos entered the league in a very long time, since Bron probably.. They're gonna want to broadcast his games on national TV right away.. They are gonna roll the red carpets.. He's about to be a big time attraction

I used to play pick up ball and shoot around vs a guy who was supposed to be the tallest man from Sudan he was somewhere between 7'3 and 7'5 and it seemed like he would tower over his friend who was apparently 7'. Thats one of the reasons I'd hesitate to compare Vic to players of a more normal height. To me it's not the same.

Strangely enough Vic might not be the tallest player drafted.. 7'5" Jamarion Sharpe at WKU is on the radar for the 2nd rd.

 

[kingsboi]

I mean anthony davis is 6'10, Wembanyama is half a foot taller. It's also fair to say that the state of the bad teams in the NBA have far more talent on their rosters than when AD touched down. Vic's got a much better chance at not being stuck in a horrible situation like AD was in N.O.

Once your talking 7'3 and above, youve now entered the rare territory of the tallest on the planet, people that height are far more scarce than what the league calls "seven footers" (which includes lots of 6'11 guys).

There's only been 20-something players listed at 7'3" and above in the history of the league, and Vic's 7'3" barefoot apparently. So I'd say he'll have the best career out of those giants; Yao Ming, Kristaps(is he really 7'3"?), Ralph Sampson.

He's ridiculously marketable, the most marketable player whos entered the league in a very long time, since Bron probably.. They're gonna want to broadcast his games on national TV right away.. They are gonna roll the red carpets.. He's about to be a big time attraction

I used to play pick up ball and shoot around vs a guy who was supposed to be the tallest man from Sudan he was somewhere between 7'3 and 7'5 and it seemed like he would tower over his friend who was apparently 7'. Thats one of the reasons I'd hesitate to compare Vic to players of a more normal height. To me it's not the same.

Strangely enough Vic might not be the tallest player drafted.. 7'5" Jamarion Sharpe at WKU is on the radar for the 2nd rd.

so perhaps a more agile Kristaps then? I've seen Kristaps take and make the same type of shots Vic has been making but it's just unfortunate he has been injured most of his career, partly I think because of his size which may or may not be a problem for Vic too.

 

[Ozymandias]

so perhaps a more agile Kristaps then? I've seen Kristaps take and make the same type of shots Vic has been making but it's just unfortunate he has been injured most of his career, partly I think because of his size which may or may not be a problem for Vic too.

Well, Porzingis didnt stay in the draft in his first year of eligibility(2014). There was a rumor (that I think was legit) OKC had promised to take him 21st that year, instead he pulls out and ends up #4 in 2015. Vic is going #1 in his first year of eligibility, or ill eat my shoe.

I think Wembanyama is much more of a pure C, he's thin n lacks lower body strength like Porz but hes got probably 6" more wingspan which firmly puts him into the territory of 'opponents are not used to playing against this'. So he's got a much better chance at recovering,altering, blocking and just sort of mind-controlling opponents into not even trying to test him defensively. Given the crazy amount of hype he's going to enter the league with -- no ones gonna want to get blocked 5 times by him and get featured on the wrong side of that highlight reel. Though there will of course be players like Andrew Wiggins who are gonna try to posterize him immediately. Vic should also be a bigger threat on the boards.

Gobert entered the league with a 7'6" wingspan but Utah claimed a few years into his career that due to stretching it had increased to 7'8".. Is Wembanyama done growing?

Porzingis back at Sevilla would play next to Willie Hernangomez and they had another 7'2" C Balvin I think his name was, the story with him was he was originally signed as a small forward n then kept growing. He's blocking 2 shots per game in the NBA over many seasons now, but someone like Wembanyama should be in contention for 3 blocks per game once he gets full minutes.

As for Injuries. I dont think Vic has any real history of lower body injuries. He had a minor shoulder issue and then an undisclosed muscle issue last season. Injuries happen though. Porzingis major (knee) injuries have all been contact injuries.

It's not like this is an Alex Len situation where hes fresh off a stress fractured ankle.

The hype now is just the tip of the iceberg IMO. His face is about to be everywhere you look in a few years.

 

[Ozymandias]

6'9 Sophomore PF at Kentucky Damion Collins apparently tested at 46.5" Vert at Kentucky's Pro Day.. It's said that all 30 NBA teams were in attendance..

Kind of insane for someone that height..

He's not like just an athlete type of player either, has a decent looking jumpshot too.

 

[kingsboi]

Well, Porzingis didnt stay in the draft in his first year of eligibility(2014). There was a rumor (that I think was legit) OKC had promised to take him 21st that year, instead he pulls out and ends up #4 in 2015. Vic is going #1 in his first year of eligibility, or ill eat my shoe.

I think Wembanyama is much more of a pure C, he's thin n lacks lower body strength like Porz but hes got probably 6" more wingspan which firmly puts him into the territory of 'opponents are not used to playing against this'. So he's got a much better chance at recovering,altering, blocking and just sort of mind-controlling opponents into not even trying to test him defensively. Given the crazy amount of hype he's going to enter the league with -- no ones gonna want to get blocked 5 times by him and get featured on the wrong side of that highlight reel. Though there will of course be players like Andrew Wiggins who are gonna try to posterize him immediately. Vic should also be a bigger threat on the boards.

Gobert entered the league with a 7'6" wingspan but Utah claimed a few years into his career that due to stretching it had increased to 7'8".. Is Wembanyama done growing?

Porzingis back at Sevilla would play next to Willie Hernangomez and they had another 7'2" C Balvin I think his name was, the story with him was he was originally signed as a small forward n then kept growing. He's blocking 2 shots per game in the NBA over many seasons now, but someone like Wembanyama should be in contention for 3 blocks per game once he gets full minutes.

As for Injuries. I dont think Vic has any real history of lower body injuries. He had a minor shoulder issue and then an undisclosed muscle issue last season. Injuries happen though. Porzingis major (knee) injuries have all been contact injuries.

It's not like this is an Alex Len situation where hes fresh off a stress fractured ankle.

The hype now is just the tip of the iceberg IMO. His face is about to be everywhere you look in a few years.

would you happen to know the average amount of years played during their career for players that are 7'3 and up?

 

[Ozymandias]

would you happen to know the average amount of years played during their career for players that are 7'3 and up?

That average would be weighed down by these giants who only played about a dozen games or less; Tibor Pleiss, Edy Tavares, Alexsander Radojevic, Peter John Ramos, Sim Bhullar, Pavel Podkolzen and Slavko Vranes.

Then you have guys who played 40-70 games; Ha Seung-Jin, Tacko Fall and Priest Lauderdale.

As for the players who played more than a season; Gheorge Muresan, Manute Bol, Shawn Bradley, Yao Ming, Chuck Nevitt, Mark Eaton, Rik Smits, Ralph Sampson, Boban, Randy Breuer, Zydrunas Illgauskas, Arvydas Sabonis, Hasheem Thabeet, Swede Halbrook, Keith Closs and Kristaps. The average they played was about 5.74 full 82 game seasons, now obviously some of those players are still active, some like Sabonis got to the NBA late and some were affected by shortened seasons.

Many of these players were extremely mechanical in their movements and lumbering..

everyone knows this but I'll just point it out.. The NBA's all time leading scorer Kareem Abdul-Jabbar is 7'2" and misses this list by an inch. In his final season he started 74 games when he was 41 years old.

 

[kingsboi]

That average would be weighed down by these giants who only played about a dozen games or less; Tibor Pleiss, Edy Tavares, Alexsander Radojevic, Peter John Ramos, Sim Bhullar, Pavel Podkolzen and Slavko Vranes.

Then you have guys who played 40-70 games; Ha Seung-Jin, Tacko Fall and Priest Lauderdale.

As for the players who played more than a season; Gheorge Muresan, Manute Bol, Shawn Bradley, Yao Ming, Chuck Nevitt, Mark Eaton, Rik Smits, Ralph Sampson, Boban, Randy Breuer, Zydrunas Illgauskas, Arvydas Sabonis, Hasheem Thabeet, Swede Halbrook, Keith Closs and Kristaps. The average they played was about 5.74 full 82 game seasons, now obviously some of those players are still active, some like Sabonis got to the NBA late and some were affected by shortened seasons.

Many of these players were extremely mechanical in their movements and lumbering..

everyone knows this but I'll just point it out.. The NBA's all time leading scorer Kareem Abdul-Jabbar is 7'2" and misses this list by an inch. In his final season he started 74 games when he was 41 years old.

interesting stats indeed. thanks for doing some research on the topic. So the average years played for a player in that stature is 5 to 6 seasons. With Kristaps entering his 6th season, we shall see how long of a career he has.

 

[Ozymandias]

Andy Katz wrote a list of top15 potential breakout stars in college basketball for the season, here it is. Kris Murray is #1.

1. Kris Murray, Iowa: His twin brother is with the Sacramento Kings. Kris Murray is the go-to guy now with the Hawkeyes.

2. Mike Miles, TCU: Miles got overshadowed last season but he could be the Big 12 player of the year by season’s end for a possibly top-10 team.

3. Adama Sanogo, UConn: A healthy Sanogo could/should be the best big man in the Big East and is a throwback to the past dominating big men in Storrs.

4. Adam Flagler, Baylor: Flagler was on the title Bears team two years ago, but as a role player. Now he will be the featured guard.

5. Jordan Walker, UAB: The Blazers will be the favorite in Conference USA and Walker the player of the year and a rising star.

6. Julian Strawther, Gonzaga: Drew Timme is the main man with the Zags but Strawther’s time is now to be a legit second option and reliable scorer.

7. Cliff Omoruyi, Rutgers: He got lost in a loaded big-man conference, but Omoruyi will stand out as a shot-blocker and elite finisher for the Scarlet Knights.

8. Tyler Burton, Richmond: Burton is a veteran on a Spiders team that shocked Iowa in the first round of the tournament after winning the A-10 tournament title.

9. Ryan Nembhard, Creighton: Now healthy after a February wrist injury, Nembhard can lead the Bluejays to the top of the Big East and be the best lead guard in the conference.

10. Logan Johnson, Saint Mary’s: Tommy Kuhse is gone which means Johnson’s numbers will climb as the focal point in a difficult offense to defend.

11. Jamison Battle, Minnesota: Battle averaged 17.5 points a game last season. He could average over 20 this season for the Gophers.

12. Ace Baldwin, VCU: The Rams have consistently had elite guards. Baldwin is next in line.

13. Justyn Mutts, Virginia Tech: He averaged 10/7 last season with Keve Aluma. His numbers should increase significantly.

14. Jalen Cook, Tulane: He was first-team all-American with 18 points a game and shooting 39 percent on 3s. But nationally few knew. He could lead the Green Wave to an NCAA bid.

15. Tyler Wahl, Wisconsin: Wahl will be a primary option for the Badgers. He shot just under 60 percent on 2s. If he can get his 3s up to the low 30s and then look out.

 

[Ozymandias]

https://247sports.com/LongFormArticle/NBA-Draft-front-office-poll--195297671/#195297671_1

interesting article on draft stuffs

 

[Ozymandias]

Oh... Isaiah Miranda will explore his draft options this spring... He's 19 and doing a post-grad year..

Sign me up for drafting him in the 2nd round. Athletic 7-footer with a solid frame and coordination, at least 7'5 wingspan and chance at being good offensively.

He's a player thatll get picked up in some capacity just because hes young n passes the upside eye test. Should be a solid development project.

 

[Ozymandias]

I know its way too early but I have a funny feeling that 6'9" PF/C GG Jackson is going to be a player the Kings like a lot this summer

This roster could use a PF like that IMO. He fits well on defense between Sabonis and Murray at the PF/C spot, could solve multiple issues. 7'3" wingspan active competitor n can really jump and switch on bigger and smaller players and plays with a meanstreak. Has potential offensively shown some flashes shooting from 20ft n beyond

He just seems like the type of draft pick that might be able to plug in fast n net big results quickly.

 

[Tetsujin]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1585647275237289984

Seems a little excessive

 

[Ozymandias]

This is going to be one of those exhausting drafts to discuss where no one wants to talk about anything but the top projected pick


The fact that opinions are low on the 2024 drafts quality will only bolster this pressure as well. a perfect storm is brewing.

 

[Ozymandias]

Wembanyama
Sabonis
Murray
Huerter
Fox

next seasons starters

 

[Tetsujin]

Wembanyama
Sabonis
Murray
Huerter
Fox

next seasons starters

Sabonis
Murray
Huerter
Fox
Scoot

is also satisfactory.

 

[twslam07]

Any 3&D SGs we can keep our eye on?

I think a roster of…

PG - Fox / Mitchell
SG - 3&D SG (Draft) / Huerter
SF - Murray / Huerter
PF - PJ Washington (FA Signing) / Murray
C - Sabonis / Rim Protecting C (FA Signing or Trade)

…is as complementary as it gets of the goal is to build around Fox and Sabonis. I think a Bane, Bridges, or Vassell would be perfect in that SG spot (while having Huerters offense and shooting off the bench). Any SGs in this draft that are comparable to those 3 guys?

 

[Ozymandias]

Any 3&D SGs we can keep our eye on?

I think a roster of…

PG - Fox / Mitchell
SG - 3&D SG (Draft) / Huerter
SF - Murray / Huerter
PF - PJ Washington (FA Signing) / Murray
C - Sabonis / Rim Protecting C (FA Signing or Trade)

…is as complementary as it gets of the goal is to build around Fox and Sabonis. I think a Bane, Bridges, or Vassell would be perfect in that SG spot (while having Huerters offense and shooting off the bench). Any SGs in this draft that are comparable to those 3 guys?

There's actually not a great list of 3-n-D SG's surfaced just yet, it's more like a list of guys who are good at one and we'll see about the other. Specifically there is quite a lot of defenders with shaky shots whos names r being thrown around in mocks currently.

One name that does stand out is Keyonte George. 6'4" dynamic scorer known for having a knack at hitting difficult shots, he's no dynamo defensively but he's an active and engaged defender.

One of the best guards from the state of Texas since De'Aaron. Seems primed to have an explosive freshman year at Baylor.


Check out the sequence of clutch shots from 5:23-5:53

 

[Ozymandias]

Today is the day!!!

College basketball is back!!!

The entire top-25 is in action!!!

 

[Tetsujin]

Baylor has forced like five travels in the first five minutes of this game. Keyonte George not really getting much of a chance to do much because Baylor has like four other guards ahead of him in the pecking order but this was nice:

https://twitter.com/x/status/1589667065123995657

 

[The_Jamal]

Any 3&D SGs we can keep our eye on?

I think a roster of…

PG - Fox / Mitchell
SG - 3&D SG (Draft) / Huerter
SF - Murray / Huerter
PF - PJ Washington (FA Signing) / Murray
C - Sabonis / Rim Protecting C (FA Signing or Trade)

…is as complementary as it gets of the goal is to build around Fox and Sabonis. I think a Bane, Bridges, or Vassell would be perfect in that SG spot (while having Huerters offense and shooting off the bench). Any SGs in this draft that are comparable to those 3 guys?

Not sure why you're so anxious to replace Huerter, who through 8 games, seems to have taken another leap with us. He's been as perfect a 2nd/3rd scorer-spacer off Fox/Sabonis that you can ask for.

And before you say defense, Kings Dtrtg is +9.3 with him on the floor in 255 minutes on compared to 134 with him off. He's a ridiculous +19 Overall Net Rtg this season. That will obviously even out with more sample, but we've essentially been the worst team in the NBA when he's off the floor and like a 4-5 seed with him on through these first 8 games.

We should take the massive win and work on improving the Barnes slot. Huerter very much looks like he's an above average starter

 

[Tetsujin]

Oh man, Keyonte George just had a Davion rip away steal. Going to Baylor was a really smart choice by him and the voices in his ear. NBA teams are going to lap that stuff up.

 

[twslam07]

Not sure why you're so anxious to replace Huerter, who through 8 games, seems to have taken another leap with us. He's been as perfect a 2nd/3rd scorer-spacer off Fox/Sabonis that you can ask for.

And before you say defense, Kings Dtrtg is +9.3 with him on the floor in 255 minutes on compared to 134 with him off. He's a ridiculous +19 Overall Net Rtg this season. That will obviously even out with more sample, but we've essentially been the worst team in the NBA when he's off the floor and like a 4-5 seed with him on through these first 8 games.

We should take the massive win and work on improving the Barnes slot. Huerter very much looks like he's an above average starter

I’m not replacing him. He’s an integral part of the team I mentioned in my post (6th man).

The reason for moving him out of the starting lineup is defense. When your C is subpar defensively, it’s difficult to build a solid defensive team. We know Sabonis ain’t going. anywhere so you have to ask what is the ideal team around him? To me, that’s solid shooting and defense 1-4.

As for his on/off, you have to keep in mind that Monk replaces him in the lineup. That’s not me saying that Huerter is a bad defender. He’s looked average out there which is better than a log of our team. I’ll be interested to see how his defense looks the rest of the season.

 

[Ozymandias]

Sheesh what a flat start to the Kenny Payne era in Louisville.. Losing the opener to Bellarmine

 

[Ozymandias]

Few things that caught my eye in these openers;

-Ugonna Kingsley Onyenso for Kentucky is not only on the active roster but looks like a solid rotation player and high upside project to track with 4 blocks in 20 minutes

-Oregon's 3 5-star C's pecking order; Looks like Dante will start and get ~25mins while Ware and Bittle get about 20 each off the bench

-Gradey Dick was extremely impressive in his debut

-Are we in store for a Daniel Batcho breakout sophomore season at Texas Tech? Their frontcourt looks dangerous

-Was impressed by Auburns shotblocking with Johnni Broome and Dylan Cardwell off the bench

-Coleman Hawkins starts the season off for Illinois with a BANG. Very impressive showing, 5/8 from 3 for the 6'10 bigman, he looks like he could be a match with the Kings. The Dain Dainja era for the Illini is off to a good start aswell.

-GG Jackson 2/2 from 3! also 18, 10rebs, 1ast, 1blk, 1stl in his South Carolina debut

 

[serbiangoat]

Few things that caught my eye in these openers;

-Ugonna Kingsley Onyenso for Kentucky is not only on the active roster but looks like a solid rotation player and high upside project to track with 4 blocks in 20 minutes

-Oregon's 3 5-star C's pecking order; Looks like Dante will start and get ~25mins while Ware and Bittle get about 20 each off the bench

-Gradey Dick was extremely impressive in his debut

-Are we in store for a Daniel Batcho breakout sophomore season at Texas Tech? Their frontcourt looks dangerous

-Was impressed by Auburns shotblocking with Johnni Broome and Dylan Cardwell off the bench

-Coleman Hawkins starts the season off for Illinois with a BANG. Very impressive showing, 5/8 from 3 for the 6'10 bigman, he looks like he could be a match with the Kings. The Dain Dainja era for the Illini is off to a good start aswell.

-GG Jackson 2/2 from 3! also 18, 10rebs, 1ast, 1blk, 1stl in his South Carolina debut

I'd draft Gradey Dick just for the name alone what a name!

 

[Ozymandias]

I was thinking, if the Kings have a coach who'd try and start Okpala -- Dillon Mitchell (Texas), who's apparently grown to 6'9", is probably a forward they like a lot too.

highlight machine lefty dunker whos quick and explosive plus a versatile defender so he'd add a nice wrinkle into lineups like

Sabonis
Mitchell
Murray
Huerter
Fox

He works here for lots of the same reasons I listed for GG Jackson, in smallball looks too at C with Murray at PF.

On the downside though Mitchell is a very bad FT shooter and raw offensively.

Mitchell wasnt highly rated a year ago but has quickly ascended into lottery pick consideration. he appears to have bigtime upside but it seems he could also serve as a high energy defender off the bench til he's more polished.

 

[bajaden]

I know its way too early but I have a funny feeling that 6'9" PF/C GG Jackson is going to be a player the Kings like a lot this summer

This roster could use a PF like that IMO. He fits well on defense between Sabonis and Murray at the PF/C spot, could solve multiple issues. 7'3" wingspan active competitor n can really jump and switch on bigger and smaller players and plays with a meanstreak. Has potential offensively shown some flashes shooting from 20ft n beyond

He just seems like the type of draft pick that might be able to plug in fast n net big results quickly.

I love the kid. Tremendous upside, and had a very good first game. But it's early so we'll see. I'll have a much better opinion after around 10 games or so. Especially when most of the top teams are playing 2nd division teams right now and blowing them out.