Kings are blowing it with fans
- Thread starter folsomfella
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The most active team this summer besides the Heat is arguably the T-Wolves. Letting AJ go for cap space. Signing both Darko and Petrovic. Trading for Beasley. Signing Ridnour and playing musical chairs with the pg's up there. Trading for Webster, so they now have about 15 sf's on the team. Big difference between making moves, and making smart moves. I don't envy the Minn fans at all.
The other very active team has been the Bucks. Is Gooden really worth $32M? I don't think so. Is Salmons worth $38M over the next 5 years? I don't think so. They took on Magette's contract. These moves aren't as bad as Minn, and they might see a bump in wins next year, but these contracts will handcuff the franchise and severely limit their options in a few years.
The patience and intelligence Petire is showing could very well make us a legit contender in 3 years. No need to screw it up over boredom.
The other very active team has been the Bucks. Is Gooden really worth $32M? I don't think so. Is Salmons worth $38M over the next 5 years? I don't think so. They took on Magette's contract. These moves aren't as bad as Minn, and they might see a bump in wins next year, but these contracts will handcuff the franchise and severely limit their options in a few years.
The patience and intelligence Petire is showing could very well make us a legit contender in 3 years. No need to screw it up over boredom.
I tend to agree with the OP. I’m not so much disappointed that The Kings didn’t get a high quality player in free agency to add to their promising young roster, I’m more disappointed that it doesn’t even seem like they made a serious effort toward it.
The defeatist "well no great players are going to come to Sac anyways" attitude I see among many fans is discouraging. I can only hope Kings management/ownership doesn't share that attitude . I also find it puzzling that many people act as if the only two options are signing a top 5 player or overpaying a scrub. There was a wealth of players in the years FA class such as Gay, Felton, Redick, and numerous others who could have been great additions. But, did the Kings even seriously pursue any of them? It wouldn’t appear so.
In all honesty, the Kings management/ownership hasn't done much in the last 5 years for fans to really be excited about. I kind of lost faith in the organization when they didn't sign Bonzi Wells and then fired Rick Adleman to boot.
Having a potential future all star duo in Evans/Cousins does give some hope for us fans. The truth is though, those acquisitions had more to do with luck than anything else. Luck that they were still available and luck (in Evans case) that he turned out to be the best player in his draft.
Really, the only reason The Kings are getting any better now is just a direct result of how awful they've been the last few years. It was only after hitting bottom that they've been able to finally poise themselves to become a half way respectable team again via a couple of great draft picks that fell a little further than they normally would have. Or in other words....The Kings are improving in spite of ownership/management rather than because of it.
The defeatist "well no great players are going to come to Sac anyways" attitude I see among many fans is discouraging. I can only hope Kings management/ownership doesn't share that attitude . I also find it puzzling that many people act as if the only two options are signing a top 5 player or overpaying a scrub. There was a wealth of players in the years FA class such as Gay, Felton, Redick, and numerous others who could have been great additions. But, did the Kings even seriously pursue any of them? It wouldn’t appear so.
In all honesty, the Kings management/ownership hasn't done much in the last 5 years for fans to really be excited about. I kind of lost faith in the organization when they didn't sign Bonzi Wells and then fired Rick Adleman to boot.
Having a potential future all star duo in Evans/Cousins does give some hope for us fans. The truth is though, those acquisitions had more to do with luck than anything else. Luck that they were still available and luck (in Evans case) that he turned out to be the best player in his draft.
Really, the only reason The Kings are getting any better now is just a direct result of how awful they've been the last few years. It was only after hitting bottom that they've been able to finally poise themselves to become a half way respectable team again via a couple of great draft picks that fell a little further than they normally would have. Or in other words....The Kings are improving in spite of ownership/management rather than because of it.
While I think that ultimately something like that will be what comes to pass, it's going to be hard for the owners to say that they can't afford these huge contracts when a number of them have been spending money like drunken sailors this offseason. Joe Johnson? Rudy Gay? Drew Gooden? Darko Milicec? Can anyone make a legitimate case that any of these guys are deserving of the contracts they got this offseason?
I sense another lockout coming. But back on topic, when the new CBA gets hashed out, the Kings will be in an incredibly envious position due to Petrie's shrewdness.
I sense another lockout coming. But back on topic, when the new CBA gets hashed out, the Kings will be in an incredibly envious position due to Petrie's shrewdness.
Look at what Petrie's done in less than one season/offseason...and I STILL have a weird feeling that he has one more move up his sleeve before the end of TDOS! So how is THIS 'blowing it with the fans'??:
2010 Roster
18 Casspi, Omri GF/SF 6-9 225 22 1 None $1,167,000
15 Cousins, DeMarcus FC/PF 6-11 270 19 R Kentucky N/A
1 Dalembert, Samuel C 6-11 250 29 9 Seton Hall $11,360,000
13 Evans, Tyreke G/PG 6-6 220 20 1 Memphis $3,610,080
32 Garcia, Francisco GF/SG/SF 6-7 195 28 5 Louisville $5,800,000
20 Greene, Donte GF/SG 6-11 226 22 2 Syracuse $870,000
24 Landry, Carl F/PF 6-9 248 26 3 Purdue $3,000,000
34 Thompson, Jason FC/C 6-11 250 24 2 Rider $2,035,920
19 Udrih, Beno PG 6-3 205 28 6 None $6,077,500
33 Whiteside, Hassan F/C 7-0 235 21 R Marshall N/A
2009 Roster
8 Hilton Armstrong F-C 6-11 235 November 11, 1984 3 University of Connecticut
40 Jon Brockman F 6-7 255 March 20, 1987 R University of Washington
18 Omri Casspi F 6-9 225 June 22, 1988 R
15 Joey Dorsey F 6-8 268 December 16, 1983 1 University of Memphis
13 Tyreke Evans G 6-6 220 September 19, 1989 R University of Memphis
32 Francisco Garcia F-G 6-7 195 December 31, 1981 4 University of Louisville
20 Donte Greene F 6-11 226 February 21, 1988 1 Syracuse University
31 Spencer Hawes C 7-0 245 April 28, 1988 2 University of Washington
24 Carl Landry F 6-9 248 September 19, 1983 2 Purdue University
23 Kevin Martin G 6-7 185 February 1, 1983 5 Western Carolina University
24 Desmond Mason F 6-7 224 October 11, 1977 9 Oklahoma State University
42 Sean May F 6-9 266 April 4, 1984 3 University of North Carolina
7 Dominic McGuire F 6-9 220 October 20, 1985 2 California State University, Fresno
5 Andres Nocioni F 6-7 225 November 30, 1979 5
10 Sergio Rodriguez G 6-3 168 June 12, 1986 3
17 Garrett Temple G 6-6 190 May 8, 1986 R Louisiana State University
9 Kenny Thomas F 6-7 261 July 25, 1977 10 University of New Mexico
34 Jason Thompson F 6-11 250 July 21, 1986 1 Rider University
3 Ime Udoka F 6-6 215 August 9, 1977 5 Portland State University
19 Beno Udrih G 6-3 205 July 5, 1982 5
2010 Roster
18 Casspi, Omri GF/SF 6-9 225 22 1 None $1,167,000
15 Cousins, DeMarcus FC/PF 6-11 270 19 R Kentucky N/A
1 Dalembert, Samuel C 6-11 250 29 9 Seton Hall $11,360,000
13 Evans, Tyreke G/PG 6-6 220 20 1 Memphis $3,610,080
32 Garcia, Francisco GF/SG/SF 6-7 195 28 5 Louisville $5,800,000
20 Greene, Donte GF/SG 6-11 226 22 2 Syracuse $870,000
24 Landry, Carl F/PF 6-9 248 26 3 Purdue $3,000,000
34 Thompson, Jason FC/C 6-11 250 24 2 Rider $2,035,920
19 Udrih, Beno PG 6-3 205 28 6 None $6,077,500
33 Whiteside, Hassan F/C 7-0 235 21 R Marshall N/A
2009 Roster
8 Hilton Armstrong F-C 6-11 235 November 11, 1984 3 University of Connecticut
40 Jon Brockman F 6-7 255 March 20, 1987 R University of Washington
18 Omri Casspi F 6-9 225 June 22, 1988 R
15 Joey Dorsey F 6-8 268 December 16, 1983 1 University of Memphis
13 Tyreke Evans G 6-6 220 September 19, 1989 R University of Memphis
32 Francisco Garcia F-G 6-7 195 December 31, 1981 4 University of Louisville
20 Donte Greene F 6-11 226 February 21, 1988 1 Syracuse University
31 Spencer Hawes C 7-0 245 April 28, 1988 2 University of Washington
24 Carl Landry F 6-9 248 September 19, 1983 2 Purdue University
23 Kevin Martin G 6-7 185 February 1, 1983 5 Western Carolina University
24 Desmond Mason F 6-7 224 October 11, 1977 9 Oklahoma State University
42 Sean May F 6-9 266 April 4, 1984 3 University of North Carolina
7 Dominic McGuire F 6-9 220 October 20, 1985 2 California State University, Fresno
5 Andres Nocioni F 6-7 225 November 30, 1979 5
10 Sergio Rodriguez G 6-3 168 June 12, 1986 3
17 Garrett Temple G 6-6 190 May 8, 1986 R Louisiana State University
9 Kenny Thomas F 6-7 261 July 25, 1977 10 University of New Mexico
34 Jason Thompson F 6-11 250 July 21, 1986 1 Rider University
3 Ime Udoka F 6-6 215 August 9, 1977 5 Portland State University
19 Beno Udrih G 6-3 205 July 5, 1982 5
Wants vs Needs:
We didn't need anyone on the FA market. We wanted some players. There's a good young nucleus here with the potential to do a lot of damage. This is the year to see what we've got w/r/t youth. A starting five of:
Evans
Garcia
Greene
Thompson
Cousins
may end up being a championship starting 5 in a few years. There's enough potential in all 5 positions, not just 1 or 2, to let the front office sit back and see what they have. Oh yeah, there's also Beno the Vet, Casspi (or Greene depending on how things shake out), and Whiteside coming off the bench.
Did we want Reddick? Yeah, many did. Miller? Sure. But what we're seeing this off-season is players taking less money to play for a contender. It's not about "not wanting to come to Sac", but rather an interesting perversion that has taken place during this past off-season.
We don't need them. Not right now. If we get to a point that a player like Felton is the missing piece, then Petrie will go after him. He's not afraid of spending MLE money, sometimes poorly. Unfortunately, not doing anything and waiting for your home-grown talents to mature seems like "not doing anything", but it isn't. It's being patient. Patience will be well-rewarded.
We didn't need anyone on the FA market. We wanted some players. There's a good young nucleus here with the potential to do a lot of damage. This is the year to see what we've got w/r/t youth. A starting five of:
Evans
Garcia
Greene
Thompson
Cousins
may end up being a championship starting 5 in a few years. There's enough potential in all 5 positions, not just 1 or 2, to let the front office sit back and see what they have. Oh yeah, there's also Beno the Vet, Casspi (or Greene depending on how things shake out), and Whiteside coming off the bench.
Did we want Reddick? Yeah, many did. Miller? Sure. But what we're seeing this off-season is players taking less money to play for a contender. It's not about "not wanting to come to Sac", but rather an interesting perversion that has taken place during this past off-season.
We don't need them. Not right now. If we get to a point that a player like Felton is the missing piece, then Petrie will go after him. He's not afraid of spending MLE money, sometimes poorly. Unfortunately, not doing anything and waiting for your home-grown talents to mature seems like "not doing anything", but it isn't. It's being patient. Patience will be well-rewarded.
I disagree. A team that's coming off a 25 year season and that has all its hopes for the future invested in a 21 year old and a 20 year old does need to add a high quality, proven piece in FA to round things out. Especially when you're 20 million under the cap, thus having plenty of funds to work with. As it stands now, The Kings only have one player that's proven to be a high quality player and that's Evans. Everyone else, is either a role player or a project. The Kings are exactly the kind of team that need a proven high level player via free agency.
Well, Rudy Gay was the player I was hoping/dreaming they'd at least make a serious run at. He seemed like a plausiable goal too because he plays for Memphis and Memphis aren't exactly a contender. The Kings might even be a step up from Memphis on the NBA ladder as far as that goes. He's avereging 20 points and 6 rebounds at 23 years old so in my opinion, he'd have been worth a very large contract if that's what it took to get him. A big 3 of Evans/Cousns/Gay could have turned into the top (or at least a top 3) team in the west in few years.
I knew it.
Dude, Rudy Gay got $80 million. Not only could we not offer him that much under CBA rules, but he's not worth that much. This is the point. Not only should we not have entered the Rudy Gay sweepstakes, we don't even know that we need a Rudy Gay-like player just yet. He's a volume scorer that doesn't shoot a particularly good percentage. He plays the same position as Donte and Omri, he's not a good rebounder, he's not a good defender, he doesn't make his team better, and he just got a max contract. No thanks.
[DavidKhan]Methinks you wanted a signing for the sake of signing someone, so you could say "our front office just spent money, we must be ready to make a push!"[/DavidKhan]
That's not the way it works. We need to see how good we are, determine if we need another scorer at shooting guard, and then we'll be in a better position to add a player. That is, IF we even need to do so. So far, we've had the best offseason since 1998, and there's no reason to make anymore changes until we can take stock and make an informed decision one way or the other.
Dude, Rudy Gay got $80 million. Not only could we not offer him that much under CBA rules, but he's not worth that much. This is the point. Not only should we not have entered the Rudy Gay sweepstakes, we don't even know that we need a Rudy Gay-like player just yet. He's a volume scorer that doesn't shoot a particularly good percentage. He plays the same position as Donte and Omri, he's not a good rebounder, he's not a good defender, he doesn't make his team better, and he just got a max contract. No thanks.
[DavidKhan]Methinks you wanted a signing for the sake of signing someone, so you could say "our front office just spent money, we must be ready to make a push!"[/DavidKhan]
That's not the way it works. We need to see how good we are, determine if we need another scorer at shooting guard, and then we'll be in a better position to add a player. That is, IF we even need to do so. So far, we've had the best offseason since 1998, and there's no reason to make anymore changes until we can take stock and make an informed decision one way or the other.
I am going to bet that this poster is the same exact poster as the topic creator. I'm sorry, but I am going to be direct with you: Your idea is terrible. Its completely stupid. You don't pay Rudy Gay 80 million dollars to come to Sacramento to be Tyreke and Cousins' sidekick. That is an absolutely asinine idea.
Do us a favor and stop posting. Its really difficult to be civil with trolls/fake fans.
Do us a favor and stop posting. Its really difficult to be civil with trolls/fake fans.
What will that high quality player do to our young players who need both time and experience on the court that you think is so crucial?
And how much would we be willing to pay this high level player and who is this high level player you're thinking of?
Will we still have enough money to signed that one special player down the road once we find out what type of players our guys are (like a year or two)?
Will we have enough money to sign our young players that could turn into star so that they won't leave?
I really want to know the specific.
And how much would we be willing to pay this high level player and who is this high level player you're thinking of?
Will we still have enough money to signed that one special player down the road once we find out what type of players our guys are (like a year or two)?
Will we have enough money to sign our young players that could turn into star so that they won't leave?
I really want to know the specific.
I believe that Memphis offered him more overall money, because the team with the rights to the player can offer higher yearly raises. It's also worth noting that Gay was a restricted free agent, and Memphis could have simply matched any contract that another team offered him.
Even still, $82 million for a one-dimensional volume scorer is just way too much. It's a horrible contract.
Even still, $82 million for a one-dimensional volume scorer is just way too much. It's a horrible contract.
I'm going to try my hardest to keep you from being able to make any major decision about the Kings roster as possible. There are so many ways I could absolutely destroy what you just wrote... I'm not going to bother because what you wrote really makes me think you live in a place far away with very bad internet access that prevents you from getting real information about the Kings. That's the best explanation I can come up with.
Bravado doesn't really impress me. You can make whatever presumptions about me you'd like, or pound your chest about how you could "destroy" everything I said, but that's just talk. If you want to have any type of actual meaningful debate, then offer up some counter points (in a non snarky way) and I'll be glad to consider them.
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First off, every 3rd option on a serious nba contender is not a 1st or 2nd year player, or 21 or 22 years old. They developed over the years, just like we all see Omri and Donte doing.
Second, by the time we are a contender, do you really see the Maloofs as being frugal? By that point we will already have, or be in the process of, offering max contracts to both Tyreke and Cousins. Either Omri or Donte, or both, will have been extended by then. With our cap space going into next summer, we probably will add another high priced FA. Were we frugal the last time we were contenders? Ummm.....NO.
Dude, you just don't get it. And Rudy Gay would have been a huge mistake.
Second, by the time we are a contender, do you really see the Maloofs as being frugal? By that point we will already have, or be in the process of, offering max contracts to both Tyreke and Cousins. Either Omri or Donte, or both, will have been extended by then. With our cap space going into next summer, we probably will add another high priced FA. Were we frugal the last time we were contenders? Ummm.....NO.
Dude, you just don't get it. And Rudy Gay would have been a huge mistake.
You're missing some details.
The Kings spent several years trying to hold on to a fleeting chance that they might be able to put a competitive team on the floor. They spent mid level money on mid level talent summer after summer, just to say that they weren't just standing pat. Moves for the sake of moves, and not only did they not make us better, they actually set us back. Once they moved Mike Bibby, they showed that they weren't going to just keep throwing good money after bad, and haven't aggressively pursued any free agents because 1) we didn't have cap space for a difference maker, and 2) we needed to strip back and either pursue free agents or build around a young nucleus.
Drafting Tyreke made it a bit easier. Now that we've followed that homerun up with what looks to be another blast, and we have young players that are growing into their roles and getting better, and we have a coach that can get the most out of his players, the best thing we can do is to take stock of what we actually have, not go out spending money again just because we can. That's the first thing. We might already be good enough.
Secondly, there's a new labor deal coming, and I am pretty certain that teams like Atlanta and Memphis that just spent gobs of money on second tier players are going to seriously regret those decisions. Playing it safe is a luxury we have, primarily because we have Tyreke and Cousins. Then, once we know how good we are or aren't, and we know what the new labor deal looks like, we can determine what the new plan of action is going to be.
The Kings spent several years trying to hold on to a fleeting chance that they might be able to put a competitive team on the floor. They spent mid level money on mid level talent summer after summer, just to say that they weren't just standing pat. Moves for the sake of moves, and not only did they not make us better, they actually set us back. Once they moved Mike Bibby, they showed that they weren't going to just keep throwing good money after bad, and haven't aggressively pursued any free agents because 1) we didn't have cap space for a difference maker, and 2) we needed to strip back and either pursue free agents or build around a young nucleus.
Drafting Tyreke made it a bit easier. Now that we've followed that homerun up with what looks to be another blast, and we have young players that are growing into their roles and getting better, and we have a coach that can get the most out of his players, the best thing we can do is to take stock of what we actually have, not go out spending money again just because we can. That's the first thing. We might already be good enough.
Secondly, there's a new labor deal coming, and I am pretty certain that teams like Atlanta and Memphis that just spent gobs of money on second tier players are going to seriously regret those decisions. Playing it safe is a luxury we have, primarily because we have Tyreke and Cousins. Then, once we know how good we are or aren't, and we know what the new labor deal looks like, we can determine what the new plan of action is going to be.
Rudy Gay would have improved the team, plain and simple. I don't see how anyone could reasonably say he wouldn't have. And if Gay is your 3rd option, well, you're doing pretty good. Caspi, Greene, Thompson, and Whiteside are all project players who may or may not ever reach their potential. Gay is a player that's playing at a high level now and that would provide needed scoring and depth immediately.