Jason Thompson (merged)

[nbrans]

Yet energetic can actually be a not so great thing when you are trying to build around somebody. Tim Duncan is not energetic, he is deliberate. But because he is, you always know where he is and what he's going to do, and you can build everything around him like a rock. Most of the great franchise players are the same way. The ball stops in their hands they survey the floor, and then they control the game. At this point Thompson has energy, but no presence at all. Its a gigantic gulf, and he's only a couple of years younger than Webb was when he arrived in Sacto. We'll just have to see how, and how quickly, he develops.

On the offensive end, definitely. He's going to have to learn how to survey and make his moves, and he's never really going to get to the level of CWebb. Where he could be CWebb's superior, though, is on the rebounding/hustle side, especially with offensive rebounds and putbacks. That quickness and nose for the ball could result in some serious intangibles, crunchtime rebounds, etc.

 

[Kingster]

Hello, my first post! (so please be gentle)

What do you think of his potential of becoming our next CWebb type dominant player? Like CWebb, he appears to have soft and big hands, can shoot inside/outside, has good court vision, passes well, and emanates a palpable desire to win. I know this is just his rookie year, but can't help pulling out my CWebb measuring stick (yes, they sell this!) whenever I watch him play. Didn't realize I miss Webber this much, but I guess I do.

I know I'm going out on a limb, but I think he could be better than Webber. He doesn't have the explosiveness in his jump, nor the strength, but he does have exceptional lateral quickness (better than Webber), straight-ahead quickness (better than Webber), and speed (better than Webber). And I'm getting the vibe that he has an exceptional work ethic, and coachability, which even Webber admitted he could have used more of.

 

[NME]

Wow, so we already know what the kid's upper limit is, huh?

 

[rhythmless]

I know I'm going out on a limb, but I think he could be better than Webber. He doesn't have the explosiveness in his jump, nor the strength, but he does have exceptional lateral quickness (better than Webber), straight-ahead quickness (better than Webber), and speed (better than Webber). And I'm getting the vibe that he has an exceptional work ethic, and coachability, which even Webber admitted he could have used more of.

I fear that your memories of Webber may have been hazy, or you have seen Webber post op a little too much. Webber was an amazingly gifted player in all facets of the game. In recent memory, only a few power forwards eclipse him. The list being Duncan, KG, Malone, of course. Barkley if you want to include him in this recent list. Im excluding Dirk and Amare because their primes have not been written in stone yet. Chris Webber was there. With all said and done, in his era, there was only Duncan, KG, and Malone to keep him from best power forward in the NBA. And none of these players had his court vision. His CAREER stats read something like 20+/10/4+, which puts him in elite/HOF category. If we had won, I am sure he would have been a HOF.

In addition, players are judged relative to other players in the NBA at the same time. Look at the landscape of PF now; Dirk, Brand, West, Amare, Bosh, Boozer, Pau, and maybe aldridge down the line. He would have to crack to the middle of this pack just to be relatively as good as Webb.

Sorry for the long passage on CWebb. I like your optimism, but lets not just throw things out like that willy nilly.

edit: i actually knew i missed webb this much. i almost cried when he got traded. so i say this knowing i have on webb shaded glasses. actually i have his shoes too

 

[bajaden]

I fear that your memories of Webber may have been hazy, or you have seen Webber post op a little too much. Webber was an amazingly gifted player in all facets of the game. In recent memory, only a few power forwards eclipse him. The list being Duncan, KG, Malone, of course. Barkley if you want to include him in this recent list. Im excluding Dirk and Amare because their primes have not been written in stone yet. Chris Webber was there. With all said and done, in his era, there was only Duncan, KG, and Malone to keep him from best power forward in the NBA. And none of these players had his court vision. His CAREER stats read something like 20+/10/4+, which puts him in elite/HOF category. If we had won, I am sure he would have been a HOF.

In addition, players are judged relative to other players in the NBA at the same time. Look at the landscape of PF now; Dirk, Brand, West, Amare, Bosh, Boozer, Pau, and maybe aldridge down the line. He would have to crack to the middle of this pack just to be relatively as good as Webb.

Sorry for the long passage on CWebb. I like your optimism, but lets not just throw things out like that willy nilly.

edit: i actually knew i missed webb this much. i almost cried when he got traded. so i say this knowing i have on webb shaded glasses. actually i have his shoes too

I'm not sure of your age, but, trust me, there are a lot of power forwards that were pretty good if not better than Webb. This is not a knock on Webb. There's no denying his skill level. Thats the problem with being an older fan. You still remember the Bob Petits of the league.

When comparing Thompson to Webber, remember that when Webb came here he was already a polished player. He had been in the league for a while. However when Webb was a rookie, he didn't have that polished elbow jumper. His passing, which was good, still wasn't as good as it would be later. He actualy looked a lot like Thompson. The difference to me is that Webb always looked poised. He always made it look easy, where Thompson, has at times, a frenetic look to him.

I do think that Thompson plays with more energy than Webber ever did and without a doubt he has way more lateral quickness than Webber, which was Webber's weakness on defense. If I had a knock on Webber, it was that it seemed to me, he really didn't like to play down low in the blocks. Not sure why, because I never saw anyone put the ball through the basket quicker than Webber. I just think that if he had his choice, he prefered that elbow jumper.

Instead of comparing Thompson to Webber, or any other great player, perhaps, we should just hope that 20 yr's from now, some other young player is being compared to Thompson.

 

[rhythmless]

If you read my post, I definitely specified that I was working only with Webber's era and later. I did that to not bring about all the other greats beforehand. If we take those into account, Webber does not crack top 10. No argument there.

That poise can be what separates greatness from elite players. They are sure of what happens because they make it happen. The game is in their control. Hakeem had it. Duncan always has it. MJ undoubtedly had everyone at his fingertips. Webber had it to a degree.

As for the knock on Webber, it frustrated me to no ends when he would stay in that elbow shot when he clearly could have taken it inside. But if you look at his personality, it makes sense. He seems to want to be more worldly than most NBA players, and I think that translated to him wanting to be more than just a traditional PF. He wanted his 18 footer on the elbow. He wanted to be a point guard, he wanted to shoot the 3. He wnated to run the break.

As for Thompson being a yardstick for others, I am pessimistic that we turn out to be that lucky. Im a kings fan after all, right?

 

[Bricklayer]

Enough.

Webber was arguably one of the ten most talented PFs in the history of the league and was a borderline HOFer that would likely have made it if either a) we got over that hump and won a title, or b) he did not blow out his knee. If Jason Thompson reaches the point that he is considered worthy of washing one of Webb's 10 yr old jockstraps it will be a helluva accomplishment. The kid has some of the same sorts of skills. He hustles. He has size. The rest is just silly.

 

[kf4l]

In all fairness I don't think Thompson should really be compared to anyone or be expected to become the franchise player. He's come a long way to even make it to the NBA and works very hard by giving his all on the court and making a huge effort to develop his game. Thats all I can ask for.

I will say that he has a lot of upside and has already shown flashes of what he can do even though he's a rookie and still learning the NBA game.

 

[Aenadin]

The Cwebb in his prime would tear apart the opposing bigman no doubt about that

20+ppg 10+rbg 5apg 1 spg 2bpg in most of his careers? nightmare i might even argue he was better than KG and Duncan in their Primes

 

[Kingster]

I fear that your memories of Webber may have been hazy, or you have seen Webber post op a little too much. Webber was an amazingly gifted player in all facets of the game. In recent memory, only a few power forwards eclipse him. The list being Duncan, KG, Malone, of course. Barkley if you want to include him in this recent list. Im excluding Dirk and Amare because their primes have not been written in stone yet. Chris Webber was there. With all said and done, in his era, there was only Duncan, KG, and Malone to keep him from best power forward in the NBA. And none of these players had his court vision. His CAREER stats read something like 20+/10/4+, which puts him in elite/HOF category. If we had won, I am sure he would have been a HOF.

In addition, players are judged relative to other players in the NBA at the same time. Look at the landscape of PF now; Dirk, Brand, West, Amare, Bosh, Boozer, Pau, and maybe aldridge down the line. He would have to crack to the middle of this pack just to be relatively as good as Webb.

Sorry for the long passage on CWebb. I like your optimism, but lets not just throw things out like that willy nilly.

edit: i actually knew i missed webb this much. i almost cried when he got traded. so i say this knowing i have on webb shaded glasses. actually i have his shoes too

Oh, I have a very good memory of Webber, all the way back to Golden State and Washington. Yeah, Webber was one step behind the elite power forwards of his day. I'm not interested in the history lesson. The question is, how do you compare the physical skills of him and Thompson? I don't have the time to wait for 10 years to make the comparison...

 

[Aenadin]

its too early to speculate anything when it comes to physical comparison.. Webber was usually plagued with injuries which did no justice to his career.. Thompson seems to be a sturdy lad, yet well see

 

[bajaden]

Chris Webber - 15 seasons: Career avg's - 20.7 ppg, 9.8 rpg, 4.2 apg.

A few comparisons:

Bob McAdoo - 14 seasons: Career avg's - 22.1 ppg, 9.4 rpg, 2.3 apg.

Karl Malone - 19 seasons: career avg's -25.0 ppg, 10.1 rpg, 3.6 apg.

Charles Barkley - 16 seasons: career avg's- 22.1 ppg, 11.7 rpg, 3.9 apg.

Elton Brand - 9 seasons: career avg's - 20.3 ppg, 10.2 rpg, 2.7 apg.

Tim Duncan - 11 seasons: career avg's - 21.6 ppg, 11.8 rpg, 3.1 apg.

Bob Pettit- 11 seasons: career avg's - 26.4 ppg, 16.2 rpg, 3.0 apg.

Almost all of these guys are HOF players, or will be in the HOF. I think Webber matches up pretty well with them. It may well be that his off court activites mighty keep him out.

Just for fun and for those that may have forgotten I decided to throw in the grand poopa of rebounders here at the end.

Wilt Chamberlain - 14 seasons: 30.1 ppg, 22.9 rpg, 4.4 apg.

What this has to do with Thompson, I have no idea.

 

[NME]

Whether or not Thompson ever achieves that "je ne sais quoi" intangible cited in franchise players, I don't think it's that difficult to foresee him putting up 20, 10 and a few assists in the not so distant future. If that leaves him at less than HOF or Webber status, I can live with it!

 

[NME]

Wilt Chamberlain - 14 seasons: 30.1 ppg, 22.9 rpg, 4.4 apg.

What this has to do with Thompson, I have no idea.

To elaborate on this line of discourse:

Kevin Salvadori - 2 seasons: 1.1 ppg, 1.2 rpg, 0.3 apg.

What were we talking about again?

 

[bajaden]

To elaborate on this line of discourse:

Kevin Salvadori - 2 seasons: 1.1 ppg, 1.2 rpg, 0.3 apg.

What were we talking about again?

But, but, but, He had potential!

 

[Widowmaker2k]

Hey, just for the record, Jason Thompson, right now:
22.9 MPG, 14.2 PPG, 7.0 RPG, 2.0 APG, and .75 BPG.

Not bad at all for a rookie coming off the bench. For me, the bottom line is that I look forward to the day that the power forward spot is once again considered a strength in our match ups.

Right now, the rookie's with the highest efficiency rankings are Marc Gasol (19.0) and Jason Thompson (18.0)(and Thompson actually leads EFF/48). I'm not the biggest fan of 'catch all' stats such as EFF and PER, but it's at least an indicator that he's playing all around good basketball compared to his classmates.