Kings-Bulls updates?

6 boards, 2 steals, 3 blocks for Cisco. His shot will come.

But I am glad Kevin is getting a chance to build some confidence.
 
Yeah, Garcia's shot was not falling again, but he got himself to the line a couple times, and his help defense was solid again. It's obvious to see the Louiville/Pitino pedigree when he's on D. He needs to work more at getting shots outside of the offense, because that is what Martin does. I have not seen Martin shoot off the catch yet. In fact, he is very uncomfortable doing so, and will always throw in an unnecessary pump fake and then a penetration dribble. But off the dribble, he can really elevate and hit shots. I still think Martin plays "Kings" defense, which means that once the ball gets below his level he stands around looking in at the play, waiting for the outlet pass. But Martin was the primary ballhandler tonight with Price out. The backup PGs are terrible by the way. And the Kings keep forcing it into the high post, which is just ridiculous for a summer league team. I'd rather clear out and see what Garcia and Martin can do. Although, sooner or later they'll have to learn the offense anyway I guess. I still like the defense Garcia would bring to the first unit, and the scoring punch Martin would provide to the second.

Pete Carril was on the bench tonight, and the usual suspects were in the stands. And, you're not going to believe this, Gavin was with a hot chick.
 
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Knowing Garcia can shoot, it's good to hear that he's doing the other things to help the team. His shot will fall eventually so that's not a real concern of mine. Just going by stats alone, looks like Martin is tearing up everyone.....
 
Not sure there is a good way to fix this

http://www.vegassummerleague.com/box_score.cfm?game=29


15 Erik Daniels, F 29 4-8 0-0 1-2 1 0 1 3 1 0 4 4 9
22 Anthony Lever, G 26 1-4 0-0 0-0 1 2 3 1 1 0 1 3 2
23 Kevin Martin, G 32 9-12 0-0 10-12 0 5 5 1 1 0 6 6 28
31 Patrick Okafor, F 5 2-2 0-0 0-0 2 0 2 0 0 0 1 3 4
32 Francisco Garcia, G 36 3-11 1-1 1-3 3 3 6 0 2 3 3 2 8
33 Cookie Belcher, G 14 0-3 0-0 2-2 0 0 0 1 0 0 0 3 2
35 Marquin Chandler, F 12 3-4 1-1 0-0 0 4 4 1 0 0 0 3 7
40 Guillaume Yango, C 8 0-2 0-0 0-0 0 3 3 1 0 0 1 1 0
42 Jared Homan, F/C 27 2-6 0-0 3-6 2 2 4 0 0 2 3 5 7
55 Robert Archibald, F/C 11 2-4 0-0 0-0 4 2 6 2 0 1 2 6 4
 
owensborocard32 said:
Knowing Garcia can shoot, it's good to hear that he's doing the other things to help the team. His shot will fall eventually so that's not a real concern of mine. Just going by stats alone, looks like Martin is tearing up everyone.....
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Yeah, I haven't seen anyone stop him yet. He's real good at using his athleticism to create space and hit the shot. He's also fairly adept at getting to the line using his jumper, as opposed to driving it to the paint.
 
there is someone on the team named "Cookie Belcher"?

is there anyone named "I.P. Freely" or "Hugh G. Rection"?
 
mcsluggo said:
there is someone on the team named "Cookie Belcher"?

is there anyone named "I.P. Freely" or "Hugh G. Rection"?
Click to expand...

That reminded me of my wife's blooper this past weekend. I was watching a Cubs game and they were talking about the new kid Murton. They said something like "....Murton, but just in case..." and my wife goes "so new guy is named Justin Case?".
 
Cisco is looking more and more like he can become DC in terms of doing everything else...except score. I think he's doing just fine. Martin has a year in this league already, and its Cisco's first month, so give him a break.
 
I bet Garcia is still thinking too much, not instictively knowing the plays and where the players will be. This will come with experience and PT (cold-turkey introduction in summer, more in-depth and refined in training camp). Sounds like he is doing as well as can be expected at the moment, just needs time to adjust to the changes in offense. I like the rest of his game, from everything I have heard so far. Martin and Garcia may be a fun combination to watch at the 2, especially if both can really keep up the defensive effort.
 
Venom said:
Yeah, Garcia's shot was not falling again, but he got himself to the line a couple times, and his help defense was solid again. It's obvious to see the Louiville/Pitino pedigree when he's on D. He needs to work more at getting shots outside of the offense, because that is what Martin does. I have not seen Martin shoot off the catch yet. In fact, he is very uncomfortable doing so, and will always throw in an unnecessary pump fake and then a penetration dribble. But off the dribble, he can really elevate and hit shots. I still think Martin plays "Kings" defense, which means that once the ball gets below his level he stands around looking in at the play, waiting for the outlet pass. But Martin was the primary ballhandler tonight with Price out. The backup PGs are terrible by the way. And the Kings keep forcing it into the high post, which is just ridiculous for a summer league team. I'd rather clear out and see what Garcia and Martin can do. Although, sooner or later they'll have to learn the offense anyway I guess. I still like the defense Garcia would bring to the first unit, and the scoring punch Martin would provide to the second.

Pete Carril was on the bench tonight, and the usual suspects were in the stands. And, you're not going to believe this, Gavin was with a hot chick.
Click to expand...

I'm confused.

Just because you haven't seen Kevin do something, doesn't mean he can't do it. You're so convinced, despite Kevin's showing in both the SPDL and NOW
the summer league, that Garcia should be the primary option for the 2?

Personally, I'm pretty excited about the way Kevin is playing right now. Or is it just a fluke he's scoring lots of points, getting more and more comfortable in his role, etc.? He was the high scorer in the SPDL, and his scoring average was second only to Mike Bibby's. But I guess that's not enough for some people...

I think Kevin is going to prove himself this coming season and I'm very proud of him for working so hard already.

GO KINGS! BOTH KEVIN AND CISCO!!!
 
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1) I've mentioned before that Summer League means very little.

2) However, that said, how you could look at the respective performances thus far and decide that Cisco was the guy who was going to get the nod is beyond me. Well not entirely -- I think you might do it if you were already so predisposed. But anybody who's anybody is susposed to tear these leagues up. And Cisco is shooting 30% and struggling to reach double figures whole Kevin might be the leading scorer in the league. I'm not going to draw too many conclusions from a screw around league where rappers and professioanl football players get invited, but if I WERE to draw any conclusions, they would seem fairly obvious at this point.
 
VF21 said:
I'm confused.

Just because you haven't seen Kevin do something, doesn't mean he can't do it. You're so convinced, despite Kevin's showing in both the SPDL and NOW
the summer league, that Garcia should be the primary option for the 2?

Personally, I'm pretty excited about the way Kevin is playing right now. Or is it just a fluke he's scoring lots of points, getting more and more comfortable in his role, etc.? He was the high scorer in the SPDL, and his scoring average was second only to Mike Bibby's. But I guess that's not enough for some people...

I think Kevin is going to prove himself this coming season and I'm very proud of him for working so hard already.

GO KINGS! BOTH KEVIN AND CISCO!!!
Click to expand...

I think what venom meant was that Cisco would be better starting for his defense at the 2 position and Martin would provide the scoring from the 2 position with the second unit. I didn't see it as a knock on Martin at all.
 
thesanityannex said:
I think what venom meant was that Cisco would be better starting for his defense at the 2 position and Martin would provide the scoring from the 2 position with the second unit. I didn't see it as a knock on Martin at all.
Click to expand...

Venom has continually knocked Kevin, so I think you're mistaken. Regardless, I think Venom can speak for himself.

And how someone can decide after a couple of summer games that a player is going to be able to provide good defense in the real NBA is beyond me.
 
i wasn't aware of the continued knocking. anyways, sounds like venom is at the games in person, so his thoughts have some validity. have you seen them play in person yet? the summer league is there to gauge someones ability, if Cisco would have shown poor defense, Venom would have stated that.
 
I'm not saying Cisco was playing poor defense. In fact, I'm trying very hard NOT to prejudge him, as opposed to some who are apparently ready to hand him the starting two-guard position based on his performance in a couple of summer leagues. Summer leagues are for rookies and younger players. It's not going to decide our starting players, nor should it. Both Kevin and Cisco will be working hard, especially in training camp, and the final decision will be made then. If we don't get a legitimate veteran at the two, it's even possible they would rotate the starting nod.

Yes, Venom has been at games and favors Cisco. CruzDude has also been at games and has been pretty high on Kevin. The point is each of them has valid points. I just prefer to not make it sound as though praising Kevin means you have to hate Cisco and vice-versa. They're both Kings. Why can't they both have our support right now?

Have I seen Kevin play in person? Yes, a couple of times. And I watched how hard he worked BEFORE the games. Have I seen Cisco in person? Not yet.

This is actually pretty silly. Look at Venom's name...VENOM. You think that's an accident? He loves to mix it up and cause controversy.

He and I ALWAYS argue. It's our job; it's what we do. We don't need someone else to translate for us.
 
We already have a thread going about Mo... Let's not hijack this one, which is pretty much a discussion about Garcia and Martin.

:D
 
I can gurantee you Martin will start over Garcia. In the kings system it's always Offense First, Defense Second. Martin First, Garcia Second.
 
ForlornKing said:
I can gurantee you Martin will start over Garcia. In the kings system it's always Offense First, Defense Second. Martin First, Garcia Second.
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I can't comment on Garcia, but you obviousy didn't watch Kevin very closely on the D end last season or read what Adelman had to say about Kevin's defense.

The kid did a nice job defensively in his rookie season.

Sounds like Garcia may be making an impact defensively, too, so far in Summer League, so that's a pleasant dilemma I'd love for our team to have...which defensive 2 guard to play?

And face it, perhaps some got all giggly when they saw Mo complete some acrobatic jams last season and occasional play above the rim, but he more often than not got his handed to him on a platter when he was trying to play D.
 
1kingzfan said:
And face it, perhaps some got all giggly when they saw Mo complete some acrobatic jams last season and occasional play above the rim, but he more often than not got his handed to him on a platter when he was trying to play D.
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Did we watch the same sonics series? Mo shut down who ever he guarded, better than any other King had done.
 
ForlornKing said:
I can gurantee you Martin will start over Garcia. In the kings system it's always Offense First, Defense Second. Martin First, Garcia Second.
Click to expand...

And - truth be told - rookies get played last unless there's absolutely no other option. Been that way forever...
 
1kingzfan said:
I can't comment on Garcia, but you obviousy didn't watch Kevin very closely on the D end last season or read what Adelman had to say about Kevin's defense.

The kid did a nice job defensively in his rookie season.

Sounds like Garcia may be making an impact defensively, too, so far in Summer League, so that's a pleasant dilemma I'd love for our team to have...which defensive 2 guard to play?

And face it, perhaps some got all giggly when they saw Mo complete some acrobatic jams last season and occasional play above the rim, but he more often than not got his handed to him on a platter when he was trying to play D.
Click to expand...

Agreed. Whatever offensive flaws Martin showed on the court last season, he did show the ability and desire to defend even the most athletic of players.
I imagine the offensive show that Martin is doing in the Vegas League is exactly what the coaching staff wants to see out of him.
 
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