Kings at 9

Players don't tank.
Management tanks via the coaching. And it's a viable strategy in the business model of the NBA.

You start playing the young/mid-season trade guys 20 games ago with no "you gotta win" hanging over their heads. Let them get NBA play time, get better lottery odds, rest your core. It's win-win-win.

You dont tell players to miss/not take shots. Nobodys gonna do that. You tell the starters they'll start and finish games and play at reduced minutes. If you win you win, if you dont you dont.
 

SLAB

Hall of Famer
They only get an ‘F‘ from fans that were absent from integrity class and don’t have an understanding about the spirit of competition.

I’m betting the vast majority of these fans don’t pay for season tickets every single year or buy tickets to many games.
I’m sure OKC’s fanbase is going to be talking about integrity of competition when they add top draft talent to SGA next season. They probably look at floundering low-lottery non-playoff teams like the Kings with lustful eyes thinking “If only we could be them!”
 
I’m sure OKC’s fanbase is going to be talking about integrity of competition when they add top draft talent to SGA next season. They probably look at floundering low-lottery non-playoff teams like the Kings with lustful eyes thinking “If only we could be them!”
And whichever faction of OKC's fanbase will feel like that also aren't the ones paying for that BS to happen. Bet you that.

They are distant fans lying in wait to front run and jump on the bandwagon once the team is worthy enough. Great for them. But they're not real fans in my book or likely even in the eyes of those that truly live and die with their team.

You can try to justify any way and all you want. But there's no getting around the fact that it lacks integrity, cheats fans out of their hard earned money, and completely betrays what competition is all about.

I'll never understand or subscribe to running away from competing until such time that you believe you have the upper-hand. Especially so when charging fans enormous amounts of $$$ and misleading them. Fans don't go to watch their team not field the best roster possible and not compete -- let alone pay $$$ for it.

You're obviously built differently than me and the many other fans that abhor and denounce the bush-league tactic. No worries. There are greater tragedies in life.

But I do have one favor to ask of you and all the others championing "tanking". How about you guys put your money where your mouth is and pay for it by purchasing expensive season ticket packages for the 3-5 years (or more) it'll take? And double down by attending and sitting through each and everyone of those games, paying for parking, concessions, etc. no matter what.
 
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And whichever faction of OKC's fanbase will feel like that also aren't the ones paying for that BS to happen. Bet you that.

They are distant fans lying in wait to front run and jump on the bandwagon once the team is worthy enough. Great for them. But they're not real fans in my book or likely even in the eyes of those that truly live and die with their team.

You can try to justify any way and all you want. But there's no getting around the fact that it lacks integrity, cheats fans out of their hard earned money, and completely betrays what competition is all about.

I'll never understand or subscribe to running away from competing until such time that you believe you have the upper-hand. Especially so when charging fans enormous amounts of $$$ and misleading them. Fans don't go to watch their team not field the best roster possible and not compete -- let alone pay $$$ for it.

You're obviously built differently than me and the many other fans that abhor and denounce the bush-league tactic. No worries. There are greater tragedies in life.

But I do have one favor to ask of you and all the others championing "tanking". How about you guys put your money where your mouth is and pay for it by purchasing expensive season ticket packages for the 3-5 years it'll take? And double down by attending each and everyone of those games no matter what.
actually if the Kings had rolled out Metu, Woodard, Ramsey, Jones and JJ .... I would have been happy watching them and seeing who could compete. I find it was more entertaining then watching guys like Barnes go for the X season in a row out of the play-offs.
 

SLAB

Hall of Famer
actually if the Kings had rolled out Metu, Woodard, Ramsey, Jones and JJ .... I would have been happy watching them and seeing who could compete. I find it was more entertaining then watching guys like Barnes go for the X season in a row out of the play-offs.
Same, but oh well, this opinion isn’t valid because we’re not season ticket holders.
 
They only get an ‘F‘ from fans that were absent from integrity class and don’t have an understanding about the spirit of competition.

I’m betting the vast majority of these fans don’t pay for season tickets every single year or buy tickets to many games.
I was on board with tanking this ONE year with no season tickets. But aside from that I generally agree with the team trying to be competitive. I don't see another year of Walton improving things, I also don't see it getting bad enough to land a franchise altering talent unless we just luck out again.
 

Capt. Factorial

This Is Why We Can't Have Nice Things
Staff member
BleacherReport screwed that up, they are sourcing Givony, whose tweet says that the coin flips are NEXT Tuesday:


We won't know whether there are any ties to be broken in the 11-14 range of the lottery until the play-in games shake out, so the date of next Tuesday makes sense and today doesn't really (they'd have to do it twice - I know it's just flipping more coins but the NBA seems to like to do these things all at once.)
 
But aside from that I generally agree with the team trying to be competitive.
What's the point of having a game, event or an organized league if players/teams aren't going to compete? Fielding the best teams you can is an integral part of that. So is playing to win.

I don't think many tennis players go into a match against Rafael Nadal, Novak Djokovic or Roger Federer playing to lose. Even though they know they largely don't have to goods to win unless the opponent has a super off day or injury.

Imagine most the competition jogging the 100M against Usain Bolt because they know they won't win. No sense risking pulling a hammy, right?

People still openly mock Michael Spinks performance against Mike Tyson in 1988 because it seemed clear he didn't intend to compete and was in it for the pay day. Fans weren't very happy throwing down $30 on the PPV to see that BS happen.

Fans pay to watch athletes compete. They watch on TV for the same reason.

No KINGS fan wants to see them reside at the bottom of the standings and perpetually out of playoff contention.

Hell, I'm a fan that lived through 9 consecutive lottery seasons from 86-87 through 94-95. They missed the postseason in 11 out of 12 seasons during that stretch. Included was some of the worst basketball you'll ever see. One season they went 1-40 on the road.

Despite that, I never once felt the org was doing it purposely. Because they weren't. They were just that bad.

I didn't like it. But I could live with it. Because they competed and tried their best with what they had.
 
What's the point of having a game, event or an organized league if players/teams aren't going to compete? Fielding the best teams you can is an integral part of that. So is playing to win.

I don't think many tennis players go into a match against Rafael Nadal, Novak Djokovic or Roger Federer playing to lose. Even though they know they largely don't have to goods to win unless the opponent has a super off day or injury.

Imagine most the competition jogging the 100M against Usain Bolt because they know they won't win. No sense risking pulling a hammy, right?

People still openly mock Michael Spinks performance against Mike Tyson in 1988 because it seemed clear he didn't intend to compete and was in it for the pay day. Fans weren't very happy throwing down $30 on the PPV to see that BS happen.

Fans pay to watch athletes compete. They watch on TV for the same reason.

No KINGS fan wants to see them reside at the bottom of the standings and perpetually out of playoff contention.

Hell, I'm a fan that lived through 9 consecutive lottery seasons from 86-87 through 94-95. They missed the postseason in 11 out of 12 seasons during that stretch. Included was some of the worst basketball you'll ever see. One season they went 1-40 on the road.

Despite that, I never once felt the org was doing it purposely. Because they weren't. They were just that bad.

I didn't like it. But I could live with it. Because they competed and tried their best with what they had.
What's frustrating is seeing other teams do it and be rewarded. Like I said, I've been generally in favor of being honest, outside of this season when there were no paying fans stuck holding tickets they can't give away. I loathe what Philly did and I hope they never get past the second round of playoffs. But until the NBA holds teams that blatantly tank accountable, and how will they do that? what hope do we have beyond being a mid-lotto team in perpetuity?

Our best chance at significant change next season is apparently off the table, so we're doomed to another year of repeat. I'll gladly be proven wrong but I've seen nothing to indicate our failure this year were bad luck. If anything our successes were highly good fortune.

Solo athletes can't do this because they can't draft themselves into a new body.
 
So should real Philadelphia 76ers fans mock and disregard their current team because of how they got there? Those darn Embiid’s and Simmons’ brought on by the nefarious tank. They’d probably be much happier with an honest Marquese Criss and Nik Stauskas.
Jokes on them. They still ended up stuck with stauskas
 
Solo athletes can't do this because they can't draft themselves into a new body.
No, but they could mail it in for the pay day like Spinks did.

In auto racing, the lesser funded racing teams still spend the $$$ to build and field cars even though they have small odds of winning.

In baseball, we see org's like the A's doing their best compete despite being a competitive disadvantages.

Whether it's an individual or team sport, the name of the game is competing and playing to win.

Like I said, I've been generally in favor of being honest, outside of this season when there were no paying fans stuck holding tickets they can't give away.
Totally get it. I still can't get behind it, but in this instance I understand the logic behind why you did.

What's frustrating is seeing other teams do it and be rewarded.
Yeah, it is frustrating. Believe me, I was a frustrated fan to see what the Houston Astericks got away with and what many athletes got away with during the PED scandal.

Those examples are different than tanking, I know, but they are fundamentally the same in that ALL involved taking shortcuts, were tactics lacking integrity and avoided competing at a fair and honest level.

None of us get to decide what ends up in the record books, but there is a large faction of fans, sports writers and critics that don't consider the records the PED users set as legit or the Houston Astericks as real champions. I'm sure many of those same people will feel the same of any org that wins a title by building their team the way the Sixers did.

Hopefully public/fan opinion will continue to be strong enough to dissuade more org's and players from choosing the same paths.
 
No, but they could mail it in for the pay day like Spinks did.

In auto racing, the lesser funded racing teams still spend the $$$ to build and field cars even though they have small odds of winning.

In baseball, we see org's like the A's doing their best compete despite being a competitive disadvantages.

Whether it's an individual or team sport, the name of the game is competing and playing to win.



Totally get it. I still can't get behind it, but in this instance I understand the logic behind why you did.



Yeah, it is frustrating. Believe me, I was a frustrated fan to see what the Houston Astericks got away with and what many athletes got away with during the PED scandal.

Those examples are different than tanking, I know, but they are fundamentally the same in that ALL involved taking shortcuts, were tactics lacking integrity and avoided competing at a fair and honest level.

None of us get to decide what ends up in the record books, but there is a large faction of fans, sports writers and critics that don't consider the records the PED users set as legit or the Houston Astericks as real champions. I'm sure many of those same people will feel the same of any org that wins a title by building their team the way the Sixers did.

Hopefully public/fan opinion will continue to be strong enough to dissuade more org's and players from choosing the same paths.
The NBA would never do it, but they could discourage tanking by allowing STHs to ask for refunds when the team holds out healthy stars.
 
They could take a more direct response if they wanted. If the NBA deemed that a team was outright tanking, simply eliminate them from being available for the top 4 picks.
I would say bump to 14 or put teams that are deemed to be fielding non competitive teams into a separate pool that pick after teams that try.

Like under a certain payroll, no players on deals under 2 years, etc.
 
I would say bump to 14 or put teams that are deemed to be fielding non competitive teams into a separate pool that pick after teams that try.

Like under a certain payroll, no players on deals under 2 years, etc.
this was talked about elsewhere on here but why not go back to all non playoff teams having the same odds or almost all of them? The argument against is you aren’t helping the worst teams but if a team that is picking say 10 or 11 gets a number one pick that make them a contender in two years you are still strengthening the competitive field.
 

Capt. Factorial

This Is Why We Can't Have Nice Things
Staff member
They could take a more direct response if they wanted. If the NBA deemed that a team was outright tanking, simply eliminate them from being available for the top 4 picks.
I would say bump to 14 or put teams that are deemed to be fielding non competitive teams into a separate pool that pick after teams that try.

Like under a certain payroll, no players on deals under 2 years, etc.
Either way would likely greatly slow down tanking. Let's face it, you don't tank to get the 5th pick.
And Capt. Factorial's "NBA Front Office Vote For Draft Position" cracks open the door, peeks its head in and says "hi!"
 
this was talked about elsewhere on here but why not go back to all non playoff teams having the same odds or almost all of them? The argument against is you aren’t helping the worst teams but if a team that is picking say 10 or 11 gets a number one pick that make them a contender in two years you are still strengthening the competitive field.
I'd be on board in actually flipping the picks/lotto odds so the teams that just miss get a boost. Why not set up stars to succeed? It's a total flip in past philosophies but it would restore the integrity of the regular season.

Outside the US they don't reward failure, they kick the bottom 3 teams out of the league. Obviously NBA owners would never allow relegation but why reward that with star players?
 
So one final take on this. The 9th team from each conference gets to play in against the 8th seed in a two game series. If the 8th seed wins one game they advance. This rewards teams who are just outside the traditional playoffs but doesn’t punks the teams that made it to the 7th seed.

The remaining teams outside the playoffs receive the same odds. Basically eliminates tanking and even if a 12 or 13 team wins the lottery you are still helping competition.

I think I’d be happy with this set up
 
BleacherReport screwed that up, they are sourcing Givony, whose tweet says that the coin flips are NEXT Tuesday:


We won't know whether there are any ties to be broken in the 11-14 range of the lottery until the play-in games shake out, so the date of next Tuesday makes sense and today doesn't really (they'd have to do it twice - I know it's just flipping more coins but the NBA seems to like to do these things all at once.)
makes sense. Seemed odd to do it ahead of time but Givony is pretty good.
 
I was on board with tanking this ONE year with no season tickets. But aside from that I generally agree with the team trying to be competitive. I don't see another year of Walton improving things, I also don't see it getting bad enough to land a franchise altering talent unless we just luck out again.
Yeah I was ok with this season since I didn’t have to pay for it lol
 
The problem with even odds for all non-playoff teams is that you know some team is going to get skunked in the lotto draw for a decade straight and there's a good chance that team will be us. I'd be in favor of something close to even odds though if they also remove teams who've had a top 3 pick in the last 3 years from consideration and/or factor in multiple seasons so losing your superstar to injury for 1 year after a long run of playoff success doesn't land you a #1 pick.
 
The problem with even odds for all non-playoff teams is that you know some team is going to get skunked in the lotto draw for a decade straight and there's a good chance that team will be us. I'd be in favor of something close to even odds though if they also remove teams who've had a top 3 pick in the last 3 years from consideration and/or factor in multiple seasons so losing your superstar to injury for 1 year after a long run of playoff success doesn't land you a #1 pick.
that's not unreasonable. I wonder what Pop's legacy would be if that was the case.
 
The problem with even odds for all non-playoff teams is that you know some team is going to get skunked in the lotto draw for a decade straight and there's a good chance that team will be us. I'd be in favor of something close to even odds though if they also remove teams who've had a top 3 pick in the last 3 years from consideration and/or factor in multiple seasons so losing your superstar to injury for 1 year after a long run of playoff success doesn't land you a #1 pick.
if you have a problem with the lottery have the commissioner or national writers rank the non playoff teams from worst to best. They already pick all NBA.