JT wants to get traded (and other trade discussion)

rainmaker

rainmaker

Hall of Famer
#301
#301
hrdboild said:
Yes, because it's batpoopoo crazy. But that seems to be the way we do things around here, so....
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Around here we trade struggling rookies for proven starting caliber vets who fit our coach, our top player and can help the team win now?

When and where, may I ask? I must have missed it.

Taking a risk and acquiring a guy like Dragic by using Nik would be a refreshing, and much needed change of course.
 
Iced Espresso

Iced Espresso

Starter
#302
#302
hrdboild said:
Nik is worth more than 2 months of Afflalo. Even after his rookie season. DWill is a guy you trade for a player who has a player option next season. If he wants to play for George Karl so bad, just ask him to opt out (which he's most likely going to do anyway) and just sign him as a free agent. No assets wasted. Even if we do trade Stauskas for him he's probably going to opt out so he can sign a longer deal. There's no reason to spend anything at all on acquiring him right now. None.
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Agreed 100%.

Unfortunately the desire to hold change in the hand, and also almost zero faith in Nik makes this desirable to some. Possibly even our front office.
 
Tetsujin

Tetsujin

The Game Thread Dude
#303
#303
hrdboild said:
Nik is worth more than 2 months of Afflalo. Even after his rookie season. DWill is a guy you trade for a player who has a player option next season. If he wants to play for George Karl so bad, just ask him to opt out (which he's most likely going to do anyway) and just sign him as a free agent. No assets wasted. Even if we do trade Stauskas for him he's probably going to opt out so he can sign a longer deal. There's no reason to spend anything at all on acquiring him right now. None.
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That is tampering and, of course, against pretty much every by-law of the NBA charter
 
Bricklayer

Bricklayer

Don't Make Me Use The Bat
#304
#304
hrdboild said:
Nik is worth more than 2 months of Afflalo. Even after his rookie season. DWill is a guy you trade for a player who has a player option next season. If he wants to play for George Karl so bad, just ask him to opt out (which he's most likely going to do anyway) and just sign him as a free agent. No assets wasted. Even if we do trade Stauskas for him he's probably going to opt out so he can sign a longer deal. There's no reason to spend anything at all on acquiring him right now. None.
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Afflalo will resign. He's Karl's boy.

He and Ben and Rudy will be a rock solid 2/3 combo. Darren is a solid PG. Boogie is the best center in the world. Karl is a Top 5 coach.

That's 5 solid pieces, and a coach who has gotten a lot of out of mildy talented roleplayers over the years. Need 2 more. solid guys and you are in business. Backup PG is a key. Starting PF the other.
 
hrdboild

hrdboild

Moloch in whom I dream Angels!
Staff member
#306
#306
rainmaker said:
Around here we trade struggling rookies for proven starting caliber vets who fit our coach, our top player and can help the team win now?

When and where, may I ask? I must have missed it.

Taking a risk and acquiring a guy like Dragic by using Nik would be a refreshing, and much needed change of course.
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Maybe take 2 seconds to look at the guy's contract first before coming at me with your sarcasm. Stauskas was fairly highly regarded coming out of college not all that long ago and he's got 3 more years left on his rookie contract. Afflalo has a player option for next season. Contracts have value that extends beyond the name attached to them. I may as well trade you my 3 bedroom home in Glendale for a chance to bid on your Beverly Hills estate at public auction in 3 months. If it doesn't work out, now I'm homeless. Look at the deal, what are we actually getting here? This is GM'ing 101, not complicated stuff.
 
hrdboild

hrdboild

Moloch in whom I dream Angels!
Staff member
#307
#307
Bricklayer said:
Afflalo will resign. He's Karl's boy.

He and Ben and Rudy will be a rock solid 2/3 combo. Darren is a solid PG. Boogie is the best center in the world. Karl is a Top 5 coach.

That's 5 solid pieces, and a coach who has gotten a lot of out of mildy talented roleplayers over the years. Need 2 more. solid guys and you are in business. Backup PG is a key. Starting PF the other.
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Fantastic, I'm sold. So let's keep Stauskas and trade him for a PF instead.
 
hrdboild

hrdboild

Moloch in whom I dream Angels!
Staff member
#309
#309
Tetsujin said:
That is tampering and, of course, against pretty much every by-law of the NBA charter
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crap man, don't ask him then. My point is if you really want him and you know he wants to play for you, it doesn't take a genius to figure out a way to make this happen. I don't want Afflalo anyway. All he does is devalue McLemore, who also happens to be one of Cousins favorite teammates.
 
Iced Espresso

Iced Espresso

Starter
#310
#310
rainmaker said:
Marc J. Spears ‏@SpearsNBAYahoo
Kings want Goran Dragic “bad,” source said.Sac could move Jason Thompson & Nik Stauskas to clear salary cap space for max offer in offseason
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Interesting.

I think Nik is a high price to pay to dump Thompson for an expiring most likely, but I'd like this more if someone would take Landry.

Interesting regardless. But next season with both JT and Landry here at the 4 getting enough money to spend in other places is harder to do.
 
rainmaker

rainmaker

Hall of Famer
#311
#311
hrdboild said:
Maybe take 2 seconds to look at the guy's contract first before coming at me with your sarcasm.
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I'm well aware of his contract. Doesn't change anything nor is it what I commented on, which was your suggestion we have a history of trading struggling rookies for players of Dragic's caliber and that would be "batpoopoo crazy".
 
hrdboild

hrdboild

Moloch in whom I dream Angels!
Staff member
#312
#312
Uggh, offering Goran Dragic 15+ million a year is an epically bad idea. In his career to-date he's had one season worthy of that contract. He has negligible defensive value and Darren Collison is outperforming him this year for a third of that.
 
jcwkings

jcwkings

All-Star
#313
#313
Bricklayer said:
Afflalo will resign. He's Karl's boy.

He and Ben and Rudy will be a rock solid 2/3 combo. Darren is a solid PG. Boogie is the best center in the world. Karl is a Top 5 coach.

That's 5 solid pieces, and a coach who has gotten a lot of out of mildy talented roleplayers over the years. Need 2 more. solid guys and you are in business. Backup PG is a key. Starting PF the other.
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Are you convinced Ray Mac isn't the backup PG? I think under the right coach and a defined role he can deliver. Hustles, good defender, good off ball movement, just don't trust him running an offense yet and tends to overdribble. It will be interesting to see what Karl can get out of him and or Sessions(which is still baffling how he built up a career as a solid backup and here looks like a nervous child, maybe Karl can revitalize him.)
 
hrdboild

hrdboild

Moloch in whom I dream Angels!
Staff member
#314
#314
rainmaker said:
I'm well aware of his contract. Doesn't change anything nor is it what I commented on, which was your suggestion we have a history of trading struggling rookies for players of Dragic's caliber and that would be "batpoopoo crazy".
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No, my suggestion was that this current front office has a history of doing things which make sense to nobody but themselves.

Seriously though... doesn't change anything? Not even a little bit?
 
S

sdballer

Starter
#315
#315
hrdboild said:
Uggh, offering Goran Dragic 15+ million a year is an epically bad idea. In his career to-date he's had one season worthy of that contract. He has negligible defensive value and Darren Collison is outperforming him this year for a third of that.
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I'm kind of feeling this too. I like dragic but not sure in going to start trading assets for cap space so I can give him a max deal.
 
Iced Espresso

Iced Espresso

Starter
#316
#316
sdballer said:
I'm kind of feeling this too. I like dragic but not sure in going to start trading assets for cap space so I can give him a max deal.
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I think it is Landry or bust man. Thompson's deal is not as bad. Even so, I'm a little curious on what they may be up to. We have not had serious cap space with these guys yet really, especially after Carl came to town.

I'm not sure what's fair for Dragic either.
 
rainmaker

rainmaker

Hall of Famer
#317
#317
hrdboild said:
No, my suggestion was that this current front office has a history of doing things which make sense to nobody but themselves.

Seriously though... doesn't change anything? Not even a little bit?
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I've been a consistent defender of Nik on here. I fully believe he'll be a good NBA player, has the tools to not only be a great shooter but to get his shot off the bounce and create for others. But, we need vets, we need to start winning, we need to surround Cuz with players who are ready to help right now, not at some point down the road and to top it off, we're already developing another young SG who's the same age.

Dragic immediately plugs needed holes and helps this team take the next step. This FO also needs to prove to Cuz they're ready to win now, they just wasted his 5th season. All that certainly takes priority over Nik's potential on his rookie contract, to the point it does not matter. Winning matters. Now.

As an aside, Dragic isn't worth 18M/Y, but what has to be considered as well is a much higher cap in 2016-17.
 
Bricklayer

Bricklayer

Don't Make Me Use The Bat
#318
#318
jcwkings said:
Are you convinced Ray Mac isn't the backup PG? I think under the right coach and a defined role he can deliver. Hustles, good defender, good off ball movement, just don't trust him running an offense yet and tends to overdribble. It will be interesting to see what Karl can get out of him and or Sessions(which is still baffling how he built up a career as a solid backup and here looks like a nervous child, maybe Karl can revitalize him.)
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I guess we'll find out with Karl but I have consistently been epically unimpressed with McCallum. I can't be the only person who notices that he is actually a better scorer than distributor, and the scoring is erratic as can be. If he was out of the league next year, it would not surprise me one bit. Guys of his talent level come and go off the end of rosters. On the other hand if he wants to blossom under Karl that's fine too.
 
jcwkings

jcwkings

All-Star
#319
#319
I love Dragic, if theres a way to get him hear i'm all on board. I think he's the best of the 3 PG's in Phoenix but Bledsoe seems to have a more "alpha male" personality and we know how IT is. Cousins, Rudy, Dragic is one hell of a core to build around.
 
Bricklayer

Bricklayer

Don't Make Me Use The Bat
#321
#321
jcwkings said:
I love Dragic, if theres a way to get him hear i'm all on board. I think he's the best of the 3 PG's in Phoenix but Bledsoe seems to have a more "alpha male" personality and we know how IT is. Cousins, Rudy, Dragic is one hell of a core to build around.
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Dragic at max just...well, I guess the cap is going up in a big way in a few years, so we'd survive, but..blech.

Outside of that though, here's the thing: do we get to keep Collison? And do we get to keep Ben?

Answer me yes to those two questions and I'm pretty happy with the 1/2/3 situation. It would be more than enough firepower and PG/ballhandling to take the heat off Cuz, whatever the cost.
 
Bricklayer

Bricklayer

Don't Make Me Use The Bat
#325
#325
randymoss1881 said:
Using Nik to clear space for Dragic is moronic. Dude put heat/LaL/knicks on his short list all of them can offer him max. He's not signing here in the off season.
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That I consider a big flag myself on Dragic. Thing is, the other team he put on his list? Indiana. And unless he is jsut a big Bird fan that suggests to me the reason eh chose those teams may not have been their glam factor, so much as: George Hill, Mario Chalmers, Jeremy Lin/Ronnie Price, and Jose Calderon., i.e. all places where he could go and be "the man" at PG with no real challengers.

We might be able to do that for him...but it bothers me a lot if we had to give up Collison to make him happy. Together those two are right up there amongst PG combos/rotations, while spending some time together. Just Dragic at $15mil vs. DC at $5mil? Mmm...not so amused.
 
CurseOfTheSalmons

CurseOfTheSalmons

Starter
#326
#326
randymoss1881 said:
Using Nik to clear space for Dragic is moronic. Dude put heat/LaL/knicks on his short list all of them can offer him max. He's not signing here in the off season.
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But out of all of those teams, we have the best situation.

On top of a brand spanking new arena in 2016, we have DeMarcus Cousins and Rudy Gay who are two perfect fits for him as we can show using data from the IT-Gay-Cousins days. Ben McLemore is also a perfect backcourt mate for him, and we have one of the best coaches ever. Those other teams can't offer this. The Lakers have nobody but an old Kobe who will take the ball away from him. Byron Scott would probably bench him. Speaking of coaches, New York has no coach and no big. Dwyane Wade will take the ball out of his hands too, and all these teams and their stars are OLD. Here in Sac, Cousins is just 24 and more capable than anybody else to carry him to a championship, and we are desperate for him to take the ball out of his and Rudy's hands because they turn it over too much.

LOOK HOW MUCH ISAIAH THOMAS TOUCHED THE BALL IN 2014, GORAN. YOU KNOW YOU WANT IT.
 
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2

206Fan

All-Star
#328
#328
Bricklayer said:
That I consider a big flag myself on Dragic. Thing is, the other team he put on his list? Indiana. And unless he is jsut a big Bird fan that suggests to me the reason eh chose those teams may not have been their glam factor, so much as: George Hill, Mario Chalmers, Jeremy Lin/Ronnie Price, and Jose Calderon., i.e. all places where he could go and be "the man" at PG with no real challengers.

We might be able to do that for him...but it bothers me a lot if we had to give up Collison to make him happy. Together those two are right up there amongst PG combos/rotations, while spending some time together. Just Dragic at $15mil vs. DC at $5mil? Mmm...not so amused.
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I would never put Dragic next to Collison in any lineups..maybe except late in the game.. The reason why he's even leaving PHX is because of that very reason.
 
2

206Fan

All-Star
#329
#329
I don't think any team should offer Dragic a max. A HUGE overpay. HOWEVER, I would gladly offer Stauskas+Thompson for Dragic.

I think there's now a bidding war for Dragic and there might be an even more desperate team that would top our offer. Lakers and Knicks would NOT be willing to give up their 1st round pick this year. The Suns would have to wait until 2017ish.
 
R

randymoss1881

Starter
#330
#330
CurseOfTheSalmons said:
But out of all of those teams, we have the best situation.

On top of a brand spanking new arena in 2016, we have DeMarcus Cousins and Rudy Gay who are two perfect fits for him as we can show using data from the IT-Gay-Cousins days. Ben McLemore is also a perfect backcourt mate for him, and we have one of the best coaches ever. Those other teams can't offer this. The Lakers have nobody but an old Kobe who will take the ball away from him. Byron Scott would probably bench him. Speaking of coaches, New York has no coach and no big. Dwyane Wade will take the ball out of his hands too, and all these teams and their stars are OLD. Here in Sac, Cousins is just 24 and more capable than anybody else to carry him to a championship, and we are desperate for him to take the ball out of his and Rudy's hands because they turn it over too much.
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It usually doesn't work that way and looking at his list he give 0 craps about whose on the team. Also he is 100% staying where he's traded this is his last and I'm pretty sure only mega contract of his career. That extra year will be vital.
 
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