[Game] Kings v. Nuggets - Monday, Oct. 28 - 7PT

[fnordius]

In this case, the Nuggets remembered they were one of the best defensive teams in the league and put the clamps down on our second unit.

Though at 95.5ppg, Kings also have the weakest offense in the league, hard to split the credit for that.

 

[pdxKingsFan]

Oh hey what do you know, I check the box score and look at that, another loss.

Cool.

Box score doesn't tell story. Team may have found something in the 4th quarter. Certainly an answer to CD's call to action.

 

[burekijogurt]

I liked what Walton had to say after the game. He's looking at the bigger picture but was very clear tonights game means only as much as the next one. Could be wrong, but I think from a personality perspective Walton has the perfect demeanor for this current squad.

I just hope he has the know-how as well. He sometimes looks confused to me at the sideline. But that could just be me.

 

[tastyburger]

Maybe, maybe not. Next game tells the tale. Regression will be disastrous, progression is still progression. And making adjustments to your 9 1/2 man selection is definitely filed under fine tuning.

Im unsure about what a 1/2 man is (maybe I need an explanation), but i think hammering out your rotation falls under standard roster adjustment, and not fine tuning. You're right that joseph wasnt paid to sit on the bench, but he also hasnt exactly made a compelling case as the backup. I feel the pace drops as soon as he enters the game. That's really my main gripe.

 

[NewArena]

Holmes needs to start, i know that much. Until Bagley returns

 

[TaxMan]

Well, the first half of the Suns game had positives too. What is going on with the third quarters though?

Is the other team making adjustments that the kings aren't ready for? Fatigue? And please keep them off the offensive glass.

Third quarter performance generally is an indication of coaching in my opinion. which team can best adjust the game plan. Anticipate changes in the other team’s scheme. Motivate the team out of the half. Etc. it’s not everything of course, but seem like a decent indicator of coaching prowess to me. Four games in, not good in that department.

 

[ESP47]

Buddy killed us tonight. Left about 10pts of offense on the table and gave up about 20pts on the other end with terrible defense.

Holmes was playing like a man possessed. Man he knows how to finish at the rim with some nifty moves.

Fox did a really solid job finding Holmes all game. Probably racked up 7 of his 9 assists on Holmes alone.

Bogie, what was with that awful 2nd half? Even at his best, I don't think Bogie running the offense is a winning NBA play. Having CoJo out there with him almost makes him the primary ball handler or at least 50/50. Not going to win games like that. I'd rather have a non shooter like Elfrid Payton or someone that can create next to him because he's money when you can set him up from behind the arc but he's terrible trying to create off the dribble.

Ariza played solidly. I don't think he's done quite yet but I don't expect him to play like this every game.

Beli was solid as always.

Dedmon was bad but not lets cut him and sign Mika levels of bad like he has been.

Refs get an F. That obvious wrap up foul on Fox that they missed. Jokic hip checking Hield, I believe it was. Then missing that travel at the end. They called a terrible game.

 

[NewArena]

Can’t believe Buddy was locked down like that

If we got a normal game outta him, we win this one by near double digits

 

[SLAB]

in a way. Kings played much better against a top Western Conference opponent. The showed both effort and cohesiveness that they have not shown until today.

If moral victories were a thing the Kings would be 26 time NBA champions.

 

[TaxMan]

Walton said in the post game that this could be a first step. But he also said (my paraphrase) that this can't be one-off because of how horribly they played against Utah and the fact they were going up against a top team in Denver. They've got to bring it every night.

The Hornets is an important test. Are the Kings going to be the immature team and play down to their competition, or are they going to improve off of tonight's game?

If we come out and lay an egg against the hornets, backs against the wall against perhaps the worst team in the league, I will definitely lose that remaining flicker of optimism in my heart.....

 

[parker]

Third quarter performance generally is an indication of coaching in my opinion. which team can best adjust the game plan. Anticipate changes in the other team’s scheme. Motivate the team out of the half. Etc. it’s not everything of course, but seem like a decent indicator of coaching prowess to me. Four games in, not good in that department.

For what it's worth, they were bad last year coming out of the half. Actually tonight they played fairly well the first 5 to 6 minutes of the third before collapsing.

 

[TaxMan]

I liked what Walton had to say after the game. He's looking at the bigger picture but was very clear tonights game means only as much as the next one. Could be wrong, but I think from a personality perspective Walton has the perfect demeanor for this current squad.

Too cool for school? To me, I’ve yet to hear any amount of fire coming out of his mouth. I sure hope his calm demeanor pays dividends in the long run, but right now there is something missing to me.

 

[burekijogurt]

If moral victories were a thing the Kings would be 26 time NBA champions.

its not about moral victories its about improvement and a path forward

 

[TaxMan]

For what it's worth, they were bad last year coming out of the half. Actually tonight they played fairly well the first 5 to 6 minutes of the third before collapsing.

I hear you....at the same time, something is just not right (obviously)

 

[SLAB]

Unfortunately we have a pretty good idea of how it goes. The improvement will be undone when they play down to the level of Charlotte in a few days.

 

[tastyburger]

Unfortunately we have a pretty good idea of how it goes. The improvement will be undone when they play down to the level of Charlotte in a few days.

Btw slab, i noticed you have an alien as your avatar. Was wondering if you stormed area 51?

 

[Kings Faithful]

Im pleased to see effort at least. That being said, we are garbage through and through. It feels like were at square one again. Vlade said "give me two years" for progress. Last year Vlade made due on that promise...what he didn't tell us is that we'd be starting over in year 3. Im 28 now, just got married, going to have children next year likely. I haven't seen the kings in the playoffs since i was a Sophmore in highschool. I feel so sorry for the older generation Kings fans who've been waiting for this team to be good again to just compete, and im sure quite a few of them have passed away at this point. Forget about championships....playoffs will be every bit as sweet at this point honestly. Someone needs to pull the stick out of the organizations you know where and get this show on the road.

 

[burekijogurt]

Unfortunately we have a pretty good idea of how it goes. The improvement will be undone when they play down to the level of Charlotte in a few days.

that is pessimistic.

 

[TaxMan]

that is pessimistic.

Keep them expectations low. It was my downfall coming into the season....

 

[SLAB]

that is pessimistic.

That is me.

 

[LPKingsFan]

I didn’t forget that. Willie has some nice finishes. That was an alley ooop though. It’s easier to finish since he just needs to throw it down. Willie often tried similar full extension finishes off a catch and drive like Holmes did near the end but it would slip out of his hand before he can finish each time. There’s a few that are on YouTube that are missed but are on there so you can imagine how awesome it would be if he finished. He came really close to getting one on Gobert.

Fair enough. I just have a soft spot for that dunk because it gave me my first hope that things would be ok post-Cousins.

 

[sactowndog]

Id take FIBA Bogdan over Buddy tonight, but it’s hard to find that Bogdan right now

Bogdan forces plays he shouldn’t but he shoots better in crunch time than Buddy and he is way less likely to make a dumb pass or decision in crunch time.

 

[parker]

Buddy and Bogi had their brain farts , but it was Denver's second chance points that won them the game. The Kings were destroyed on the glass.

This isn't the first game this has been an issue. Do they have the personnel to clean this up?

 

[sactowndog]

He did take a couple of dumb threes, but he did have the most assists after Fox in 19 minutes which would imply he did not play selfish.
But I would still have Buddy out there at the end. he can always catch fire.

Buddy never catches fire in crunch time. Last year in clutch situations only Justin Jackson shot a worse percentage from 3....

https://stats.nba.com/players/clutc...9&SeasonType=Regular Season&TeamID=1610612758

 

[KingsFanSince85]

I’m still peeved about Buddy’s 3 being overturned. IDC if the foul technically occurred a split second before the ball was out of his hand. It’s a bad rule. The defense shouldn’t get rewarded for a foul away from the ball.

It should be continuation. Or like a flag against the defense in the NFL, the offensive team should get the choice of allowing the play to stand and decline the foul call if it benefits them.

But the notion that the ball has to be out of the shooters hand before the foul call conflicts with what happens when the foul actually occurs on the shooter while he is in the act of shooting. In this instance, the foul occurred as Buddy was in the act. Therefore it should be continuation.

I mean, if this is the way the NBA wants to call it, then anytime my team is up 3 with under :10 remaining, I’m having my defense bear hug each player that is inside the arc once the ball is inbounded or in play. Or bear hug the screener. Actually, any player that doesn’t have the ball no matter where they are. That way they can never get off a 3 point shot because we will have fouled someone before a shot could possibly be fully released out of a shooters hand.

Just an awful rule. And it killed the KINGS momentum late in the game.

I‘m so sick to death of NBA technicalities working against the KINGS.

 

[sactowndog]

Buddy killed us tonight. Left about 10pts of offense on the table and gave up about 20pts on the other end with terrible defense.

Holmes was playing like a man possessed. Man he knows how to finish at the rim with some nifty moves.

Fox did a really solid job finding Holmes all game. Probably racked up 7 of his 9 assists on Holmes alone.

Bogie, what was with that awful 2nd half? Even at his best, I don't think Bogie running the offense is a winning NBA play. Having CoJo out there with him almost makes him the primary ball handler or at least 50/50. Not going to win games like that. I'd rather have a non shooter like Elfrid Payton or someone that can create next to him because he's money when you can set him up from behind the arc but he's terrible trying to create off the dribble.

Ariza played solidly. I don't think he's done quite yet but I don't expect him to play like this every game.

Beli was solid as always.

Dedmon was bad but not lets cut him and sign Mika levels of bad like he has been.

Refs get an F. That obvious wrap up foul on Fox that they missed. Jokic hip checking Hield, I believe it was. Then missing that travel at the end. They called a terrible game.

I have got to think the coaches are telling Bogi to handle the ball. Why they aren’t running him off screens is certainly a fair question. I want Bogi to catch and shoot not dribble.

 

[twslam07]

It’s getting more and more obvious that this team is in desperate need of a secondary ball handler/playmaker. We should not be asking Hield or Bogdan to create as much as we are. They would really flourish if they didn’t have to worry about having that responsibility, but Fox obviously can’t do it for 48 minutes and nor should he be doing it all for the minutes that he’s on the floor (shout out to those that think two playmakers can’t coexist).

Joseph is not known for running an offense, making plays for others, etc. Although a lot of you kept telling me before the season that Joseph was a big upgrade from Ferrell in that department (again, he isn’t).

If we had two guys who excelled at breaking down the defense and finding the open man, I think Hield and Bogdan would look a lot better than they have.

Also, you got to start thinking about having Bjelica and Holmes start. With Bjelica in there for Bagley right now, Dedmon’s shooting isn’t needed as much. I wouldn’t pull the plug on Dedmon quite just yet. He deserves a bigger sample size but it’s not looking good so far.

Lastly, it may be an unpopular opinion around here but I would potentially still start Bjelica and Holmes even after Bagley is healthy. If I go off what Bagley showed me last year (and against PHX) his game is not going to translate into wins. Bjelica and Holmes (in their roles) will. If Bagley wants to start become a better 3pt shooter (to replace Bjelica) or become a better defender (to replace Holmes). Doubt it would happen with egos and his dad most likely becoming a distraction if this happened.

Big men who are below average shooters, below average defenders, AND below average passers do not translate into wins in this era. I’m tired of people saying he’s “talented.” Use your talent (or develop that talent) in ways that win in today’s game.

 

[TaxMan]

I’m still peeved about Buddy’s 3 being overturned. IDC if the foul technically occurred a split second before the ball was out of his hand. It’s a bad rule. The defense shouldn’t get rewarded for a foul away from the ball.

It should be continuation. Or like a flag against the defense in the NFL, the offensive team should get the choice of allowing the play to stand and decline the foul call if it benefits them.

But the notion that the ball has to be out of the shooters hand before the foul call conflicts with what happens when the foul actually occurs on the shooter while he is in the act of shooting. In this instance, the foul occurred as Buddy was in the act. Therefore it should be continuation.

I mean, if this is the way the NBA wants to call it, then anytime my team is up 3 with under :10 remaining, I’m having my defense bear hug each player that is inside the arc once the ball is inbounded or in play. That way they can never get off a 3 point shot because we will have fouled someone before a shot could possibly be fully released out of a shooters hand.

Just an awful rule. And it killed the KINGS momentum late in the game.

I‘m so sick to death of NBA technicalities working against the KINGS.

Right now every momentum swing going against the kings. Got to fight through this stretch and hope they come out the other side more battle tested. That three was a killer. As was winning the challenge on the milsaap three foul call earlier in the game....results in jumpball, turns into a three. Fox gets mugged terribly, no foul call, three the other way, turnover, layup, 7 point swing. Momentum near the end with a chance to tie and fox bumbles his dribble, results in jump ball. Feels like there were maybe 5 more plays like that this game.

 

[TaxMan]

It’s getting more and more obvious that this team is in desperate need of a secondary ball handler/playmaker. We should not be asking Hield or Bogdan to create as much as we are. They would really flourish if they didn’t have to worry about having that responsibility, but Fox obviously can’t do it for 48 minutes and nor should he be doing it all for the minutes that he’s on the floor (shout out to those that think two playmakers can’t coexist).

Joseph is not known for running an offense, making plays for others, etc. Although a lot of you kept telling me before the season that Joseph was a big upgrade from Ferrell in that department (again, he isn’t).

If we had two guys who excelled at breaking down the defense and finding the open man, I think Hield and Bogdan would look a lot better than they have.

Also, you got to start thinking about having Bjelica and Holmes start. With Bjelica in there for Bagley right now, Dedmon’s shooting isn’t needed as much. I wouldn’t pull the plug on Dedmon quite just yet. He deserves a bigger sample size but it’s not looking good so far.

Lastly, it may be an unpopular opinion around here but I would potentially still start Bjelica and Holmes even after Bagley is healthy. If I go off what Bagley showed me last year (and against PHX) his game is not going to translate into wins. Bjelica and Holmes (in their roles) will. If Bagley wants to start become a better 3pt shooter (to replace Bjelica) or become a better defender (to replace Holmes), then great. Start him. (Doubt it would happen with egos and his dad most likely becoming a distraction of this happened).

Big men who are below average shooters, below average defenders, & below average passers do not translate into wins in this era. Tired of hearing about talent. Use your talent (or develop that talent) in ways that win in today’s game.

I’d love to see yogi in there for 15 min a game just to give us a shot in the arm.

 

[twslam07]

Bogdan forces plays he shouldn’t but he shoots better in crunch time than Buddy and he is way less likely to make a dumb pass or decision in crunch time.

Bogdan baffles me. You see his high IQ in some of the plays he makes but then you’re left scratching you’re head on others.

I know he knows how to play this game and play it to help his team win. However, I think he has a “I need to prove myself” attitude with the kings at times. Perhaps it was that he lost his starting job? Perhaps he has some jealousy for Hield? Perhaps it’s that Hield got a big contract extension?

I really don’t know, but if Bogdan could set that ego (if I’m interpreting his play correctly) aside, I may prefer Bogdan as our long term SG.

I wouldn’t be surprised to see these head scratching plays go away if Hield was traded and/or after he signs his next contract.