Kings' Weakest Position?
- Thread starter SacTownGrantFan
- Start date
Gary
All-Star
Doesn't mean PG is our weakest position. I would like a more defensive PG as well and have IT off the bench.
whozit
Starter
Bricklayer
Don't Make Me Use The Bat
You will live where we tell you you live. And you will like it!
Do the google! It is about halfway between the metropoli of Jackson and Angel's Camp!
I suppose somebody from Galt would consider those places metropoli wouldn't he?
Thompson, no. He is what he is at this point, a solid backup with a frustrating tendency to make bad decisions at the worst possible time. (To be fair -- as his role has decreased, so have the mistakes so there's hope for him as a solid contributor off the bench) But Williams is 22. We just don't know yet. He's way too inconsistent, but in flashes he absolutely has starting SF talent. I didn't post anything in the "trade or keep Rudy Gay topic" because I've already stated my opinion enough that it's getting redundant, but it's relevant here...
The reason I'm not too keen on keeping Rudy Gay is that we already know who he is and he's not a great fit with this team. He scores the ball but he's not really making anyone else better. Williams is a relative unknown and until we give him a legit chance to prove himself we just don't know if he can be the starter or not. But he's a very different player than Rudy Gay, that much is clear. And if he does work out, potentially a better fit for this team as a scorer who does most of his work off the ball -- cutting to the basket, establishing deep post position on smaller defenders, spotting up at the three point line, or breaking loose for an alley-oop.
...
It's pretty obvious that the SG position has been a weakness for us this season, but so what? It's not the biggest weakness going forward. All we need there is somebody who can fit in a team scheme. McLemore can do that, he just has to get better. I would argue that the lack of a post defender and a true playmaker are much more glaring holes than a 2 guard who shoots for a good percentage.
Whew!
Here's my thinking:
I think it is our weakest if our only option is to start a guy and play him 40 minutes a game because of a lack of reliable options. He's great offensively, terrible defensively, and creates an unbalanced starting unit, more so than at the other positions of need. If we get the right starter here, I think things become a lot more balanced. I see it as killing two birds with one stone, where other fixes would be a more one-one solution.
After that, it would be SG. I'm not sure we can label McLemore a bust just yet, but he needs to be ready next year, and there isn't great depth at that position, just like at PG. Right now he's a rookie with the potential to be the right fit, but as this team is built, might not have the time he needs to develop.
I don't think PF is as dire as people are making it - we're serviceable here, but if we could move a body or two to be serviceable elsewhere, I'd take it. Not that it could happen, but if Landry could net us a solid backcourt vet, that would be great. I still think JT needs to stay, as he's our only backup 5. Well, except for Lurch.
Bricklayer
Don't Make Me Use The Bat
Rudy, however, is making the team better. When he plays with Cousins, we're about .500. In any other arrangement of personnel we are much less.
ShastaKingsFan
All-Star
It would have been interesting to hear what everyone's opinion of Williams' potential on this team going forward would have been,...if the Gay trade had not happened. Allowing Williams to start and have long stretches of minutes.
I have a feeling his development to this point could have been very different, based on what we saw in those first several games when he was the starter
King Baller
All-Star
Here is my take on this topic:
STARTERS:
PG) I don't think we have a starter at this point. IT is one of the top 6th men in the league forced to play the starting role. Ray McRookie looks promising but is not ready to start. Kings need to get a staring level PG going into next season.
SG) It has been painful watching Ben McRookie learn the ropes of the NBA. he is starting to play better and I hold out hope he becomes a starter. Kings need a veteran stop gap at SG until Ben takes over.
SF) Rudy Gay is all that. I hope he takes less per year and resigns long term with the Kings.
PF) Reggie Evans is a pretty good stop gap player until the Kings get the starter they need. Love to see Pete pry Taj Gibson from the Bulls. JT is a nice 3rd Big though I'm not sure the Kings can afford his deal in that role.
Center) Cousins is the Kings Cornerstone.
BENCH:
PG) IT could rule the bench in a 6th man role. Ray can play both Guard spots.
SG) I would like to see Ben start next season on the bench behind a defensive specialist.
SF) Derrick Williams is young and can hold down this spot along with Outlaw and Royce White (I'm being optimistic.)
PF) JT, Reggie, DWill, Acy. Bench PF is the Kings deepest spot. Oh and Landry
Center) JT & Reggie. I don't see Gray sticking around.
So as I see it the Kings need Starters at both Guard spots for the beginning of next season and a starting PF before long.
KB
STARTERS:
PG) I don't think we have a starter at this point. IT is one of the top 6th men in the league forced to play the starting role. Ray McRookie looks promising but is not ready to start. Kings need to get a staring level PG going into next season.
SG) It has been painful watching Ben McRookie learn the ropes of the NBA. he is starting to play better and I hold out hope he becomes a starter. Kings need a veteran stop gap at SG until Ben takes over.
SF) Rudy Gay is all that. I hope he takes less per year and resigns long term with the Kings.
PF) Reggie Evans is a pretty good stop gap player until the Kings get the starter they need. Love to see Pete pry Taj Gibson from the Bulls. JT is a nice 3rd Big though I'm not sure the Kings can afford his deal in that role.
Center) Cousins is the Kings Cornerstone.
BENCH:
PG) IT could rule the bench in a 6th man role. Ray can play both Guard spots.
SG) I would like to see Ben start next season on the bench behind a defensive specialist.
SF) Derrick Williams is young and can hold down this spot along with Outlaw and Royce White (I'm being optimistic.)
PF) JT, Reggie, DWill, Acy. Bench PF is the Kings deepest spot. Oh and Landry
Center) JT & Reggie. I don't see Gray sticking around.
So as I see it the Kings need Starters at both Guard spots for the beginning of next season and a starting PF before long.
KB
CaminoChaos
Bench
I think I saw somewhere that are point diff at the SG is -8 or -9. That's huge considering are average game point diff is -2
I don't think that really means much. We're not beating quality competition, we're beating tanking teams like Philadelphia and Milwaukee and the occasional .500 team. We did have a nice run early in Gay's tenure when we beat Houston twice, Miami in OT, and Portland but that was when he was shooting some ridiculously unsustainable percentage like 80% from the floor. I just don't put much value in the win/loss statistics absent of context. Certainly not enough to overlook the eye test, or the negative A/TO ratio, or the porous defense. The team defense has improved in the last month but I would attribute that mostly to other roster moves (Fredette and Thornton out of the rotation, McCallum and Evans in) and quality of competition (mostly low-scoring Eastern conference teams including Chicago, Brooklyn, Philly, and a double-dip of Milwaukee).
I suppose somebody from Galt would consider those places metropoli wouldn't he?
Hey, I live in Sacramento County, not the City of Galt! Not by much though!
Bricklayer
Don't Make Me Use The Bat
I've posted that stat before on here, might be where you saw it. LPKingsFan links to the source (82games.com) in his post above. Statistically we win two positions handily. Win one slightly. Then get murdered at the other two.
Hallama
Starter
You will live where we tell you you live. And you will like it!
Do the google! It is about halfway between the metropoli of Jackson and Angel's Camp!
My hometown, Jackson.
When they start their IT-worship I sometimes switch to the other team's announcers (using League Pass Home/Away feed option), but Kayte always brings me back...
I get what you're saying, but Thompson isn't the guy whose contract we can't afford, if only because he's the only guy in our frontcourt rotation who can play the 4 and the 5, on both ends of the floor. The guy we can't afford is Landry.Here is my take on this topic:
STARTERS:
PG) I don't think we have a starter at this point. IT is one of the top 6th men in the league forced to play the starting role. Ray McRookie looks promising but is not ready to start. Kings need to get a staring level PG going into next season.
SG) It has been painful watching Ben McRookie learn the ropes of the NBA. he is starting to play better and I hold out hope he becomes a starter. Kings need a veteran stop gap at SG until Ben takes over.
SF) Rudy Gay is all that. I hope he takes less per year and resigns long term with the Kings.
PF) Reggie Evans is a pretty good stop gap player until the Kings get the starter they need. Love to see Pete pry Taj Gibson from the Bulls. JT is a nice 3rd Big though I'm not sure the Kings can afford his deal in that role.
Center) Cousins is the Kings Cornerstone.
BENCH:
PG) IT could rule the bench in a 6th man role. Ray can play both Guard spots.
SG) I would like to see Ben start next season on the bench behind a defensive specialist.
SF) Derrick Williams is young and can hold down this spot along with Outlaw and Royce White (I'm being optimistic.)
PF) JT, Reggie, DWill, Acy. Bench PF is the Kings deepest spot. Oh and Landry
Center) JT & Reggie. I don't see Gray sticking around.
So as I see it the Kings need Starters at both Guard spots for the beginning of next season and a starting PF before long.
KB
King Baller
All-Star
Can't disagree with that.
SacTownGrantFan
Bench
It seems like you're defending Thompson and Williams quite a bit.
There are some things in your comment that don't make sense to me.
We don't have time for potential? That's what every college player has. Potential.
"Potentially Randle will be no better than either?" Of course, it could go either way.
"He has done nothing they didn't do in college?" I think that's a very oversimplified way to look at it. You can't just look at a guy's numbers and be like, well, he did just what that guy did it college. So it'll be just the same in the pros. There are guys all the time who have mediocre early careers and explode in the NBA, such as Tony Parker and Rajon Rondo. There are plenty of guys who have stellar college careers and fail in the NBA or perform at a much lower level, such as Shelden Williams and Tyler Hansbrough. A great thing about the draft is that it's pretty unpredictable.
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Entity
Hall of Famer
To simplify. If we want to get a good player. Our pick must be traded to get him. Therefore the services of a freshman in college doesn't really make me think awesome. It makes me think oh crap here we go again. If we want to be a formidable team, we have to get somebody now that can play with gay and cousins. Nobody in this draft is ready to do that right now.
Bricklayer
Don't Make Me Use The Bat
Its heresy in this draft, but I once again find myself willing to argue that position again. BECAUSE its such heresy.
Here's the deal
.
Our SF has been the starting SF on multiple 45-50 win type teams.
Our starting center, TODAY, is ready to win 50 games.
I won't go to bat for IT as a starter, but I will note we are almost .500 with he Cuz and Gay starting, with no training camp. And I WILL go to bat to say that IT has it in him to be an impact 6th man on a playoff team.
SO. My belief is that the pillars of this franchise are ready to win now. I would go so far as to say that NOT winning next year could prove catastrophic. It could begin to loosen Cuz's loyalty. it could cause Gay to want to walk away. Accordingly, I think it must be avoided at all costs. We cannot afford to draft another Ben McLemore, or Thomas Robinson, or Jimmer. We need to start winning now. And all the important pieces are fully capable of it. The ONLY reason not to win next year is if we fail. Flat fail to surround them with the right pieces. And so if I've got this really valuable draft pick that might work out, and might be ready to win in a couple of years, but I get offered a star/star roleplayer type proven guy...I am all ears. We need to win next year. We SHOULD win next year. If our draft pick can make it happen great. If we get #1, great. But if we get #8 or #9 and its a well...maybe situation. And meanwhile Atlanta calls us up and says you know...we want to start over. Any interest in Horford for that pick and Thompson? Well...I'm not hanging up! or what if Chicago calls us up and says, you know what, we really want to take our shot now, how would you feel about taking the restriction off your pick and giving us that #8 pick for Jimmy Butler and our #1 next season? Well...I dunno how I'd feel. Get rid of our encumbered pick (and with the Chicago pick next year as well, I'd be free to trade one of them this offseason for something else). Add a major backcourt defender (who shoots as badly as the incumbent unfortunately), an extra pick next year.... I don't know I do that, but I'm listening to those sorts of things. This draft isn't magic. It could go great for us, it could go poorly for us. If somebody offers me a vet I feel pretty sure is going to go great for us...you gotta listen and think about making this happen now. You can't go chasing rainbows forever.
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Thank you.
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