Kings trade Dedmon for Parker and Len (merged)

[jellyfish]

Memphis has been masterful with their use of assets and cap space. Got decent young talent and picks for Conley as well as a productive vet in Crowder. Got assets for Gasol instead of losing him for nothing. Got a pick for taking on Iggy then held on to him when I have no doubt Vlade would have bought him out and they got a really good haul for him in Winslow.

Ja
Brooks
Winslow
JJJ
Jval/Clarke

What an awesome start to their rebuild only 1 1/2 years into it. Makes me jealous what we could have been with a real front office.

But imo it all starts around the two guys they are building around Ja/JJJ have skillsets which are easy to plug in around. The other moves have been great but they would mean nothing if those two did not have the skills they have.

 

[VF21]

Exhibit A for firing Vlade. An inability to maximize assets.

We have a thread totally dedicated to this kind of thing.

 

[The_Jamal]

It’s a great comparison in many respects because Memphis is a small market team like Sacramento. It’s just maddening to see how well many other franchises handle their basketball operations and how dismally the Kings handle theirs.

It's just little things like not buying out Iggy like everyone expected them to. Even had pundits being like "How could they do that to him?? Let him go to a contender!"

No, he's an asset and they had no reason to buy him out before the deadline. If nothing came of the deal, still, why buy him out and let him walk to a contender? Especially when it looks like your team is pushing the 8 seed? And guess what, that patience paid off and they got another potential building block asset to grow with their core.

 

[KingsCitizen]

Dedmon was a fan favorite signing until he came out lazy and pouty. I wish to see those "I would pay Dedmon" posts last summer and give you guys a GM certificate.
Good thing Holmes came out like a raging bull. So Mica holds the spot for now until Bagley turns his glass legs to something.

So now the Kings payroll will roll like the warriors, heavy pay on guards and meh on the bigs. Vivek must be proud.

 

[Groovygreg]

Exhibit A for firing Vlade. An inability to maximize assets.

I like Vlade fine as a person and as a Kings dignitary, but I can’t understand for the life of me why ANYONE still has faith in Divac as a GM. The team needs to clean house with the F.O. and bring in some savvy basketball minds that are going to make roster decisions with a sound and objective business sense instead of historically fanciful thinking.

 

[Groovygreg]

It's just little things like not buying out Iggy like everyone expected them to. Even had pundits being like "How could they do that to him?? Let him go to a contender!"

No, he's an asset and they had no reason to buy him out before the deadline. If nothing came of the deal, still, why buy him out and let him walk to a contender? Especially when it looks like your team is pushing the 8 seed? And guess what, that patience paid off and they got another potential building block asset to grow with their core.

That is the type of GM the Kings desperately need - someone who understands that professional basketball is a business that requires a sound strategy and dispassionate decision-making to achieve success.

 

[KainLear]

If the Kings would draft better, then they would have quality players in the pipeline as assets to trade or develop. That might help reduce the amount of FAs they need to lure with bloated contracts.

I mean, as someone pointed out, we spent 3+ top lottery draft picks on bigs during Vlade's tenure. Bagley (R1/#2) is still arguable at this point, Papagiannis (R1/#10), Giles (from the Zach Collins pick), and Willie Cauley-Stein (R1/#6). If even one of those 3 before Bagley had panned out, we might have picked the kid who our whole front office went and had dinner with prior to the draft whose name slipped my mind for some reason.

 

[The_Jamal]

I'm also really worried how we're going to resign Holmes after next season. With all indications we're going to keep Bogi, there's going to be no path to giving Holmes a viable contract since we need to be under the cap.

 

[SLAB]

I'm also really worried how we're going to resign Holmes after next season. With all indications we're going to keep Bogi, there's going to be no path to giving Holmes a viable contract since we need to be under the cap.

It’s okay. That’s when Giles explodes onto the scene as the full-time starter following the wink & handshake agreement they reached this past offseason.

 

[hrdboild]

Just like the George Hill trade I'm not going to praise Vlade for unloading a contract he sought out and negotiated in the first place literally last off-season. I'm still disappointed in our steadfast refusal to stick with a plan long enough to actually know if it's going to work or not. Dedmon was a perfect fit for the team we had last year. Apparently last season is ancient history and this deal needed to be made so we can start planning for next off-season. That's what people tell me anyway. I don't know, I'm just here for the laughs.

 

[ESP47]

I don't know why people are disappointed in this trade. They got out from under Dedmon's bloated contract and didn't have to pay anything of true value. I don't like Jabari Parker but if we have to keep him through next year, there are worse players to be stuck with. At least he still has a sliver of a chance of becoming a good player.

 

[jcassio]

At first I voted Meh. But the more I look at it, the more I like it. One could argue that this trade was more about keeping Bogi than acquiring Parker or unloading Dedmon (who was a complete disappointment to the Kings, except for a few posters here with very short memories). Maybe it also puts us in a better position for keeping Holmes long-term. Despite our awful record this season, I can see this roster as having 7th or 8th seed potential:
Fox
Bogi
Buddy
Barnes/Parker
Bagley
Holmes
Giles (though doubtful he'll be a King next season)
Lottery Pick

 

[Showtime]

So Vlade uses two picks to clean up his own mess. Shocker.

 

[luckytkp]

So Vlade uses two picks to clean up his own mess. Shocker.

He got 2 picks from Portland.

 

[HebrewHammer]

I don't know why people are disappointed in this trade. They got out from under Dedmon's bloated contract and didn't have to pay anything of true value. I don't like Jabari Parker but if we have to keep him through next year, there are worse players to be stuck with. At least he still has a sliver of a chance of becoming a good player.

The same bloated contract that he was signed to half a season ago by the same FO that offloaded him? That is spinning our wheels, if we are being generous.
And Jabari Parker is that inefficient scoring, little passing and less defense kind of player that this FO seems to love. Yay?

 

[The_Jamal]

At first I voted Meh. But the more I look at it, the more I like it. One could argue that this trade was more about keeping Bogi than acquiring Parker or unloading Dedmon (who was a complete disappointment to the Kings, except for a few posters here with very short memories). Maybe it also puts us in a better position for keeping Holmes long-term. Despite our awful record this season, I can see this roster as having 7th or 8th seed potential:
Fox
Bogi
Buddy
Barnes/Parker
Bagley
Holmes
Giles (though doubtful he'll be a King next season)
Lottery Pick

Nope, fans are going to be real surprised when Holmes walks after next season because we're over the cap and the max contract we can offer him is 8.75 million/season. For us to be positioning to keep Holmes, we need to have real cap space to make him an offer that he actually deserves (starting around 12-13 mil). We might have been able to get away with that deal this off-season where very few teams have money, but the books open wide up in 2021 for everyone.

Unless some sort of poison pill contract still exists where we can just completely back-load a deal (so 8.75 the first season, then like 15-16mil/year after), he's more than likely gone with us looking like we're 100% keeping Bogi.

 

[jellyfish]

Can't wait to see Parker/Bagley out there together the vision and defense will be mouth watering.

 

[KingsFanSince85]

you do know Memphis got Iggy from Golden State for free. In fact, Golden State paid Memphis a 1st to take Iggy. Then after getting paid to take him they turned him into Winslow!

And your point is what? You can't possibly be arguing that he has little to no value or that he isn't as valuable as the KINGS packaged trade because the results prove the contrary. So help me to understand your angle???

MIA is an upper-tier playoff team in the East and Pat Riley a well-respected GM. He just paid a 1st and Winslow for Iggy.

Doesn't matter what MEM got him for 7-months ago when GSW was reeling from decimation of their team and looking to create cap space to acquire D'Angelo Russell. It's about today.

Iggy had value then and he still has value now. A lot more than DeWayne Dedmon, anyway. Which was the point all along.

You're upset about nothing. Vlade couldn't get the same package (or even close) for Dedmon that MEM got for Iggy. He didn't have the same value to a playoff contender. The results make that very clear.

IDK if you're aware but HOU and LAL were also quite interested in Iggy. Playoff teams were lining up for him and it drove up his value. So stop with the nonsense about what GSW traded him for last July.

It. Does. Not. Matter.

I mean, look at the contract Dedmon got from the KINGS a day after that Iggy trade. Aside from ATL trading for him now, do you think any team would offer him that now? Things change very fast.

 

[The_Jamal]

And your point is what? You can't possibly be arguing that he has little to no value or that he isn't as valuable as the KINGS packaged trade because the results prove the contrary. So help me to understand your angle???

MIA is an upper-tier playoff team in the East and Pat Riley a well-respected GM. He just paid a 1st and Winslow for Iggy.

Doesn't matter what MEM got him for 7-months ago when GSW was reeling from decimation of their team and looking to create cap space to acquire D'Angelo Russell. It's about today.

Iggy had value then and he still has value now. A lot more than DeWayne Dedmon, anyway. Which was the point all along.

You're upset about nothing. Vlade couldn't get the same package (or even close) for Dedmon that MEM got for Iggy. He didn't have the same value to an aspiring playoff contender. The results make that very clear.

IDK if you're aware but HOU and LAL were also quite interested in Iggy. So stop with the nonsense what GSW traded him for last July.

It. Does. Not. Matter.

For Iggy and Gallo. Deal isn't done yet, but they aren't trading both for just Iggy.

And you're missing the point. It's the fact that Memphis is in asset collection mode and looking to obtain quality future pieces to build a strong foundation for their rebuilding squad. They acquired a 1st round pick just to eat Iggy's salary from the Warriors. That's taking advantage of a situation at the time the Warriors were in to make their squad better. They held on to Iggy when many teams would have just bought him out. Now they're going to get Winslow, another good young player, by staying strong and not releasing Iggy despite his request for them to do so.

 

[PacMan]

Is Parker Derrick Williams 2.0?

Before he tore his ACL, he was averaging 20 ppg in Milwaukee. I don’t think Williams ever come close

 

[The_Jamal]

This trade itself isn't bad at all. Dedmon was always a bit of an overpay, but he in theory was a glove fit with the roster. Rim-protecting C that could space the floor. I was on board with the signing (one of the few I actually did like). 2 late 2nd round picks to get off half the contract isn't the worst thing.

Us not being able to get anything out of a good player like Dedmon is another issue in itself. Happens all too often in Sacramento where we sign a rock-solid role player that completly flames out here and then goes on to be great for another team. I fully expect Dedmon to be his usual self in Atlanta again.

 

[Gguod]

And your point is what? You can't possibly be arguing that he has little to no value or that he isn't as valuable as the KINGS packaged trade because the results prove the contrary. So help me to understand your angle???

MIA is an upper-tier playoff team in the East and Pat Riley a well-respected GM. He just paid a 1st and Winslow for Iggy.

Doesn't matter what MEM got him for 7-months ago when GSW was reeling from decimation of their team and looking to create cap space to acquire D'Angelo Russell. It's about today.

Iggy had value then and he still has value now. A lot more than DeWayne Dedmon, anyway. Which was the point all along.

You're upset about nothing. Vlade couldn't get the same package (or even close) for Dedmon that MEM got for Iggy. He didn't have the same value to a playoff contender. The results make that very clear.

IDK if you're aware but HOU and LAL were also quite interested in Iggy. So stop with the nonsense about what GSW traded him for last July.

It. Does. Not. Matter.

I mean, look at the contract Dedmon got from the KINGS a day after that Iggy trade. Aside from ATL trading for him now, do you think any team would offer him that now? Things change very fast.

The point is how each team used cap space. Memphis was smart and gained future assets with their cap space. They took Iguadala in for a 1st round pick, then they flipped him for Winslow. So they used 17mil for one year and got 1st round pick and Winslow. Thats an excellent use of cap space.

We used 13 million for three years (small grt in 3rd year) for Dedmon and had to give up two future assets for getting rid of him. We used 12 mil for Ariza and got two seconds back so basically we used 25million of space and have nothing to show for it. Thats a bad use of cap space.

These types of deals that Memphis made (taking in Iggy and a 1st) is something bunch of people in here have been advocating for years now but we never seem to do them.

 

[itzcoatl]

I like the move. Over the summer, it seemed like Dedmon would be a good pick up at center. Maybe we overpaid a little, but he was coming off a good year. It didn’t work out. Something in the relationship went so sour that he publicly demanded out and paid a big fine for doing so.
Not everything works. We moved on. Not a fan of Parker but he will expire sooner than Dedmon and might contribute some off the bench.
this is a clear commitment to Holmes. Addition by subtraction.

 

[KingsFanSince85]

The point is how each team used cap space. Memphis was smart and gained future assets with their cap space. They took Iguadala in for a 1st round pick, then they flipped him for Winslow. So they used 17mil for one year and got 1st round pick and Winslow. Thats an excellent use of cap space.

We used 13 million for three years (small grt in 3rd year) for Dedmon and had to give up two future assets for getting rid of him. We used 12 mil for Ariza and got two seconds back so basically we used 25million of space and have nothing to show for it. Thats a bad use of cap space.

These types of deals that Memphis made (taking in Iggy and a 1st) is something bunch of people in here have been advocating for years now but we never seem to do them.

Lol. Again, why do you automatically assume they could do that type of deal? You have no clue.

The leaps some of you make w/o having any inside knowledge is baffling.

Prove to me that the KINGS had a deal like the one MEM just made w/ MIA on the table and I'll apologize. But until that proof is provided I'll keep circling back to the fact that there were playoff contending teams lined up to acquire Iggy and it gave MEM, who waited patiently on making a deal for a while now, a lot more leverage. The market for Dedmon clearly wasn't the same.

So, again, apples to oranges. And a lot of connecting of dots and wishful thinking.

I'm not a fan of the current FO or Vlade and their decisions. But there's a faction of you that suffer from delusions of grandeur, foolishly believing you are qualified GM's when the reality is, you really have no clue what you don't know. The Internet and analytics have poisoned many minds and created a false sense of knowledge and experience. Ignorance is bliss, or so I've heard.

 

[AMR42700]

Two occurrences don't make a pattern. Other teams do have players that demand to be traded.

Actually it's not just those two. Its afflalo. Go back to Ramon Sessions. What's weird is different coaches, players etc.. same team though. The ringer said something along the lines of (paraphrasing) "good luck len and parker where careers go to die...Kangz." I cant blame them for that assessment. I think one thing about our team is we love the team, but we have done a lot of bad moves over the years. Vlade got out of this one again but no other team gets into as many bad situations as we do. Memphis has rebuilt in 16 months, Brooklyn was a couple of yrs. We are 14 yrs almost...at some point we need to recognize what this looks like to NBA fans who are not necessarily Kings fans. Its soft to make excuses when Memphis made moves we could have made and we are once again losing and defending our midseason trade of one of our FA signings. It's really bad optics for us. We used to have all eyes on us for the right reasons, the glory yrs and the cover of sports illustrated bc our team was innovative and good. I love the team and I want them to succeed but it's also fair to wonder why MEM trades for Igoudala gets a 1st and Winslow and we have to attach two seconds to get rid of one of our marquee signings. It's a bad look for us.

 

[AMR42700]

I don't know why people are disappointed in this trade. They got out from under Dedmon's bloated contract and didn't have to pay anything of true value. I don't like Jabari Parker but if we have to keep him through next year, there are worse players to be stuck with. At least he still has a sliver of a chance of becoming a good player.

It's not about this trade which considering the circumstances ain't bad. Its signing players and trading them when other teams accumulate assets and maximize their cap space. Vlade did it again but why was he in this position in the first place?

 

[KingsFanSince85]

Dedmon was a fan favorite signing until he came out lazy and pouty. I wish to see those "I would pay Dedmon" posts last summer and give you guys a GM certificate.

Yeah, I remember all those posts too. Lots of the same people complaining about "not maximizing" assets right now. These people ALWAYS have the right answers and KNOW what to do in each and every situation, despite not being privy to any 'real' conversations between teams or between the execs of the org and really having no inside info to base decisions upon whatsoever.

In short, these people are never wrong. Never.

Yet, amazingly, they've never held a GM or front office job in their lifetime. Nor anything remotely closely related to the field. I wonder why that is.

But they can sure scour 3rd party websites for rumors, innuendo and advanced statistics that magically provides them the answer to the meaning of life and how the universe began.

 

[The_Jamal]

Lol. Again, why do you automatically assume they could do that type of deal? You have no clue.

The leaps some of you make w/o having any inside knowledge is baffling.

Prove to me that the KINGS had a deal like the one MEM just made w/ MIA on the table and I'll apologize. But until that proof is provided I'll keep circling back to the fact that there were playoff contending teams lined up to acquire Iggy and it gave MEM, who waited patiently on making a deal for a while now, a lot more leverage. The market for Dedmon clearly wasn't the same.

So, again, apples to oranges.

So in other words.. Memphis spent their cap space incredibly wisely taking an asset for Iggy and then patiently waiting for contenders to pounce on him at the deadline?

We weren't in position to take on the Iggy contract because we spent $60 million on Barnes/Dedmon/Ariza/CoJo this summer and 2 of them are already gone. Memphis got absolute maximum value out of their cap space while we got nothing out of ours.

No one is suggesting we should have been able to get the same haul for Dedmon as Memphis did for Iggy. I'm not even sure why you keep bringing that up, not a single person in this thread has mentioned that. Everyone's ticked (and rightfully so) that Memphis is playing the long-game with their rebuild and are now already further along than the Kings in 16 months because of great decisions they've made. Like taking the Iggy contract over spending on Trevor Ariza and CoJo.

 

[KestrelKing]

Whoa. You totally missed my point. I was saying that the post I quoted was an example of what he referred to in my previous post. It was not in any way a commentary on the playoffs, Ariza, Dedmon, etc.

My mistake. I meant to reply to jellyfish. I think you and I pretty much agree.

 

[Livinthedream]

This trade itself isn't bad at all. Dedmon was always a bit of an overpay, but he in theory was a glove fit with the roster. Rim-protecting C that could space the floor. I was on board with the signing (one of the few I actually did like). 2 late 2nd round picks to get off half the contract isn't the worst thing.

Us not being able to get anything out of a good player like Dedmon is another issue in itself. Happens all too often in Sacramento where we sign a rock-solid role player that completly flames out here and then goes on to be great for another team. I fully expect Dedmon to be his usual self in Atlanta again.

This can not be stated enough.