Kenny Thomas, Corliss Williamson, and Brian Skinner

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Bricklayer

Don't Make Me Use The Bat
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#31
kingsfan1950 said:
We have all heard the saying, "Sometimes the whole is greater than the sum of the parts". I really believe this will be the case here and we will get to the second round, in all truth it really is too early to tell....
All depends on matchups. People underestimate just how much disruption there has been on the team this year -- teams rebuilding mid-year have a hell of a time making any noise because all of that chemistry, knowing where people will be, trusting your teammates etc. is not there. If we can get a team we are traditionally comfortable against, we can still take a round I think. Preferably somebody who doesn't play much defense as we're not going to be 100% comfortable or smooth on offense. Dallas awould be nice -- have to try to hang on to that #5 spot. Probably means a rnd #2 vs. the Spurs. But jsut pulling off a round after all of this will be a moral victory that we can feel decent about going into next year.
 
#33
^i would have to agree...

i keep thinking this our team (over the last 2 games)...i keep forgetting about Peja...i really can't wait for him to come back
 
#34
iheartBrad said:
i keep thinking this our team (over the last 2 games)...i keep forgetting about Peja...i really can't wait for him to come back
And Bobby!! Don't forget the heart and hustle guy, Bobby Jackson! :)
 
#35
Traditionally, the Kings have played best when they play as a team. Rather than it being a one man show, the players work together...and a new person steps up each night. Hopefully, this trade will push for that sort of style.
 
#36
Bricklayer said:
All depends on matchups. People underestimate just how much disruption there has been on the team this year -- teams rebuilding mid-year have a hell of a time making any noise because all of that chemistry, knowing where people will be, trusting your teammates etc. is not there. If we can get a team we are traditionally comfortable against, we can still take a round I think. Preferably somebody who doesn't play much defense as we're not going to be 100% comfortable or smooth on offense. Dallas awould be nice -- have to try to hang on to that #5 spot. Probably means a rnd #2 vs. the Spurs. But jsut pulling off a round after all of this will be a moral victory that we can feel decent about going into next year.
I think it's less of an issue with the Kings than with other team. Our offense is very open, flexible and shares the wealth, so there isn't a lot of circling around, figuring out who is the "Alpha Star" of the team. Webber is now having to deal with that in Philly.

Brad Miller has only been with the team a year and a half, and it seems like he's a long time core veteran from the beginning of the Adleman era.
 

Bricklayer

Don't Make Me Use The Bat
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#37
PixelPusher said:
I think it's less of an issue with the Kings than with other team. Our offense is very open, flexible and shares the wealth, so there isn't a lot of circling around, figuring out who is the "Alpha Star" of the team. Webber is now having to deal with that in Philly.

Brad Miller has only been with the team a year and a half, and it seems like he's a long time core veteran from the beginning of the Adleman era.
Actually I think in our offense the problems might be MORE acute -- with us its all about feel + knowing everybody's tendencies. On a team that runs a very structured offense with a lot of set plays where you know exactly who is going to get the ball and where, it makes it easier because new guys know exactly what they are susposed to do on every play. Feel + comfort with the rest of the team is less improtant than playing a role. With us we us there is less structure, and more need to know instinctively where everybody's going to be.
 

HndsmCelt

Hall of Famer
#38
Bricklayer said:
Actually I think in our offense the problems might be MORE acute -- with us its all about feel + knowing everybody's tendencies. On a team that runs a very structured offense with a lot of set plays where you know exactly who is going to get the ball and where, it makes it easier because new guys know exactly what they are susposed to do on every play. Feel + comfort with the rest of the team is less improtant than playing a role. With us we us there is less structure, and more need to know instinctively where everybody's going to be.
Thats much more true of the starters than the bench. And yes we now have 2 new starters but Cat has had some time to get into the groove and the adjustment with big men in general is easier. But this is yet another good rational to contenue to start Darius for several more games. I suspect Yoda and Adelman will be refocusing the team on defense since that is where the new players can make the fastest impact and thusly compensting for the offensive breakdowns, but in the end the Kings do not seem to be having trouble putting up 100+ points and that in and of it's self is dam good indicater.
 

Bricklayer

Don't Make Me Use The Bat
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#39
HndsmCelt said:
Thats much more true of the starters than the bench. And yes we now have 2 new starters but Cat has had some time to get into the groove and the adjustment with big men in general is easier. But this is yet another good rational to contenue to start Darius for several more games. I suspect Yoda and Adelman will be refocusing the team on defense since that is where the new players can make the fastest impact and thusly compensting for the offensive breakdowns, but in the end the Kings do not seem to be having trouble putting up 100+ points and that in and of it's self is dam good indicater.
Before the possible injury tonight (any more word on that?) I assumed that Darius would get the rest of the road trip more or less regardless of performance. But I have a feeling once he loses that spot he's not getting it back, so if he has to sit a game or two out, probably be Thomas.
 

HndsmCelt

Hall of Famer
#40
Bricklayer said:
Before the possible injury tonight (any more word on that?) I assumed that Darius would get the rest of the road trip more or less regardless of performance. But I have a feeling once he loses that spot he's not getting it back, so if he has to sit a game or two out, probably be Thomas.
No doubt, and Thomas will do fine as the focus moves to Pedja, and hopefully Brad... lets Kenny ease in to system. The big relife is that if Darius's sprained knee keeps him out for a few games Skinner obviously can contribute off the bench.
 
#41
Thomas has simply proven thus far he will most obviously be the starter. The guys gets athletic rebounds. I think the Kings have a better shot now than before at being a "championship contender" this season. Our entire game became too predictable and we were horrendously unathletic in the frontcourt. Now we are big time deep with defensive minded, rebounding, athletes and more importantly we have experienced players.
 
#42
HndsmCelt said:
No doubt, and Thomas will do fine as the focus moves to Pedja, and hopefully Brad... lets Kenny ease in to system. The big relife is that if Darius's sprained knee keeps him out for a few games Skinner obviously can contribute off the bench.
i really do like kenny thomas backing up peja, come to think of it. one of our biggest weaknesses as far as position goes is that we've never had a proper back-up SF. matt barnes did well in peja's absence, but its obvious he still has a long ways to go in improving his game. that said, i still hope philly waives him in the off season and we can re-sign him. at any rate, kenny thomas will be a very capable backup for peja. peja has mostly a perimeter scoring game, and is lacking in areas like rebounding and interior scoring. thomas, on the other hand, can hold his own on the boards. he isnt a great rebounder, but he'll give us what we need while peja's on the bench. he also slashes to the basket well, and can give us a scoring punch right at the basket. he will give us something different coming in for peja. i think it gives us more flexibilty...and thats a good thing. the kings, if anything, are kinda predictable on offense. we need to make defenses work harder against us.
 

Bricklayer

Don't Make Me Use The Bat
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#43
SacTownKid said:
Thomas has simply proven thus far he will most obviously be the starter. The guys gets athletic rebounds. I think the Kings have a better shot now than before at being a "championship contender" this season. Our entire game became too predictable and we were horrendously unathletic in the frontcourt. Now we are big time deep with defensive minded, rebounding, athletes and more importantly we have experienced players.
Not really sure you can call trading a Chris Webber away a way to get "more experienced". Not even sure if Kenny Thomas has ever played in a playoff game. Think Skinner has one first round series under his belt, and certinly a lot less expereince than the man (Tag) who's spot he is taking in the rotation. Only real gain is in Corliss, who could be a nice experienced reserve to team with Bobby, but is going to have a hard time getting minutes behnd Peja.
 

Bricklayer

Don't Make Me Use The Bat
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#44
Bricklayer said:
Not really sure you can call trading a Chris Webber away a way to get "more experienced". Not even sure if Kenny Thomas has ever played in a playoff game. Think Skinner has one first round series under his belt, and certinly a lot less expereince than the man (Tag) who's spot he is taking in the rotation. Only real gain is in Corliss, who could be a nice experienced reserve to team with Bobby, but is going to have a hard time getting minutes behnd Peja.
Oops -- just checked. KT does in fact have playoff experience with Philly 2 seasons ago. But here's the thing:

Webber: 59 gms 2310 playoff minutes

Thomas: 12 gms 389 playoff minutes
Skinner: 13 gms 132 playoff minutes
Corliss: 58 gms 1048 playoff minutes

Corliss will help, if we can find him court time, but you can't trade away a veteran playoff warrior in the chmapionship hunt for half a decade and expect to be getting more experienced.
 
#45
Bricklayer said:
Not really sure you can call trading a Chris Webber away a way to get "more experienced". Not even sure if Kenny Thomas has ever played in a playoff game. Think Skinner has one first round series under his belt, and certinly a lot less expereince than the man (Tag) who's spot he is taking in the rotation. Only real gain is in Corliss, who could be a nice experienced reserve to team with Bobby, but is going to have a hard time getting minutes behnd Peja.
Our bench wasn't as experienced is what I was saying. And I will say that it would be a travesty if Corliss gets Tag's chair, and his minutes, the guy is a former 6th man for craps sake. These are the kind of guys that Adelman likes to play anyway, so we will see.
 

Bricklayer

Don't Make Me Use The Bat
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#46
SacTownKid said:
Our bench wasn't as experienced is what I was saying. And I will say that it would be a travesty if Corliss gets Tag's chair, and his minutes, the guy is a former 6th man for craps sake. These are the kind of guys that Adelman likes to play anyway, so we will see.
Yes, but how?

Corliss can only play SF or PF, and at PF all of the post play and toughness kind of goes away because he's too small and has a hard time posting bigger players or rebounding at all against tall guys. And so then you get Peja back, and that means most of Corliss' minutes are as Peja's backup, whch is only a 10-12 minute gig. Almost has nothing to do with Corliss not being good, and everything to do with him sitting behind one of our two main scorers now.

If it looks like this:

C- Miller 38min
PF- Thomas 32min
SF- Peja 38min
OG- Mobley 36min
PG- Bibby 40min

and I think that's pretty reasonable given what we know of Rick then you have

C - 10min (Skinner/Tag)
PF - 16min (Songaila/Skinner/Williamson)
SF - 10min ( Williamson/Evans)
OG - 12min (Evans/Jackson/House)
PG - 8min (Jackson/House)

And something does not add up. Not enough minutes, too many bodies. If you squeeze Evans, House, Darius and Tag entirely out of the rotation, ou have enough minutes, but Evans and Darius would seem to still be candidates to get a few.
 
#47
I think the last two games have shown how the rest of the year will go. That is against shorter average/bad defensive teams (like Philly) our frontcourt, even with Peja, should beat their frontcourt defensively and be able to outscore them as well. Against bigger/more athletic frontcourts we'll still struggle especially if non of the newcomers is in the game. Our best hope is our backcourt and Peja refinding his game.
 
#48
Bricklayer said:
Yes, but how?

Corliss can only play SF or PF, and at PF all of the post play and toughness kind of goes away because he's too small and has a hard time posting bigger players or rebounding at all against tall guys. And so then you get Peja back, and that means most of Corliss' minutes are as Peja's backup, whch is only a 10-12 minute gig. Almost has nothing to do with Corliss not being good, and everything to do with him sitting behind one of our two main scorers now.

If it looks like this:

C- Miller 38min
PF- Thomas 32min
SF- Peja 38min
OG- Mobley 36min
PG- Bibby 40min

and I think that's pretty reasonable given what we know of Rick then you have

C - 10min (Skinner/Tag)
PF - 16min (Songaila/Skinner/Williamson)
SF - 10min ( Williamson/Evans)
OG - 12min (Evans/Jackson/House)
PG - 8min (Jackson/House)

And something does not add up. Not enough minutes, too many bodies. If you squeeze Evans, House, Darius and Tag entirely out of the rotation, ou have enough minutes, but Evans and Darius would seem to still be candidates to get a few.
It would have to depend on the situation of who plays and when they play. Corliss getting 12-15 min. a game is fine with me. Playing him 4 min. one game, none the next, and 6 the next, is not fine with me. Those are Tag minutes. As long as he gets steady off the bench minutes I will be fine. I assume he would be alright with it as well, considering that he is a former 6th man.

I would also like to see a little time shaved off of Brads minutes. I dont like him going over 40 min.

Another great thing about our depth is that we can afford to protect the paint. Before if Webber would get into foul trouble things would kind of get screwed up as far as the rotation. It was refreshing to see the Kings not giving up endless amounts of uncontested layups, even if the result was a foul.
 
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HndsmCelt

Hall of Famer
#49
Not sure I see Kenny at the 3 but probably beceause I just have not seen him there. Corless has a better inside game and the swtich from Pedja to him ought to make it hard on defenders.
 

HndsmCelt

Hall of Famer
#50
Well I think we can take Tag out of the line up now, although some of us would still argue for him. House has gotten better but once Bobby is back that will be the end of his PT. Evans and Darius will not go anywehre but it's not like neither of them are starngers to injury and that is the big concern as we hit the post seaon... having the ablity to fill in slots with a minimal disruption and still have a decent bench behind the replacment. Now we have that at every spot.
 
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